Questions About Auto Insurance and Accidents

marsha7

That would be interesting...if your friend drove YOUR car, he would be a permissive driver and your insurance would cover him...

But if he drives the rental, and you did not list him as a driver on the rental contract, I would wonder if he is considered a nonpermissive driver, not because of permission by YOU, but by the rental contract...so you let him take the wheel but Hertz specifically does not have him as a listed driver, so if your insurance is generous (ha!) they might cover him, but his own insurance might be the only guarantee of coverage he has...and if he has no insurance, he could be held personally responsible (Chapter 7, anyone?) and, if you purchased the collision damage waiver from the rental agency, having him drive the car might void that...

BTW, even tho I have that CDW coverage with my credit cards, I will often buy it thru the rental agency for the $13/day, simply because if there is a wreck, I just hand the keys back to Hertz and walk away, let them handle it...no coordination with my credit card, no phone calls waiting to see who has paid what, just hand over the keys and walk away...I am buying convenience and future time savings by buying the CDW, IMO...

stever

I thought you'd like that one Bob. :-)

Oh yeah, in my hypothetical, my friend is a trustworthy preacher with an impeccable driving record who had the wreck because a wasp got in the car.

kyfdx

In my hypothetical, I let my wife drive, and she is specifically not covered under the rental agency's insurance.. (I think that was our original premise).

My supposition is that her own car insurance will cover her for any accident that is uncovered, otherwise. True, if she didn't have collision, that wouldn't be covered (though, it might be under liability, since it isn't her car).

My agent tells me (not as a response to this hypothetical) that I'm covered while driving any other car... (my wife, as well.. since she is a named insured on our policy). I believe him! lol...

-kyfdx

stever

The part that bugs me is that she doesn't have permission from the owner of the car to be driving it.

lilyowen

The thing to remember is that insurance and hypotheticals are a really bad idea. Policies and events are so different depending on venue and carrier, that it is really impossible to give a 100% answer to this question. The moment you agent or carrier says "yes, you are covered in any car that you drive" you then rent a tractor trailer, drive it to Argentina, go on a five-county high-speed chase and intentionally run twenty people off the road ... all while having failed to update your account for that EFT that was due on the policy two weeks ago.

All I can say it that your agent is probably not the best resource for policy knowledge. Get a copy of your policy with all of the endorsements and make your own decision ... then discuss it with the claims folks at your carrier if the situation arises ... otherwise it's all just talk.

houdini1

But she does have permission from the owner because she is driving the owner's temporary replacement vehicle.

Think about any normal lease situation. About half the people lease their cars so technically they are not the owner either, but they are still able to insure the cars and their liability. A leased car is a leased car whether it is for one day or 3 years.

tidester

my friend is a trustworthy preacher with an impeccable driving record who had the wreck because a wasp got in the car.

So that would make it an "act of god" which is normally excluded from coverage by insurance policies? I think it's best just to have your friend rent his or her own car. :P

tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper

stever

lol, I was wondering if you remembered our bee sting case Tides. :-)

And yeah, I know that getting a "right" answer is going to be impossible since all the policies and companies and state laws are different. But don't let that stop y'all.

marsha7

is...if an insurance doesn't pay that you think should have, it will end up in the courtroom, which means some scummy lawyer will get paid simply to make the insurance do what it should have done anyway...oh, wait...does that mean the lawyer gets paid to do that???...back up, boys and girls...that ain't the worst part, that's the BEST PART!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!...(sorry, I just woke up and realized where MY self-interest lies.......$$$$$$$$$...I mean, my concern for the client) :P :shades:

houdini1

Man, what a gig !!!

stever

And then the client hires another lawyer to sue the first lawyer for not getting enough money out of the insurance company. :P

marsha7

America!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mr_Shiftright

Did you read about the judge who made a ruling recently that a 4-year old could be sued in court for hitting an old woman while pedaling her bicycle with training wheels?

True story. Apparently, if you are UNDER 4 years old, you are not deemed culpable under the law, but over 4 you are.

