I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

kyfdx

I was working at a place in '77 and a girl that worked in the office had won a Manta in a raffle a couple of years before.. pretty cool little cars....

fintail

The Buick I saw was just driving by...I was too surpised at its mere presence, its condition, and its colors to notice the model. And I've always had a problem telling photos of vinyl from leather...I usually rely on the stitching. Some vinyl is very convincing.

 

My dad had a Horizon when I was very young, he loved it and he talked about it for years later. It was indeed great in the snow, and he drove like a maniac back then, so I recall him cruising at 80+ on rural interstates. I do have a memory of a door handle breaking off though, and I have the same vivid memory of one snapping off on the Ciera my mom had at around the same time (it broke of in my hand). I don't like lift up door handles.

 

I saw a couple of semi-unusual cars today. A 1st gen Legend coupe...not so rare I know, but it was odd in that it was in showroom condition, driven by an older woman. I also saw one of those ugly Volvo Bertone coupes, this one had significant front end damage (hood buckled and all) but was still driving along.

ghulet

...on eBay is a base model (I think there were both Limited and Park Avenue in '76), so I'm betting heavily that the interior is vinyl, like on my base '71 Electra. Leather was actually not so popular in the mid-70s in general; it's de rigeur now on even mid-priced cars, but even things like S-class Mercedes and BMWs had vinyl back then, while most domestics had vinyl or velour.

andys120

Here's a pimpy Buick I like....

 

http://www.hemmings.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/dealers.detail/hmn_v- - ehicle_id/216424

 

Cuz it goes back to when they had real motors, check it out, 455 CID/4bbl! Woohoo!

ghulet

...$8k for a four-door, base model '70 Electra? That seems a bit dear to me, though I'd actually rather have a four-door than two-door in almost any case, if we're talking closed cars. Never understood two-door cars in general.

seminole_kev

...I saw a old Mustang II. Had a lot of poor bondo work around the rear wheel wells. Not in good looking shape.........of course some wouold say that about it when it left the factory. ;-)

andre1969

is a nice looking car. I always liked the dashboard on those...has a clean, uncluttered look about it that almost seems futuristic for 1970.

 

I think I still prefer the '75-76 just for the flashy pimp-factor, but the 70 will do nicely. And even once you do the translation from gross hp to net, I'm sure that '70 would definitely be a screamer! I think by '75-76 the 455 only had like 205-210 hp, and was probably good for 0-60 in about 12-13 seconds? I had a '69 Bonneville that was probably good for around 8.5-9, I guess, and I'm sure that a '70 455 would be comparable? Especially considering my Bonneville just had a 400?

michaellno

...saw a pretty tatty looking Volvo P1800 coupe. Grey, not sure if it was primer or paint, but had some rust spots along the door sills.

andre1969

yesterday. I'm not sure of the model, but it was one of those small-ish yet bulky looking late 70's/early 80's designs, that had the square headlights and a roofline somewhat reminiscent of a '75-80 Ford Granada. Silver Spur, maybe?

 

It was parked at an apartment complex, of all places!

stickguy

I saw a similar Roller yesterday too, pulling out of a dumpy strip. Not sure if they were at the coin op laundry, or the $.99 video store.

lemko

...an orange 1974 Plymouth Gold Duster in fairly decent condition. It kind of reminds me of Al Bundy's ride.

andys120

This was a mid-70's fourdoor with antique license plates and an antique woman behind the wheel.

 

The car wore a coat of decent light blue metallic with a few scratches and dings but no doubt a closer examination would reveal some rust and other problems.

 

It looked like a decent driver, still a step above beaterhood but can you imagine driving the same plain-jane fourdoor for 30 years!

merckx

I saw on Barrett-Jackson last weekend that a Porsche Carrerra 6 had an ignition key. Was this common for dedicated racers back then? I just can't imagine why...

blh7068

"Maybe this one's a Limited, though? Did they have the Park Avenue edition in '76?"

 

My first car was a 76 Electra Limited, and there were only two trim levels-the 225 and Limited.

 

I got a lot out that smogged 455...oh, and that car did have the crushed velour interior. Most of the ones I have seen had the velour.

blh7068

"I think by '75-76 the 455 only had like 205-210 hp, and was probably good for 0-60 in about 12-13 seconds?"

 

Actually hp dropped from 75 to 76...i think my smog motor was rated at only 195 net hp. '75 was 200-210.

 

Heck, my 71 firebird with a 400 2 bbl is rated at 185 net hp.

 

FWIW- I recall reading those 70 Buick 455's desginated for the full size line were rated at 370 brake hp...guessing thats somewhere in the in the 290-310 net hp range. So i think your 0-60 times sound reasonable.

kyfdx

The horsepower is down, but the torque is still there...

 

I had a '77 Cobra II with a 302 V-8 and a two-barrel carb.. Only rated for 135 HP, but it was still extremely quick... Ran out of breath pretty early, but very fast 0-45 MPH.

turboshadow

My parents had a VW engined Omni. I learned to drive stick on an Omni. I can say this with all sincerity:

 

The Dodge Omni was one of the worst cars ever foisted off on the American public.

 

Among its more charming traits were:

1. A four speed box that you couldn't tell if you were in first or third. Not the best car to learn to drive stick on. My dad drove a five speed and said the only difference was you couldn't tell if you were in first, third, or fifth.

2. Engine 'management.' Half Dodge, half VW, all bad.

3. Defined the term 'oil burner.' The upside is we never had to spray for mosquitos.

4. Acceleration that could best be described as tepid, unless the aforementioned engine 'management' system took it upon itself to interrupt spark to the engine. In that case, acceleration became 'exciting,' especially since this usally occurred when a large semi was bearing down on you.

5. It did have a supercool yellow/orange/black 'Omni' racing stripe.

6. Quality Dodge Service!! (dealer went to prison IIRC...odometer fraud)

 

Believe it or not, I remain a Dodge fan in spite of this horrid little car. Maybe I am a glutton for punishment.

 

Turboshadow

wimsey1

I had an Opel Manta also('72, Dad had a '73, brother had a '74) and a '75 wagon (the fuelie year). Have very fond memories of those cars, never had any problems with the FI system.

 

Saw an early Fiero moving under it's own power the other day! Haven't seen that in a while. Looked well kept.

debaser853

A friend of mine is obsesed with Fieros. Races them autocross and rally. chaserace.com

andys120

There's an entire cult-thing that's been going on with Fieros, almost from the get-go, I've never quite understood it myself.

 

The contemporary Toyota MR2 was a much better car IMO, I saw a fairly nice one today.

 

Today's other sighting is the main body of a 1937-41 Ford Tudor

sedan in primer sans hood and fenders being trucked on a flatbed.

 

Give the Ford stylists of the era credit, cuz even a bare unpainted shell like that is recognizeable as a Ford.

debaser853

Saw a 4-door Defender 90 on a lot for sale. Left hand drive. Much much bigger than the 2 door variety.

kyfdx

Cool.. did you see a price?

debaser853

From their website:

 

Defender 110 - Rarest of the Rare!!! Mint Condition, Low Miles - Must See!!

 

Milage: 15266

Price: $69,900

 

Says standard equipment includes "turbo charged."

kyfdx

Turbo diesel, I would imagine.. Wow.. I can live without it...at that price..

Mr_Shiftright

If you can find a 5 speed V-6 Fiero (as usual GM finally gets a car right and then discontinues it), they can be somewhat sorta kinda desirable for a small group of enthusiasts. But if it's an early car and an automatic 4 cylinder, it would be hard to give it away.

fintail

Slim pickins for noteworthy oddballs on ebay right now

 

I guess if you like 70s Euro lux styling and no ROI

 

This has a nice patina

 

Hey Andre...it's cheap

 

Very honest looking fintail...I wonder why it has a salvage title

 

Immaculate ponton owned by local MB specialist now has amazing bids...I wonder how legit the bidder is...although the person who paid a mint for his beautiful diesel fintail was legit

 

Yesterday I had a 'time warp' moment in the fintail that others with old cars might be able to relate to. I was driving out in a rural area, as I prefer to cruise around in less traffic. There were very few cars on the road. Maybe 1/8th of a mile in front of me was a 64 Nova. And the only other car, oncoming, was a 57 BelAir 2 door post. For that brief moment, I think I was back about 40 years ago.

Mr_Shiftright

the fintail has a salvage title because any old car that doesn't have a high book value is very easy to "total". One bent fender and that car is totalled. The low selling price seems to confirm this.

 

So most old cars without high book value will suffer the stigma of a salvage title, often without much significant damage. I could total my Porsche 928 with a popsicle stick I bet.

andre1969

with a salvage title, does that pretty much scar the car for life? Or, when you apply for a new title in your own name, will the "salvage" part be removed? Would the "salvage" make the car any harder to get inspected, titled, and tagged?

 

I bought my '79 Newport from the junkyard, but I lucked out and bought it the same day it came in, so the title was never marked as "salvage". They just did it like a used car, I think. And speaking of '79 Newports, Fintail you have no idea how tempted I am to bid on that one!

fintail

I was thinking that too. Maybe that fintail at some time wound up in a junkyard, and then someone rescued it. I've heard of sound cars usually with a mechanical defect ending up in yards.

 

Either that or it was in a fender bender and the fender and light assembly was wrecked or something, and as Shifty says, a small accident exceeded the value of the car.

 

I think salvage titles can be hidden by moving the car to some states. I don't think it works for all, although I am sure the old salvage title stays on a carfax. I wonder how a carfax works on a car without a standard VIN.

 

I think you could do a lot worse for the money on that Newport.

Mr_Shiftright

CARFAX wouldn't list a car this old, and really, at this age and with this market value, the whole idea of a salvage title is irrelevant.

 

Just about every car on the road today worth, say, $3,500 or less is ready for salvage at the first fender bender.

fintail

Looks like the most expensive fintail on the continent

 

If they drop the price a little more I bet some wacky German will buy it and bring it home, thanks to the depreciated dollar. Looks like a nice car though, with some rare options, like headrests, dual mirrors, foglights, extra chrome trim. I wonder about the cruise control...MB didn't have that til the 70s, so it must be a weird Rube Goldberg period aftermarket item. Too bad it's not injected.

 

The local MB guy here got 12 grand out of his mint diesel fintail, so who knows...

Mr_Shiftright

You mean they found $12,000 in the trunk?

fintail

I don't know...maybe some components are cast out of platinum?

 

Maybe on this one too

 

Interesting article on old car issues in Uruguay

lemko

...red and white 1953 Buick Special two-door sedan. Looked like an amateur restoration.

andys120

be worth over $40K?

 
http://hemmings.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/dealers.detail/hmn_vehic- le_id/216642

 

andre1969

what would a real one run nowadays? I guess I'd value one of these as less than the real thing, but still more than a more mundane Coronet convertible with a lesser engine like a 318 or 383. I have no idea what prices are running on 'em these days, though.

 

Beautiful car though, even if it is a fake!

stickguy

Well, on something that was a trim/option package to a basic car, you can create an exact duplicate, even if it isn't original. Kinda like taking a real one and using NOS to restore it, you can take a Coronet and use the same parts to create a true re-creation!

 

I think my point is what you are looking for, a real top $ collectible, or a fun car to use?

 

I wouldn't pay 44K for a fake for sure, not that I would do it for a real one either!

Mr_Shiftright

Yeah, a big block clone can bring that kind of money. Of course, once the muscle-car balloon bursts, which it will, these clones will take a huge hit in value, while the "real thing" will stabilize at somewhat lower prices but not too much. I'm already seeing cars that were purchased under the dazzling TV lights suddenly bringing $35K less a few months later.

 

A 1970 Plymouth Barracuda Gran Covertible Clone with a 440 just sold on eBay for silly money:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item- =4524571582&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT

 

(A database of ONE does not make a market).

 

Car was worth maybe $45K tops tops, so some fool is down $20K from the starting gate.

fintail

This is kind of like watching Ferraris c. 89-90

stickguy

I don't know what's more amazing: somebody bid 68K on the 'cuda, or the fact that the seller didn't take it! (based on the reserve not being met).

 

What about those major high prices from the B-J auction? Are they paying for the atmosphere, or are some of those cars so nice/rare/whatever that they will always be top of the market?

turboshadow

Everything was insane in 89-90! Musclecars we drove around in when in high school five years earlier were fetching close to 10 grand!! Going from a 500 dollar street thrasher to 10Gs in five short years?? Insane!!

 

Turboshadow

andre1969

I had just put a lot of work into my low mileage '69 Dart GT. It only had around 50,000 miles on it. I didn't put much into it, money-wise, but did put a lot of work into it sanding it down and getting ready to paint, and then one of my neighbors who restored old cars helped me paint it.

 

Well, I had this thing looking almost brand-new again, and wanted to keep the miles off of it, so I thought about trying to buy a beater. There's a used car lot up the street that, at the time, had a '70 or so Nova 2-door sedan with a 307 and a 2-speed automatic. Nasty shade of brownish green with a black vinyl roof, cheap black interior, and no a/c. It was in decent shape, and not ragged out, but was just a cheap, basic car. Well, they wanted $1900 for it, which was about $800 MORE than I paid for my Dart! No way in hell was I going to pay more for the beater than I did for the good car!

 

I remember also finding a '75 Buick LeSabre 4-door with a 350-2bbl. It wasn't in bad shape, and the only rust was on the lower parts of the front fenders, right in front of the doors. I think this place actually wanted $1500 for that thing!

stickguy

Yeah, but the 10K car is now a 30-50K car!

 

When I was in middle school, a friends older brother had a superbird. Used to beat the snot out of it, and probably wrecked it (the way he drove). Just a beat up old car at the time (mid-70s) IIRC, I don't think it was expensive or pristine (although the details get fuzzy that far back).

kyfdx

Um.. stickguy.. Spotted a '99 323i.. new body style.. sedan.. 83,XXX miles.. 5-speed, naturally.. for sale in York, Pa..

 

A hood ding.. and a this and that.. asking $10,900.

turboshadow

"Yeah, but the 10K car is now a 30-50K car! "

 

But it went from 10K in 90, to 4K by 94. Cars in question were '69 Charger's. Bought mine in 94.

 

In the early eighties, musclecars were cheap, cheap, cheap. High school kids could afford 'em.

 

Turboshadow

andys120

Yep in '82 I bought a '69 GTO convertible (400cid/4speed)for $6500 and probably overpaid at that.

andre1969

in the summer of '92, the local junkyard had a '68 Dart GTS out in their little used car lot in front. It was kind of a copper color, and had the 340. There was nothing blatantly wrong with it that I could see. They wanted $1400 for it.

 

I really wish I had the money to buy it back then! However, I had just bought my '68 Dart 270 a few months before, and wasn't ready to sell it, or add another car to the fleet (a fleet which, back then was only my Dart and my DeSoto). This is a really lame excuse I know, but one beef I had against that GTS was that it didn't have air conditioning, which my 270 does. Ooh, if only I could've gotten it through my mind at the time that you don't NEED air conditioning as much as you NEED 340 cubes! ;-)

fintail

I like looking at the prices of Ferrari Daytonas etc back in 89 or so to today. What an investment, not to mention the eyewatering maintenance costs in the meantime. Serves the bastards right to speculate in cars. You can see the same thing on a lesser scale on common 20s cars. A nice Model T or Model A is certainly worth less now than 20 years ago. The same thing will happen to muscle cars. I just have to wonder...what's next?

 

I spotted a few oddballs today...a blue Merkur XR4 that looked pristine from the rear, but unfortunately had front end damage...an immaculate 1st gen c. 80 Audi 5000S, in a boring beige, and a decent white 560SEL in wheels that were blingy in 1989, like something Sir Mix-A-Lot would have drove. The guy in that complimented my 126, that was nice.

lemko

...often drives prices. Model Ts and As have probably fallen in value because those people who remember them from their youth are dead or very old. Muscle cars are hot because of all the aging baby boomers desperately trying to cling to their youth. I wonder if we'll see 60-something Gen-Y'ers bidding outrageous sums on a mid-90s slammed Civic in the 2040s?

debaser853

Outside my window today: a 60's Dodge p/u Utiline, baby blue, work truck. Marker lights and spot lights on the roof, hand built wood cargo box in the bed, and a coffee cup perched on the dash! Has a little lift, smallish tires, 4wd.

 

(I had to search Dodge Trucks to get some year/body style info.)