By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our
Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our
Visitor Agreement.
Comments
-mike
Coming Soon: Jeep roads in Canyonlands NP and the Forester!
TWRX
I suspect that this upgrade will help the XT as well. I found this comment on nabisco by Paul Hansen.
"..The entire Subaru lineup of the WRX, Legacy, Outback, Baja, and Forester is based on the same platform. What really defines the differences in handling between the cars is the suspension tune and wheelbase. Legacy end of the pond is the long wheelbase Subaru's, the Forester/WRX end is short wheelbase.
The body shares the same platform as the WRX - except that it is *wider*. Earlier on in the GC8 era, the Forester was well known here in JDM-land for having *more* potential than the WRX in the mountain twisties. It had a slightly wider track and could get *more* rubber under the fenders than the WRX. And every WRX suspension piece bolted up. The new Forester and the new WRX are now roughly *equal*, because the WRX finally got wider fenders as standard.
You have to ask which is cheaper - bolting on some suspension and putting on some real rubber, or switching from a 2.0-litre to a 2.5-litre turbo. Some people will opt for the Forester for this very reason - till the Legacy Turbo comes out."
-Dennis
P.S. There was a video on nabisco that showed a WRX wagon (or sedan) blasting to the top of a sand dune.
But who will take a $40k designer SUV off road? Nobody. Who would risk scratching the nice paint?
Get a stripped down XTerra, Rodeo, or Wrangler to do that job. There are fewer places to do it, anyway, with urban sprawl.
RX8's back seat is still pretty useless. There is no leg room, so why bother with the extra doors? Then Mazda overstates HP (yet again). Then the 6 has that rust issue....I dunno, I'd let all that get sorted out before I would even consider one. Plus styling is odd at best.
-juice
WRX wagon: $21,368
Forester XT: $23,899
Baja turbo: $2?,???
XTerra V6 4X4: $21,693
Rodeo V6 4X4: $21,538
Wrangler Sport I-6: $19,601
fitzmall sells all of the above. They also sell Touaregs, currently for $33,601 up to $46,593. You could even squeeze in an EVO and a Wrangler.
-juice
Careful where you go with that Forester, though, since you'll encounter much more than sand on the Moab trails. Even fully modified Jeeps struggle on some of the tougher obstacles, and those are Wranglers with locked differentials, >33" tires, and >4.5" lifts. The Forester should be great for around 35% of the Moab area trails, which will let you see some spectacular scenery. For the harder stuff, consider renting a modified Wrangler from Farabees in the town of Moab.
Have fun!
actually juice-- I **totally** agree with your whole post especially the Mazda bits! scary. put that one on the calendar, won't happen again for a while!
-Colin
Next mike will get better mileage from his next tank than me. ;-)
-juice
TWRX
Been thinking of getting another Subie to complement our OB.
Looking for an older 5-speed subie coupe with a flat-4 and AWD, with a budget of maybe 2 grand. A little performance would be nice too.
What do you guys recommend?
Thanks,
Eric
It's going to be awhile before my wife and I offroad again. We're expecting our first child in mid-March.
In fact, the last time we went Jeeping in Moab my wife was one week pregnant; we just didn't know it at the time. Our little girl certainly got a bumpy introduction into the world!
-juice
however all things being equal I'm really leaning towards a late 80s accord instead.
-Colin
Or...get a beater Miata that you could later turn in to a track car.
-juice
TWRX
Still, things are looking up with the new Legacy around the corner.
-juice
TSX A-spec: dumb name replaces "Factory Performance". Basically grossly overprice bling-bling, and mostly cosmetic. I'm sure it'll sell like crazy, but Type-R would have sold even better. Nice seats, though.
CTS Sport: they supercharged this one. Cadillac is 2 Legit 2 Quit (bad MC Hammer reference). Is it just me or is the CTS really growing on people?
Escalade ESV Exec Ed: So tasteless inside and out that I'm sure hip-hop artists will buy them.
SRT-4 Extreme: this is more of a rolling parts catalog. We should envy Dodge for offering so many factory parts via Mopar and then covering them under warranty. Hear that Subaru?
Viper SRT-10 Carbon: not sure I like the new Viper look, but all that real carbon fiber under the hood sure looks cool.
Focus RS8: I'm on the fence on this one. Big V8 crate motor in a modified light chassis. But why start with the wrong platform to begin with? And I can't imagine the suspension can sustain the weight of a V8 up front. For 1/4 mile, fine, but on the track this would be way off balance.
GMC Canyon AT4: lots of great ideas here. Bob would love the retractable tonneau cover, the liner, the rails. But...can it tow more than 1000 lbs without trailer brakes? ;-)
Tiburon SC: your mom is 2Furious because you spent your money 2Fast on this sport compact.
GTO Autocross: bold name, no? It's lowered, even though they don't mention it. 50 more HP is always good. But...won't it still be kind of heavy and big for autocross? It would seem to be more at home at the track. And maybe they could give the Pontiac fans a fade hood scoop since they're crying out for one.
Scion xA: almost the full-body cladding that I crave. Color stolen from Franken L, mike should sue for copyright infringement!
-juice
Any problems with the 93 impreza that they fixed later? Any problems with 93 to 95 imprezas would be appreciated. How does everyone like the quality of the 5-speed tranny?
Miata--now there's an idea...
Eric
Civic Si HFP: again, $4 grand is crazy for a cosmetic package, factory or not. The engine is still weak for this class. Most people would just address the tires and suspension for 1/4 of the cost or less.
New H1: where's the Duramax? Just 440 lb-ft? mike would be seriously disappointed. ;-)
H2 SUT: why is the Baja the only vehicle that doesn't get a mid-gate these days? It'll be embarassing, but this H2 SUT will actually outsell the Subaru.
Mazdaspeed Miata: I'll have to drive this one to give it my verdict. More power is fine, as long as it doesn't feel heavy or lose any of that tossable nature. If so, then I'll be looking at a used one in a couple of years, if Subaru does not build the B9 Scrambler.
EVO RS: great idea, but the price should be lower than the regular EVO given all that was deleted. These would pop up all over Summit Point.
350Z Nismo: Nismo parts are not only specifically designed for Nissan vehicles, they're covered by Nissan's limited parts and accessory warranty says Edmunds. Too bad we can't say the same about SPT.
Corolla XRS: the S was already cute, for a tall car anyway. This looks cuter, but still not like a serious challenger to the WRX or even the SRT-4. Celica sales died so they probably figured they'd put the spare engines in the Corolla. Still, where's the torque?
-juice
-mike
The GTO has an indy rear and should be better, but still, it's kind of heavy.
-juice
Their biggest qualm was with the throttle-by-wire, and they didn't like the feel of the brake-by-wire either.
I felt the same about the by-wire systems in Mercedes' latest fleet of cars. Proof that maybe technology just for tecnology's sake isn't enough reason to switch over.
-juice
will pique paisan's interest: A massaged V10 diesel putting out 373bhp & 634 lb/ft at just 2,000rpm.
Bob
Abt Sportsline has opened the UK order book for its all-new Abt Touareg VS10, the world’s most powerful diesel 4x4 road car. Based on Volkswagen’s diesel-powered Touareg V10, the new car offers a significant uplift in power (373bhp compared to the standard Touareg V10’s 303bhp), a stylish new bodykit and a revised suspension system to deliver a more sporting drive.
Never said I didn't like the Touareg, just said it was a great wagon!
-mike
Still, it looks more like an inflated Golf than an SUV or even a wagon.
I'll have a burger, fries, and super-size my Golf please. At least they super-sized that diesel too.
-juice
-mike
Call some junk yards and have them put you on the list for the first Duramax wrecked from behind or rolled over.
