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  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343
    edited August 2015
    qbrozen said:

    we have the stay right, pass left law here in NJ. It is rarely obeyed and almost never enforced. The Pennsylvanians on our roads are almost guaranteed to ignore it, from my experience.

    A friend of mine is married to an Ohio State trooper -- he claims that passing on the right is many times more of a contributing factor to crashes than speeding. Bet the speed laws, however, are quite rigorously enforced.

    Why is that? Are the fines from speeding higher than from passing on the right infractions? Wait, wait, don't answer that, yet: If the speeding fines are, for example, $100, then passing on the right fines ought to be $250 -- you would think once the word got out that such infractions would sharply shrink.

    I'm one of the people that thinks you should either take laws off the books that are routinely ignored or that the infraction fines should be made proportionate to the potential bodily and property damage that such infraction, if ignored, suggests. And, then, of course, enforce them.

    So, if my friend's trooper husband is correct, that passing on the right side really is suicide and that speeding, in an of itself is less likely to cause death and destruction, why not "align the time (i.e., the fine) with the crime" so to speak? Full disclosure, I have little compunction about driving 85 or 90 in a 70 zone (with assured clear distance), but, as noted, I break out in hives and nausea if I am dragged kicking and screaming into passing on the right due to some moron who certainly must be ignoring my repeated wink, wink, winking left turn signal "the universal (and polite) signal to please let me pass."

    OK, I have one more ? to pose -- I took driver's ed in high school, I took a course to learn to teach driver's ed in college -- why is it we are taught to maintain about 15' per 10MPH assured clear distance between you and the car in front of you (on the highway, not on the crowded stop and go streets of, say, Manhattan) yet, if you were even to attempt to keep 90' between you and the car in front of you on the state highway or Interstate highway at 60MPH, you are assured someone will risk heaven and earth, life and limb to squeeze in between you and the car in front of you and then essentially brake hard, thereby causing a ripple effect of some dozens and dozens of miles on such thoroughfares as the long flat and straight stretch of highway say between Cincinnati and Columbus OH?

    Has no one even heard of the pop-sci occurrence called The Butterfly Effect?

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 18,325

    It's a wonderful part of the world -- enjoy. Five of the seven times I've visited Switzerland and/or Austria, the weather was rainy, snowy or otherwise inclement. Be thankful for the wonderful weather you appear to be enjoying, and thanks for the updates.

    I was blessed to be able to spend five weeks in Europe in the summer of 1981; just knocking around with a friend who taught at a French-English school in Deauville. She and I toured Austria, Germany, Italy, and Switzerland. Eight years later a friend of mine and I wrangled some press passes for the Frankfurt Auto Show; we brought our wives with us and spent two "Press Only" days in Frankfurt and then rode around Germany for a couple of days. We hope to go back sometime sooner than later. My mom's side of the family came from Diersburg. I'm one of the few people who had relatives who flew in the Luftwaffe as well as the AAC...

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
    Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
    Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 265,583
    I'll give them a chance to move over.. but, I'm not sitting in the fast lane for 5 miles behind someone doing 10 MPH under the traffic flow. At some point, you have to go around. What if they were doing 30 mph?

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  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,736
    edited August 2015
    yeah, I don't get the idea of making it illegal to pass on the right. I would hope, however, if a state has both no pass on right AND stay right pass left laws, a cop is going to pull the left-lane camper over instead of the right-lane passer.

    I find myself passing on the right many times a day.

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343
    edited August 2015
    kyfdx said:

    I'll give them a chance to move over.. but, I'm not sitting in the fast lane for 5 miles behind someone doing 10 MPH under the traffic flow. At some point, you have to go around. What if they were doing 30 mph?

    Traffic flow = the "Natural Speed Limit." Several studies show that if the speed limit on a given highway is 65 and the flow is 80 - 85, that the flow remains virtually unchanged, when the speed limit is raised to 75 or 80 even. The flow of traffic like the ebb and flow (rise and fall) of the stock market really does have a mind of its own. Efforts to enforce (and seriously fine) lane protocols would do far more to increase the safety of many of our highways than "speed traps" will ever do.

    There will be folks who drive at 110MPH when the speed limit is 65 or 80 -- that doesn't change. If the natural speed is 85, the "NORMAL" range will be 80 - 90MPH. Go figure.

    Me, I do pass on the right, but only after sincere and polite attempts to get the Left-Lane-Bandit to move over, I'm crazy, I know, but I do have physical symptoms that arise when I pass on the right -- it seems like breaking a societal covenant restricting and preventing us, mostly, from having "stupid attacks."

    Thankfully, I can't recall someone driving at 30MPH in a 70 zone in the left lane, I would think I would probably use my voice command cell phone to call 911 to report a very dangerous situation, then I would pass on the right and get the hell outta Dodge!
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    Mark our car is a US spec car, the nav is in English, but we have it set for Kilometers to work with the signs.. Everything is in English except for distance. I'm getting to know how far a meter is...

    What adventure it was today, we went from Salzburg to Lake Hallstatt, then to Ljubiana, Slovenia. Lets say a trip that would take roughly 6.5 hours total, took 12... I'm too damn tired to write it out, I'll post in the morning, it is currently 11:23pm and I'm pooped..
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,928
    dino001 said:

    There is still some "badge engineering" in other manufacturers, including VAG. In Europe, they have Skoda, Seat, VW models differing mostly by some styling and interior, but essentially identical otherwise (with "special model" exceptions). Not as visible here, as VW to Audi separation is much more pronounced, especially within current US market offerings. Other do much worse job of separating models, especially in lower end of the premium brands, where majority of their entry level models are barely changed in comparison to their close common relatives. Lincoln MKZ/Ford Fusion, Acura CLX/Honda Civic come in mind, especially their lower level trims. Even previous generation Audi A3/VW Golf GTI were not as far apart, as they should be.

    I actually found the previous generation A3 and GTI to differ greatly. However, with the GTI continually making many improvements, I find the 2015 GTI to finally be up to snuff. Of course, since they've caught up at VW with the GTI to the A3, they no longer offer a 5-door A3 (although I think that's changing with the A3 E-Tron's).

    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,928
    The fact traffic enforcement concentrates on speeding tickets (which lead to virtually no danger or accidents), and routinely completely ignores left lane passing laws is one of the biggest crimes of the past century. Police should absolutely ticket the driver causing the problem (the left lane impeder) rather than the symptoms (people passing on the right).

    No one ever accused the highway patrol of using logic or common sense though.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • tlongtlong Member Posts: 5,194

    qbrozen said:

    we have the stay right, pass left law here in NJ. It is rarely obeyed and almost never enforced. The Pennsylvanians on our roads are almost guaranteed to ignore it, from my experience.

    A friend of mine is married to an Ohio State trooper -- he claims that passing on the right is many times more of a contributing factor to crashes than speeding. Bet the speed laws, however, are quite rigorously enforced.

    Why is that? Are the fines from speeding higher than from passing on the right infractions? Wait, wait, don't answer that, yet: If the speeding fines are, for example, $100, then passing on the right fines ought to be $250 -- you would think once the word got out that such infractions would sharply shrink.

    I'm one of the people that thinks you should either take laws off the books that are routinely ignored or that the infraction fines should be made proportionate to the potential bodily and property damage that such infraction, if ignored, suggests. And, then, of course, enforce them.

    So, if my friend's trooper husband is correct, that passing on the right side really is suicide and that speeding, in an of itself is less likely to cause death and destruction, why not "align the time (i.e., the fine) with the crime" so to speak? Full disclosure, I have little compunction about driving 85 or 90 in a 70 zone (with assured clear distance), but, as noted, I break out in hives and nausea if I am dragged kicking and screaming into passing on the right due to some moron who certainly must be ignoring my repeated wink, wink, winking left turn signal "the universal (and polite) signal to please let me pass."


    Don't let science get in the way of good politics and government funding...

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 17,493
    @flightnurse - excellent pictures and play by play of your ED journey! Keep 'em coming!

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD

  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    breld said:

    If I'm not mistaken, here in Colorado, you can get ticketed for driving in the left lane on the highway if you're not passing. I'm not so sure how much it is enforced, but I do like that the law is at least there.

    I don't think people really know why they moved over into another land most of the time, maybe just out of habit.

    So driving over here is a treat, and the people really know how to drive, they do drive faster then posted speed limit even on "B" roads, but they are safe drivers. You do not see them texting, or talking on the Cellphone, or putting make up on while driving, plus on "B" roads there are bike all over the place.. It amazing to see how many bike share the road. Now, no bikes are allowed on "A" roads. "A" roads would be like major highway, "B" roads are just that the back roads. But people are very focused on driving, when we came into Solvenia, you wouldn't have known, the roads are in excellent condition, smooth as silk.

    So we are in Italy, the A2 Autostrada was fast and smooth, car is passed the 1200 mile point and now we can open her up. had it up 135mph rock steady. more on that later time for some cappuccino..

    ciao bella
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    So it's 1045pm had a great day, we are staying in Erbusco Italy, it's about 20 miles east of Bergamo, where my surname is from, going to meet cousins I have never meet before.. We are staying in a place called L'Alberete it's a hotel right in the middle of wine country, the views are breathtaking.

    So to catch you up on the driving from yesterday, we left Salzburg to go to Lake Hallstatt, what a place, and the tourist love it. It's also home to one of the biggest salt mines in Austria. The Drive there was about 2 hours, nothing to really report, ate lunch hung around and left, about 2pm. Now this is where it gets weird, we I put the info into the Nav system to get us to Ljubljana, Solvenia I told it NOT to take toll road or highway. This was a big mistake. The Nav system said it was about 200 KM away, and said we would arrive about 6pm, About two hours into the drive I noticed the time to arrive keep getting longer, I went back into the nav system and saw what was chosen as the route all "B" roads.. I fixed this but we were so far buried into the ALPS it didn't matter, we saw some great places, then we came upon a accident. After sitting for about 30 minutes, one of the fireman came up and told us we can wait 2-3 hours before it is cleared or we can turn around and take the "detour", when I asked him about this detour he couldn't answer the question, mind you the Nav gave us an alternate routes but we had to go forward about 20km before they took effect (that wasn't going to work.) so we turned around and followed people who were just as lost, but they spoke German. We got a gas station and asked someone there, they gave us direction and found the detour,once we got half way through the detour we turn the Nav back on and found us a route to get moving. But this route, routed us OVER the ALPS, we hit the highest point of 1765 meters (close to 6K ft) we finally got into Slovenia, and arrived at are hotel about 815pm, about 2 hours later then we wanted.. Ljubljana is a wonderful city, we hit the town about 845 for dinner, we were supised on how many people were walking about, we were by the river that splints the city in town. Lots of history there and we both want to go back. It's a very modern city.

