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Comments
I think Toyota's commercials suck and so do Kia's.
As for the Camry I would never buy one its really not my style at all.
As far as comparing Mazda to Daweoo I think its unfair. Daweoo was in the US for 3 years and the president of Daweoo ran out of his own country because of fraud charges.
If Mazda doesn't get its acts together they are going to be like Oldsmobile and just go out of business.
It just doesn't seem Mazda is serious enough dealer wise. They don't treat their customers well enough. I have heard some stories on these boards. Mazda has to get better customer service. Thats a definite. Their on the bottom with Mitsu. It shouldn't be like that. VW even scores higher than them. However I have heard some good stories about Cusomers getting rattles fixed on their 6 so maybe its getting a little bit better but I don't think that much.
Oh yeah...I saw a Green 6 yesterday. So I've seen 3 6's in 6 days.
As I said in my first few posts here, the Mazda6's audience is limited too. Especially in the way the car is being marketed. A sport sedan in the Mazda6's price range has to first be established as a competent family sedan. Then after that has happened they do as Emeril always says "KICK IT UP A NOTCH!!" Mazda has it all backward.
We all know Mazda is not going belly up. I don't even know why anyone would draw that conclusion from my post.
Yeah - might be partially due to their advertising "tactics". Might also be due in part to the "herd mentality" and long-time favorites Camry/Accord/Altima/Taurus, etc.
But - for the most part, there are no "real" incentives from Mazda. Look around - you're seeing up to $3000 rebate OR 0% financing for GM vehicles. Ford will have cash rebates/financing. Dodge too. You don't seem to see that on "foreign/import" makes, though. Although I about fell off my couch the other night when I saw something about a cash rebate (albeit a small one) from Honda, I think it was. Or a down payment match, or something like that (seems like it was only $300 or $500 though).
Consumers today are so used to incentives since they started popping up right after 9/11, that unless you have some - and some GOOD ones at that - and advertise them, they won't even think about, much less consider the other cars. Cash-back and 0% financing are expected these days.
Oh yeah everybody keeps on talking about the Altima that it was in the same boat as the 626: the First generation Altima did do very well. The second generation wasn't recieved well when it debut. Nissan is doing the whole niche thing well something Mazda should be doing right now. Mazda's market share is only 1.4%. Mazda sales were on an uppoint 2 years ago and than the Domestic Big 3 started offering offering big discounts. I don't know if declining Mazda sales have something to do with that or not.
Mazda has no intention of selling the same number of cars as Honda. To position it as a direct competitor invites failure - Honda has the market and their car is plenty good enough to keep it.
The Altima, Accord, Camry & 6. Which of these four things don't go with the other 3?
The number of things wrong with the current situation has to do with the perception of Mazda in the marketplace (the 626? Ewwww), the economy and the niche Mazda is trying to occupy. They'll never be a Honda - and I don't think that's their goal.
Sure - Honda is selling cars in a down economy - but Honda is also the safe bet. Proven (in the extreme) and with a loyal customer base. Mazda's problem is entirely different - essentially the new kid on the block with a car considered by many in the know at least the equal of the best in class. Still - it's unproven. The only thing to fix that is time.
Complain all you want about slow sales. So what? I LOVE the current exclusivity - it's something you simply can't get for nearly any price. I could care if they sell one more as long as I can get support and parts when I need them.
Remember the Ford Contour? It was a fine car that handled well, had nice engines and was a pretty pleasant inexpensive car. But it had a small back seat and the North American market didn't want a family car with a small back seat.
The Hondas/Toyotas/Nissans of the world were able to build a larger family car for North America than they build in Europe and Asia. Mazda just doesn't have the resources to produce different cars for each market.
The Mazda6 is the perfect size for Europe and Asian markets and it is well built and a blast to drive. Notice how the Mazda6 sales overseas are doing fine?
But with the talent in "Ford Far East", Ford needs all the help they can get! The only good parts of their current lineup were masterminded by Mazda, helping them make the Focus and Escape
interior and suspensions.
Making the Rx-8 proves the auto world needs Mazda to stay afloat!
Truth be told, I'm rather fond of the exclusivity too. When we drive around in the 6 we have a car game that goes like this:
"Oh, look! ANOTHER BMW!".
