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bigdaddy : The VUE is due for a refresh next year so it will likely be better than the current model. It also gets a new Honda engine option which some people will like (though I don't).
As for the "Saturn experiment", GM should absolutely not walk away Saturn. It's the only domestic division that grabs import and younger buyers in significant numbers, it tops the satisfaction survey year after year and it always ranks high in dealer surveys also. GM should get the SKY , the mini van and L-series replacement out ASAP, and fix up the interior of the VUE. They have a great name, they just need some great cars and sales will take care of them selves.
I personally want Saturn to succeed, and while I may leave the brand for something overseas I still view my Saturn experiences as positive overall.
from this accused eccentric,,,, I LOVE MY ION!!
Enjoy your car and ignore the armchair critics.
Personally I will never forgive GM for pumping billions into Saturn while killing Oldsmobile. If they hadn't gradually let Olds wither away there would be no need for a Saturn division. And the Oldsmobile that used to be would never have created a car with so many off-putting elements as the Ion. If that car is what we former Olds loyalists are now supposed to buy according to GMs way of thinking, no wonder the company is struggling.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
That said, Saturn doesn't carry the stigma Olds carries. Some people are still puzzled that I drive an Olds and think I'm nuts until they actually sit in the car and realize the last generation of Oldsmobiles were modern and wonderful cars.
I think Saturn has a lot of promise if they can get some product out soon. I like the ION and VUE. In fact the VUE may just be our next vehicle. I only hope the coming L replacement and van are even better and perhaps a little more upscale inside than the current L is.
I really can't understand people like "Regfootball" and "Drivinisfun". These guys have never driven an ION and they bash it because in their mind it's quirky because it has a center IP and some accent accessories they don't like. There are still others that bash Saturn because they are good to their customers and like to advertise that fact, boy what a sin! Then there are other who predict Saturn is in "serious trouble". Please folks, give it rest!!
To the arm chair critics, go test the ION before you bash it. You have zero credibility here in my eyes until you do. The car is hardly quirky, just a little different and some people don't like to have everything the same as every other car on the market thank you. As for Saturn's supposed demise, I can tell you that our Saturn dealer is selling lots of cars and Saturn sales were up last year. Now that the ION is finally being advertised, I'm sure sales will only get better.
Regfootball, I'll ask you this again. If you hate Saturn soo much, why do you spend soo much time here? You really need to get a hobby.
I like the ION and would definitely consider it if I was buying a small car today. I want to test one some day soon so I can see for my self if it rides as well as you say.
All I am saying is that I do not see things turning around for Saturn in the immediate future. Yes, sales were up last year but only because of the VUE. And the upcoming Equinox will steal some of the VUE sales. The L has been a financial disaster from the start - that is a fact.
As for the ION, I generally like the car. It is by far the best small sedan GM has but not a class leader either. And I have driven an auto and a manual. I would imagine that it will sell over 100k annually and maybe even reach the 150k goal but will never reach the 200k mark of the S.
bigdaddy : The VUE is doing well (ahead of target) and I think when it gets a refresh next year it will be even better. Keep in mind also, the NOX only has a V6 motor and VUE has a 4 cyl which competes better with the other 4 cyl. small SUVs.
I also see your point about loading up other economy cars. Especially Hondas. Boy, do they get expensive for the EX models!
I'd bet the big GM machine is even too big for Lutz to make a huge difference.
regfootball : You are dreaming if you think this is the way to voice your bashing to GM. Try the direct approach instead of antagonizing the ION owners here.
ecrire2 : Congrats on the new ION.
Vocus - I agree, I like the economy and some luxury features mixed together. Of course, I would never go nuts and get a top of the line Ion either.
.0O(Hmmmmmmm) I don't think the GM exec is really paying attention to two guys rambling on trying to ruffle feathers of ION customers instead of reading the opinions of customers that have actually purchased the ION. If so they have bigger problems than trying to use their resources.
Logic : Sales are up in a down market. Ion sales seem to be ramping up nicely. Saturn is a great little division. If it weren't there we would have bought the Corolla.
Regfootball : Get a hobby.
The GM execs should be spending their time listening to people who DID NOT buy the Ion. That would be a lot more useful.
Also, don't think that companies don't pay attention to BBS comments. I am on close personal terms with a major motorcycle manufacturer and they watch the related boards very closely to see what their customers and potential customers are thinking.
I don't think GM spends much time (if any) monitoring these boards. It's not really all that useful.
Look, you are in a minority. You can cry all day long chanting the virtues of the ION but the reality of it is that the car is a FLOP and has been blasted by the automotive press left and right. There are people that defend their Yugos to this very day so there are a group that will defend their ION's...you are clearly one in the same.
This car is not in the radar screen of the general buying public with the exception of hardcore Saturn fans and loyalists.