    Salzburg has large elect bus network, but you have to see this mess all over the place.



    Austria, like German have a lot of lakes, this is just one of them. Here we meet a daughter and father who were riding bikes from Munich to Lake Halstatt they are on holiday..



    Hatchback and Wagons are all over the place in Germany and Austria, this has to be one of the more popular models around Europe, I would day 90% of them are diesels I saw many 118d or 120d's. BMW also makes this as a 3 door hatch, also the A3 5 door (the one we get) as well as the A1 is very popular, and most are oil burners.



    First real photos of the car in bright sunlight the blue look amazing..






    The 3 series has a mid-life cycle for 2016, but the GT and 4 series do not get one, however, both the GT and 4 series have received some updates that the 3 series gets. First the Rims, these have more of a grey tone to them less silver, also the middle consul and AC controls are different and lastly, the rear exhaust is black not silver this photo shows the rear exhaust.



    The next two are in Lake Hallstatt, truly an amazing place.





    Last is a shot of a town we detoured through, got to love iPhones and GPS, I had no idea the name of this town, but when you take a photo with the phone it says the GPS coordinates and will stamp the photo with the name later on. The name of this town is Bad Aussee, it was really charming. BTW I don't think this town gets this many cars...


  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343
    Wow!
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    Excellent photos. I see your son's GT is one of the larger cars on your journey.
  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 14,120

    Wow!

    FN....double WOW!!!!!!
    2024 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD Long Range
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    Congrats, Nurse. I have dark blue, too. Mine is the older version (Deep Sea) rather than yours Imperial (I think), but they are quite similar.

    One word of caution - the car always looks fantastic when just washed and detailed, but it's absolute dust magnet. That blue will show you every speckle of dust. I learned to live with it.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    The Q50S is silver....looks clean for a very long time...can't see any dust!
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    dino001 said:

    Congrats, Nurse. I have dark blue, too. Mine is the older version (Deep Sea) rather than yours Imperial (I think), but they are quite similar.

    One word of caution - the car always looks fantastic when just washed and detailed, but it's absolute dust magnet. That blue will show you every speckle of dust. I learned to live with it.

    Dino thanks, yes it's Imperial Blue, we both wanted Mediterranean blue but to get that color it would have been 4 week delay and $1930 bucks.. My 320 is Jet Black and know all about how dirty they get, but thanks for the warning..
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 17,493
    @flightnurse - your car looks sensational in Imperial Blue.  I like those wheels too.  Did you guys trade in Rick's Genesis?  Or do you do that when you get the car re-delivered?

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD

  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343
    edited September 2015
    Because they can . . .

    Maybe this is old fashioned thinking.

    It seems to me, if you're going to market your car with a choice of ten standard (non-custom) colors, the price should include the cost of the paint. When the customer requests a "non-standard" or custom color, well, whatever the traffic will allow should govern the price.

    I've taken the tour through the Audi factory in Germany (6 times), and they are very proud of the part of the tour where you get to see the paint booth. There is a display near the paint facility that has the entire spectrum of available colors displayed as somewhat large paint chips (for the workers or the customers? to see). There were dozens of Audi colors apparently able to be specified -- I would call them non-custom.

    I understand that Pearl Swirl Pink is probably not a color chosen often, ditto some fantastic purple swirl colors -- but, I assume the fact that they are "on the wall" means the factory just didn't make a one-off paint blend for a customer (perhaps Bentley does this, but I would not imagine Audi would not for $1,000, in other words.)

    We're down to two (black gloss and white gloss) standard colors these days -- literally every other standard color costs extra. The Audi Exclusive line (should one venture into their paint pallet) costs even more on top of that.

    It just irks me to be charged for something that shouldn't be a question. Silver is not a custom color, hell, even the purple infused black Audi calls Panther black justifies a $1,000+ optional add on. Pull the other one.

    I know, I know, everyone does it and seems to get away with it -- and I do assume that some paint colors cost more to fabricate than others, but couldn't these companies just bury the cost in the base price and let the customer pick what they want. This is especially annoying since most folks don't order their cars, and therefore have no say.

    Rare is the car on the lot that is gloss black -- the ones on the lot are pearl black or panther black or oolong black or whatever the name du jour is. But at anything over 10 feet away, they all look black and shiny.

    Even the Ibis White (a free color) looks little, if any, different than the metallic white offered -- beyond 10 feet away.

    I had no issue paying for a full-on leather interior (no alcantara, that is) for my S4, but I would have been miffed if leather was standard and yet RED leather was $1,000 upcharge. God help me if I wanted the leather in a non-standard color.

    I'd gladly pay for a heated steering wheel or heated rear seats -- those options weren't available. But 'cmon, black or white paint or pay up? Luckily I am fine with white.

    Now, my wife, on the other hand, just rolls with it and says, $1,075 for the color is OK.

    I've watched the cars being painted, mostly it's done by robots -- does it really cost THAT much extra to get one in silver?

    Roll up your arm and bend over!
  • benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,547
    Entry level lux car sales for August:

    3series 10,163 +24%

    ES 7,286 -1.6%

    C-Class 7,154 +38.9%

    IS 4,537 -11.3%

    TLX 4,353 +97.7%

    Q50 3,839 +44.6%

    S60 2,730 -13.1%

    MKZ 2,571 -9.5%

    A4 2,541 -21.4%

    ATS 2,449 -12.7%
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2024 Subaru Outback (wife's), 2018 Honda CR-V EX (offspring)
  • benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,547
    smaller entry-level sales:

    A3 3,188 +31.2%

    CLA 2,622 -3.7%

    ILX 1,660 -4.1%

    CT 1,504 -28.7%

    Regal 1,450 -23.2%

    1/2series 1,024 +55.9%
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2024 Subaru Outback (wife's), 2018 Honda CR-V EX (offspring)
  • benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,547
    tight race for top 3 in luxury so far this year

    1. BMW 223,348

    2. Lexus 222,151

    3. MB 220,870
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2024 Subaru Outback (wife's), 2018 Honda CR-V EX (offspring)
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 17,493
    @markcincinnati - I agree with you.  They do it because they can.  For the second time in 4 years has specifically told the Porsche dealer she refuses to pay $800 extra for metallic paint.  Her 2011 Cayenne was White.  Her 2016 Cayenne is White.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD

  • tlongtlong Member Posts: 5,194

    Because they can . . .

    Maybe this is old fashioned thinking.

    It seems to me, if you're going to market your car with a choice of ten standard (non-custom) colors, the price should include the cost of the paint. When the customer requests a "non-standard" or custom color, well, whatever the traffic will allow should govern the price.

    I've taken the tour through the Audi factory in Germany (6 times), and they are very proud of the part of the tour where you get to see the paint booth. There is a display near the paint facility that has the entire spectrum of available colors displayed as somewhat large paint chips (for the workers or the customers? to see). There were dozens of Audi colors apparently able to be specified -- I would call them non-custom.

    I understand that Pearl Swirl Pink is probably not a color chosen often, ditto some fantastic purple swirl colors -- but, I assume the fact that they are "on the wall" means the factory just didn't make a one-off paint blend for a customer (perhaps Bentley does this, but I would not imagine Audi would not for $1,000, in other words.)

    We're down to two (black gloss and white gloss) standard colors these days -- literally every other standard color costs extra. The Audi Exclusive line (should one venture into their paint pallet) costs even more on top of that.

    It just irks me to be charged for something that shouldn't be a question. Silver is not a custom color, hell, even the purple infused black Audi calls Panther black justifies a $1,000+ optional add on. Pull the other one.

    I know, I know, everyone does it and seems to get away with it -- and I do assume that some paint colors cost more to fabricate than others, but couldn't these companies just bury the cost in the base price and let the customer pick what they want. This is especially annoying since most folks don't order their cars, and therefore have no say.

    Rare is the car on the lot that is gloss black -- the ones on the lot are pearl black or panther black or oolong black or whatever the name du jour is. But at anything over 10 feet away, they all look black and shiny.

    Even the Ibis White (a free color) looks little, if any, different than the metallic white offered -- beyond 10 feet away.

    I had no issue paying for a full-on leather interior (no alcantara, that is) for my S4, but I would have been miffed if leather was standard and yet RED leather was $1,000 upcharge. God help me if I wanted the leather in a non-standard color.

    I'd gladly pay for a heated steering wheel or heated rear seats -- those options weren't available. But 'cmon, black or white paint or pay up? Luckily I am fine with white.

    Now, my wife, on the other hand, just rolls with it and says, $1,075 for the color is OK.

    I've watched the cars being painted, mostly it's done by robots -- does it really cost THAT much extra to get one in silver?

    Roll up your arm and bend over!

    It's all marketing and revenue maximization. Show a lower base price, but then make sure everything is an upcharge. BMW has been doing this for decades, Audi (at least in the US) not as long but they are getting there more and more.

    It's the same reason you can get a certain cell phone for some lower price but the base model has only 16Gb which is pretty minimal. Of course the upcharge to 32 or 64Mb is way out of proportion to the actual cost of those changes for the manufacturer. Instant profit!

  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    nyccarguy said:

    @flightnurse - your car looks sensational in Imperial Blue.  I like those wheels too.  Did you guys trade in Rick's Genesis?  Or do you do that when you get the car re-delivered?

    Yes the Genesis was a trade in, BMW will allow us to keep it until re-delivery.
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217

    Because they can . . .

    Maybe this is old fashioned thinking.

    It seems to me, if you're going to market your car with a choice of ten standard (non-custom) colors, the price should include the cost of the paint. When the customer requests a "non-standard" or custom color, well, whatever the traffic will allow should govern the price.

    I've taken the tour through the Audi factory in Germany (6 times), and they are very proud of the part of the tour where you get to see the paint booth. There is a display near the paint facility that has the entire spectrum of available colors displayed as somewhat large paint chips (for the workers or the customers? to see). There were dozens of Audi colors apparently able to be specified -- I would call them non-custom.


    Roll up your arm and bend over!

    BMW has what they call Individual colors for both exterior and Interior leather colors, as well as Options, when you choose an Individual color the car gets painted at a different facility, so the added price is the while process. Now, the 3 GT is not built at the same factory as the 3 sedan, touring, 4 coupe and grand coupe. So for our GT to get painted mediterranean blue, the body would and parts would have to be taken off the assembly line, shipped to where the 3 series is built, painted and send back to the original factory for completion. BMWNA does not allow for Individual options on the 3 series in the US, but they are available for BMWAG customers.

    We took the BMW factory tour this time and watch 3 series sedans and wagons being built, was very interesting to watch.
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    So the trip from Slovenia to Erbusco Italy was a straight shot on the Autostrata, as we wanted to get to the resort we were staying at, it exceeded our expectation, it is nestled in the foothills of wine country of northern Italy, the resort is surrounded by grape vineyards, a perfect place to relax. Once we arrived, we just drove around the area to take in the sights.

    Yesterday we went to Lake Como, now lake Como is shaped like an upside down Y, for me it's one of the most beautiful area's of Italy, when we left the resort it was gloomy and overcast, on the trip up we got hit with a very heavy downpour which cleaned the windshield of all bugs! We stopped in Varenna for lunch, then took the Ferry to Bellagio (yes, the hotel in Vegas is named after the city.) Then we drove home, but the rain had stopped but was still gloomy. Didn't matter the area is still beautiful.

    Hotel in Varenna, just on the water.



    Waiting for the Ferry to arrive, the Bently's owner saw our plates and asked where we were from, when I told him he stated he was jealous of what we North Americans can do with the ED.



    Out on the lake






    Lastly when we got back to the resort, there was a Infiniti Q50 that had a 2.2l turbo-diesel

    Oh yeah on the start of this adventure, I got a ticket for going the wrong going down a road, the damn GPS told me to go, but I didn't see the sign saying One Way... 27,50 euro fine...

    We are off to Monaco, Nice and Marseille (staying in Marseille.)

    Ciao
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343
    edited September 2015
    To live and work, Germany; to live and live and live, Italy.

    My wife's family (from Columbus, Ohio) have an apartment in Venice (and they are so gracious as to give us the keys whenever we go), so we ALWAYS to to Venice. And, we do love Venice, but, to me, Venice is good for about 3-days before it gets on my last nerve, the place is just so crowded and, if possible, just keeps getting more and more commercial.

    A short train ride from Venice, however, is Verona -- a city (well, town) that while certainly for the [German] tourists, retains walkability without pain, and, for my money has better restaurants, by far, than are widely available in Venice.

    The "oldest restaurant in Italy, Europe? the World?" is in Verona -- it is called The 12 Apostles, and the food there bests even Tantris (Munich's best, I think). Apostles is built right on top of the original Roman road, and if you tip the manager, he'll take you to the basement which as a plexiglass floor allowing you to walk on the Roman road, more or less.

    http://www.12apostoli.com/en/

    Hmm, I'm seeing a pattern here -- I live to eat!

    FN -- reading your stories and viewing pics have been, these past few days, the best parts of my day. Gratzie!
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    circlew said:

    Excellent photos. I see your son's GT is one of the larger cars on your journey.

    Circle, the GT is my partners car, in the photo at The Welt, I'm the Younger one, (by 9 yrs).
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    So we drove from Erbusco to Marseilles France yesterday, we decided to just do the superslab and get there fast, well 8 hour fast..

    So my impressions of Italian drivers, they aren't as reckless as you hear about, they follow most of the German or Austrian driving rules, 1) they only use the Right lane to pass, 2) they use their left turn signal if they want you to move over, and 3) yes, some are crazy.

    So we are motoring down the A5 autostrata and come up to slower traffic so we slow down, then barreling down on us is a VW passat wagon (they are big in Italy) and yes, it's a TDI.. The VW driving is flashing his lights, turn signal on, looks pissed that I didn't move over, Once we clear traffic and people move over (this whole time VW driver is inch's from my bumper) I nail the gas (we have 2200km on the car) and wham, talk off. VW growing smaller and smaller in the mirror. Top out at 135mph, we reach slower traffic, VW own barreling down doing the same thing, flashing lights, turn signal, giving me the Italian salute, not too sure if it was a good one or bad one. Again, once traffic opens up, and people move up, I take off, and the VW gets smaller and smaller in the mirror. Again, top out at 135, reach slower traffic, again VW driver flashing lights and turn signal, this time once we clear traffic, I get in front of slower traffic and pulled over the right land (this A5 has 3 lane's in each direction) and the VW pulled up, it's quite funny, he can tell he has it floored but not moving so fast, I nail it get in front, and pull away. Had to slow down speed limit lowered to 110 kph. VW owner catch's up and passes me.. He finally got what he wanted. It's interesting that it doesn't matter what country they are from they all barrel down on you at warp drive then get stuck on your bumper like that is going to make the car in front go faster..

