Inconsiderate Drivers (share your stories, etc.)

magnette

I drive a Fiat Seicento Sporting, which is a small (even by European standards) 2 door hatchback - 1107cc, 10foot 6 inches long, topspeed about 91 mph, 0-60 12.1 seconds - theoretically. However, while the above sounds dire, it handles like a go-kart in city traffic, it's half an inch narrower than a Smart, and the real killer is the 55 mpg dropping to around 40 in town - petrol prices don't worry me so much....
Having said that, petrol is somewhat more here than you guys pay - last week I filled up for 93.9pence per litre, and I saw it for sale on a motorway at 99.9p. To do the maths, I think 93.9ppl works out at about £3.55 per US gallon, and with exchange rate at $1.8596 to the £ that would be about $6.60 (I think).
Most of that is tax, of course. We probably pay about the same as you excluding the tax- until last year Britain was a net exporter of fuel thanks to the North Sea.

The other car in my life is a 1955 MG magnette, a saloon, but it isn't roadworthy at the moment following years of neglect, caused by various house moves, etc., and it needs a new cylinder head, clutch, 5 tyres, and a rewire...(I try not to think about it).

magnette

The main opposition party here in UK has recently proposed a few measures to make it more 'driver friendly', one of which would be to allow drivers to treat a red light as a 'Give Way" sign, and turn left if nothing was coming - obviously you have to remember we drive on the left...It hasn't been well received in the press because of concerns about vulnerable users like cyclists etc, as unlike boulevards in LA, our roads are generally quite narrow, and are shared by the aforementioned cyclists, pedestrians can cross without hinderance on most streets, unless the authorities have installed railings, etc , and so on. Do all your states now allow right turn on red, or is that restricted to a few ie California?
Slightly more popular are plans to make bus lanes operate only at peak hours, (some are 24/7 at present), but to allow overtaking on either side on Motorways and other multi-lane roads has met with considerable opposition because of fears over accidents.
I know conditions in US are different because you have wider roads with more lanes, but is it still acceptable to pass on either side on your freeways? When I was there a few years ago I found that quite unnerving, although it wasn't helped by the fact that to my eyes you all drive the wrong way round anyway...

snakeweasel

Do all your states now allow right turn on red, or is that restricted to a few ie California?

All states allow right turns on red.

but is it still acceptable to pass on either side on your freeways?

As long as you stay on the marked pavement you should be ok.

docnukem

but is it still acceptable to pass on either side on your freeways?

Legal, yes, but still darn inconsiderate many times (such as when many are waiting to pass a slow vehicle, and some yahoo decides his time is more important than those in the line/queue). The real problem is that some people make it necessary (to pass on the right) as they stay in the left lane even when they are not passing. This is also legal, but even more inconsiderate.

carlisimo

Turning right on red is normal for us, but you're right it does cause close calls when pedestrians and cyclists are involved. In a city, you have to be really careful as a driver and not everyone is. (And many traffic lights have "no turn on red" signs where it's believed to be risky.)

As for passing on both sides of the freeway... I hear it was better 10 years ago, but when I learned to drive 6 years ago it wasn't obvious to be that the left was faster. Imagine a world where only 50% of the population was taught to pass on the left, and half of those don't care.

I wasn't taught to pass on the left. I was taught "don't go above 65," and "if they're speeding, they're bad and it'd be silly to yield to them." Everyone's taught that way, even if parents sorta slip in a hint to drive the usual 5-10 over. But they're too scared to say it outright, with all the teen deaths on the road.

Trucks slow down the right lane or two below the other lanes' speed, but other than that it's not obvious that left lanes go any faster than middle lanes. But that's not universally true. It IS true during heavy or even medium traffic. In light traffic it's true on certain freeways, but not all of them. Some freeways seem to be pretty organized all by themselves, and some don't. One of the local freeways sees real speeds of 65 on the right, 95 on the left, and it's so smooth that there's not much police enforcement (280 between San Jose and Palo Alto). But not far from it is a freeway with drivers doing 55mph to 85mph in any of the three lanes (880 near San Jose).

mark156

Do all your states now allow right turn on red, or is that restricted to a few ie California?

Magnette, from what I understand, New York city doesn't allow right turn on red. It's usually ok unless otherwise posted anywhere else in the country.

