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Comments
what colors looked good?
are they worth 7k over MSRP?
I am in Iraq and have been following the Solstice (on my off time). A dealer in the ATL area said he might be able to get me one ... if I would pay him 5-7K over MSRP! :mad:
I then saw an Military Overseas Car Sales Trailer at Camp Victory, in Baghdad, Iraq and was able to reserve one for only $1,000 down and the remainder due when I come home. I reserved a FULLY loaded Sly with the two tone interior for just over $23K (bottom line), which is about 2 K under MSRP.
Great Forum
I am glad GM is doing this.
I would willingly pay more for my Solstice if the premium is being used to give our people in Iraq a bonus when them come home.
So how about it: is there any decent roadster driving country there? Or is it all flat and dry?
Solstice was a great ride and overall package!
By what measure?
seems at the momemt Mazda seems to be the one concerned most about the solstice from a pure price and public appeal perspective....the S2K....is priced well above the solstice....however it does seem most of the solstices are being ordered fully loaded....coming in between 23-25k before tax and tags.....mine fully loaded with all but two options.....is close to 26K driving off the lot.....
Better how? Steering reponse? Shifter? Balance? Perceived power (torque)? Style? Top operation? Ergonomics? Value? Gas mileage? Comfort? Reliability? Features/content?
For some reason, I get irritated when a salesman just makes a blanket assessment that Car "A" is 'better' than Car "B" with absolutely no discussion of how the vehicles were judged.
Overall impressions—It’s gorgeous, the size is perfect, it sounds great, and handles like a dream. It has a more substantial look than either the Miata or the Honda. Has heft to it, more like a Boxter or Carrera. The single word that now comes to my mind regarding the Sol is substance. This is not a weak or flimsy little car.
Exterior—Forget your concerns about the roof or all the add-ons we’ve been seeing (the flying buttress bumpers, weather stripping, antenna, GM badge, etc.). Your overwhelming impression is the car’s beauty and you don’t notice the add-ons. Sure, I don’t love the GM badge either, but it’s unobtrusive and, at least on mine, I’ll leave as is. I like the roof, it has a substantial feel, very thick cloth. The glass window is sturdy and well integrated into the roof. While there was some of the waviness we’ve seen on the buttresses, IMHO it in no way detracts from the car’s overall stunning look. Even the ends of the buttresses were fine (something I had been very concerned about after seeing the close-up photos here on the forum, which looked terrible to me). When you see the car you don’t notice these things, and looking closely it looks just fine. Fit & finish also looked fine, though I honestly didn’t spend a lot of time looking for problems as these were test mules. Every color is a winner. I’m glad I was forced to choose before seeing them because in person this would have been a very tough choice. No one will be disappointed with their color choice. Mysterious and Envious are very dark, would have been great choices. Black is stunning. Red, Cool, and Pure are exactly what you’d expect. My color, Sly, was what I had hoped. I had been very curious about what shade of gray Sly would be, as I’ve been noticing many different shades in cars on the road, from reddish/brown-tinted gray to blue-tinted. Sly is smack dab in the middle. Essentially a darker version of Cool, with neither red nor blue hues. All the cars had polished wheels, which looked very nice.
Interior—I’m very impressed with the interior. Ergonomically perfect, everything close by, easy reach, right where you want it. Solid feel for the most part (the drink holders are a bit flimsy), steering wheel is solid, seats support well, all knobs and handles feel substantial, gauges look great. I’m 5’10”, about 190 lbs., my sense was that folks bigger than I will have no trouble. I rode in a cloth seat version, and the cloth also felt substantial, and looked great. Very understated texture. Most had black leather, which have a classic, understated look. Some folks won’t like the two-tone, which is what I ordered in my Sly. The gray is a gun-metal color, a strong hint of blue, and lighter than I expected, confirming some of the fears expressed by some of you here earlier. I personally like it, but some of you may not. It should stay a bit cooler than the black. Radio fascia well coordinated with the rest of the dash. My only qualm is the organization of some of the knobs on the dash. Other than the row of three large dials, the rest look somewhat randomly placed.