"Oh, look! ANOTHER Mercedes".
Its silly but we get a big kick out of it, particularly when you see several "exclusive" cars in a row.
But I'd gladly give up exclusivity to see Mazda sales go up (at least to the point where Mazda was turning nice profits in NA). This would allow them to keep pouring good products into the North American market.
The Mazda mix of reliablilty/price/fun-to-drive was what made the cars great in the past. Mazda has returned to that mix and it would be horrible if the market didn't suport them.
It would be grand to see Mazda hit the 70,000 or 80,000 mark with the Mazda6. They wouldn't be common and Mazda would make money.
The Accord/Camry/Altima group has been growing in size over the years - and there's no real reason for it. If all the cars were the same size, no one would complain. There isn't an absence of utility - just the perception.
IMHO - the 6 is the perfect size for a sedan.
I also think everyone is all wet on this gloom & doom for Mazda crap. The next Taurus, known as the Futura, will be based on the 6 chassis and I believe there are a total of 10 cars planned to take advantage of the basic 6 design.
It's a BRAND NEW vehicle from a company that hasn't had a winner in this class for the best part of a decade. Opinions do not change overnight.
Besides - the rest of the world has figured it out. The US is just being obstinate.
Yes, and the 3.0L engine in the Mazda 6s is a close relative of the Contour SVT engine, no?
Having said that, I will get a 6, but I am WAITING FOR INCENTIVES. It's only a matter of time (hopefully a short time).
I have been easy on it these 800 miles, but not a feather foot. Seems good to me?
Mark.
I'm happy with my decision, actually more pleased than with my original configuration. This way I get to have everything that I wanted on this car for slightly less money. The black leather is the biggest compromise for me, but I'll adjust. I think it looks better with the dash and it should be easier to keep clean than the lighter color interiors. In the end, it's worth it to have everything else that I wanted and am able to get (now) with this order. I'm glad that I settled that and made a fully informed decision based on my own personal experience. I'm excited!!
I love this car already and can't wait to drive it. After having a (ubiquitous) silver Camry, I'll be happy to own a unique vehicle like my 6. Can't wait til July. Oh, did I already say that? LOL
I put the Sport Grill on my 6s, and LOVE IT! It really carries the color around the automobile.
Good luck keeping it under 80 during break in. This automobile simply wants to fly.
Mark. : )
Mike
I think an ad campaign showing the 6 to be a split personality, something along the lines of 'a car for dad' and 'a car for mom' (maybe that won't be politically correct) but I can see a picture of a 6 on the screen split in half with two different shades (like a night/day commercial) and maybe some academic type, like the one that did the Q45 ads discussing the diversity of the car.... Oh well I guess that's why I don't make the big bucks on Madison Ave.
Personally I wish I had waited for the 6 and not bought the PRO, but I can't afford to trade up right now. I'd like to see this company succeed.
Can you tell me if tommorrow, the 15th of May, is the last day to order (and get the car in for June/July delivery) before production shuts down for a while and the next earliest opportunity to get the car delivered will be Sept./Oct.(2004 model)?
and Mazda's response:
In response to your question, Mazda dealerships can no longer accept
orders for a MAZDA6s manual transmission, with Sports Package. If you
desire such a combination, you must wait for the 2004 model year. If
you would like a MAZDA6 without a Sports Package, the dealership should
be able to order or find the vehicle.
my confusion:
ok, does this mean I can order today, tommorrow, the next day, and so on.. and still get a non-sport version 2003 model within the next couple of months or so?
Where's one of our Mazda experts when I need one?!!
I remember times when buyers had to wait 6 to 8 months for standard models, the way the factory contented them. No discounts! Prices were often over sticker by $2000. It depends on the times and the economy.
Don't worry about the 120 days inventory, Mazda will move them. They always do. There's a glut of cars now and it will take time to shake-out.
fowler3
Starting off with auto transmissions on up to auto climate control, it discourages me to think that the cars available 10-15 years from now might be so automated and dumbed down for the everyday driver, that real drivers will suffer a loss of true drivers' cars. The 6 seems to be the perfect balance and any more technology would really start to dampen the driving experience.
Discuss!
Inventory means squat. They could cut plant production and bleed that off and you'd never know the difference.
I say the car is moving off lots better and better. I'm seeing more and more of them every day.
Chris
What's up with that??? I thought once a VIN was assigned, the build was only a matter of 2-3 weeks.
As someone suggested a few dozen notes earlier; they seem to have it all backwards this time around.
On another issue, I wouldn't prefer a no option vehicle like Honda. That is one reason I've never owned a Honda or the Inifiniti G35. I can't live with a sunroof in most cars. Not enough headroom. I need some optionality. I don't want to be forced to get leather because I want a fog light, as an arbitrary example.. Just my .02 worth.
I commute daily and only get about 20% of my tank on the freeway, the rest is stop/go, light to light driving.
And I love to be first off that line after those lights... So I probably deserve the 19 mpg I'm getting...
To get a Maxima (2002 model, I don't know about this new one) you would have to have EVERY option to get traction control... leather, heated seats, sunroof, top level stereo... the whole nine yards.
I think that's crazy.
I've owned two new cars now with Trac/control and NEITHER of them required leather.
I don't know what you have to get in an Accord to get traction control... I didn't even shop that car.
that's exactly the path Mazda MUST avoid!!!
they tried that during the mid 90's and failed miserably, because they lost their roots in trying to be like Honda and Toyota, and their cars got lost in the shuffle.
they are on their way back to recapture their 'sporting cars' company image from the early 90's, they can't stop now!!!!
May not be worth a whole lot - but it takes away an 'advantage' another car would look to have if the car didn't offer it.
The only problem is that if Flat Rock is operating under the UAW contract that Ford/GM/DC are under, idle workers are still paid something like 95% of their pay sitting at home. If you were to shut the plant today, it would still take until mid September to sell all those cars at the current rate. Of course, production would need to restart a couple of months before September in order to have 2004 inventory.
As for incentives, I recall a Toyota excutive crediting GM and Ford for saving the North American auto industry in the wake of 9/11. If they didn't step up to the plate and lead the way with incentives, many car companies (and associated businesses) would be in deep trouble.
As a Ford shareholder, I want to see Mazda succeed. People here feel they are confused. The enthusiasts here want to see Mazda selling sport sedans. But sport sedans are not a huge market and it is the domain of Acura, Audi, BMW, and SAAB. Mazda has to offer a compelling reason for people to buy their brand over the other brands. Face it, people seriously looking at those four brands aren't going to buy a Mazda without that compelling reason: just a cheaper price isn't it. Further, Mazda can't make it selling 100K $25K units per year.
Others here think Mazda needs to compete head on in the family sedan market. Doing that puts the 6 up against Accord and Camry - a market the 6 is not going to just walk into and take away share without offering again a compelling reason. Accord and Camry lead the market because they offer what the market wants - value and reliability IMHO. Mazda has to show that it offers that as well as something else: and a sports sedan isn't it in the family sedan market.
The important thing to keep in mind is profitability and goal achievement. If Mazda is doing that to it's satisfaction and the satisfaction of their shareholders/stakeholders, what we think really doesn't matter.
I don't think they aren't moving; it's just that they made more of them than there is demand for. I sure hope they make more sport pkgs & V6s for 2004! Is there any indication that they will?
Obviously they are moving but not fast enough if there is 120 days of supply on dealers lots.
From what I heard the mix will change quite a bit for the '04 MY.
Great! Any specifics?
Also, I like certain aspects of the sport pkg, but not all. I assume it's possible to remove the side sills and replace the wing spoiler with a lip spoiler. Do the the two spoilers use the same holes?
Do you know when ordering for the '04 will start?
Any hints about option combo changes for '04 models?
why do we must pay near 30k to get a 'sports sedan', when for around 25k you get a very well equipped sports sedan, minus the the luxury equipments and the 'snob appeal' that these premium brands often carry?
are we equating 'sport' with 'premium'? a la Audi, BMW, Acura, and Saab? Are you telling me that the American's taste for cars is so vain that the only customer segment that cares about sporting elements in a midsize sedan are those that can afford a premium brand?
I remember in the Protege, they used thicker sheetmetal and put in alum. accents.
Are they going to put in more sound deadening material?