I am thinking strongly of taking an apartment in London for about two/three months (maybe next year). I WILL NOT drive there, cabs or a car and driver will be the only way. I just don't think I can handle driving on the "wrong" side ( :P ).

A couple of years ago, I had taken the "maiden" voyage of the QM2 from NYC to Southampton... then, a Rolls and Driver to London... the driver was talking about the "Lorries"... (2 hour ride?) I learned right quick that those are the tractor-trailer trucks. :confuse:

One of the problems that we have in California that I don't understand, is that motorcycles can pass in-between lanes. I was driving recently in the HOV lane (Hi-Occupant-Vehicle---usually 2 or more people) and a motorcycle comes between me and the car next to me driving and I'm cruising at 80 miles an hour. I absolutely didn't see this guy pass me on the passenger side then he whips right in front of me. I just can't feel sorry for the cycles that get hit, it should be illegal to do that! :surprise:

Mark156

snakeweasel

Turning right on red is normal for us, but you're right it does cause close calls when pedestrians and cyclists are involved.

Not only that but people making a right turn on red pull out in front of cars going through the intersection. More than once I have seen people making the right turn get hit by traffic with the green light, and I barely missed those idiots far to many times. :mad:

euphonium

While making a Left turn on a Green Left turn arrow, The car across the steet tries to make a Right on his Red light and thinks he has the right of way. More confusion especially when there is only one lane to merge into. :mad:

snakeweasel

It also happens to me when I have a green arrow and I am makeing a U-turn. Cars turning right aren't expecting U-turns, so they don't even bother stopping at their red while making a right... they just expect that everone with the green arrow will continue through the left turn...

Here is a problem, you have a dedicated left turn arrow so there is no through traffic so some times the cross traffic may have a green right turn arrow.

carlisimo

I think he's talking about when the guy turning right (while you're making a u-turn) has a red light. Not a red arrow, but a normal red light that's legally light a stop sign if he's turning right.

snakeweasel

I know thats what he was talking about. I was just throwing that example out because many people who would do a U-turn on a left turn arrow will be in that situation.

snakeweasel

Thats not the case around here, many intersections have a dedicated right turn green arrow (if there is a dedicated right turn lane) when cross traffic only has a left turn green arrow. Few, if any, of these intersections are marked "NO U-TURNS".

magnette

When you come to London, you won't need a car if you are staying in the middle of town, it is impossible to park there and traffic is pretty bad most of the time - I wouldn't get a car if I was staying in central NYC either. But if you want to get out into the country, a car would be really useful - our railways only go to certain main towns, and they are suffering from decades of underinvestment, so they are not reliable, although they are getting better....
I've always found it ok driving on your side of the road, after the first mile or two, but where I have generally fouled up is with 'anonymous' bits of road ie carparks in shopping areas etc and gas stations. Once I go into one of those, ie a big expanse of concrete where you can go where you like, I tend to revert to my default setting and try to drive on the left, which is disconcerting for the other users of said car park...
Somewhere in Arizona I came out of a diner one morning through the entrance, and was starting to turn left, in a daydream, into oncoming traffic, but my other half started yelling at me (she was more awake) so we averted disaster..
I always thought it would be even worse with a British car on foreign roads, ie in Europe, because I'd be in my own car, and hence even more likely to go wrong, but I've never taken my own car abroad yet, so I don't know.
The very first time I ever drove on the (wrong) ie right side of the road was in Union Sq SanFrancisco, picking up a rental car from Alamo, and it was a bigger car than we had ordered so it felt like a bus. I remember going over the Golden Gate about half an hour later, thinking I was straddling two lanes, but I got used to it.
We have a lot more people on our roads with the steering wheel on the wrong side of course because there are many foreign registered cars running around, and half the lorries on our main roads seem to be foreign registered, so they have some difficulies with blind spots - if passing one (on the right) it is not unknown for the guy to start pulling out because a car is down below his line of sight which can be interesting...
Re your point concerning motor bikes cutting between lanes that isn't allowed here, although tolerated in slow moving traffic, but it frequently happens.

snakeweasel

When you come to London, you won't need a car if you are staying in the middle of town, it is impossible to park there and traffic is pretty bad most of the time -

Same thing here in Chicago, there are people that don't even own cars living in Chicago. Usually they will rent one if they are going out of town. Public transportation in the city is great and the train system between the city and the suburbs are second to none (many lines you can set your clock to the trains). However public transportation between and within most of the burbs is pretty much non existent.