-juice
-mike
-Dave
Bob
* Mercedes is working on a diesel hybrid, which will go into some Freightliner FedEx trucks shortly for fleet testing. That being the case, I'm assuming it's based on the 5-cylinder 2.5L diesel engine currently used on the Sprinter models. Interestingly, in this application (and unlike other hybrids), the diesel never shuts off.
http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=6619&sid=17- - - - 3&n=156
Bob
Craig
Bob
Diesel Hybrid - I'm not diesel savvy so indulge me please: wouldn't there be some issue with time in restarting if the engine were to be turned off?
Bob
The Baja Botch leaves lots of lessons for Subaru. Have brochures ready. Watch the pricing. Watch the content. Offer the powerful engine up front. Careful with the colors. Leave the cladding on the old Pontiacs.
But...I'm not convinced Honda will find that many buyers, either. Look at it this way, Explorer outsells the Pilot by about 4 to 1. So the Sport Trac might outsell the Pilot Crew cab 4 to 1. That would put sales well below Honda's forecasts.
Plus, it would cut into Pilot and Odyssey production, and those models are hot. It's a big risk Honda would take.
-juice
I thought perhaps you were questioning the reason for that. I guess not.
I think the Explorer outsells the Pilot because there are just that many more Explorers available. As for production, Honda has plenty of space in Alabama!! I wouldn't be suprised that Honda will meet their expectations. But then again, nobody pays me to tell them what to build.
Bob
-juice
Bob
Do you think it would cost more, or less, than a regular Pilot?
If it's more, that would give the Avalanche a big price advantage. Plus it's bigger and has more payload.
Of course you realize Honda could sell a Pet Rock as transportation and people would buy it.
-juice
Craig
* zero emmissions vehicle
* stone-cold reliable. Literally.
* very fuel efficient (uses none)
* cheapest way to own the "H" badge
-juice
Wednesday, 19th November, 2003
BMW stands out in a European context as a car company doing pretty well while its peers struggle to make profits. One big factor in BMW’s success was dumping Rover back in 2000 and focussing on high-margin executive, sports and luxury models. For all the griping among journalists about Bangle’s adverse design influence on models like the 7 and 5, there’s little sign that BMW is heading for a major profits dive. The company’s products are generally well liked by the market and BMW has no trouble in commanding a badge premium. A lower euro against the dollar would help profits from the US, but there’s hedging for now.
BMW has – overall - also been pretty successful with the Mini brand I think, successfully taking the idea of a premium brand into the small car sector. Maybe that’s partly where Mercedes-Benz went wrong with the A-class – keeping it in the Benz brand - although I realise that even the suggestion that the A-class has not been successful will always be vigorously contested by Mercedes-Benz (but plenty believe it is still not profitable when development costs are taken into account). DaimlerChrysler has its ‘smart’ car brand of course, for cars that it would not want to see besmirch the three-pointed star, although what driving a smart says about you and where the brand is positioned is still unclear to me (especially with the upcoming Forfour).
But breaking out into new segments raises questions – for both Mercedes-Benz and BMW. Does it mean higher costs, lower margins and a dilution of brand image if going downmarket? Actually, on the last point, I hear that the execution of the 1-Series gives it a very premium feel (it borrows quite a bit from the 3-Series).
One thing’s becoming clear though – both BMW and Mercedes-Benz are looking to grow volume and get into new segments and there’s plenty of product action coming up – BMW: X3, 6-Series, 1-Series; Mini Cabrio; M-Benz: Compact Sports Tourer, Grand Sports Tourer, R-class, CLS.
Bob
If it's more, that would give the Avalanche a big price advantage. Plus it's bigger and has more payload.
It will probably be priced about the same, maybe a little less, depending on how it's contented.
As to the Avalanche, I don't think many Honda customers will shop Chevys. If the Honda pickup is unique enough, in its own way, I don't think that will be a problem.
Bob
Even though Baja had more content, it started out much higher priced than the base Outback.
Pilot does not even offer a moonroof, so the Crew Cab shouldn't. I think these vehicles have to lean more towards utility and less towards pampering luxury.
-juice