I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

imidazol97

>vAndy Granatelli has been reading the Postwar Studebaker forum, which has been discussing him, Studebakers and STP in impolite terms,

Ask him what was the chemical and the purpose of STP at the time, the cost for materials and canning in the product, and the selling price recommended for STP. He can find my email address in my profile at the top of this post.

Mr_Shiftright

C'mon, enough Andy and Studebakers. There's a Studebaker topic HERE/POSTWAR STUDEBAKERS for anyone who is interested.

And now, back to the obscure I hope? Any more off-topic, by me or anyone else, will have to be moved to where it belongs.

andre1969

I recently got an email from Hagerty insurance that had an article that listed "Threatened, Endangered and Extinct Cars: Reader submissions."

Kind of an interesting read. I noticed in the list they said they insured fewer than 15 1980 Dodge St. Regises. Heck, I didn't think they'd even consider a car ilke that! Maybe I need to try getting my two '79 New Yorkers off my regular insurance and onto the antique policy!

jljac

Packard should never have merged with them. They should have joined American Motors in 1954. They might still be around today, who knows?

This discussion should be in the Packard forum, but there isn't one. Wonder why???

If Packard joined Nash it would have ended up like Hudson.
"

Mr_Shiftright

That's an interesting list. Most of it makes perfect sense. It's the old adage "Not loved when new, not loved when old". I was susprised though, that Hagerty insures over 500 Deloreans. I wouldn't have thought that many would still be running, but I guess the Big Movie saved that car's butt from certain extinction! :P

Not suprised by over 500 Pintos, since they made so many, but I was shocked to see that there are more than 500 Spitfires with Hagerty. I *never, ever* see a Spitfire on the road anymore.

I can also see why 80s cars have faired badly on survival. I knew this was coming because some years ago (for you old timers who remember) I posted an article about how wrecking yards were not saving 80s domestics, but rather crushing them because they were taking up too much space and not generating enough parts sales.

Mr_Shiftright

We do have a PACKARD topic, if you'd like to visit it--maybe get some discussion going.

PACKARD TOPIC

Mr_Shiftright

Ed "doc" Ricketts, of Cannery Row fame, was killed in this type of car....hit by a train of all things:

andre1969

Not suprised by over 500 Pintos, since they made so many

I think in the long run, the Pinto's infamy as "the barbecue that seats four" might have actually helped save it as a "classic" car. People want it BECAUSE of that notoriety. Plus, it's quirky, oddball, and reverse-chic enough to have a broad appeal. Heck, I wouldn't mind having one of those little portholed wagons, the one that looks like it could give you an STD... :P

I can also see why 80s cars have faired badly on survival. I knew this was coming because some years ago (for you old timers who remember) I posted an article about how wrecking yards were not saving 80s domestics, but rather crushing them because they were taking up too much space and not generating enough parts sales.

Back in 1994, after holding onto it for parts for about 2 1/2 years, I finally sent my wrecked '69 Dart GT off to the junkyard. They had that sucker for about a year and a half, and it was picked clean when they finally got rid of it. In contrast, that same year, some friends of mine were trying to unload a still-running 1976 AMC Hornet wagon. They offered to give it to me, and I wouldn't even take it! I called the junkyard that took the Dart, and they just politely said that they wouldn't have a need for a car like that. So, we ended up driving it down to a junkyard south of Culpeper VA called Leon's, "The Walking Man's Friend", about 90 miles away. I got 'em 90 bucks for it, mainly because it still had fairly new tires on it.

Mr_Shiftright

There you go.

If an old car has A) no counterparts in the wrecking yards and b) no active aftermarket, it's going to be hell to keep it on the road.

Think of the cars with the best aftermarket support:

Model A Fords
VW bugs
Camaros

You see these cars all the time on the road on any given Sunday.

fintail

Aha, the Bitter, from the Ferrari 400/412 school of angular design. Not worth a whole lot (any of them)

omarman

What ever happened to Eric Bitter? He did interesting stuff with the Opel parts bins. That looks like a late 80s SC coupe. There was also an SC sedan but I've never actually seen either except for pics. Was that one in your post a recent appraisal?

omarman

Ha! Hi fintail! Just saw the Bitter post myself. Was wondering if you remember the name of the smaller sports car which Bitter introduced after the SC sedan? Might have been based on the Opel Ascona but can't be sure. I do remember that the press was not impressed with the little sports car but it looked good - on paper anyway.

Mr_Shiftright

Herr Bitter is still doing his thing apparently, but one wonders how:

http://www.webwombat.com.au/motoring/news_reports/bitter-vero.htm

No the Bitter was not an appraisal. I wish, biz is slow. Just inventory at a car dealer who specializes in oddball stuff. He had a super-nice supercharged Cord (pricey $$$), a #3 '52 chevy coupe restored decently but incorrectly, a '56 Chevy 2DHT retro-rod (very nice), an older Jaguar XJ6 (ho-hum), a plain-jane '65 Mustang coupe (beige, my favorite color :P ), a late 40s Ford Panel truck (pretty sweet). There was an Alfa Giuletta Spider that looked very nice and might be up for sale, but the color was black so I'm out on that one.

He has a '50 Plymouth coupe in the back with a bad engine, but he's asking too much for it IMO. I wouldn't mind driving that around.



(not the actual car).

fintail

I don't remember it. Those things peaked just about the time I started getting into cars. I've actually seen a couple coupes in person locally, but no sedans.

hpmctorque

Interesting information!

uplanderguy

Please forward me Andy's email. My email address is available if you click on uplanderguy.

Thanks!

au1994

Throw Mustangs and MG's in there maybe?

uplanderguy

Packard should never have merged with them. They should have joined American Motors in 1954. They might still be around today, who knows? The American Lexus?

Would they have survived '57-58? I know Packard folks like to blame all their problems on Stude, but when they built only 200 Packards in Feb. '56, one must scratch their head.

Packard's Nance went on to run the Mercury-Edsel-Lincoln division in '58-60. Edsel was quite like Packard--a 'junior' and a 'senior' line. We all know how well that went. They faded, while Stude sold a bunch of Larks and made their highest profit in history. Of course it was short-lived, but kept them alive longer than any other independent than AMC and in fact their Parts and Service operation lasted until 1972. My last post here on that subject.

lemko

...American Motors would be like if it was Packard-Hudson-Nash-Studebaker in descending order? Would we be speaking of a Big Four today or would've they all quickly sank together?
If I didn't chose a GM, Ford, or Chrysler, I would much rather have the alternatives be Packard, Hudson, Nash, or Studebaker than Toyota, Honda, Hyundai, etc.

texases

"Would we be speaking of a Big Four today or would've they all quickly sank together?"

My guess, they'd all have gone away - putting those 4 together wouldn't have created much in the way of added efficiency. Kind of like when all the British carmakers got lumped together.

Mr_Shiftright

Let's discuss Packard in our PACKARD topic please, unless we're posting an obscure Packard photo.

Let's stay on topic here. Anyone who wants to start a "What If"? kind of topic for the independents-----GO FOR IT! Let me know by e-mail what your idea is, and I'll put something up for you.

Shifty the Host

Mr_Shiftright

Just moved the last comment to the Postwar Studebaker topic.

jljac

Please forward me Andy's email. My email address is available if you click on uplanderguy.

I did that, but the E-mail address line says "private." My E-mail address is easy to find.

Mr_Shiftright

you guys can also correspond privately rather than in the body of this topic--much appreciated.

jljac

I tried to make my E-mail address made public by stating Stude.net but have not suceeded in doing that. D'oh. . .problem solved.

lemko

...really nice dark bronze-colored 1972 AMC Matador sedan near St. Vincent Street and Oxford Avenue and a black circa 1979 BMW 7-Series near a repair shop on Martins Mill Road and Bingham Street in NE Philly.

jljac

I tried to make my E-mail address made public by stating Stude.net but have not suceeded in doing that. D'oh. . .problem solved.

My account here still has "private" as my E-mail address and I cannot seem to change that. Uplanderguy profile is also marked "private." I thought that by identifying my website address, the problem was solved as an alternate way to contact me, but apparently that plan did not work either.

Therefore, click here, http://stude.net/ then click the "Email author" button at the bottom of the page to send me an E-mail.

jljac

Think of the cars with the best aftermarket support:

Model A Fords
VW bugs
Camaros

I just read very recently that someone is producing new complete bodies for the 1965 Ford Mustang so that you can build your own. Ford Mustang should be on the short list.

