Oil Filters, whose is best, and Why?

ruking1

#1877

As most know Allied Signal owned FRAM. They have just recently sold it to Honeywell. It remains to be seen what changes the new managment have or will put into play.

bburton1

knows I wuz talking about that product. Yeah Honeywell used to be a class outfit-now part of GE I think-hope they don't follow the same value engineering path.

Yep Allied Signal is a very interesting organization.

fleetwoodsimca

Try a Pennzoil filter. I am informed that they're made by Fram.

vidtech

I decided to cut open the "new"supertech ST8 and check it out.Very impressed with the paper element.I cannot figure out how the bypass valve works.There are six holes cut into the middle of the end cap and the stamped steel spring is covering these holes.I am used to seeing the spring loaded "button" type valve.This design looks likeit wouldn't work should the filter become resticted.

americanflag

oil filters with the 5W-30 oil or should I use a different filter? I glanced at the e-book the Motor Oil Bible and he mentions the importance of filters, what do you think is the way to go?

knapp3

I think the Motorcraft filter is a solid choice. There are better filters available, but few others are a better value. It's well constructed, has decent filtering ability, usually a silicon anti-drain back valve, a smart bypass valve design, and at less than $3 (usually) at Walmart, a darn good buy.

fleetwoodsimca

In my area, Motorcraft filters sometimes get sketchy on availability. I have come to realize that Champion filters meet all specs of consequence, and therefore the Walmart Supertech filters are a best buy. Another great Champion filter is the slightly more expensive STP at Autozone. Some Motorcraft filters look like Champion made them. Get the drift here?

americanflag

dealer when they do the change.

I would think that the time you would need an exceptional filter would be if you were doing extended drains. If you are changing at say 5k mile intervals, then the oil change is like an oil filter. But if you are going 25k miles between changes with synthetic, then the filter is really taking the place of the changes in terms of keeping the oil free of debris. Do you think this is the case?

I am just wondering, if I am going to change my oil every 5k miles using Mobil 1 oil, is there much advantage to using a Mobil 1 oil filter over a Ford provided Motorcraft filter?

vidtech

the motorcraft is made by purolator to ford's specs.i was told by this guy at purolator that their filters have higher efficiency ratings than the purolator made motorcraft filters.i would have to say the mobil one is far superior to the mororcraft.supertechs are fine but i wouldn't use them for extended drains,after examining them i have my doubts of the bypass ability should the filter become restricted.

americanflag

of 5k do you the Motorcraft from Ford is the way to go or is it worth the extra cost to go with the Mobil 1 oil filter?

knapp3

Seems to me the answer depends on what you view as important for your car. The mobil uses a more efficient synthetic media and will do a better job removing particulant. It easily has the capacity to last 5K. The motorcraft also has the capacity to last that long, but will probably only filter out what needs to caught. I don't think you can go wrong either way. I use a motorcraft on my 2 Fords, and a Mobil 1 on my Maxima. Purely personal perference on my part.

fleetwoodsimca

I'd go with the Motorcraft filter. You're smart to change at 5K instead of anything longer.

csandste

that Purolator is moving some of it's line to use cardboard endcaps like Fram.

americanflag

of a Mobil 1 filter versus a Ford Motorcraft filter (besides price)? I am intrigued by the idea of using a superior filter.

knapp3

Gosh, consider these for a Mobil 1...

A thicker steel canister.
A synthetic filter media vs a paper one.
Greater dirt holding capacity.
Filtering efficiency down to 10 microns.
Tons of available SAE information and data from Mobil vs only generalizations from Ford.
Sexy gray painted canister vs white.
Silicon valves on the full line, not select few.
3X's the cost of a Ford.
Amsoil,Pureone, Hastings, and AC Delco Ultra pureists might disagree, but it's hard to find a better filter than M1.
Cynics say your car can't tell the difference.

bluedevils

What are the primary ones-- traps more stuff, holds it better/longer, traps smaller stuff, etc.?

fleetwoodsimca

(:o] That convinced me to buy any Champion filter under any name I can find!

knapp3

Bluedevils: Yup, you nailed 'em.

