I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

fintail

Same here. Modern belts would look weird, and I would have to somehow fit the box. I don't drive it a ton anymore...I guess it's a risk I willingly take.

 

At one time when I had vintage racer aspirations for the car, I thought of installing a harness type system like ina race car. I didn't consider it long.

andys120

If you got the type of inertial reel that was used in the back seat of my '86 Mustang 'vert it'd take up very little room (roughly 4"x4"x2") and it'd be incredibly easy to install, assuming the latch is compatible with whatever belt you've got in there.

jrosasmc

Speaking of seat belts, I know of one late '70s car that only has lap belts: the '76 Cadillac Eldorado convertible. I've seen Eldo coupes from that year with full one-piece shoulder and lap belts, but I swear the convertibles only had the lap belts standard. Check it out the next time you see a '76 Eldo ragtop or look at one of the many examples for sale on Ebay and you will see what I mean. It may be big but it's no Volvo!

fintail

If I ever replace the belts in the fintail, I might see about retrofitting inertia reels. They'd probably be nice too because one half of the belt would be out of the way when not buckled. Until then...it stsys in the stone age.

ghulet

I don't think any '70s domestic convertibles had shoulder belts, I'm pretty sure they weren't required. They would have had to be mounted to the seat itself, kinda like in modern convertibles. Indeed, if the most expensive convert at the time (the Eldo) didn't have them, I can't imagine any of the others did.

210delray

...weren't required to have shoulder belts back then.

andre1969

were pretty much on their way out in the 70's, and weren't accounting for many sales anyway, so that's probably why they were exempted.

 

What about those newer Eldo/Toro/Riv convertibles, which were offered around '82-85? Did they have some kind of provision for a shoulder belt? I have a buddy who used to have an '85 LeBaron convertible, and then he made the same mistake twice and bought an '86. That's been so long ago now, but I'm thinking they had shoulder belts that were anchored in the back of the car around the part where the rear windows rolled down.

210delray

...did have shoulder belts anchored somewhere in the back of the car (not on the front seats themselves). They were not required, however.

 

Convertibles with "basket handles" like the VW Cabriolet attached their front shoulder belts to these.

andys120

Right, the belts of my '86 Mustang GT were anchored to the body, just behind the door and fed thru a slot to a fitting on the sides of the seats so the shoulder belt would position properly. I imagine this system is still in use for many ragtops although some now use belts that are anchored into the seats themselves.

seminole_kev

was 1986 the last year of the "open" head lights, or was it the first year of the smooth, covered lens headlights?

andys120

It was the last year for open h/ls, which I disliked so I put in aftermarket plastic covers (big improvement IMO). '86 was the first year for EFI but that year's 5.0s actually had 20HP less than the last carbeurated* 5.0s.

 

* Curiously Edmund's spell-check has even less of an idea how to spell this word than I LOL.

andre1969

at least, according to my Power Point spell checker!

michaellno

On my way home from work last night, I spotted an odd looking car/truck type thingy.

 

Front end looked like a late model Opel Astra (small hatchback) .. however, it had a pickup truck bed grafted onto the back of it ... sort of like a "ute" they sell down under in Australia, or, if you're old enough to remember, an El Camino or Ranchero.

 

This wasn't a hack job, either, looked like it was only a few years old.

 

Guess I should look on the GM website in Mexico to see if they offer something like this .. yep, found it. Called the "Tornado", it has a 1.8L 4 banger making 100HP. Here's the website:

 

http://www.chevrolet.com.mx/content_data/LAAM/MX/es/GMMGM/showroo- m/chevrolet/modelos/tornado/diseno.html

 

Although, it seems like the one I saw was an older version.

andre1969

actually I think that Tornado IS a version of the Holden Ute. Here's a Ute, for comparison:

andre1969

is kinda purty:

 

http://www.holden.com.au//images/uploads/gallery_images/crewman/i- mg_crewmanS.jpg

(warning, the picture is kind of a big 'un)

seminole_kev

I spent plenty of summers riding around with my cousin in her 1986 Mustang convertible. . (It was a V6 model though). Fun car for the time. Good for running around South Florida in.

 

I asked about the headlight design because I couldn't remember if it was an 85 or 86 that she had, but I knew her's was the last year of that front clip style.

bumpy

...except that the Holden Ute is a lot bigger, being based on the RWD V8 Monaro (aka neo GTO). Ford Australia also makes a Falcon ute about the same size as the Holden.

fintail

Yep it sure looks like a modern Holden Ute to me. Go to the Aussie ebay site and you'll see some oddities. They like muscle cars there too...then again, I'm sure you've all seen the Mad Max movies, so you know...

 

Today I saw a Datsun 510 that appeared to have wheels from an 80s Maxima. That same 6.3 is still in the same spot in the MB dealers side lot...not a good sign 6 days later. I also saw a nice looking 'Al Bundy' style Duster.

andre1969

still has the same '74 Imperial that I first saw back in October. They still want $5995 for it. I wonder if now would be a good time to go in and offer them the $2500 or so that it's probably actually worth? ;-)

 

Doing a reality check though, it really doesn't do anything for me. It's a real hardtop coupe (no padded opera windows), but it's brown. With a brown interior. When it comes to these massive beasts, I think I actually like the 4-door hardtops a bit better!

 

So I guess it would be kinda dumb to go in and offer $2500 for a car that I don't really lust after. And with my luck, they'd probably accept my offer!

michaellno

I've spent a fair amount of time on both the Holden and Ford of Australia's websites, so I've seen the ute's on their. Plus, I think C&D did a quick review of one in their magazine a year or two ago.

 

What I saw last night was way, way smaller than the ute's. Picture a Geo/Chevy Metro 3 door, except that instead of the back seat and hatch area, you had a small pickup bed. It looked like the Astra from the front. I wish I had gotten a better look at it, but it was 3-4 lanes over in traffic.

Kirstie_H

Don't forget tonight's member-to-member chat - it's open mic night, so come and discuss whatever's on your mind.

 



 

http://www.edmunds.com/townhall/chat/townhallchat.html

 

6-7pm PT/9-10pm ET. Drop by for live chat with other members. Hope you can join us!

 

kirstie_h

fintail

Yep now that I look closely, that Tornado is smaller than a Ute. The Ute looks like a modern day ElCamino if there ever was one. I wonder if it would sell here.

 

That's certainly the most obscure thing I've heard of lately.

michaellno

Equipped like they do Down Under, with an optional manual transmission and a big, honkin' V8, I would think the Holden and Ford utes might find an audience here in the states.

 

My understanding is that options on them include a built in barbie and a cooler for the XXXX or Fosters.

debaser853

During last winter's commutes to work I saw, several times, a RamCharger, circa 2000 body style Dodge trucks. Got close enough to see that it had Mexican plates.

 

Looked pretty decent. I've always liked the big 2 door trucks.

michaellno

Yep, they still build those south of the border. I think GM builds a version of them as well. They are 2WD only, I think, but otherwise are reminiscent of the large Blazers, Broncos and Ramchargers of the 70's and 80's.

andre1969

so they actually ARE still building those full-sized Mexican Dodge SUV's? And that's what they're calling them...Ramcharger?

 

I remember seeing some pics of on built on the 1994-2001 style Ram. As I recall it was a very piecemeal production, using the doors off of a Ram pickup, and the tailgate off a minivan! Still cool, though!

 

I was really expecting Dodge to offer a full-sized SUV when the Ram was redesigned for 2002. I guess the figure that since the Durango now seems to sit somewhere between mid- and full-sized, that a true full sized SUV would be redundant? Kinda like how it seems nobody will ever make a "true" midsized pickup, because it would be too close to the full-sizers?

michaellno

Nope, doesn't look like Dodge is building the Ramcharger any more (www.dodge.com.mx) - but you're right, I think C&D did a quick article about the previous generation Ramcharger, and mentioned the minivan tailgate.

 

I know that at one point, DC was looking to build a full size Suburban fighter off the Ram platform, but killed it for reasons that escape me. But, I agree, the Durango is pretty much an equivalent vehicle in terms of size, so I'm guessing that they felt like they could save money that way.

 

Funny, I've been thinking that what's missing are true "small" pickups. The Colorado, Frontier, Tacoma and Dakota are really starting to encroach on the full sizers in terms of cargo space and towing capacity (other than the Super-Heavy Duty's and duallys).

debaser853

FWIW, It had the same taillights as the 1st gen Durango, which were the same taillights as the 96-00 minivans.

 

I remember reading that Dodge was looking to build a smaller pickup, but I don't believe that it's still on their agenda.

jaserb

You hit the nail on the head. I parked my '92 Ram 50 next to a new Tacoma the other day and I was amazed by how much bigger it is, in every dimension. The Ranger is the only "small" truck left. Even it seems quite a bit bigger than the old S10s, let alone the old Toyotas, Mazdas and Isuzu P'ups.

