Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/22 for details.
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/22 for details.
Options
I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
"We need a bigger Lemans" (a Bonneville).
Car was demolished, but restored after much labor (about a year) . Ford went to the wrecker. It was an old rusty thing. My friend spent an overnight at the hospital and was sore for weeks. Lucky it hit on the passenger (left) side.
I often wonder how the carnage would be if someone plowed into my fintail, but I have seen the period crash test footage and I know the car is pretty solid...I think it would fare very well for something its age. It could probably destroy similar sized modern cars too.
Now if that had happened to the Host Steve in the UP, I'd put a twenty up that the pickup had an open six pack next to the driver's seat! Up there, in any town you may find a restaurant, you may find a gas station; but you'll always find a bar and package shop.
In the picture with the driver, it looks like the airbag didn't even go off.
Also a black entourage style Lincoln convertible with the top down.
The weather has been good this October.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
'69 300 convertible w/ 440
So, you have a nice, low mileage 40 year old convertible. Why would you drill holes in the A-pillars and interior trim to install dumb-looking spotlights? This isn't a Highway Patrol car. C'mon, man.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052533/Worlds-fastest-crash-test-Car-sm- ashes-wall-120mph-speed-family-runarounds-hit.html
Just upchucked my lunch!
Thank you.
That does look like what is left of a Camaro, though.
Did you know there was a remake of that movie?
That does look like what is left of a Camaro, though.
Did you know there was a remake of that movie?
Yeah, but in the end, it was an engineless '67 Camaro that stood in for the Challenger. Judging from that single leaf spring, I'd guess it was just a cheap 6-cyl model. At least I'd HOPE GM put beefier leaf springs in the stronger models. I remember the single leaf spring was one weak spot in the original Chevy II/Nova...I didn't realize they carried it over for so long.
I saw the remake in the late 1990's at, of all places, on an outdoor screen at the Mopar show in Carlisle! I remember it had Jason Priestley playing the part of the blind DJ, and had the somewhat famous (among Mopar circles at least) line of "You think you're gonna catch him in a dogpie Chevy?! It takes a Mopar to catch a Mopar!" And then the cop making the statement ends up rolling a really nice looking '68-69 Charger. I just hope they used a junker for that scene, rather than a nice car!
The remake also featured a Challenger, but the impact at the end was off-screen, so they didn't waste yet another old car.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic
The movie ends, rather abruptly and clumsily, with the Charger hitting a freight train and bursting into flames, and then they roll the credits. That scene was also used in the opening credits of "The Fall Guy"
Dirty Mary was done by a French director, and I think he also did "Race the Devil", around the same time, which also had Peter Fonda in it. That movie had some pretty good stuntwork in it for the time, especially considering they were trying to do high-speed chases with a Vogue motorhome and various medium/heavy duty trucks!
Looked like it belonged on the scrap heap, as well..
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
I liked that darker (thought not real dark) turquoise I remember on some of them too.
Yeah, seems like it, doesn't it? The two-tone creme/beige was the only color choice you got on the 5th Ave in 1979, and they made about 15,000 of those, out of a total of roughly 54,000 New Yorkers.
For 1980, they gave you a second choice, "black walnut", which is a really dark brown. They show it off in the first few pages of this 1980 Chrysler full-size brochure.
FWIW, the "Nightwatch" blue New Yorker they show a few pages further in, is a dead ringer for my '79 non-5th Ave New Yorker, right down to the hubcaps that are airbrushed on. They actually used that same picture in the 1979 New Yorker brochure, where the car had been sporting the deep turbine style hubcaps, that came with the extra wide 7" rims. I guess those weren't offered in 1980, and it was just cheaper to superimpose different hubcaps on the car, rather than stage a new shot!
For 1981, they still offered that two tone creme/beige, but took away the "walnut" and added "Driftwood Gray" over "Light Heather Gray" and "Mahogany Starmist" over "Heather Mist".
I think they only built around 13,000 New Yorkers total for 1980, and around 6-7000 for 1981, so as a result, I'd imagine the '79 5th Ave in two-tone creme/beige is by far the most common color.
Here's the 1981 full-size brochure. One interesting thing that they did that final year was to switch the 5th Ave leather with the regular model's leather, and vice versa. For some odd reason, the '79-80 5th Ave used the same seat pattern as the base cloth model, just with leather. Meanwhile, if you got leather on a base model, it was the really thick, pimpy style with all the little buttons. I think the 5th Ave style looked cleaner, but to most buyers, I guess that thick padding and pimpy little buttons looked more luxurious, so Chrysler finally got around to switching the two for 1981. By then, it was too late though, as the R-body was dropped about half-way through the model year.
Also sadly, by 1981 they had improved the build quality and interior workmanship on these cars in a major way. The '80 was even a pretty big improvement over 1979 with regards to workmanship. But, by 1981, fuel crisis #2 and the recession were in full swing, Chrysler's future was still very shaky, and big cars in general just weren't selling all that well compared to a couple years before.
