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Saturn ION

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  • saturnfreak01saturnfreak01 Member Posts: 134
    Smart decision vuefor2, no need to put yourself or loved ones at risk by driving a car that is produced by a company which has so clearly disregarded the saftey of its customers in the past, aka EXPLODER, and now FOCUS, even years ago the PINTO was all the rage.. but that, was a death trap also. FORD (buy one and you might be FOUND ON ROAD DEAD!
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I am glad you decided not to consider the Focus. I really liked those cars when they came out in Sept. of 1999, right before I got my 99 Protege DX. I almost got a Focus, but had issues with front seat comfort. I am SO glad I didn't now!
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    It's a shame the Focus is not reliable yet as it does win a lot of performance and design awards. The people who work on the Focus should all get canned for this stuff. There is no excuse for it 3+ years after the car came out.

    While I am not a huge Ford fan, they make some pretty cool stuff. Focus is not the company and I hope they can fix the problems they seem to be having as of late.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    the Focus is known for its high reliability in Europe......why the difference in NA?
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    I can't understand it either.

    Clearly there is incompetence at the NA plant.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    It is the assembly plant. I wish I could find the article talking about the Wayne plant. They said there is a high absenteeism rate, lateness, and people generally not caring about their jobs. So it seems the problems are coming from that. They have made alot of changes though, and it's showing in the 2002 MY Foci, from what I have heard.
  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    I read today that even more recalls are possible as there are further investigations pending by various government agencies. It's amazing that anyone would buy a Focus. I guess not everyone reads the news paper.

    Where did the Ion owner go? I never heard any further comments from him?
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I can't believe someone would actually buy a Focus either. It doesn't even have as high a rebate as, say, a Neon does. Also, they are losing resale value left and right because of all the recalls.
  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    Ya, the deals weren't great as far as I can see. You see lots of Focus cars around, they seem to sell in spite of all the recalls so Ford must be doing something right.

    I saw my first Ion on the road yesterday, a gray one. It was sparkling so it must have just gone on the road the same day (it rained the day before).
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    Keep in mind that most rental agencies buy Focuses (Foci?) to put in their fleets. They also seem to be the choice of the cash strapped out there too.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Focus seems to be popular with the "tuner" crowd. I see lots of supped up ones driving around here. Of course I live in Ford Town Canada (Oakville) so maybe that's not normal.

    ION should have a good "tuner" car with the 200hp quad coupe next year.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    200hp quad coupe??? Never heard about that one. Do tell...
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Next year there will be a supped up version of the Quad coupe with a 200 hp turbo charged Ecotec. Looks to be the first "performance" oriented car from from Saturn.

    I hope it's as cool as it sounds.
  • wenbwenb Member Posts: 45
    The quad coupe being sporty will probaly get the performance treatment first. What they should do later is offer a performance version of the sedan that still looks like a clean normal car.Often times to get a performance package, you have to get spoilers ground effects and stuff that more mature or tastefull people don't want.Plus a lot of that stuff adds weight slows the car down and is a problem with long term quality aperance.Nothing grosser than seeing and on side panels fall off.For those who can afford it you should be able to pay extra if needed to leave off some of the ugly stuff.
  • imaddiktimaddikt Member Posts: 15
    mpgman -- The Ion3 is great. It rides so much smoother than my SL2, and the shifting is acutally easier too. It has a better gear shift--a round ball that fits into your hand eaier. It is also easier to push a little farther since the engine is a bit bigger. I like to ride in high RPM's and it can definitely handle it! I haven't had any issues at all, and when I talked to my techs here, they say that they haven't seen anything wrong so far. I know it is early, but they are good at catching that type of thing. We have quite a few Ion's on the lot now, and I am surprised that more retail facilites don't have a larger selection. But at my retail facility we get cars drop shipped directly from Tennessee instead of putting them on a train first then a truck to the store.

    As for the features, they are awesome. I don't have to turn on my lights because it does it for me automatically at night, and when it thinks it is getting darker outside. They have a sensor right on the dash. The instrument cluster in the center of the console also makes it much easier to drive and focus on the road. Better visibility. I no longer have to look through my steering wheel to see how fast I am going! I can now clearly see that I am speeding! I strongly recommend these vehicles. A big step up from the s-series in my opinion--without the large price increase. At least not for what you are getting on this vehicle!

    And don't let other places put you off because there are things added to the vehicle. The reason they add all of that stuff to a mall car is to let everyone see all of the options that they have available on a vehicle. None of it is standard or a must if you are purchasing a car. It just lets people know that they can get interior protection if they would like it. You would be surprised at how many people refuse to purchase a car unless it has all of that added stuff to it.

    Happy shopping and I hope you all at least take a test drive--even if you are not planning to purchase the car. For anyone who has owned a Saturn knows that great "Saturn Experience" and I think everyone should check it out to see how different we really are.

    And as for performance packages--they will be offering them, just as they do on all other Saturns. You just have to check with the Saturn parts department and they can explain everything to you--at least ours offers it. Our parts girl is big into fixing up cars and she has all of the info on it--how to add extra power, ground effects, spoilers, etc.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Thanx for the post. Lots of good info there.

    I will test drive one soon as I would like to see where GM is with small cars now. I was not a fan of the SL but the ION sounds very good.
  • soggydogsoggydog Member Posts: 67
    I went to look at them today and they don't have any in the showroom. They have them all out in the grass, behind the dumpster. The sales rep said they don't have the brochures yet and are waiting for the national ad campaign to kick off or something like that. She said they would go get one if I wanted, but it was raining real hard, so I said, never mind. It makes me think they are trying to push the old stuff.

    Anyone here other than a Saturn sales person own one yet?
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    The local lot still has about 10-12 S-series sedans left in the back last time I looked. The local paper has ads every day giving them away to make room for the IONs. A girl here in the office bought an SL1 last month as the deals were just so good she couldn't resist.
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    Check out Saturnfans. The brochures just came out over the weekend. The web host at saturnfans downloaded them for easy review. The sales launch will probably be starting soon.

    Saturn has only made a few thousand IONs to date. GM is probably letting the factory get production numbers where they need to be before they start a big ION push.
  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    Our Saturn dealer has not received any more since it's initial shipment of 3 Ions.

    I think it will be a few weeks before you see any kind of ad campaign. Production is obviously not up to speed and our sales man said he wasn't sure how long an ordered Ion would take to arrive.
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    On the one hand, a lot of people who know at least a little about the ION are wondering why no marketing push. It is almost natural to begin worrying about a product flaw.

    On the other hand, start a big marketing campaign before product is in place, and a lot of people complain about being suckered into the dealer only to have to wait a few months before getting the product they want.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    I hate it when retailers advertise a product that's in short supply. This goes for department stores and car dealers. I'd rather they had some stock before they do the media blitz.

    Still no IONs up here to be seen.
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Member Posts: 854
    Funny how the Hyundai fan thinks it's bad to ignore Ford's past (Pinto), when Hyundai produced horrid products up until a few years ago. It's OK to forgive an import company, but not domestic?
  • saturnfreak01saturnfreak01 Member Posts: 134
    Ford continues to produce unsafe cars with every passing decade. Hyundai seems to have learned people wont' buy a POS car number one, and its bad business to knowingly produce and sell cars to the public that are unsafe.

    Ford, has known about its problems. AKA EXPLODER, and did not a darn thing about it. If you support hundreds of deaths, go ahead. BUT I sure as heck won't.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    Ford rushed the Focus to market, to try to save their butts. The reason most of the problems with the car weren't caught was because of quality control.

    Hyundai did make bad cars, but they have improved tenfold since their 1995 introduction of the Accent. And they even told the public about the fact that they overestimated HP figures, they didn't have to do that. And they surely didn't have to extend powertrain warranties or offer free roadside assistance for longer periods to make up for it either.
  • afk_xafk_x Member Posts: 393
    "And they surely didn't have to extend powertrain warranties or offer free roadside assistance for longer periods to make up for it either."

    Ummm if they didn't do something they would surely be sued. Not because of unhappy customers but because of money hungry lawyers.

    False advertising anyone?
  • afk_xafk_x Member Posts: 393
    The ION really feels like it could benefit from intake and exhaust modification.

    It feels really strong up to about 4K RPM and after that it just feels choked (for lack of better word)

    Weird because my 137 HP L200 pulls very strong all the way to redline...
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    I dunno, I think I'd still take a Focus over a Hyundia if they were my only two choices.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    You said you wouldn't take a Hyundai because they rust out alot. That doesn't happen here in the US though. Also, your warranties aren't as good as they are here, either. I would take the Hyundai first.
  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    I wouldn't buy either. I don't have much faith in either brand right now. If they were the only 2 on the market I would go Focus also as it's a better rated car over all.

    Rust is a problem in the northern states where there is snow and ice. It's not an exclusive Canada thing vocus. Lots of rusty cars up here also.

    Ion has an advantage as rusty doors won't be a problem.
  • saturnfreak01saturnfreak01 Member Posts: 134
    http://www.autosafetyexpert.com/fire.html


    http://www.indianexpress.com/ie/daily/20001013/iin13012.html


    http://www.carconsumers.com/save_lemon_law.html


    http://www.autosafety.org/


    I just typed in "unsafe fords" on yahoo.com and came up with 20 or so websites, most of these are in reference to a Ford product, one bout the pinto disaster, and the last is about auto safety in general

  • tomcat630tomcat630 Member Posts: 854
    "Ford continues to produce unsafe cars with every passing decade"

    I wouldn't want to be in a Hyundai Accent in ANY accident. And go type in ANY car brand regarding saftey, ANY car is unsafe if rear ended at 70 MPH.

    Saturnfreak, Saturn's parent company, GM made 1973-87 trucks had supposedlky unsafe gas tanks and nobody has called them "murderers".

    None of those websites have merit. False generalizations and if you want to believe anti car/leftist/NBC Dateline propaganda, go ahead. Ford did nothing about the tire problem? What are all those tires in recyle bins? GM did nothing about Corvairs, Vegas, and Citations, that people died in, so they are good guys?
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Saw the first Canadian ION ad today in the National Post. It was advertised with a VUE and an L-series.

    Base Ion with 5-speed manual for C$15,495 less a $500 Christmas bonus. Still no pricing on the Saturn Canada web site though.
  • wwhite2wwhite2 Member Posts: 535
    This an ION forum or bash ford forum ? I thought this was for saturn fans not ford haters?
  • imaddiktimaddikt Member Posts: 15
    Unfortunately retailers have to advertise products because of orders from Saturn, Inc. Of course they want to get rid of older vehicles--anyone would. But they are good deals--if anyone has noticed all of the specials on them. I am not sure where everyone lives, but we have a pretty good supply of ION's here, and they keep coming in on the truck. The reason you don't see as many right now is because Saturn Inc only gives each retailer so many "images" that they can have built and sent to that store. The retailer doesn't always have a choice in the matter. Oh, and push the ION a little harder... mine gets to the red line without choking all of the time.
  • saturnfreak01saturnfreak01 Member Posts: 134
    After all, if one looks back through 50-100 posts, this discussion ultimately came about for certain people comparing hyundai's to Fords, neither of which belong in this room.

    Im all for returning to the ION discussion for this is as WWHITE pointed out, a Saturn supported room.
  • denvaildenvail Member Posts: 3
    The dealer across the street from my workplace has received 10 or so on Wednesday.(Ottawa)
    They are releasing / unveiling them Nov 20th.
    The ION 1 is priced at $16495CDN.
    Test drive is but 3.5 days away!!
  • stuartlasserstuartlasser Member Posts: 4
    Okay, right up front, I'll tell you that I'm a Saturn retailer -- but that's for a point of reference and nothing else. I, along with numerous other Saturn retailers, have spent the last 4 years working with Saturn to develop the ION. It's an excellent car with outstanding handling and ride characteristics. The new IP (instrument panel), smaller steering wheel, and general use of materials has been done extremely well. In scrolling down some of the messages, there were a few questions that I can answer. The new ION Quad Coupe will be out in March. As far as I can recollect at this time, the interior dimensions are pretty much the same as the sedan -- except that the Quad Coupe comes with a fold down passenger seat so you can schlep long itmes in the car. The reason we haven't advertised the cars so far is that we're trying not to screw-up like we've done in the past. Saturn is waiting to get enough IONs to retailers and will begin an advertising campaign after the 1st of the year. This car is a contender!
  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    Like I said before, I'd prefer a wait rather than show up at the dealer and see that they only have 1 or 2 in stock. I've notice our Saturn dealer has about 6 or 7 in stock now so the inventory is definitely building.

    stuart, I'm glad you are enjoying the car. Do you have an automatic Ion, I can't remember? Also, do you know if there will be any introductory specials on financing?
  • stuartlasserstuartlasser Member Posts: 4
    I'm now driving a 5-speed, ION 3 but I just finished putting 1,000+ miles on an automatic. I usually prefer a stick and I still like the control that offers. That said, I actually liked the automatic on the ION and that's pretty unusual for me. I'm going to order a black Quad Coupe for the spring (with some accent roof rails and IP touches) and that will be a stick. As far as introductory stuff, Saturn is already offering 0% financing and will probably have an attractive lease option.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    They are offering 0% on the ION already?
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I think they have 0% on their entire line now, if I am not mistaken.
  • stuartlasserstuartlasser Member Posts: 4
    You are both correct. 0% is on all Saturns and all, except for the ION, are for up to 60 months. The ION is for 36 months.
  • soggydogsoggydog Member Posts: 67
    I just got a flyer from my local dealer offering $2,000 cash back or 0% for 60 months on the closeout S. That don't sound so "special" to me, If I can get the same 0% on a VUE or the L. I guess if I was paying cash, the 2,000 cash back would be attractive.
  • imaddiktimaddikt Member Posts: 15
    Stuart, you are a retailer? Where are you located, if you don't mind my asking... I am also from a retailer. I prefer the manual transmission as well, and to me if shifts much easier than the S-series ever did. The automatics are great--but I like the get up and go of a stick. 0% for up to 60 months is on everything until January 2, 2003--exclusing the Ion. The Ion is 0% for 36 months, 2.9% for 48 months and 3.9% for 60 months. Still not a bad deal for such a new car!
  • stuartlasserstuartlasser Member Posts: 4
    I think the stick is excellent. I've been driving the 5-speed for about a week or so and have 400-500 miles on it. It's broken in very well and I'm enjoying it more each day. That said, I still like the automatic and that's very surprising for me as I always prefer stick. I'm a retailer in NJ and have been since launch in 1991. What retail facility are you from?
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    The deals just aren't as good up here as car sales are stronger so incentives aren't needed as much. Last time I checked the VUE was 3.9% for 48 months, no big deal. The old L-series were at 0% for 48 but the new ones aren't. Nothing listed in the ION ads I've seen so far.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Saw in the paper some pricing has been announced.

    C$15495 for ION 1
    C$17795 for ION 2
    C$20150 for ION 3

    Not bad at all. Have to see the option pricing to be sure though. Big ads in the local paper so the marketing looks to be gearing up finally.
  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    If they had 0% for 48 or 60 months, that could get me in for an Ion in December. My wife is liking the Corolla better but a low rate offer like 0 will be hard to pass up. I would love to have a new car for the winter driving.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    Certainly exchange any information you'd like via email, but please don't start posting contact specifics such as where you work. Those kinds of messages are seen as soliciting around here, which is expressly forbidden by your Membership Agreement.

    Email me if you have any questions. Thanks!!

    :-)
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