Put down that toy, kid, you work for GRANDMA now. :P

tidester

Hmm. Can a lawyer sue him or herself? Maybe an insurance policy will pay for both sides.

tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper

marsha7

Since I work alone, I always tell folks that I am my sexy secretary...so, if I harass myself, I can sue myself for sexual harassment...then, the firm gets 1/3 and I get the rest of the damages for pain and suffering...and, since I am the firm, I get the rest of the money...

I just can't figure out how to depose myself and then object to questions about my past sexual history... :confuse: :sick: :lemon:

houdini1

Which one was on the bicycle, the kid or the old woman?

Mr_Shiftright

Hahaha...reminds me of that old Monty Python skit----"Hell's Grannies".

the_big_al

The car came back from the body shop on Friday. LATE Friday. Now is the time for guess as to total cost. Answer will be posted later today (hopefully if I remember)

The was a couple of small snafu... and while I can't prove it and it's fixed anyway now, I think they did something to my ignition. That along with a couple other minor things would keep me from using this body shop in the future despite what appears to be a really good job and a fantastic complete top to bottom detail after the car was finished.

A week ago Friday I received a call from the body shop. The gal on the phone was asking if I had a different key for the car. I asked why. She said that the key wouldn't turn in the ignition. I asked are you sure you've got the right key for the car? She said yes, but it won't turn and wanted to know if I'm sure I dropped off the right key. Well, obviously I did, because I left them with the key I drove it down there with. I tell them I'll be down in a bit with another set, but thinking this is weird. I'm going to be pissed if I get down there and they are indeed using the key to someone else's car.

I get down there with FOUR extra sets. (Yes, four. My wife had a bad habit of losing keys so I made several extra sets.) I have my daily driver key, her daily driver key, and two other extra keys with me. I get down there and a tech walks me back to the car. It's at the back of their lot, all torn down and ready to be put back together. So they have obviously moved it several times since I have dropped it off. They have been able to move it from where I first left it at the front, around to where it sat for a few days before moving it to inspect and perhaps tear down and from there it was sitting now. So at least three times, if not a couple more. So the key I left them WAS working. So why won't it work now?

I get in with the key they left me. It is the correct key. I slide it in to the ignition. I can tell the ignition feels funny. It feels like the 200K mile 20 year old ignition on my old work van. Not a 6 year old 60K mile ignition. I try and turn the key. It won't turn. I wiggle the wheel, but still no go. Something is definitely wrong. I asked the tech what they did to it. They say they didn't do anything. I'm like it just stopped working?? Is that even possible?? How does an ignition just break? I tell him it's NEVER had an issue before. Never a sticky key (unless it was cut wrong), never a hard time turning. It's always turned just fine every time.

I don't think that was what he wanted to hear. We go back inside and this time the adjuster guy over my car comes out with me. Back out to the car we trek. Same thing. He gets in and tries. All 5 keys. Same thing. Again, I ask what did you guys do to it? He replies nothing. But I could tell he wasn't tell me the whole story. He was kind of being evasive. Even to the point where he wouldn't even admit to moving the vehicle around. I even pointed out that he had to move it, and that they did move it and used the key I left them and that you had to have started the car to move it. It was like he didn't want to admit that they had to do that to move the car.

Well, then he gets in and pokes at it and the plastic trim around the ignition is a bit loose. He's like maybe it happened during the accident? HAHA!! Sure. The airbags didn't even deploy. I just took out a headlight fender and a hood. How, explain how can that be related to the accident?? He then says well let me call GM and then the insurance and explain and perhaps I can get insurance to take care of it. I'm like wow. Actually though this didn't really surprise me because of an earlier conversation I had with him, which I will get to. By now, I am pretty sure that they did something to damage it and he just won't admit it, because he's not placing the blame on me and saying it's something I'll have to pay for. He knows it was working before and now it's not. I think however, he was hoping that when I was told it wasn't working, I would come down and say, "Oh ya! It's kinda tricky. This is how you work the ignition..." Then he could say, well it's totally not working now and will have to be fixed and then he'd be off the hook.

That however was not the case, since there was nothing wrong with it before. He also knows that I am telling the truth about that because of this earlier conversation I had with him. Before hitting the deer, the car had a couple other minor dings to it. One on the passenger back quarter panel by the taillight where I brushed the car against the tree in our driveway. Barely noticeable, but obvious to a close observation. The second was a pretty good gouge in the driver's side rear fender by the door where my wife had backed into a fire hydrant. This gouge was actually pretty bad and quite noticeable, however it wasn't worth an insurance claim and it was only cosmetic. So I haven't worried about it.

When they were going over the car, they found these two additional dings. The adjuster calls me up and asks me if they were included. I ask him which ones are you talking about? The sort of tells me. I then proceed to tell him exactly where they are and describe what they look like. He's like yep, that's them. They look like they could be related to the accident do you want to include them? I tell him no, they aren't related and shouldn't be included. He then says again, are you sure they didn't happen when you hit the deer?? Because they really look like they could have happened then. Again I tell him no. He's like okay then. A bit surprised. He's like well thanks for being honest, I just wanted to check. We then hang up. I didn't think much about it though however until the ignition thing happened. It was then that I realised that even then he was trying to be a bit less than honest so that he could make more money. Not that I couldn't have included them. I mean they were legitimate hits to the vehicle, and insurance is there to take care of things like that? But because they weren't part of the original incident, I didn't feel they should be included, so I didn't include them.

the_big_al

They did fix the ignition, but they charged it to the insurance. Somehow they were able to get the insurance to believe it was part of the accident. I doubt hitting the deer caused the ignition to fail. After all, the ignition operated just fine several times before I took it in to the body shop. And to my knowledge, ignitions just don't fail like that.

But the car is back, in one piece and operates fine. At this point I'm glad it's back. At least it had less issues than the last time I had to go to a body shop. The car was done when they said it would be, and the work performed was really pretty good. The car looks great and they did a complete top to bottom detail of it. However, just those couple of things soured the whole experience.

So the grand total??? A lot more than I thought it would be... Take your guesses now. The prize is, you get the pleasure of knowing you're better than everyone else! :shades: :shades: :shades:

stever

Hm, $3,000 was their original estimate and they've been trying to pad the bill it seems. I'll go with $4,800.

euphonium

$6325.42

euphonium

$6325.42

robr2

I'll bid $6326 Drew.

jwilliams2

I'll go low. My guess is $3,349.50.

Mr_Shiftright

I'll stick with my original bid of $6000, in post # 4667. As I like to say "whatever can go wrong, will go wrong".

kyfdx

I'll bid $6327, Bob....

the_big_al

Total amount came to just over $4000. This is including the over $600 charged for the ignition fix. So not counting the igniton, we're looking at around $3400 total damages to the body. I don't count the ignition as I think they bunged it up, but found a way to get insurance to pay for it. I can't prove it however, but that's my theory.

...

fezo

Darn it! I was waiting for Bob before guessing.

Oh, well...

Mr_Shiftright

Geez, that's a good price. I could never get your damage fixed for that where I live I don't think. A crack in my back bumper drew the lowest of 3 bids at $768. My friends E500 Mercedes had the back bumper nailed in a low speed rear-ender, and that came out to around $7000

jwilliams2

Darn. Missed it by fifty bucks.

marsha7

I haven't checked Internet since Friday, so I missed the game, but wasn't my original guess $7,500.00???

I guess I lost The Price is Right...

Karen_S

A reporter is looking to interview a driver who recently saved money on auto insurance, either by renegotiating a policy, switching companies or changing driving habits. Please send your daytime contact info and a brief recap of your experience to pr@edmunds.com no later than December 8, 2010.

woodyww

Some drunk woman rammed into the rear bumper on my 2000 bmw 5-series in a parking lot. I managed to get her to stop & got her license info. It's a moderately bad scrape; I'm trying to decide if it's worth all the dues to file a claim, get it fixed, etc., for a 10 y.o. car. I called my ins. co. today & my bp went up 20 points just getting the claim started, probably b/c I know what dues it's gonna be.