Fleedwoods: I think you hit it on the head too. And the little ole Walmart SuperTech @ $1.97 may be the best buy out of the whole bunch. But you still need to watch each application carefully. For example, the SuperTech filter for my Maxmia is a tiny 6607 model # (I think). Aint much bigger than a golf ball. Honest. So in that case, I'd choose the Champion-build STP, Bosch or (as I actually do) the Mobil One filter in stead. I even prefer all those over the Nissan OEM. If SuperTech had an oem-sized application for a Nissan, I'd have to rethink what I do. Now on my Ford vehicles, I happen to like the way Ford locates the by-pass valve at the opening. I haven't found any Champion-built filter that does the same. They all appear to be at the opposite end of the filter. Call me picky, but for that single reason I stick with a Motorcraft brand. The irony is that if you find one of the older SuperTech filters (blue box, not the new black ones) that fits a Ford, say a SuperTech 2A that cross references with a Ford FL-820S, the old SuperTech filter had the valve at the opening. But it got moved with the newer line. Darn!

You can drive youself nuts trying to figure out which filter is the best. Whether my choices are the best, I don't know. But I don't worry about it either anymore. Following these posts now is just entertainment!!!!

By the way, how did you bold print your little thingamajiggy, whatshamacallit, dohinky: ????

oilcan2

Having read all the posts,I find it darn near amazing nobody advocates the use of a by-pass oil filter.Whether or not you use syn oil or not a
by-pass filter would help,I use the amsoil one,
this goes down to 1 micron (approx).It also increases oil capacity from 1 to 3 qts. depending
on which element you use.On small engines with a
4 qt. capacity that makes a difference.The other
one I know of is the one that uses the toilet paper in a canister,they can be found on ebay.
just thought I would throw this out there and see
what opinions come back.

knapp3

The point of all my posts is that I think the best filter for YOUR car, is the one YOU buy. Just know why you make the decison you do.

Wix, Purolator, Hastings, even a few select Fram models (like the Tough Guard), and if you're so inclined, By-pass setups, are all decent choices too.

The is no Holy Grail of oil filters. 2 different people driving the same car, using 2 different filters can both be right.

vidtech

i would stay clear of the new s-techs because of a poorly designed bypass valve.the one i examined was the full size for fords.as i see it the filter cartridge would have to partially collapse for the oil to bypass should that need ever happpen.long drain intervals and use in cold climates where the oil gets thick is not the place for a supertech.you get what you pay for and i feel these new filters have been compomised.
a clogged or restricted filter=an oil starved engine.

ruking1

#1897

You must have passed over my posts about preoilers and oil bypass filtering and the reference to Amsoil vendors that sell them. If 60% of the engine wear happens at start up and double filtering removes the other 30-40% (not totalling 100%) DUE to particle size and or oil filter ceasing to filter,(ie bypass value functioning) that as a minimum could give an engine about double the life, i.e. (250k range x2) So for a lack in 100-400 dollars in aftermarket products/systems, engines wear down twice as fast as they should.

So that to encapsulate, 1. synthetic oil, (Mobil One, Redline, Amsoil)2. bypass oil filtering system (two filters: main and bypass filters) 3. preoilers (preoiling surfaces whose oil has drained due to shutdown, app decrease in long range wear=60%)And that gives the tools for long distance mileage engine longevity.

americanflag

of the Mobil 1 over the Ford Motorcraft? I want the best...

ruking1

#1901

First of all there is no doubt that the Mobil One is the better filter than the Ford Motorcraft. That being said one needs to evaluate whether or not the price performance ratio is a concern.

A personal example on a high performance machine: Corvette Z06. The stock filter is a AC Delco PF44 (app $ 2) synthetic media oil filter. This is the oil filter that has been tested and certified thru GM engineering and testing procedures for "statisticallly, the longest life" Mobil One makes a great filter application for this also( app $10-12) . As does AC Delco under the name ULTRA guard UPF44 (app$ 8-10) Upon doing research on the WALLY Mart application Super Tech (app 1.97), LO and behold the AC Delco Ultra guard (which as been discontinued for my application) HAS the same specs as the Wally Mart Super Tech application. When you put them out SIDE by side ONLY the graphics are different! So in my personal research AC Delco PF44 and/or Wally Mart Super Tech are my choices.