I always thought it would be even worse with a British car on foreign roads,

I will say this, my sister is a rural mail carrier in Colorado and she drives a car with right hand drive. I find it strange driving her cars.

magnette

I've seen a site that sells ex US Mail jeeps here as they are RHD...Don't think I've actually seen one on the road though.

One other idea re traffic lights that has been kicked around for years but nobody will implement it is for all lights on 'quiet' junctions to switch over to flashing amber at night, so traffic would have to stop, then give way to cars from the right ( as on roundabouts). If it was a busy junction though, then it would stay on the usual sequence of red/amber/green. I think this would make sense in those areas where traffic is only busy at certain times of day, as it is infuraiating to pull up and wait through a complete set of lights when you are the only car in site, but it wouldn't work in most town centres..

I just mentioned roundabouts. Do you guys have these in your various states? I can't remember seeing one in the times I've been driving - only in western states though..

snakeweasel

One other idea re traffic lights that has been kicked around for years but nobody will implement it is for all lights on 'quiet' junctions to switch over to flashing amber at night,

There are a few like that here, but with increased technology what has happened is that they have sensors in the roads prior to the intersections that sense traffic that control a traffic signal. At intersections that have little traffic at nights (or other times) the road with the most traffic will get a constant green light and will only change if a car on the other street approaches the intersection.

I just mentioned roundabouts. Do you guys have these in your various states?

Yes we do but they are few and far between. There is one near where I grew up and must have gone through it a few thousand times.

carlisimo

In San Francisco it's common to find yourself driving against traffic (or just plain lost), so don't feel bad about that. Hard city to drive in, though a car's more necessary than in some other big cities.

Shifting with my left hand is what would worry me the most. I have some sort of practice with Japanese arcade games, but they don't have clutch pedals and it must be weird moving both limbs on the same side of your body. (At least in my car where there's too much clutch pedal travel and my whole body moves as I shift.)

fintail

An observation from today - Lexus SUVs are the bane of my existence.

I saw a hilarious episode of incompetency today. I am two cars behind a dirty white 80s Porsche 911 Targa at a red light. When the light turns green, the drivers stalls it...several times. The driver (shockingly a 20 something woman) then gives up and storms out of the car, and her male passenger takes over as she sulks to the passenger seat. Perhaps a crowded hilly area is not a good place to learn a manual? Oh yeah, and all of us (10 cars lined up by then) missed the green light because of her.

snakeweasel

An observation from today - Lexus SUVs are the bane of my existence.

For me its Land Rovers.

I had a similar thing happen to me over the weekend. Happened to be a few cars behind a Citroen 2CV (or is it CV2?) and while they were able to get the car going maybe to 25 MPH they would suddenly stall and drop in speed. So we had this line of cars gradually gaining speed then stopping over and over again.

tallman1

We have several roundabouts in my area of western Washington and more are being added all the time. Some people love them and some hate them. Many still haven't figured out how to use them. It makes for interesting reading in the letters to the editor section of the newspaper.

docnukem

An observation from today - Lexus SUVs are the bane of my existence.

For me its Land Rovers.

For me, it's Buicks--all shapes and sizes. They just don't seem to know how to reach the speed limit, where to turn, when to turn, etc.

imidazol97

>They just don't seem to know how to reach the speed limit, where to turn, when to turn,

In our area that's become Camry's and Accords also. Now a large number of Hyundai are being driven by 'less certain' drivers.

drummerdude

Here in Eufaula, Alabama, we dont have anybody doing #1. But we have a huge traffic jam when everyone in town is trying to get to school/work in the morning, and coming home in the afternoon, becasue people dont get in the proper lane, then when they see it is time to merge, they try to use the 1/2 lane on the left to pass everyone who is already in the correct lane, then after they pass 2 or 3 law-abiding citizens, they finally merge like they are supposed to. Theese are people who live here, they drive through this spot every day, they know the procedure/law, yet they refuse to merge the right way. I dont let thoose idiots in front of me, I just inch up to the car that has been in front of me for a couple miles, so the idiot who doesnt know how to merge correctly cannot pass me or get in front of me.

rockylee

I was cruising down HWY 287 from Amarillo to Dumas, when this Burgandy Chrysler Sebring cut me off and ran me into the median at nearly 70 mph. 3 young african american guys in the car and the driver was on his cell phone. :mad: The other dudes I could see in the car shook him and told him to watch-out !!!!