    France

    What to say about France, if you think the Germans have an aire of attitude, you need to come from France. The attitude is, we can do that because we are french... Merging traffic, they will pull in front of you if there is day light between you and the car in front, they don't care about their cars, well most french don't.

    We stopped in Monaco, did the tourist thing, stopped in front f the Casino, and got a photo of the car, TALK ABOUT CROWDED!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The cars, WOW, the Cars, I got one photo of a Lambo, lots of make there too. The streets are narrow REALLY narrow.. Lots of construction going on and our GPS wasn't updated on this, so it took a little longer to get to the Casino, but we got there.

    Marseilles

    What to say about Marseilles, I didn't know much about the city except it was a port city. It's a very old city, and it shows, when you come in from the toll road, you come in through the slums, the GPS worked great, some of the streets we went down, were REALLY narrow,dirty, and stinky. Insane is a word that Rick used a lot....

    My thoughts of Marseilles, lots of immigrants, usually from north Africa, lots of different cultures, Christians, Muslims and so on. Have seen some women in Burka's walking about here and all over Europe, the native people of Marseilles aren't happy with most of the immigrants. It's a very diverse city, the food says it all, more on that later.

    So here are the photos from our trip to France..

    In Italy they have rest stop's but nothing like what have in the US, the rest stop has gas, food and places to eat the food outside, and they are SUPERCLEAN... The next couple of photos is one place we stopped to get gas and something to munch on.













    So we stopped at a French version of the roadside gas/convenience store what a big difference, the placed looked like it was about to be shutdown, hardly no drinks in the coolers, and the bathrooms look disgusting (this was the real reason why we stopped) see for yourself. A far cry from what the ones in Italy looked like,







    So car's in Europe, we have seen some American cars over here, here is a photo of one that we had a good laugh at.




    Monaco is supper clean, VERY clean in fact. Monaco is not a country, it is part of France, but it is a Principality, their license plates say, Principality of Monaco on them..








    So I know you are all waiting for that Lambo photo, so here it is..



    Traffic lights are interesting here, if you do not stop behind the crosswalks you will not see the traffic lights, but the French being The French have a fix....




    Once again the GPS, she works well, she really does but at times I have to wonder, when we left Monaco, we put into the GPS the hotel address and said, the faster route, even toll roads, well..... For about 60 km we were on two lane country roads, then finally back on the toll roads.. She tries..



    So I'll end this installment with a photo taken from our Balcony over looking the harbor and looking at the monument that is roughly 500 yrs old, it's a night photo..



  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217



    FN -- reading your stories and viewing pics have been, these past few days, the best parts of my day. Gratzie!

    Thank you Mark...
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,928

    breld said:

    If I'm not mistaken, here in Colorado, you can get ticketed for driving in the left lane on the highway if you're not passing. I'm not so sure how much it is enforced, but I do like that the law is at least there.

    I don't think people really know why they moved over into another land most of the time, maybe just out of habit.

    So driving over here is a treat, and the people really know how to drive, they do drive faster then posted speed limit even on "B" roads, but they are safe drivers. You do not see them texting, or talking on the Cellphone, or putting make up on while driving, plus on "B" roads there are bike all over the place.. It amazing to see how many bike share the road. Now, no bikes are allowed on "A" roads. "A" roads would be like major highway, "B" roads are just that the back roads. But people are very focused on driving, when we came into Solvenia, you wouldn't have known, the roads are in excellent condition, smooth as silk.

    So we are in Italy, the A2 Autostrada was fast and smooth, car is passed the 1200 mile point and now we can open her up. had it up 135mph rock steady. more on that later time for some cappuccino..

    ciao bella
    Some people will view your comment that people driving faster AND safer at the same time is blasphemy for the myth believers of "speed kills."
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • thebeanthebean Member Posts: 1,266
    @flightnurse, I love your Europe posts and pics.  The rest stop in Italy looked fantastic - we sure don't see anything like that here. The French restroom surprised me.  I guess there are lazy employees in all countries.

    Keep 'em coming!
    2015 Honda Accord EX, 2019 Honda HR-V EX
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,345
    Curious FN since you had a picture at a tool booth. Is there some kind of transponder, or do you need change in the right currencies? Or bills with these being a manned booth?

    I'm so used to EZ pass now, couldn't function without it.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    thebean said:

    @flightnurse, I love your Europe posts and pics.  The rest stop in Italy looked fantastic - we sure don't see anything like that here. The French restroom surprised me.  I guess there are lazy employees in all countries.

    Keep 'em coming!

    We were at two "rest stops" and both were like that. Might have gotten them on a bad day. But so far the attitude of the French is, We've French we can do that, seems to apply.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    stickguy said:

    Curious FN since you had a picture at a tool booth. Is there some kind of transponder, or do you need change in the right currencies? Or bills with these being a manned booth?

    I'm so used to EZ pass now, couldn't function without it.

    Yes to all. France has a transponder system call Liber-T that works like EZ Pass. The toll booths take cash in multiple currencies including Euros, US Dollars, Swiss Francs, UK Pounds, et al as well as credit cards.
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343
    edited September 2015
    You commented about German, er, personalities then followed up with your observations about French personalities. Granted, my European travels have been entirely recreational, but I would say that only in 2 countries have I ever noted an attitude that was less than gracious. France (several times) and Switzerland once in Lucerne (come to think of it the person in Lucerne had a heavy French accent.)