(The Wally Mart is made by Champion Labs. The discontinued AC Delco UPF44 points to Champion Labs. The Mobil filter seems to be made by Champion Labs.)

fleetwoodsimca

Totally agree with you on the 6607 Supertech filter for certain Nissan applications. It looks too small to do the job. Maybe it is actually up to the job, but I appreciate the illusion of confidence due to size provided by other brands under a filter number of 7317. Quite some time ago, I switched over to the WIX supplied Kmart filters using that number. Kmart used the Castrol and the Penske name on them as their house brands. When Kmart started heading south and began closing out those filters, I bought a bunch because I own two Nissan 3.3 Liter V6 engines-- one in a Pathfinder, one in a Mercury Villager. My last two Penskes are currently installed, and I have one dozen Castrols on the shelf to go to next. I change oil and filter in both these engines about every 3K miles. That means I have at least a 36,000 mile supply, or 18K per vehicle on the average.

knapp3

Dam, you got vision! Those were good filters, especially the Castrol, and especially at the price Kmart wanted. Good decision.

Americanflag: You want the best? Go with Mobil One and don't look back.

americanflag

is why: I think I trust an aftermarket company other than the car manufacturer to provide a superior filter that will enhance engine life. Why do I say this? Well, the manufacturer is recommending 5W-20 Motor Water for engine oil, why would they use anything but the most basic filter?

And what is the additional cost of the mobil 1 filter? $12 Mobil 1 - $3 Motorcraft = $9 increased cost. $9 X 3 oil changes per year = increased marginal cost of $27 per year. Cost of vehicle is $30,000 including financing costs. I think I'll use the best, and so far I have been very happy with the Mobil 1 (5W-30) oil and the company's candid advice.

knapp3

Good to hear that. I've wondered about thier bypass, but never really had any insight. Glad I stayed with the Motorcraft in those applications.

csandste

if it will physically fit. I've posted my correspondence with Champion Labs on several occasions. I think calling for the small filter simply allows them to call for a single filter across the entire product line.

joatmon

I got wind that my favorite filter (UPF53) was being discontinued, so I stocked up with all I could find. I'm now down to 17 fiters and I change at 8k with Scheaffers #703. So, I've got 136,000 miles worth. Now, I've the 4Runner will just last that long....

Jack

fleetwoodsimca

What we gonna do, if we sell these vehicles before the filters are gone! (:o]

americanflag

about cutting open your oil filters and seeing they are not working. I cut mine open, eyeballed it, and I could see there were a lot of particles caught in there in the 40 to 20 micron range, but I couldn't see any particles under 20 microns. So maybe I will change to a Mobil 1 filter.

bluedevils

When I sold a Ford Contour last year, I threw in the last 2-3 Motorcraft filters and my last few quarts of Mobil 1 oil as a nice parting gift. I don't know if the new owner appreciated it, but it made me feel good.

cutehumor

for example, what to do..if your vehicle is totalled by an accident..you have a ton of oil filters left..do you go out and buy the same exact vehicle and engine size or buy a different vehicle with the same engine?

my 92 mirage would be totalled if a shopping cart hit it. LOL

malachy72

the filters were S/T from Wal-Mart, they would let you exchange them for your current filter!

fleetwoodsimca

Kmart allows returns for refund up to some point in time, beyond which, no more. I have been known to "trade" filters when the remaining stock after a vehicle sale doesn't fit anything I have. Most reputable firms allow filters to come back in exchange for other filters, if no refund is involved. You have to buy enough "new" stuff to at least cover the returned goods.

americanflag

surprise, right?) about which is better: an oil filter that flows more oil or one that filters the oil more finely. I was thinking of going to a Mobil 1 because it filters finer particles, but perhaps the Motorcraft has an advantage of flowing better?

texasjeep

I guess I will have to put my vote towards filters not really making a difference.
I haven't had a chance to read all the post but hope to get around to it.
I always thought Fram was a good oil filter brand.
Then I read the oil filter study and looked for an alternative.
http://www.scuderiaciriani.com/rx7/oil_filter_study/
I didn't find one of the recommended filters locally without doubling or tripling the price I pay now. I am sticking with Fram for now.
I have 198,000 miles and have been using the cheapo Fram filter with castrol 10wX30 for as long as I can remember. Doesn't seem to burn any oil. It smokes occasionally on startup and take off. I am kind of lazy with the 3,000 mile changes and it has been driven hard. I think I will personally know when this engine goes because I am keeping the truck until it does.

bluedevils

everybody here would agree you are better off with a SuperTech from Wal-Mart ($1.97) than a standard Fram. Probably cheaper AND better than the Fram.

bigorange30

Because at $2 a piece or $6 a piece, it doesn't compare to the $30K you might spend on the car. Shouldn't you use what will protect that investment the best whatever the cost in this nickle and dime range?

fwatson

"Because at $2 a piece or $6 a piece, it doesn't compare to the $30K you might spend on the car. Shouldn't you use what will protect that investment the best whatever the cost in this nickle and dime range?"