I wonder, if Chrysler had given these cars a few more years, if they would have caught on again, once big cars began to sell well again? After 1981, Chrysler pretty much gave up the big car market entirely. Rumor has it that if Iaccocca had his way, the M-body (Diplomat/Gran Fury/5th Ave) would have been axed as well, but demand from police and taxi fleets kept the platform in production, and when they applied the 5th Ave package to it, it became a pretty solid hit, and a cash cow.
I don't know the exact pricing but the 5th Ave probably came in a little cheaper than any of the Panthers. It wasn't as up to date (or as large) as the Panther was at the time but was probably a solid alternative for a RWD V8 sedan.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic
The 5th Ave they tested came in at $16,892, versus $16,617 for the Grand Marquis LS and only $15,636 for the FWD Electra they had in that test. Of course, a lot of it depends on how they're equipped.
I think one reason the M-body 5th Ave was popular is that it gave you a lot of big car feel, but in a package that was sized somewhere between mid and full-size. They were slightly smaller inside than GM's RWD intermediates (down to just Cutlass Supreme and Bonneville by that time)...a bit more legroom and headroom, but less shoulder room and trunk space. But externally, they were sized about mid-way between mid and full-sized. Most traditional full-sized cars by that time were at least 210-211" long, while most intermediates were under 200", and these came in around 205-206". And, they were decked out very well inside, very luxurious in an American (i.e., pimpy) sort of way.
I think sales of the M-body New Yorker peaked around 90,000 units though, so it never did sell as well as a Grand Marquis or Crown Vic in any given year.
IIRC the window sticker for my 89 MGM said something along the lines of 21K, it did have every option except leather. I was suprised in 85 the 5th ave was more expensive.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic
I'm ok with it, for the record and I think its a trend that should come back unlike say, the mullet.
2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Limited Velvet Red over Wicker Beige
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
Well, they couldn't lay them seductively across the hoods and trunks anymore like they used to do in the 60's, because the sheet metal would cave in! :P
Check out the slightly Cheryl-Laddish looking woman in this 1979 St. Regis brochure. She seems like she's awfully hot and bothered down in that lower right-hand corner. I wonder if the dude slipped something in her drink? Or, if they had that "Skor with Pherimones" body spray back then? :shades: And in the upper right-hand area, it looks like this happy couple just picked up another happy couple for Swingers' Night! Way to advertise that roomy back seat!
http://fortcollins.craigslist.org/cto/2666430093.html
Personally, I think the price is a little too high for a 25-year-old Saab that isn't even a turbo. I'd also be afraid of it because of the transmission - who knows how much time it has left before it self-destructs.
2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Limited Velvet Red over Wicker Beige
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Limited Velvet Red over Wicker Beige
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
It really wasn't a bad-looking car for the times. The interior design (except for the chenile cloth upholstery) looks good too. But I think they were not very good cars. I remember CR saying their tester snapped a torsion bar just sitting one day. And I know they had a bad reputation for build quality. They didn't seem to sell very many and the ones they did sell didn't seem to stick around very long.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
By and large, I think they made better police cars and taxis than they did private automobiles. The engines and transmissions were durable, and for the most part the platform was tough. Although, suspensions were a weak point. But, they'd start squeaking and rattling, rusting and leaking, getting hard to start, have minor parts fall off, long before their Ford or GM competition. But, a few years down the road, the Ford or GM would often "catch up" when it blew an engine or ate a transmission.
Years ago, there used to be a '79 St Regis in the same two-tone green as that brochure running around locally. And, the day after I bought my '79 5th Ave, I saw it, about a quarter mile from my condo, sitting along the road with a for sale sign. $500. Damn, I thought. I actually liked the St. Regis better than my New Yorker! Partly because it was green, but also because I like that raked back front on the St. Regis. This one had the nice, thick, corduroy style interior, but just had crank windows and a 318.
I also thought it a bit ironic that St. Regis showed up for sale within walking distance of my condo, since it lived in the next town over. I rememer I used to see it regularly when I used to deliver pizzas. It's almost as if it was calling me!
Nah, this ain't no Dodge Swinger ad. These folks are supposed to personify respectful, modest behavior. They could easily afford an Imperial, but chose a St. Regis so as not to flaunt their wealth.
Maybe if today's terminology had been in vogue in '79 a well optioned St. Regis would have been categorized as near-luxury, whereas the New Yorker and Imperial would have been luxury. Or, maybe the New Yorker would have been Mopar's near-lux entry, with the Imperial as the only Mopar worthy of being labeled lux. In that case, the prestigeous sounding St. Regis owner would have had to resign himself to merely owning a mid-price car, with his main bragging rights being that it was well optioned, unlike that green one that andre saw. Ah, heck, why does something so simple have to be so complicated?
In 1955-56, there was a Chrysler model called the New Yorker St. Regis. It was a ritzier version of the hardtop coupe. In those days, it was fashionable for the auto makers to slip in an extra name to denote the hardtop...Bel Air, Newport, Sportsman, Riviera, Catalina, Lancer, etc, all started off as hardtop suffixes. Chrysler called the cheaper version of the New Yorker hardtop "Newport", but it was $3951, versus $3995 for the St. Regis, so I couldn't see $44 making much difference in luxury, even back then.
As for the '79 St. Regis, here's how it fell into the full-sized lineup, price-wise. All prices are for the base 4-door sedan with the base engine, which was a 6-cyl for most. The LTD/Marquis and Bonneville were standard V-8.
Impala: $5928
Catalina: $6076
LeSabre: $6110
Delta 88: $6212
LTD: $6284
Caprice: $6323
Marquis: $6387
Newport: $6405
St. Regis: $6523
Delta 88 Royale: $6524
LeSabre Ltd: $6620
Bonneville: $6718
LTD Landau: $6811
Marquis Brougham: $7176
Bonneville Brougham: $7584
Grand Marquis: $7909
So, the St. Regis was a bit pricey, compared to the competition.
As for the New Yorker, here's where it fell in with its peers...
Ninety Eight Luxury: $8795
Electra 225: $8878
Ninety Eight Regency: $9236
Electra 225 Limited: $9278
Electra 225 Park Ave: $9959
New Yorker: $10026 (5th Ave added around $1525 to this)
Continental: $11,200
DeVille: $12,093
Fleetwood Brougham: $14,102
As had often been the case in the past, the New Yorker was sort of the threshold, which separated "true" luxury brands like Cadillac/Lincoln from everybody else.
Looking at the competition, it's easy to see why the Chrysler, and Dodge especially, had sales issues in '79. Getting a Delta 88 Royale or an Electra Park Avenue, to name just 2 examples, for about the same or less money, would have been a far more appealing choice.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
One of my New Yorkers is the base model, and honestly, IMO, it's not that impressive on the inside. I think one of the best parts of the car is the dashboard, which has full gauges, a swept-away look that makes the car feel roomier, and higher-quality padding that's more resistant to cracking. But, all the R-bodies used that same dash, just with different inserts for the woodgrain (or blackout trim), so it's not really all that unique. GM, at least, gave you five different dashboards, although by that time I don't think there was much difference between a Ford and Mercury dash.
The interior fabrics really aren't all that plush, either. To me, it feels like it should belong in something more along the lines of a LeSabre Limited. I actually think that corduroy stuff that was used in the St. Regis and Newport seemed more supple and substantial. And the carpeting isn't exactly high-rent shag, either. My 5th Ave has the nicer shag, but the base model's carpet just seems like your typical 70's standard-car stuff.
I'd imagine that the cars ultimately sold at a deep discount as well, so while the MSRP's made the cars look expensive, the out-the-door prices were a lot more reasonable.
I think one of the biggest factors that kept sales of these cars down was Chrysler's impending doom. It affected sales of all of their cars, to be fair, but if a company might not be around much longer, buyers of that company's more expensive, prestigious models are even more likely to stay away than those who go for the cheaper cars.
Personally I like the long, low sleek style of these cars, but they also have a massive, hulking look about them, that makes them appear heavier than they really are. In a more fuel-conscious time, that probably kept some buyers away.
One of my favorite features of the R-body is the location of the B-pillar. The front doors are large, and the B-pillar's pretty far back. So even with the seat all the way back, the B-pillar doesn't give me blind spot issues like it does with most other 4-door pillared sedans.
Nice car really but the price is silly.
What people REALLY want in an old Saab is the 5-door hatch ( this body configuration is very desirable to Saab lovers), where an old one is purchased and then the old 8-valve turbo engine engine and tired manual, or doomed automatic, transmission are gutted, and people install a rebuilt 5 speed manual transmission with better gear ratios, and the later 16 valve turbo engines. People will sometimes spend $20,000 to configure an old Saab 5-door hatch in this fashion, and when you're done you have a comfy, fast, pretty reliable ski car/family car that can carry a piano in the back.
There are shops that specialize in these conversions.
But a 2D hatch automatic, no matter how pretty, is just an old used car, and the transmission is a hand grenade with a loose pin. But at least it's a non-turbo 8V motor, so you're free of the Saab head gasket epidemic.
That reminded me of something I had forgotten about for years.
Back in 1980 I got my first job, at a small wholesale/retail operation that dealt in dental supplies and equipment. It was owned by a husband and wife and they actively managed the place. He was a real tyrant, but his wife was a sweetie and we got along well. She decided she wanted a new car around that time and I remember her telling me that she was going to buy a Chrysler because she wanted them to survive. I don't remember what she had been driving but one day she showed up in a very pretty Cordoba, sort of a turquoise green color - two-tone, I think - with the forged aluminum wheels.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6