    The German people have always been friendly, polite, courteous and sometimes playful even. I've been to Oktoberfest about 6 times, and when going into a beer tent, you join a large group of people at a picnic table and within a few minutes it seems the folks are wanting to know about the US, US sports and are trying to teach us Americans some of the German-only songs that come up every 15 minutes or so between good ol' Rock and Roll. A gentleman and his father were in Munich for Oktoberfest and when they found out my wife was a lawyer, the older man bought my wife an order of peeled radishes (covered in salt) from one barrister to another. We had a great time. The folks on the subways in Munich, too, are always willing to help you figure out which stop will get you closest to your destination.

    In France, on the other hand, we went to a bistro, like you see in the movies, in Paris and the waiter gave up his picture for the dictionary next to the word "surly". Apparently since tipping is not as serious as it is in the US, this waiter was actually pissed when we thanked him (in English) when he brought us our wine, beer and cheese saying (in heavily accented French) "why can't you people even TRY to speak French?" OK, well perhaps I could say merci, but other than asking "how's the weather" and saying "I like chocolate ice cream" I didn't think I wanted to embarrass myself or run the risk of butchering my communications (especially since the menu we were given was multi-lingual). How wude!

    The staff at our (5-star) hotel in Paris was totally gracious and friendly, but my impression, from several interactions with the locals, was that they don't like us much -- or maybe they just don't like me. I went ahead and gave an American tip anyway, who knows if anything changed. The Italians were huggers and both-cheek kissers (didn't have that happen in Germany, but they were friendlier than the French.)

    FN, I have no clue as to your age -- I am 63 -- I started going to Europe when I was about 20 years younger (and richer), but it can be done for not too much money, if you realize that most of the time you spend in a Hotel it is dark (meaning, 3-star hotels with air conditioning work just fine). Once I got over the sense that we needed 5 star hotels (because, well, you never know), we found we could see Europe for not much money (saving our coin for fine dining instead). Also, we don't use cabs anymore, we figure out how to use the trains and subways -- and for the long trips, we splurge on first class train travel if the distance is over 5 hours. Also became a fan of night trains with full size beds (saves on hotel bills too). My point is, unless you're much much older, I urge you to make this trip one of many, many more you should take. Benelux was a fun couple of trips -- Amsterdam, Brussles and Luxembourg city, do it again, do it again.

    Anyway, you've taken me, at least, on a great vicarious trip with you two. My only regret is that you didn't get an Audi, but there's always next time.

    Keep 'em coming.

    Ciao (baby).
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 18,325
    I would only return to France if we were at war with that country- and I had an M1A2 with at least 500 rounds of M830A1 ammunition.
    But that's just me.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
    Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
    Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    stickguy said:

    Curious FN since you had a picture at a tool booth. Is there some kind of transponder, or do you need change in the right currencies? Or bills with these being a manned booth?

    I'm so used to EZ pass now, couldn't function without it.

    You can buy a "pass" ahead of time, but since the machine was in french I didn't know how to use, so at each toll booth, I'd pay with cash, now the most expensive toll was in Italy, 32 Euro
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    Mark, I'm 52, I agree with you on the travels of Europe, and the secert if taking a train is to take an over night one..
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217
    walking around Marseilles you see some interesting things, and cars, so enjoy today's photos..

    Scooters are the way to get around town, and let me tell you they will let you know it too. Just a random shot




    Yes, they are looking for the next winner of The Voice of France here in Marseilles




    Ok so we are americans, we stopped in a Mikey D's to get a coke, interesting place, you can order take out or have it served at your table and order at this Kiosk, the McCafe is a separate area in Miky D's, they had pastries and macaroon's.






    So now it's all about the car's we saw, the first if a Peugeot wagon, very popular and a looker too.




    Another Peugeot hatchback




    Here is an Audi A2




    Here is a surprise, this is a Kia, called a Ceep, very good looking car.





    We can park how we want, because we are French..



    The Mediterranean, and sorry guys no topple women at this beach...



    An Alfa 147, another popular car in Europe



    The names car companies give their cars, we had a good laugh at this one.



    So the next couple of photos are interesting, we ran into a wedding procession of the well to do, all the license plates were from Monaco.





    This AMG did not sound stock at all..







    Now this is what the Bride rode in, a limo of a Chrysler 300 with a RR front end...




    Now some random photos of the city






    On our walk back to the Hotel we came upon this glass cover, very interesting, this is a photo of my taking a photo straight up, looking down at me.




    Just the harbor




    So some of the Chrysler cars are brought over here but sold as Lancia, the 300 is called the Thema, It's a big car over here..