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OTOH, why pay three times as much for something that is no better. The SuperTechs appear to me to be as good as any commonly available filter out there.

If there is something better it would be in the $12 to $15 range, or a commercial filtering system.

texasjeep

bluedevils
I will look into supertechs. I don't care to ever go inside a wal-mart, so I would have to be able to find supertechs somewhere else.

I guess the 6X range is what I meant. I was wanting to avoid spending $12 vs the $2 I pay now. It was about a year ago when I looked at other filters. Right now I am sticking with what has worked for me. I don't want to spend more money if I don't have to.

armtdm

A previous post stated

"I guess I will have to put my vote towards filters not really making a difference."

Based upon my cutting open too many filters and never seeing any evidence that they are full or plugged up (or even trapping dirt and wear metals) etc I feel that if you change your oil every 3000 miles it doesn't make any differnece what you use for a filter, in fact, IMO, no filter will produce over 100,000 miles in todays engines. Oil does all the work, filters are a useless appendage only good for catastrophic events.

fwatson

I don't know what your bone to pick is with Wal-Mart. But if you have that strong a feeling about Wal-Mart you won't be buying a SuperTech filter.

I'd suggest then that you go to Autozone and get an STP at about $3. They have Bosch also, but they are no better than the STP's and cost 50% to 100% more. Personally, I'd swallow that grudge and slip into and out of Wal-Mart before anybody saw me. It'll save you about 33% on an excellent filter.

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 armtdm

" filters are a useless appendage only good for catastrophic events."

Darn cheap catastrophy insurance at about $4 to $6 a year. If you keep stray metallic fragments out of other parts it can save a lot of money from something going south all of a sudden.

texasjeep

I won't get into the whole wal-mart thing, but part of it is that you don't slip in and out around here. I have better things to do with my time than to stand in line for a 1/2 hour. Since I never heard of superTech, I was thinking it was a wal-mart thing.

I did hear from someone that with today’s engines and roads that you don't need to change filters. I agree that it is cheap insurance and will continue to change my filters.
Although, I think it would be a fun experiment to run without changing the filter. I may have to try it. Not on my Jeep of course, but my 13 year old truck I may not mind doing it. I would think the only way to really know the condition of the engine is by taking it apart?
Anybody want to sponsor me?

bluedevils

I thought your objection was going to be along the lines of 'Wal-Mart puts all sorts of small-town stores out of business in many communities in which it does business.' That would be a totally valid reason for not shopping there!

bluedevils

Your point about spending more for the 'best' filter in light of it protecting such an expensive vehicle is very well taken, and oft-mentioned by different folks here. The flip side is many people have budgets, and if one is constantly spending more $$ for the "best" or most expensive widget, whether for car or home or elsewhere, it adds up. Especially in light of strong evidence that the most pricey filters are truly superior in terms of engine protection and longevity, I think the well-regarded budget filters are a viable and wise alternative for many people.

I've used Mobil 1 filters before and feel they are probably among the best filters available. But I'm not sure if they are really worth the extra money, and I don't use them any more.

americanflag

by someone who used the Mobil 1 filter and then a cheaper filter. Does anyone know if the analysis would show a difference?

Also, how do I get an oil analysis, I am getting interested. Guess I must be becoming a nerd (uh, sorry, no offense, guys...0

americanflag

by someone who used the Mobil 1 filter and then a cheaper filter. Does anyone know if the analysis would show a difference?

Also, how do I get an oil analysis, I am getting interested. Guess I must be becoming a nerd (uh, sorry, no offense, guys...)

bigorange30

http://www.blackstone-labs.com/auto.html

Should I really spend $18 dollars to see if I can save $10 on an oil filter? Have you seen Frank Hunt's filter study? He has taken it offline right now because of very high traffic. I made my decision that the Mobil1 is superior based on his study and am willing to spend a few extra pennies to make sure my oil remains as clean as it can be so that I can maximize the life of my oil. This notion that the filter does nothing is insane. What evidence is there that supports that?