Subaru Crew Cafe

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  • locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    Nicholas, I was wondering about your flag. I thought you were Canadian and have seen the US flag a number of times over your name. How odd.

    Bob, I think they're history too. 30,000 units per year makes Subaru seem large. :)

    ~c
  • c_hunterc_hunter Member Posts: 4,487
    That whole thing puzzles me, it really seems like Isuzu is purposefully trying to get out of the consumer business.

    I have not looked at an Axiom or driven one. Are they so bad that nobody is buying?

    Craig
  • kenskens Member Posts: 5,869
    Bring back Joe Isuzu!

    Ken
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    "Bring back Joe Isuzu!"

    They tried that a couple of years ago - didn't work.
  • njswamplandsnjswamplands Member Posts: 1,760
    Introduce Juice Isuzu? nah all he would do is sit on a fence and never get a car :-o
  • hondafriekhondafriek Member Posts: 2,984
    I hate to admit it but you were right on in your assessment of Bondra, so far he has been a total bust on the Senators team.

     As a matter of fact in game 6 he was responsible for a 4 minute penalty for cross checking Tucker in the face that resulted in a goal that was almost the death of the SENs.

     (Mind you having said that, I would pay good money to have the opportunity to cross check that dirty bugger myself:-)

      Cheers Pat.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    They were cash starved. GM didn't let them spend in R&D where they needed to. The market shifted towards car-based and they weren't allowed to respond.

    If that sounds bad, what is Jeep going to do to fix their market share erosion? Much tougher.

    -juice
  • atlgaxtatlgaxt Member Posts: 501
    It's a shame because the Axiom is not a bad vehicle, and the 250 hp direct injection engine is a great engine, with good hp, good torque, and decent fuel economy (for a truck based SUV) all on regular grade fuel. I don't understand how they think they will remain in business until they get their new product in '07.

    On another note, has anyone seen the new new Suzuki Forenza wagon? Am I crazy or is this a good looking vehicle?

    http://autoshow.edmunds.com/news/autoshow/articles/101518/page027- .html?tid=edmunds.e.autoshow..leftnav.28.*
  • p0926p0926 Member Posts: 4,423
    That wagon's not bad looking. My first thought was it kind of resembles an Audi.

    -Frank P.
  • njswamplandsnjswamplands Member Posts: 1,760
    driving thru butler, nj. anyone from here? man that car looked sharp except for that dorky driver window air deflector thing.
  • volkovvolkov Member Posts: 1,306
    I thought it looked like a baby Cadillac SRX.

    Nicholas
  • dcm61dcm61 Member Posts: 1,567
    has been beat to death, the press can now pick on Nissan.

    Huh? Why should foreign automakers have to split their fleets?

    http://www.freep.com/money/autonews/nissan21_20040421.htm
  • lark6lark6 Member Posts: 2,565
    Losing to the Leafs every time they face them in the postseason is getting old. Time for a wholsale overhaul? Sure the team will revert back to its old losing ways for a while but getting rid of the guys with apparent psychological blocks that negate superior talent could help.

    Ed
  • hondafriekhondafriek Member Posts: 2,984
    You and me both ED. Regettable though it may be I think the first one to go will be the coach, he just does not seem to able to motivate to the next level.There will be a house cleaning.

    It has been said that after a number of years no matter how good the coach that players tune him out. I think the likelihood of Bondra being back is about Nil, same for DeVries I think Bonk should also be gone.

     As for goaltending well bad though Lalime is at times there are not many better goalies available around the league. And as for the inconsistencey I don't how they are going to address that, the team threw away literally 20 to 25 points this year on games against the leagues bottom feeders.

     Also for some reason they seem to think that coming off a great game that the next team they face should mail the 2 points in.
        (Okay Rant over)

       Cheers Pat.
  • oregonboyoregonboy Member Posts: 1,650
  • ozman62ozman62 Member Posts: 229
    It must be disappointing. I've been waiting for the Sens to take it to the next level for a while now. I think you may be right about the coach, he's done pretty well, but can't seem to get that final few percent out of his players. I think the European influence/ mindset is a little too strong there, too. The Sens essentially got beaten by one (old)man - Balfour. He played great, but you have to fight through that if you want to win.
    Obviously, here in the West, we've been highly entertained by the Flames/ Canucks tilt, and I must confess, as I was watching some of the other series, I was thinking 'Where's the playoff intensity? Don't these guys want to win?'
    Now the Flames are in tough against the Dead Things, but hey, everything from here on in is a bonus (for the Flames).
    Regards,
    Owen
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Yeah GM actually strangled their marketing arm and that's what shot them. They could have had some great marketing ploys against Jeep easily beating all the Jeeps in a stock-stock competiton other than the Wrangler in offroadability. Not to mention tons and tons of stock features in the trooper 10 years ago that the other SUV companies just got to marking in the 2002 model years.

    Just an overall marketing flop. :( I still think that GM should buldle Isuzu with Subaru to create a "whole" company with the isuzu division taking care of Subarus "trucks" and subaru taking care of the AWD cars.

    -mike
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Forenza's interior is horrible, though. Looks like a cheap GM steering wheel. Outside it's fine.

    May not be a bad idea, paisan, there is zero overlap in product.

    -juice
  • hondafriekhondafriek Member Posts: 2,984
    Yeah Owen Hugh Adami writing in the Ottawa Citizen said that Ottawa needs a break from these guys. I am inclined to agree with him I don't mean that they should leave entirely, but we do need a long break to settle the nerves.

      Next year will be interesting to see what happens if there is no lockout. One glaring problem in Ottawa from the SENs got back in the NHL. has been goaltending, They have never had a goaltender that you could have 100% confidence in.

     But like I said to ED the number of truly good goalies at the moment is almost non existant.

      Cheers Pat.
  • volkovvolkov Member Posts: 1,306
    Having lived in Ottawa for nine years which is the longest I've ever been in one place, I do have a certain sentiment for the Sens. Still, they have constitently been loaded with talented players who just couldn't step up when it was needed. In the end, the team lacks "grit" for want of a better term. That was the 'Dead Things' problem for years. Yes, they hoisted the Cup, but how many years did they disappoint in the post-season?
    Hope they can fix it.

    Nicholas
  • ldbrickerldbricker Member Posts: 140
    however when our Aeros first came on the scene they did quite well. If I remember correctly they are the first Houston team to go all the way to a championship. The Rockets pulled 3 in a row very soon after that, at least as I recall things. I've been to a few games and it is definitely exciting. At times I can't even keep up with where the puck is. I'd rather watch racing on the Speed channel though.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    HCH is still the best seller, interesting. Let's see if Prius passes it in 2004.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    is that both Honda and Toyota sold more hybrids than Subaru sold Bajas!

    Bob
  • locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    oh come now. how is that at all surprising?

    ~c
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Got me there Colin! ;)

    Bob
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Mitsubishi is hemorrhaging red ink, and DC has had enough. According to AN, if DC can't find a buyer, it could spell the end for Mitsubishi.

    http://www.autonews.com/news.cms?newsId=8484

    Bob
  • locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    must be a subscriber... CliffsNotes?

    seems reasonable to me. shocking to hear, perhaps, but eventually all bad things must end one way or another.

    ~colin
  • grahampetersgrahampeters Member Posts: 1,786
    G'day

    Frankly, I am not surprised that Mitsubishi has problems. They now have a design chief who has decreed that all Mitsubishis should sport their corporate nose. Its unfortunate that he is French and seems to have taken Gerard Depardie as his inspiration. It works for the actor, but not the cars.

    Cheers

    Graham
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    It's free to subscribe. This is one of their very few "free" articles, BTW.

    I'd do a copy-and-paste, but most likely I'd get spanked by the powers that be here. This is big news, so I'm sure other news services will pick up this story shortly, if not already.

    Edit: Here's two more.
    http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=7065&sid=17- - 3&n=156

    http://www.freep.com/money/autonews/dcx23_20040423.htm

    Bob
  • c_hunterc_hunter Member Posts: 4,487
    "But Mitsubishi, hammered by losses from buyers with bad credit in North America, expects to post a net loss of $664 million for its fiscal year, which ended in March."

    Huh?? Does Mitsu float a higher than normal number of risky loans to customers? I find it hard to believe that's enough to "hammer" a single company more than any other.

    CRaig
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    Boy, the possibilities here are staggering.

    If DC sells both Mitsubishi and Hyundai, who would buy them? Another Asian car company? I doubt it, as there would be too much model overlap. GM, Ford or BMW? Again I doubt it. Maybe VW, as they don't have a foot in the Asian market yet.

    If it does come down to Mitsubishi (and Hyundai) going on their own, it will mean "survival mode," and that they will have to concentrate on vehicles that have the most potential to reap lots of money -- FAST! That means the EVO could be among the first to be sacrificed. The EVO is a great "image" car, but it will never bring them the kind of money they will need to survive.

    Bob
  • p0926p0926 Member Posts: 4,423
    I must have been living under a rock because I didn't realize the DC had a stake in either company. Of course it was no real surprise considering the growing globalization of the auto industry.

    -Frank P
  • damish003damish003 Member Posts: 303
    Craig,

    Someone here will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Mitsubishi had a "no payment for a year" promotion, or something to that effect, a year or two ago. I recall thinking at the time that they were going to get deluged with buyers that had nothing to put down on a car. A recipe for financial disaster, IMHO.

    -Dan-
  • locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    dan,

    actually that program was hardly 0% to all comers. if you had poor credit you got the usual fairly high rates, or a denial. if you had average credit you did get 5% or less, though.

    a friend bought a mitsu during that and did get 0% but he has great credit. sitting in there with him talking about the cars (I test drove them with him, gave him my thoughts) I overheard numerous other would-be purchasers who were upset at not getting 0% after their credit report came back. I imagine the fine print on the 0% ads said as much, though.

    ~c
  • damish003damish003 Member Posts: 303
    I had to research that one. Colin's referring to the 0% offer, and I was talking about the no payment for a year deal. Both programs were in effect at the same time, according to the following.

    http://www.motortrend.com/features/news/news030407_mitsu/

    Either program sounds like desperation tactics to me.

    -Dan-
  • p0926p0926 Member Posts: 4,423
    I remember that sales promotion. No down payment, no interest and no payments for one full year! That's an expensive program to subsidize even if you only offer it to buyers with good credit.

    -Frank P
  • atlgaxtatlgaxt Member Posts: 501
    Regarding Mitsubishi and the ugly corporate nose.

    Sounds a little like what Subaru is planning.

    Hopefully they will not begin to offer zero down, zero interest and zero payments for a year.

    On another note, I thought Hyundai was doing well in the states (probably another reason Mitsubishi is sucking wind). If Mercedes sells their portion, I'd think that their would be no real impact on Hyundai here.
  • bat1161bat1161 Member Posts: 1,784
    It's funny, as I'm reading this board about the Mitsubishi problem I am hearing about it on Bloomberg radio here at work. Analysts say they see it as a "remote" possibility that they would close shop all together. It is being talked about on the Dow Jones a lot.
    Mark
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    This is a big story, as well as a lesson to be learned from in regards to Subaru.

    DC owns 37% of Mitsubishi, and GM owns 20% of Subaru. If I were Subaru, I would be very wary of letting GM get a larger percentage of Subaru ownership in the future. Anything over 20% ownership puts a small company (like Subaru) in a very risky position in terms of determining their future. The larger the percentage, the less control that small company will have, and when things go bad...

    Bob
  • locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    I just disagree with the whole corporate nose idea in general. Let's take the Dodge grill for example. I'm not a particularly big fan of it on it's original vehicle, their full-size truck, but it definitely looks like a truck grill. That same grill is absolutely ridiculous on the Viper, and not much more at home even on a minivan.

    ~c
  • kenskens Member Posts: 5,869
    Wow, that is big news about Mitsubishi and potentially Hyndai.

    It's the 10-year/100-mile powertrain warranty kiss of death.

    I'm sure the loss of a major competitor will change things for Subaru in terms of the WRX line. Would the USDM STi have 300HP had Mitsubishi not been around to introduce the EVO?

    Ken
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Mitsu has mostly been selling masked Chrysler clones. The Galant ain't what it used to be. Remember the AWD turbo model they had a while back? Look how dull they are now, they're a Stratus with a huge beak.

    Their 0/0/0 offers left buyers massively upside down on loans. They got tired of the dull cars but had to pay a stiff price even to get out of their cars.

    You think that builds loyalty?

    Very poor, short-term thinking.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    with all this turmoil, does anyone think the EVO will survive to do battle (on the track & in the showroom) with the STi? I have my doubts...

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    They were about to do a special edition, that might not make it after all...

    -juice
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    will go from FQ to FD.
  • hondafriekhondafriek Member Posts: 2,984
    Loosh that was good.

      Cheers Pat.
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