And no, I didn't call the police, but I should have, if only to get her off the road. And I got her driver's license info., but she was too out of it to remember her ins. co., so it seems like the only way is to file a claim with mine, which I'm not too crazy about.

PS--the red line in the pic is some kind of reflection. And I pulled the car out of the garage today, you have to get way up close to notice the bumper scrape. It's just that the car is in such nice, pampered condition......

jipster

Her insurance should pay for the damages. I'd make a police report, track her down, try to get her off the road before she kills somebody.

igozoomzoom

Assuming that you have Uninsured Motorist coverage, your insurance company should go ahead and pay to repair the damage to your vehicle. They will try to find out the at-fault driver's insurer and pursue reimbursement from them (if she even has insurance). They may also pursue her directly for reimbursement if she is uninsured or they are unable to obtain her insurance information.

In this situation, it's unlikely that she or her insurer will admit fault or pay for the damages. Without a police report, it's your word against her's. Her insurance company won't pay unless she admits fault to them or you provide proof.

Also, you will be responsible for paying your deductible before your UI coverage will pay anything. If you have a $500 deductible on UI and the repair will cost $900, you'll pay $500 and your insurance company will pay the $400 balance. IF (and it's a big IF) they are reimbursed by the other driver or her insurer in the future, they are required to refund any deductible you paid....but don't hold your breath.

The potential negative consequences of filing a claim on your own policy probably outweigh any benefits, in my opinion. A claim filed on your UI policy will show up on your C.L.U.E. report for up to 7 years (varies in some states). The C.L.U.E. reports losses reported on your policies and insurance companies use them to determine premiums....and any loss reported, even an Uninsured Motorist claim, can raise your premiums! Being involved in two NOT-at-fault accidents within a certain period of time can affect premiums or even cause non-renewal of your policy....

Good luck...

kyfdx

...it's 20/20 hindsight on my part.... but, no way I would have let her go.. Your only chance of getting money out of her was to call the cops and get a report..

If you do decide to pursue it... I'd start with the cops.. Call and tell them what happened, what information you have, and what you should do.. Maybe they will offer to help you out, somehow.

Mr_Shiftright

Couldn't he just pay to have it fixed out of his own pocket and sue her in small claims court for the bill? What's she gonna say? He backed into me? yeah, right, the judge/ref won't buy that.

kyfdx

I just assumed he has a regular job... Who has time to go to court?

Mr_Shiftright

Well unless he's a slave on a Roman galley, I would assume that this is possible....?

kyfdx

I don't want to get off topic, but I work 8:30-5:30 Mo-Fr.. To go to court, I have to use a vacation day from work.. I think I'm pretty typical, in that respect.

If it's probate, or something scheduled, maybe I only have to miss an extra hour or two, around my lunch hour... otherwise, my experiences with court, is your whole day is blown (my record has been expunged, now..lol).

It would be my last option.. Plus, if it turns out she is a deadbeat, all you've won is a judgement... Good luck enforcing it..

Mr_Shiftright

It's still better than being the victim and being punished for it.

kyfdx

LOL... maybe..

Vacation days are like gold..

marsha7

Now you've got me thinking about Ben-Hur...

Mr_Shiftright

I just hate to see deadbeats get away with it !! :mad:

houdini1

I am surprised that you have a secondary job to supplement your income as a host !!

I still have to work as an actor until my job as a waiter takes off.

oldfarmer50

"...Vacation days are like gold..."

I though that every day working for Edmunds was like a vacation. :P

kyfdx

You guys are killing me... too bad burlesque is dead...

marsha7

"I still have to work as an actor until my job as a waiter takes off."

I had to read that one twice, and now I can't stop laughing...I would use emoticons, but, as we know, they taunt us with the symbols below, but they just don't work anymo'

Kirstie_H

What, you didn't even TRY?

They're back. Don't be an Eeyore. :P

houdini1

Let's give er' a try... :mad: