Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/25 for details.
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/25 for details.
Options
I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Ten munutes later, a '55 T-Bird, excellent shape:
Saw a Chrysler 300C LWB in Denver the other day. Makes a nice limo/livery car. The same day I spotted a 25th Anniversary Corvette Convertible parked in a Denver suburb. 32 years old and still looks great.
I like seeing the Olds 98's, my grandfather and father-in-law (both deceased) drove them.
58 Buick Chop Job -- now I know who to sell my Renault LeCar Ice Cream Truck to---do people *really* have this much money to throw down a rabbit hole?
The Caballista ---- HAHAHAHAHAHA
1982 Le Baron Le Station Le Wagon --- fair enough at $4,000 but yer pushin' it.
1988 Chrysler "Sleeper" Wagon --- 15 PSI of boost on an '88 Chrysler 4-cylinder engine? Be afraid, be very afraid. :surprise:
Tatra V8--- rather an insult to the Czechs to call it a "Commie Super Car". Like they invited the Red Army into their homes?
1983 Zimmer --- calling all retired Florida swampland real estate moguls!!
OIY! I need an Alka Seltzer after reading these ads..... :sick:
The Tatra is cool - I always liked their quirkiness. I wonder if this one is cerified to be used in the US.
Zimmer Golden Spirit - ughh - note the randomly places power window and lock switched on the door panels and the 85mph speedometer on such a "grandeur motorcar"
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
You can thank Ford for that.
I notice the 302 is a 4-bbl though. Wouldn't that be the engine from the Mustang GT? For some reason, I'm thinking the Mustang GT used a 302-4bbl that year, with around 170 hp, while everything else used a milder fuel-injected 302 with 140 hp.
Oh, and I gotta say, I LOVE that '82 Olds Ninety-Eight! I've always admired these cars anyway, but I think the combination of condition and color really make this one stand out. I know I tend to get more excited than anyone should over these 80's cars, but that one actually has me drooling a bit! :shades:
Which motor does that car have? The air cleaner doesn't have a 350 emblem. The listing didn't specify size...
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
That was probably one of the most durable engines around in that timeframe. The weakest areas of this car would probably be the 4-speed automatic, and the primitive ECU. Both came out for 1981, and I don't think they had the bugs more or less worked out until 1983. Despite that, Consumer Reports tended to rate the 98 and Electra of this vintage better-than-average, so overall, they were pretty good cars.
27 liters, 1000 horsepower
Collector car expert Bill Stephens and Keith Martin of Sports Car Market Magazine evaluate real Classics at the Gooding & Company auction in Scottsdale Arizona, including a Rolls-Royce Phantom II with a Merlin airplane engine.
http://www.supercars.net/cars/4769.html
That '73 Grand Prix is SICKENING it's so hot. My grandparents had a '73 Chevy Bel Air 9p wagon I think in the same color combo (it was some kind of orange, maybe slightly lighter, with white interior--it replaced a loaded '69 Kingswood Estate that my uncle's girlfriend ran off the road). That GP should have fetched way larger bids than the above somewhat bland '80s Olds 98.
Some bidders may have been put off by the seller's confusing remark about the Grand Prix having its original "nailhead engine."
That Grand Prix is a beautiful car, and nicely optioned...but I just don't care for that color! It's kinda sad how the Grand Prix went downhill over the years. According to my old car book, the 1973 had a standard 400-4bbl V-8 with 250 hp. So, not only did it have a big engine standard...it had a powerful big engine standard (400's came in 170, 185, 200, 230, and 250 hp setups that year).
For 1974, the 400 was still standard, althoug down to 225 hp. In 1975 it was cut to 170 hp...I wonder if that was a 2-bbl by that time, or if the 4-bbl just got that weak? For 1976, a 160 hp 350-2bbl was standard, although if you got the SJ, the 185 hp 400 was standard. The SJ was pretty popular too, with about 88,000 built. The Grand Prix as a whole didn't do that well in 1975! And for 1977, the GP was demoted to the 135 hp 301-2bbl, with the SJ holding out with a 180 hp 400-4bbl.
For '73, I thought the Grand Prix came with a 400/230hp engine standard on the J model while the 455/250hp was optional for the J and standard on the SJ.
My memory could be totally wrong because back then, most cars were typically offered with a slew of engine options-usually more than just the 2 which I recall for the Grand Prix anyway.
A 250hp Pontiac 400 V-8 would have been a rival to the SJ 455/250hp engine in '73, but I just don't remember it. The strongest Pontiac V-8 for '73 was the 455SD, but it wouldn't have been available in the Grand Prix.
Just curious, does the book list any other applications for the 1973 Pontiac 400/250hp engine besides the Grand Prix?
I saw an oddity last night. A 1960 Dodge wagon, white, excellent condition. As I saw it driving while I was breezing through a green light at an off-ramp, I didn't notice if it was a HT model or not, but it looked to be in excellent shape. Funny thing is at that same intersection maybe 20 years ago or more, I remember seeing a gold and white 1958 Chevy 4 door HT...I remember the location because I was eating at the restaurant located there.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
I think the Monte Carlo looked better outside than the GP for '73, but the GP's interior was the best of the Monte, Regal, and Cutlass Supreme/Salon, by far, IMHO. That instrument panel is magnificent and recalls the great Grand Prix dashes of the mid '60's. The Monte's panel is absolutely bargain-basement in comparison. Those buckets look pretty awesome too. I think the '69-72 GP looks better outside than the '73, but the '73 has it all over the earlier ones on interior.
Bill
If it was a 4-door hardtop, that would be a really rare model. That year there were three stations wagon models...Dart, Matador, and Polara. And in the Dart lineup, they might have offered them in Seneca, Pioneer, and Phoenix trim levels, but I can't remember off the top of my head. Only the Polara wagon was a hardtop though, and I think they only made a couple thousand. The mechanic who's working on my '57 DeSoto has two of them, but they're both basket cases. One of them has a 383 cross-ram, which he says was stock from the factory!
That book only lists this 250 hp 400 as being used in the Grand Prix. The book could be wrong though...wouldn't be the first time! It's the big Consumer Guide Auto Encyclopedia that they put out every so often. Lots of pretty pictures and nice historical write-ups, and tables with production figures, engine choices, etc, but there are errors here and there.
I tried searching the web, and can't find any mention of a 250 hp 400 used in 1973. Musclecarclub.com shows it, but that's probably a typo as the actual writeup mentions the 230 hp 400, with a 250 hp 455 being the only option...yet when they list the engines below, they show 250 hp for the 400.
That 1973 SD455 was supposed to go in a few different cars, like the GTO, Grand Prix and the Grand Am, and I think sales literature was even printed up listing it. But at the last minute, I think it got pulled, and was only used in the Trans Am. A couple of test cars were built with the engine... CARS Magazine got ahold of a pre-production 1973 GTO with one, and prematurely named it their performance car of the year!
I think one thing that really helped put the Grand Prix a step above was that its interior was fairly unique. IIRC, the 1973 Monte Carlo used the same dashboard as a 1973 Chevelle, just with the optional round gauge cutouts (still had to pay extra if you wanted REAL gauges in there and not idiot lights, though). And I think the interior was pretty much the same as a Chevelle. On nicer models, they might put carpeting on the lower door panels, and make the vinyl padding on the upper half thicker, but it was still the same basic thing. But the Grand Prix got its own unique dashboard, totally different from the LeMans. Although, the LeMans would steal it for the 1973-75 Grand Am, 1975-77 Grand LeMans, and 1977.5 Can Am. The Grand Prix's door panels were unique, as well, with more of a full-length armrest that swooped upward toward the front.
I don't think Olds or Buick even went through that much effort to distinguish a Regal or Cutlass Supreme interior apart from the cheaper models. Same dash, IIRC, and same basic door panel design, although like the Monte Carlo, the nicer models swapped out the cheaper vinyl upper part for either nicer vinyl or velour.
The Grand Prix was pretty expensive back then, though, wasn't it? I seem to remember it being a lot more expensive in base price than the Monte Carlo or even the Regal and Cutlass Supreme.
For example, Australia kept the Ford 351 Cleveland alive long after it stopped being EPA approved for sale in Cleveland Ohio (or anywhere else in the USA).
Re: Grand Prix engine options
Typo's aside, your book seems to confirm that the '73 Grand Prix may actually have had only 1 optional engine above the base 400. (After taking the 455SD out of the equation.) That's surprising when you consider how many engine options were offered during that era of Detroit hx.