I still contend that GM WASTED the DELTA platform in this abominable looking car. Chevy desperately needs a replacement for their 22+ year old J-body Cavalier and the DELTA car is what they need. Had this car been given to Chevy instead, today we would have seen a much nicer and clean executed vehicle, not this disjointed fugly ION contramption.
See my MINI has also a center IP but it is TASTEFULLY EXECUTED WITH WORLD CLASS MATERIALS AND DESIGN.... right there lies the difference folks!!!! (www.miniusa.com)
But for some of you a mediocre executed vehicle will do and this is the type of customer Saturn is very happy to cater to. For the rest of us that appreciate tasteful design, worldclass engineering and quality, Saturn miserably fails to meet these expectations.
I drove an ION3 last week as I had promised a few months ago. Did not care for the thing at all. Pretty clumsy handling and very average ride quality. I absolutely detested the "Marshmellow" shaped steering wheel and the cheap interior materials.
Some of you "Experts" need to spend some quality time in an European or Japanese made vehicle to wake up from the Saturn "Trance".....LOL!
Regfootball: Keep it up buddy!
I don't think GM spends much time (if any) monitoring these boards. It's not really all that useful."
You are dead wrong mi amigo.....
GM as every other manufacturer out there does spend a substantial amount of time monitoring these and other car internet based boards and forums. Many of them pay people to read and monitor message boards on a 24/7/365 basis...trust me on this pal.
I have posted in the Impala forum for a very long time and have been contacted by GM before due to posts in that thread.
Dindak, do you live in Disneyland by any chance?
Everyone has the right to buy what they like, and that is all that truly matters. The opinions of others are irrelevant.
Everyone is also entitled to his or her opinion< which none of us have to agree with.
Lastly, I Just bought my third saturn> but it was not an ion
I bought a 2003 L200 automatic, premium special edition in silver. It includes heated leather seats< power drivers seat< crome clad wheels< sunroof< foglamps< six disc cd changer< cassette < and all for 16795 before taxes and an additional 2 year warranty coverage I added on
They are free to keep repeating the same points, but there is little value in responding unless they actually have something new to say.
Of course, the MINI is ugly as sin. Just MHO.
I agree man, it really gets old when the same Aztek design inspiration gets recycled and passed down onto other cars...
Umm yea, and the ION must be such a work of art that deserves a display spot in the Louvre museum in Paris.
Yeah whatever pal, you are still in the minority...
hey man, I love your comments....lots of truth there.....
dindak says I'm offensive......why do some think its personal? No motivation to attack people......this isn't about people.....Heck its not personal in any way, if some think it is then they are being paranoid.....its intended as constructive criticism (as in 'get a clue' for GM on why a lot of folks won't look at a car like the Ion. I surely am not out to discourage someone from buying one if they like it. I sure as hell have no right to tell people what to like or do with their dinero.
HOWEVER
that will not prevent me or anyone else from discussion or criticism of a car's failures and successes. In the case of the Ion it is pretty easy to itemize the reasons why this car will not be greatly accepted in the market compared to other competition. It may not mean the car is a complete flop, but again, as I said, the issues with this car glow like Neon at the 50's diner.
As far as car company people monitoring the message boards....it does indeed happen. One of the mags or journals had a piece on line about how the auto companies are gaining a lot of insight and info from a lot of different message boards. If I remember correctly, I have also seen some posts or emails posted in some our edmunds boards from reps of manufacturers who have jumped in with feedback and comments. It may have been the Mazda 6 board I saw that on.
As far as driving the Saturn, I could drive it. I actually would bet its a solid decent driving car. I don't think I can rip that aspect of the car too much aside from its slower than it ought to be. The problems with the Ion and market perception are most than powertrain. Those items are easy enough to spot from seeing one, sitting in one, and general press consensus.
Besides, if I did take one out I would be embarassed to ask the sales rep for a towel when I got back from the drive. The interior is repellant to me to the point that I might yack all over myself.
Lest you say I bash Saturn exclusively, I'll let you know I do like the L series, and the Vue is ok except the interior on that is a bit below par.
Hang in there Vuefor2, If all the people I have seen driving around in ION's start posting messages then the only minority around here will be the "boys" without hobbies.
>Umm yea, and the ION must be such a work of art >that deserves a display spot in the Louvre >museum in Paris.
>
>
>Yeah whatever pal, you are still in the
>minority...
Had you read my post, you would have noted that I was not comparing the looks of the mini to the Ion. You seemed to have inferred that somehow. I was just commenting that I find the mini ugly.
Upon reflection, however, what I should do is go over to the mini forums and and talk about how ugly the mini is and how pretty some other vehicle is. Seems to work for you. :-)
Your posts are unconstructive and do nothing for anyone here. Bashing owners does nothing but hurt your silly "cause". I think you post just to make yourself feel important and good about your Mini purchase. What a joke!