 

-Jason

fintail

Local vintage MB specialist's 4cyl fintail has been relisted and has attracted amazing bidding. I have to wonder if the bidder is legit, could be some joker

 

Last weekend I looked at a 98 S500 that a local Porsche dealer received in trade. They don't usually handle such big cars, so the first word the salesman said was 'make an offer'. I passed on it, as the color is wrong (black) and the interior wasn't clean to my obsessive standards. Additionally, I love my 126 and don't want to part with it as it is behaving perfectly, but keeping 3 cars would be impossible too. The 140 was in decent shape otherwise and could have been had cheap, maybe 17-18K if I tried.

 

That leads me to this. Now I've got a new car itch. I've always kind of liked these big weird tanks more than the sedan versions. They only sold 348 of these in the US that year, so it should count as obscure. I really like the colors too. But the location is not so great, and the maintenance and economy would be killer. I think I can resist temptation.

jrosasmc

I live in New England (Vermont) so I could go see that '97 S600 coupe if I had the desire to. Unfortunately I don't have any interest in checking it out, as you noted the maintenance and gas mileage would absolutely decimate one's bank account. I can't imagine how much it would cost for one year's insurance as well. Even a BMW 318i would cost peanuts to maintain rather than this beast.

fintail

I can just imagine what a major service or a full tuneup would cost. And god forbid it ever need engine work. Still, I think it's quite nice to look at...maybe better in more common V8 form, better mileage anyway.

 

For awhile I've told myself I am going to hold on to the 126 another 4 or 5 years and them maybe pick up a CDI (I wish we'd get a S diesel) if they end up being good cars. That still holds true. And I still don't know what I'll end up doing with the 126.

Mr_Shiftright

I think cars like this, of late 90s complexity, and totally out of warranty, are money pits and very bad investments. Buy 'em cheap and bail out at the first major component failure. Maybe you'd get lucky but don't pay book prices for cars like this, is my two cents.

 

If the engine blew up on an S600, you'd might as well just take off the license plates and call the wrecker.

seminole_kev

you realize in that last post you left Andre an opening to pop in with his latest phrase that I've already threatened him over! ;-)

andre1969

I would say throw a Mopar smallblock into it, but a Chevy smallblock will fit in places that a 273/340/360 won't ;-)

seminole_kev

*sound of blood vessel popping*

 

;-)

andre1969

I'm not really advocating swapping in a smallblock on a car that's already running well. But let's suppose you had some old car that you really, really loved, but really couldn't afford the upkeep on it. Suddenly the engine blows. Let's say it would cost $8K to get that engine fixed, or you could get a Chevy smallblock thrown in for like $2K.

 

If it meant having a car I liked still running, albeit bastardized, versus being scrapped, I'd prefer it still running!

 

But if it makes ya feel any better Kev, whenever I'm at a car show or swap meet, and I see a Chevy smallblock where it doesn't belong, I usually say "yuck" ;-)

seminole_kev

Then you do the honorable thing and sell the car to someone who can fix it or part it out to keep others of its kind on the road. ;-)

 

Really I'm not THAT uptight about it, but sometimes it seems people are too willing to get rid of the best part of certain cars. Jags being a big red flag for me, but other high end or sports cars, that had wonderful motors being made into "lumps" (to borrow a Jaguar term) bothers me as a car fan.

 

Now if you go and put a 440 Max Wedge into a Dodge Omni and make it RWD, those kind of things actually appeal to me, because you're not doing really any "harm".

andre1969

it's not the engines they need to be swapping out with Chevy units, but more like the electrical stuff, automatic trannies, a/c units, etc... <ducking>

seminole_kev

what's air conditioning? ;-) My car never had, so it can't go wrong!

 

Seriously though, yes tranny's were their weakpoints. Generally they were out of date and clunky compared to their competitors. Not that they would fail, just that they just were out of date technologically. Really, to me the electrical thing is a little blown out of proportion. It isn't the insanity that it is made out to be. Really the electrical is fairly crude and simple, but that's not really a problem. In a way it is almost an advantage. If you can work on household electricity, you can work on a Lucas electrical equipped vehicle. The big problem I see is that there isn't a fuse for each system (or even groups of systems) only a few, "major" fuses. So if something pops a fuse, it is a bear to figure out what is actually doing it.

 

Oh, and like a real cat, they love to mark their territory. Leaking seals of all sorts are common on the older Jags. I think the Brits only think of marine mammals when someone refers to seals.

 

Beautiful motors though. Those XK straight sixes are just a joy.

fintail

Yeah, book prices on cars like that 140 coupe are still pretty steep...I'd want to pay much less. I don't know what the attraction is...but my 126 is running very sweet and I am now in search of a set of factory chromes for it, so that should keep my careless spending at bay.

 

I almost thought of putting a 350 or something in the fintail when it needed some big engine work in 1997. I knew it was going to end up costing me a few grand, and a V8 conversion crossed my mind. But in the end I figured I might as well do it right...and I have no regrets.

jrosasmc

How many years have you owned that '64 fintail by the way? It's got to have a lot of miles on it by now!

 

What do you make of Benzes like the mid-90s C-Class sedans? One of my friends has a '96 C220 that he's owned since new but it only has 50k miles on it. He takes it out only when it's not raining or snowing (basically it's his summer toy).

jaserb

but probably more common than Chevys in Shifty's neighborhood. I was ready to turn right at an intersection with a right turn arrow light that just turned from yellow to red as I was approaching. I was in a hurry, so I debated jumping the light before the light turned green for the oncoming traffic (yes, I know. Bad me.) I looked left to see what was waiting in the lane I would be jumping into - if it was a bus or something I'd have been OK.

 

It was a beautiful titanium gray Ferrari 550 (maybe 575) Maranello.

 

Didn't think I'd be able to jump him at the light in my D50 4x4, so I opted to wait...

 

-Jason

fintail

I've had the fintail for 10 years now. I got it right before I went to college, and I drove it as a daily driver for a little while after. I think I put maybe 60K on it...not a ton, as when I was in school I didn't drive daily. The engine problems happened c.40 K miles ago now.

 

Many people like those C class, and they can be had cheaply nowadays, even the last ones of that style. Other than a C43 (AMG), I am not won over by them though. I simply like larger cars. And that C220 is a 4cyl, about 150hp...I don't ask for a lot, but I like more than that LOL

Mr_Shiftright

I have to tell you honestly that I have never driven a foreign sedan that had been converted to American V-8 power that wasn't a god awful thing to drive. It just doesn't work for some reason.

 

Now a Cobra or a Sunbeam Tiger...well, at least you KNOW you wanted a brute. But you stick a 350 in a Jaguar XJ6 and you completely change the character of the car. All the smoothness and quietness is gone and the torque just tears the guts out of it unless you [non-permissible content removed]-foot it (ergo, what's the point?). And you get all kinds of weird vibration and balancing problems you never anticipated, and exhaust clearance issues (a classic one is having the exhaust manifolds fry the foreign car's steering box due to too close a fit).

 

Then hooking up all the accessories often requires a lot of clunky bolt on stuff.

 

Having ranted, I did ONCE see a beautiful installation of a Ford 289 into a Mercedes 280

SL; however, the gentleman who performed this was a craftsman of such merit that he actually designed and fabricated roller coasters for Disneyland. So he rather knew a lot about doing something right with cost no object.

fintail

That's what stopped me from doing it, other than killing the originality of a good injected fintail, of course. It's not just an engine. You'll have to install another transmission and all the linkages and mounts that come with. Then the cooling system will need to be adapted. Then the suspension will probably need to be adapted for different weight. Then you'll probably have to adapt the steering and brake booster. Then the electrics will have to be adapted. It's usually not worth the hassle unless you are doing it all yourself and you have all the time in the world.

fintail

Ebay time:

 

This should be tons of fun

 

And so should this...weirdos travel in packs

 

These are rare in NA

 

"ready to restore"...you'll be the first ever to do so

 

Every surviving example of these sad things ends up on ebay

 

Unusual Buick Sportwagon

 

I've heard of a 'double bubble', never seen one

 

Lovely DS

 

Decent honest looking fintail

 

This is kind of cool in a freaky way

andys120

Fiat Abarth "Double Bubble:

 

I love the racy spirit of Carlo Abarth's creations

There's a group, mostly Europeans, who prize those cars...

 

http://europeancarweb.com/features/0502ec_berni/

 

Subaru 360 My God, they were uglier than I remembered. ..cruises nicely at 45 mph LOL, tatranslationquot;it's all done @ 50 mph." Oh yeah, everybody wants a really ugly, really slow car.

Mr_Shiftright

A Buick "sportwagon"? What sport, demo-derby?

andyman73

The other day, I was getting new shoes on my ride, and I saw this rather interesting car go by. It looked like your run of the mill 70s Caddy, as it came towards my location. Then as it passed by, it rather obviously had a Cadillac style El Camino bed, with fins and all. It appeared to be nicely done, not a home chop job.

 

I guess they couldn't wait the 30 odd years for the Escalade EXT to come out. LOL!