The Ride—Scott drove the car harder than I think I ever will mine. Accelerated hard, cornered hard, and braked hard. I would score acceleration a B+, cornering and braking solid A’s. Again, I wasn’t driving, but the Sol has a balanced feel that is very evident on the corners and in hard braking. The sound was more impressive—throatier—than I expected, especially when the revs got up there. The car also handled the speed bumps which they had set up very solidly. This will be a blast to drive!
One comment however - this 'first impressions' report was from an individual who shall soon be a Solstice owner. While I appreciate the frankness of a few of the comments, would it be unreasonable to assume this person might be a bit predisposed to really really like the Solstice?
Don't misunderstand - I'm not a huge S2000 fanboy. I think the Solstice has it all over the S2k in both interior and exterior style (S2k is a bit boring on the outside and I HATE the dash). I also think the S2k could use a bit more ooomph in torque (although this was improved greatly with the change from a 2.0 liter to a 2.2 liter engine). But the S2k is still widely regarded as one of the 'best' roadsters available regardless of price and compares very nicely with a Boxster S.
If GM has managed to make a 'better' roadster than the S2k, and do it for several thousand less, I'll be surprised.
Braking, suspension travel, overall quality of components and balance in the S2000 more than likely will be better than the Solstice/Sky and MX5.
It should be that way. The S2000 is a more expensive, more exclusive car.
But not everyone wants to pay that $10k premium.
What I want from my Solstice (or Sky -- I'm still so confused :confuse: ) is 23k worth of competence. The fact that I'll have a better looking car is gravy on the plate. I'll respect that the fellow roadster lover who popped more for an S2000 or a Boxster has the overall better performer. But I would like to think at least I would be driving something that made the more elite car driver crack a smile.
Is a stripper version of the forthcoming Solstice Coupe with either the 2.0 litre supercharged - about 210 h.p., or the rumored 2.4 turbo with 250 h.p.
The coupe will be somewhat cheaper, more rigid and lighter than the convertible. If GM were real daring, it could offer a bare bones model, a-la the new Lotus Elise, with just enough to be street legal.
Given the overall competence of the Kappa platform, you might have something that would be a bear for commuters but could really light up the more expensive competition at somewhere around 25k.
But not everyone wants to pay that $10k premium."
Absolutely. And for someone who only wants to spend 20-25k on a new car, the Solstice would be the 'better' vehicle. But if someone were prepared to spend as much as 40-50k on a vehicle, the S2000 may be the 'better' car. Value is a huge part of what goes into a car buying decision but what constitutes 'value' varies significantly from buyer to buyer.
"The coupe will be somewhat cheaper, more rigid and lighter than the convertible. If GM were real daring, it could offer a bare bones model, a-la the new Lotus Elise, with just enough to be street legal."
Yes, that would be awsome. And completely out of character for GM. Why put something on the market for 25k which could potentially embarrass their own Corvette? Particularly if they sell as many Solsti as they can make without going to that?
I am worried about this kind of thinking as well.
My hope is, some combination of the Kappa being Lutz' baby, and the GM performance team looking to spread their influence throughout the company will carry the day. I am not holding my breath. Seems to easy a plan to pass up though. But then, we all know how many cool might have beens are listing in GM's wake.
er, yep, I never noticed that on the website - I assumed they would do a power roof
Looks, handling, etc.
The S2000 only has more horsepower.
I thought it looked better, had better torque, handled better on the course, a lot cheaper, options are options, not a buy it now this is all you get!!!!
the premise to do a base roadster for 20K wouldnt allow for an automatic roof that would collapse into the clamshell in the back and then close .....all in all not a problem with this driver.....eagerly awaiting his roadster to arrive!!
Looked better? IMO, yes. I think it is heads and shoulders more stylish than the S2000.
A lot cheaper? Absolutely.
Had better torque? Hmmmm, well the two cars are within 25lbs of each other on curb weight. And the Solstice is rated at 4 more ft/lbs. But, isn't the S2000 geared a bit lower than the Solstice which should mean that torque at the driven wheels would be a bit higher? I dunno, I haven't driven a Solstice so you could be right. But I would be surprised if the Solstice could post a better 5-60 time than an S2000.
Handled better? I'm going to refraim from comment until I can read a review from a bit more qualified and unbiased reviewer than a Pontiac salesman.
Options are options? Well, this cuts both ways. With the Honda, you choose color and that's it. You don't have to scour the country looking for THIS color with THAT package and THIS option with THOSE wheels. Yes, you have the opportunity to get just exactly what you want, no more or no less, BUT the reality is that (at least initially) buyers will just have to pick from whatever is available.
But I'll certainly give you the cheaper and more stylish argument. And I'll also agree that for a vast majority, this would qualify the car as 'better' than the S2000.
The referenced confusion was (and still is) whether I want the Sky or the Solstice.
There is a lot to be said for either design.
Maybe I should buy one of each :P
With the Saturn rep for customer service and freindliness combined with the excellent new vehicles look for some production volume increase.
It does not state what the minimum octane rating is. I'm sure it's at least mid grade.
I can wait for next year. By then I might have smartened up enough to buy a used CTS-V - hopefully one bought for a wife who decided against the stick. :-)
Am not sure my lower back can handle the likely low seating position of the Solstice, combined with the shifting. And I'd hate to buy it in an automatic. We'll see. But if a Pontiac dealer wanted my order, I'd place one right now.
Provided I could get one in red.....no, blue....aieeeeeeee
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Is it closer to the Honda S2000 with light feel and snick-snick rifle lock action, more like the kinda numb, grungy cable feel the Cobalt offers, or inbetween?
and, just curious...
is a Solstice the star at this years GM'S AUTOSHOW IN MOTION ? I.E., will there be one at the show we can actually __drive__ ?
all the reviews state the shift is short throw and concise....there is another forum you can see more information of the solstice but I cant post it here...PM if you are interested.....I dont think you will see it at the autoshow..unless it is a mule or engineering model...the production models are just leaving the plant and headed to dealers as we type this....the first ones should be hitting this week or next...but all are part of the early order program and are sold.....so I doubt you will get a test drive....patiently waiting on mine..probably will not see it till late Nov early Dec...
The Honda has a six gear set up, the Solstice a five.
Power windows are available if you want them.
Take the time and go look at one when they are in.
Yes, I know power is an option. But it's a sign of where they consider the Solstice in the market. Not competing with the S2000, but apparently with a $12k Civic. (And even the del Sol had power windows standard with the base model.)
So, you are welcome to tell yourself that domestic brands are just as reliable or well-built, but you might as well tell yourself grander tales and really get something out of your fantasies
I don't care what the base model offers, as long as I can get the options I want. I'd rather have the option to buy AC or other items than have them forced down my throat ala Honda. ("You want leather? You have to order a sunroof")
The Solstice will compete just fine with the Miata. It doesn't need to compete with the S2000 as they will sell at far different price points.
I can't comment on your reliability comment. Al I can say is "we'll see." I don't believe the "new" GM vehicles (i.e. the Cadillacs) suffer the same reliability problems that the old GM vehicles did. The CTS is as good as anything in its class. Let's hope the Solstice is. The best way to keep the Japanese and Euro car companies honest is to have good competition from GM (and Ford, etc.). Better American cars will beget better German and Japanese cars. The consumer wins if GM can succeed.
Most roadster sales are stale right now....ask a Z4 or an S2K dealer.....the Solstice should help bring the entire market back again......Im still amazed at the number of people who havent seen or heard of this car..despite a pretty big marketing compaign on this car.....will eagerly await the automotive mag reviews and comparisons.....from what the forums are saying...it beats the miata in power (HP and torque) and ergonomics (cockpit about the size of a Z4).....S2K has more power...but is in a slightly different price class as well...for a 20-25k roadster..I think GM hit right on....only time will tell for reliability......and yes I have one on order!!!
GM is still living from is bad experience of design and manufacture from years past....driving a GM now..(04 Chevy)....very happy with it....the design, the comfort, economy and price.....resale value...doesnt factor in with me..I drive them well over 100K where resale and trade in values arent an issue....
and after both a toyota and honda (late models) had transmission and electrical problems.....I came back to american!
Club racing is a popular and growing hobby for many.
Club racers throw out power accessories and air con when they tune their machines. Club racers appreciate the opportunity to buy a machine without the add ons. The base Miata will not have a/c for that very reason.
JD Power is not the only organization to rate recent GM products high. CR has chosen several GM products as best buys.