Mr_Shiftright

Yes I think so...when they start making new bodies for cars, you know their aftermarket is strong! You can buy an MGB body as well.

For me, a 'strong' aftermarket means literally *dozens* of vendors, and many of them doing reproduction parts, down to the smallest details.

omarman

Wow, great link to the Bitter Vero. There's even a pic of Erich at the bottom of that page. Also a link to the official Bitter site which includes info about that little sports car which never made production: Bitter Rallye. Turns out it was going to be based on the Opel Manta.

Re: 1950 Plymouth
Nothing swoopy or any hint of the forward look to come but it still looks good - especially the business coupe. Being a dealer of obscure cars must be fun.

Mr_Shiftright

I wouldn't mind rebuilding an old flathead 6. I used to be a pretty fair builder in my day. What would be a bit of a mess is if I bought it, pull the engine and found the block to be no good. I don't want to build a rod---too expensive.

I need to check my photo library for other obscure stuff I've appraised in years past.

fintail

Saw a C43 AMG today, and a lovely looking light yellow W116 (probably a diesel) out in the rain last night.

tjc78

Today in a residential neighborhood I saw a 70 GTO and 69 Camaro in the same shade of blue (or darn similar). What are the odds of that?

explorerx4

1965 Mustang bodies, guess who is selling them?

texases

As much as I like '65s, you'll have, what, easily $50k in one...or you could buy a 2012 GT 'vert...

Mr_Shiftright

I wonder how they'll stamp the VIN door plates? It might sound pricey but by the time you try to fix up a rusty old body and pour hundreds of hours of labor into it, this might be the way to go.

hpmctorque

I think texases has got it when he says for the same money you can buy a 2012 GT 'vert. I owned a '65 Mustang V8 with 4-speed and positraction. Nice, but not $50K nice.

stickguy

in a driveway, an Oldsmobile that I have never seen before(that style).

might have been a '60, maybe '61, from googling.. A 2-door coupe, with a very rounded top (thin pillars too).

Looked solid from what I saw driving by, but very original and un-restored.

And at the mall, a '69-70 Mustang, with the hood up for some reason.

lemko

...1978 Chevrolet Malibu coupe painted a ghastly Da-Glo green on Rising Sun Avenue between Ripley and Borbeck IN NE Philly.

bryan

Saw a Qvale Mangusta, silver, in Falls Church, VA parking lot. Wash DC plates. I must admit I did quite a doubletake; can't say the car is attractive! I had no idea what it was, so to the Internet I went. Supposedly only 200 in the US? I totally understand why!

Mr_Shiftright

That car depreciated like a cannonball dropped off a rooftop.

explorerx4

a mid 50's Chrysler coupe butter yellow/white.
Lowest number CT 'Early American' plate I have seen.

andre1969

I just googled it, and man that thing is fugly! I know there's always some mystique that surrounds low-volume, exotic, custom-built cars, but with that thing, I'd say we crossed the line from "custom-built" and right into "home-made" :sick:

fintail

Saw a white 59 Caddy flat top today, in good unrestored condition. Actually got behind it while in the fintail, quite a contrast in period designs.

Mr_Shiftright

I appraised a '59 flatop just a few weeks ago. It ran but needed a lot. I didn't think it was worth very much at all. These cars are so expensive to restore, and if you need paint + interior + mechanical work, you're buried for life in it.

fintail

Just like if you restored a fintail. So they have more in common than fins :shades:

Today also saw a Ferrari 328, a couple big old boxy 80s Landcruiser 4 doors, and a 70s style custom Beetle driven by an older man in a suit.

lemko

Here's a pic of the Qvale Mangusta for reference:

texases

Who was the guy that, when he saw this design, said "Yep, that's a beautiful look for an expensive sports car - let's build it!"??? :sick:

andre1969

Who was the guy that, when he saw this design, said "Yep, that's a beautiful look for an expensive sports car - let's build it!"???

I think it was Roger Corman! :P

Mr_Shiftright

Why it's the new Aston-Mazda-Celica glue-on assemblage art piece!

I'm aghast that Italians designed this car. I would have thought they could do better than that.