    Thanks it for now, off to Beaune France.
  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 14,120
    FN...loving youre report and pics.
    Thanks!
    2024 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD Long Range
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    edited September 2015

    In France, on the other hand, we went to a bistro, like you see in the movies, in Paris and the waiter gave up his picture for the dictionary next to the word "surly". Apparently since tipping is not as serious as it is in the US, this waiter was actually pissed when we thanked him (in English) when he brought us our wine, beer and cheese saying (in heavily accented French) "why can't you people even TRY to speak French?" OK, well perhaps I could say merci, but other than asking "how's the weather" and saying "I like chocolate ice cream" I didn't think I wanted to embarrass myself or run the risk of butchering my communications (especially since the menu we were given was multi-lingual). How wude!

    And that is why the French don't like Americans. Most don't even bother to try to speak in French instead expecting everyone else to speak English. Well guess what - they do but they appreciate your faulting attempt to speak their language. Once you start to "embarrass" yourself they will speak with you in English. It's called courtesy. How would you feel if a tourist came up to you in Cincinnati and started speaking in French without even an attempt to speak English? I'm guessing the same as that waiter.

    When I travel to Quebec, my limited French gets a smile and a hearty English reply.
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    edited September 2015
    These sensitivities can run very deep and show up in surprising places. For example, in Belgium there are Flemish (Dutch) speekers and French Wallons. Brussels is a French speaking enclave in the middle of Flanders, the locals feel the have been "invaded" by French speakers, both government and European Union officials. You can imagine the Flemish not appreciating that. It is considered polite there (at least by the Flemish) that when you want to communicate in French, you ASK if they speak French. They do, but they want to be asked.

    Similar thing goes in some post Soviet Union countries. They all are working very hard building their national identities, often overcompensating. Most speak Russian, but they again have to be asked.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Member Posts: 5,618

    I would only return to France if we were at war with that country- and I had an M1A2 with at least 500 rounds of M830A1 ammunition.
    But that's just me.

    Spoken like someone who knows what they do at Ft. Knox (besides store gold). I've been involved with the engine since about '94.

    '08 Acura TSX, '17 Subaru Forester
  • jeffm5jeffm5 Member Posts: 123
    I've never been to Europe, but my wife visited Italy about 3 yrs. ago. Her interactions with the locals were very positive. She'd love to go back. As for the "surly French" - I've heard that same comment from many Americans of varied backgrounds who've visited France. My opinion is if it wasn't for Americans like my late father who participated in D-Day they would be speaking German now. And my late Aunt told that to a surly sales person she had an unpleasant interaction with in Paris. God Bless America!!

    FN, thank you so much for going to the trouble of posting your travels and pics. Very enjoyable and enlightening.
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    edited September 2015
    jeffm5 said:

    I've never been to Europe, but my wife visited Italy about 3 yrs. ago. Her interactions with the locals were very positive. She'd love to go back. As for the "surly French" - I've heard that same comment from many Americans of varied backgrounds who've visited France. My opinion is if it wasn't for Americans like my late father who participated in D-Day they would be speaking German now. And my late Aunt told that to a surly sales person she had an unpleasant interaction with in Paris. God Bless America!!

    FN, thank you so much for going to the trouble of posting your travels and pics. Very enjoyable and enlightening.

    Here is the thing - those bailouts create resentments, especially when you consider that France used to be a superpower, cultural and science center of the world. Until WW2 French was the language of cultural elites and scientists (most articles with scientific breakthroughs were published in French journals). All of it went away in just few years, after a humiliating defeat (France didn't put much longer resistance than half sized Poland, attacked from behind by Sovients). Reminding them about it is not helpful, it's kind of like this big kid from high school with good heart but no manners pulled you out of the school yard butt kicking and then every time he sees you, or visits your house, he loudly proclaims to everybody who can hear how much he sacrificed and how grateful you should be to him. BTW, this kid is now getting all the awards, accolades, you used to get, college scouts come to see him, not you, etc. You get the picture.

    To be clear, I'm not trying to diminish your father's sacrifice, or Americas role in the War, or the fact that people in Europe should be grateful for it. I'm from the part if the world that had misfortune to be "liberated' by the Red Army and I would trade with French in a second. However, you also need to understand the wounded pride, which resulted in irrational lashing out against the very people who don't deserve it, but are close and convenient. The best way to deal with it is shrug it off and not get too flustered. It's just ignorance. Also, you need to remember that while substantial sacrifice was made, USA was also by far the greatest beneficiary of the new world order after the War and the casualties suffered are not even in the same order of magnitude and devastation than those suffered by the Europeans. Average European sees America as a net beneficiary of the War and it's not an unfair view from the global perspective (grant you not necessarily you father's).

    American soldier came, fought gallantly, often died or got wounded, but then came back to his country that was intact and stronger than ever. French, Polish, or even English soldier had to stay in their ruined country, rebuild it from ground up, sometimes starving in the process, often having his family decimated. Having those proportions being remember, you may find out much easier to get along, even with French.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • jeffm5jeffm5 Member Posts: 123
    I don't mean to sound like an "Ugly American". It's just that you hear so many comments from Americans of all stripes about rude and boorish behavior from the French. Shame on any American who treats a French visitor rudely because they can't or won't speak English. Also shame on any American visiting France who feels they are entitled to special treatment because of what happened during WW II. I'm just asking for common courtesy.
  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,191
    edited September 2015
    Agreed. There is no excuse for lack of courtesy, regardless if where you are. Then working in a service industry, it should be you way of life.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

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