I just glared at them when I passed them. The other guy in a Black Chevy SSR gave me a thumbs up since he watched them cut me off and my defensive driving skills saved my bacon.

Rocky

imidazol97

Those are the types I call in to the state patrol number. Who knows what else is going on with them. I also call in the plate number of any car witnessing.

I did that once for local police in adjacent political division and gave them the number of the antique Riviera run into the grass ahead of me (the first ones with no seams showing since they were leaded in completely) and of the kid passing another car who ran him off the road.

The policeman called me next day to tell me he measured the same kid driving same car at above state speed limit, let alone the local 45 speed limit. Hopefully the judge took away his under 18 license for a while.

fintail

I almost called the cops yesterday on a Porsche Turbo with a driver who looked to be about 16 weaving in and out of traffic...but as it was likely some useless trust-funder from Medina, chances are nothing would have happened anyway.

My previous place of residence had a roundabout...it really did solve some congestion issues, but it could be scary. I would avoid it unless I was driving at a really dead time.

redmaxx

Than I would say that for those intersections, the right of way would be reveresed from what I have experience and those making the u-turn would have to yield to those making the right turn on the dedicated green arrow? That is what common sense tells me.

That makes sense to me, but it seems awfully shortsighted of the engineer not to put up a no U-Turn sign. If this happens a driver turning left would hold up the entire queue of cars turning left, defeating the point of the left arrow.

It seems a regular occurrence now that when the left arrow light goes green at least two cars across the road make a right on red. I have seen three go through and a fourth try, but almost got clipped.

redmaxx

I just mentioned roundabouts. Do you guys have these in your various states? I can't remember seeing one in the times I've been driving - only in western states though..

I see them a few places here in AZ. For the most part, people understand how to drive them, until they get into the neighborhoods near where I live (developers put a whole bunch in) and then nobody understands (either that, or doesn't care). They go too fast, go left when entering, don't yield, etc. It seems that the designers don't even know what they were doing. With one, they put the yield signs on the circle, as if traffic on the circle was to yield to entering traffic! Then another one is clearly only wide enough for one car, yet two lanes connect directly to the circle.

carlisimo

If you have a green right-turn arrow (or a green light at all), I don't see why cross-traffic would have a green left-turn arrow at the same time. So they shouldn't be U-turning into you.
(Not counting left-turn red light runners, but they shouldn't affect the signal design.)

Where I've driven, U-turns are only prohibited on narrow streets or during rush hour.

snakeweasel

If you have a green right-turn arrow (or a green light at all), I don't see why cross-traffic would have a green left-turn arrow at the same time.

Why not? if cross traffic has a green left turn arrow anyone making a right turn won't cross the left turners path. It makes perfect sense that if North-South traffic has green turn arrows (but not a green light) that East-West traffic can have a green right turn arrow (but not a green light).

carlisimo

The only thing I'm having trouble seeing is what the green right-turn arrow is for. Just keep it red; right-turners can still go, but it's on them to wait for U-turners.

snakeweasel

The only thing I'm having trouble seeing is what the green right-turn arrow is for. Just keep it red; right-turners can still go,

With the right turn arrow you won't need to come to a complete stop and more traffic can go through thereby making traffic flow faster.

stickguy

One of the local interest columnists in the Phila. Inquirer did a piece about some local guy that refuses to speed on the local highway (aka racetrack) system. Seems this guy keeps a log of cars passing vs. being passed, among other things related to a thesis.

So, the columnist decides to try it out, doing a round trip from Bucks county and back (for the locals, on the NE ext, blue route, and Skuykill (I know I spelled that one wrong!). I think at morning commute time.

So, he sets the cruise at the SL (maybe plus 2) and sets out. By his count, he was passed by 372 (I think) cars, and passed no one. THis on a 40 mill drive.

This guy writes somewhat humorous pieces, and did a good job describing the truck driver that climbed up his butt, finally passed and then cut him off on purpose. Also funny was the list of people smoking him (soccer moms, loaded up landscaper trucks towing trailers, and old people in Buicks).

hercules00

Given that even the cops dont pull you over for upto SL+10 (unless it is a really miserable and frustrated cop) I have no doubt that he saw so many cars pass him by.

And as far as the truckers go, I sympathize with them. From my experience, they are better drivers than 95% of the people on the road and they know the rules better. They also seem to drive at a constant SL+ 8-10. When you are hauling a big rig across a few thousand miles day in day out, you will get mighty upset if you see some dumb guy bloking your lane. Put yourselves in their shoes. You will understand why they tailgate you and cut you off when you come in their path for no reason. I am on my nerves end at the end of an 8 hour drive when I see some stupid cellphone toting moron blocking the left lane. What maddens me more? When I manage to cross them, most of the left lane huggers seems to have their beams on high, blinding me in my low set car x-(

redmaxx

With the right turn arrow you won't need to come to a complete stop and more traffic can go through thereby making traffic flow faster.

Exactly right. By eliminating the u-turn and putting the arrow in you allow that lane to go and don't have to worry about people that don't want to turn right on red.

redmaxx

Around here the truckers don't seem to know what they are doing. They routinely block the road by going about the same speed alongside each other, pulling out when they aren't supposed to, lane changes when they shouldn't and cutting people off, coming up to a stop light along side each other (takes a mile or more for all the traffic to get up to the SL), etc. It is so bad on one road, truckers get impatient pulling out so they just go. They cross traffic and then use the median as their acceleration lane. So the police have setup signs reducing the SL from 65->55->45 and in really busy times, they pull out and slow traffic to 25.

xwesx

One of the problems that we have in California that I don't understand, is that motorcycles can pass in-between lanes. I was driving recently in the HOV lane (Hi-Occupant-Vehicle---usually 2 or more people) and a motorcycle comes between me and the car next to me driving and I'm cruising at 80 miles an hour. I absolutely didn't see this guy pass me on the passenger side then he whips right in front of me. I just can't feel sorry for the cycles that get hit, it should be illegal to do that!

Er, uh, huh?! Why would anything so moronic as that be legal? Oh, hahaha, maybe I should not have wrote that.

Seriously, though. Any cyclist squished, clipped, or in any other way maimed or killed while performing such an idiotic maneuver can receive no sympathy. I might manage a chuckle or sigh of relief unless someone else was injured or overly inconvenienced by the whole mess. :sick:

redmaxx

Here we have HOV lanes with a wide buffer between it and the next lane. This subject brings back memories of seeing an Excursion passing down that "lane". :surprise:

oskwi

Yesterday, in my "neck of the woods", a red Grand Am was supposedly sideswiped by a semi while merging onto the freeway. The driver naturally lost control of her vehicle, went off the highway, became 8 feet airborne, crashed through a fence, crashed into a utility pole that housed several transformers and started a fire, nearly crashed into a newly built office building, and, because of the transformer crash, cut off power to many businesses and homes near the site. I happened to be traveling by right after all of this happened. Now, according to the news, the woman is in the hospital and the police are looking for witnesses to try and track down the semi driver.

Who knows if the semi truly did not see her, but it makes you stop and think nonetheless.

Safe motoring to everyone!

whahappan

Don't assume he was in the left lane. Stickguy doesn't specify what lane he was in, but I would assume he stayed in the right lane. I'm certainly not one of the "Speed Kills" camp, and I have nothing but contempt for LLC's, but if someone wants to go the speed limit but stays out of everyone else's way, I have no problem with it.

Hercules00
"You will understand why they tailgate you and cut you off when you come in their path for no reason."

The way I read it he was just cruising along and the truck came up from behind him, there's no suggestion he came in the truck's path for no reason. I think you're making too many assumptions.

snakeweasel

Who knows if the semi truly did not see her, but it makes you stop and think nonetheless.

Thats true, it is even possible that the truck driver never knew there was an accident. A 14 ton truck may not even be affected by a 3500 pound car side swiping it.

snakeweasel

but if someone wants to go the speed limit but stays out of everyone else's way, I have no problem with it.

As it should be, if someone is doing the speed limit staying in the right lane they have every right to do so and no one should be upset about it. Many times I am going to be very early or that I have no place to go and all day to get there I will just set the cruise control at the speed limit and enjoy the day. Of course I stay in the right lane except to pass.

snakeweasel

I hate them, hate them, hate them, hate them, hate them, hate them, hate them, hate them, hate them, hate them, hate them, hate them, Oh and one more thing I hate them.

We have them all over Chicago and they only work during rush hour. Since this is a crowded urban area many of these on ramps you need just about the entire ramp length to get up to speed. These lights just make your acceleration speed that much slower. Plus if there is traffic a head of you on the ramp it makes the already long commute longer as it slows down the traffic entering the expressway.

Let me add that I hate them.

mark156

There is the neatest roundabout in the city of Orange, CA. It's right in the center of downtown Orange and is very easy to use. I would imagine that in a very high traffic area, roundabouts would not work well and become grid-locked.

Orange reminds of Mayberry, a small quaint town that has craftsman style bungalows with picket fences.

On a recent drive to Los Angeles from the Desert (150 miles), I found that the HOV lane and adjacent lanes don't move as fast as the far right lane. Since I was not in a hurry to get to LA, I just stayed towards the right (5 lanes including HOV) and many times I was driving faster than the left lanes. :confuse:

mark156

ruking1

..."I would imagine that in a very high traffic area, roundabouts would not work well and become grid-locked."...

You might want to take a look at the roundabouts in our capital city, Wash D.C.

Also given multiple same direction lanes of traffic, very often the "slow" or right lanes become the defacto "passing/fast" lanes.

snakeweasel

I would imagine that in a very high traffic area, roundabouts would not work well and become grid-locked.

Just the opposite, a roundabout can improve traffic flow especially if its an intersection of more than two roads.

In Naperville, IL there is one subdivision that at every other intersection has a very small roundabout, It keeps people from racing through the neighborhood.

redmaxx

They work well when the freeway is congested and you have several cars trying to get onto the freeway. But here is my question. What would you do if you find you are the only one on the on ramp and the lights are flashing green and red? Would you A: come to a stop and wait for your light to turn green even though you are the only one on the ramp or B: or just continue onto the freeway because you are the only one on the ramp. OR C: this is a silly poll and why ask such a dumb question

Come up cautiously, check for cops (since it is still a red light after all) and if there are none, then option B. The point of them, after all, is to stagger cars coming on the highway. I don't hate them, as long as they are operational during rush hour. What I dislike is, (in my area) when it is 7PM and they are still operational, even though the highway is back up to 65-75MPH. Then I've got to floor it to get up to highway speed in time.

redmaxx

We have them all over Chicago and they only work during rush hour. Since this is a crowded urban area many of these on ramps you need just about the entire ramp length to get up to speed. These lights just make your acceleration speed that much slower. Plus if there is traffic a head of you on the ramp it makes the already long commute longer as it slows down the traffic entering the expressway.

I don't know about Chicago, but most of the time they are operational in Phoenix, traffic is only going 45MPH or so, and they put them such that there is still plenty of room to get up to that speed. Here is an example. On the picture, you see the freeway and the two diverging entrance and exit lanes. The one on the left is the entrance lane and if you look closely, at the top of the picture you can see a thin white line on the ramp, before it goes from asphalt to concrete. At the bottom you can see where the lane merges on the highway. Enough room for 45 or 55. 65, eh, needs a good bit of gas, if traffic is going 75 though, hold on!

snakeweasel

I don't know about Chicago, but most of the time they are operational in Phoenix, traffic is only going 45MPH or so,

Here in Chicago its a crap shoot, some places the traffic could be at a standstill others it could be going 65+. It all depends on the location and time of day. One point that I used to go through every day about 5:30 or so traffic would be going 55 or so and I could barely get up to speed in the short distance that was after the light before traffic would be merging into the acceleration/deceleration lane to get off at the next exit.

Some times you either have plenty of room and/or traffic is going slow enough, other times it short and traffic is going fast.

carlisimo

Sometimes they're necessary at onramps where traffic is flowing at 65mph or more. Sure you can add more cars in that particular spot, but down the road there'll be a chokepoint. Traffic has to be limited well upstream of the slowdown (or potential slowdown).