Even the '73 Corvette had 2 optional engines that year, I think.
That was probably one of the most durable engines around in that timeframe. The weakest areas of this car would probably be the 4-speed automatic, and the primitive ECU. Both came out for 1981, and I don't think they had the bugs more or less worked out until 1983. Despite that, Consumer Reports tended to rate the 98 and Electra of this vintage better-than-average, so overall, they were pretty good cars.
My grandpa bought a new Olds 88 in '83. I remember it being a nice and comfortable car. He liked the hwy fuel economy as he drove it back and forth to Florida a lot. It was reliable, but it started giving him problems at the 110k-120k range. The trans started acting up and he traded it in on an '87 Caprice Classic Brougham LS.
If it was a Matador/Polara, well those only came with big engines. The Matador had a standard 361-2bbl with 295 hp, while the Polara had a 383-2bbl with 305. Optional were a 383-4bbl with 325 and a 383 Cross-Ram with 330 hp.
If it was one of the Dart models, it probably just had the old 318 poly engine, although I think the big-blocks were available. The 318 had 230 hp with the 2bbl or 255 with the 4bbl carb.
Actually Andre, There were a lot of questions regarding engine availability-period. There werent going to be enough parts for as many applications as you mentioned, and I think thats why it was limited to the TA and Formula. All the builds those SD engines made it into were very late 73 model year cars....and early 74.
I doubt it. IIRC, parts availability was a huge problem.
Not surprising. My mom had an 85 Olds Custom Cruiser wagon with the 140 hp 307. It always ran super smooth from day one with no problems.
My grandmother had an '85 LeSabre sedan with the 307. She gave it to me in 1999 after she lost her license, and I had it for about 3 1/2 years...finally gave up on it when the brakes went out. It actually had plenty of life left in it at 157,000 miles, but at that point I had too many cars, and was about to get a pickup truck, so I figured it was time to let it go.
Never had any trouble with the engine, although it was getting to the point that it needed at least 89 octane to run without pinging. The last time it went through the emissions test, in early 2001 I think, it returned numbers that looked good even by 2000 standards! The only issue I can recall with the transmission was the lockup torque converter refusing to unlock, and that would sometimes cause it to stutter and stall out when you slowed down. I think that was just a switch though, and was fairly cheap to fix.
I recall hearing about the 1972 strikes that crippled F-body production, but I don't know the story of 455SD engine parts/supply problems. Could you give more details or point/link to a reference?
It's an interesting topic for me because of other "orphaned" engines of the 70's which found a home in racing/aftermarket biz and managed to "live on."
Recall the Keith Black Hemi? He wasn't the first guy to offer a revised 426 Hemi V8 block after Chrysler abandoned the elephant. But Keith Black became the "standard" for such animals. Witness the ten years of Top Fuel racing record-holders who ran Keith Black Hemi blocks.
As a result, I'd expect that a "pro street" modified Hemi Cuda would bring more money at auction with a KB Hemi than a period-correct stock Hemi!
Pontiac had a real winner with the 455 SD, albeit at the wrong time. Maybe the best Super Duty V8 they ever made? But after 1974...gone. Without even a loyal aftermarket following to keep the 455 SD alive and working in a plastic bubble even...
Theyr'e almost all red.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Unlike the old MGs and Triumphs etc, the Miata's start when you want them to. Great car to have fun with.
Your right, you don't see those old MBs much anymore. That's why it caught my eye as I had to wait for it to drive by so I could walk out to the parking lot.
Okay, i just did a bit of research on those 220's. The one I saw had to be a 220b. It definitely was a W111. Is your's a W180? I can't remember.
Here's a pic of a really nice example:
My car is also a W111. A W180 is a Ponton - pretty much a 1953 style car that was made in some form until 1960...where a fintail is a 1959 style car that was made in some form until 1968.
I tried to peak inside to see if it had crank windows but the owner was sitting in it.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
An Edsel. Think it was a 4 door. Bright pink.
good thing I never had lunch today.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I saw that too.... that place has some funky stuff. They had a few barges that caught my eye a few times, but when I looked at them they weren't in the best of shape.
I wanted to see what they were asking for the Edsel, no price but here is a link so the others can see it Pink Edsel
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic