I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

ab348

I only remember the cars of two teachers, grades 7 and 9. Both had VW beetles. But my grade 9 teacher hit a deer with his and totalled it, so it was replaced with a ‘69 Karmann Ghia.

stickguy

teachers cars? I only recall 2 in HS. History teacher, younger guy, was in Vietnam (this was the late 70s) had a gen 2 Camaro. V8. No clue what model.

and my English teacher (real nerdy guy) had a 75ish Datsun 610 2 door, 5 speed. Red. This one I remember, because (weird as this sounds) I drove it once. He was selling in, and I was interested. Can't imagine this happening today! Mostly what I recall about it was that it backfired every time you shifted. The 70's were like that though. No, I did not buy it.

stickguy

out driving today local, passed a few interesting ones. A black C3 Vette. late 70s I think. rubber bumpers and I think the bubble rear window.

then a 64ish White Pontiac GrandPrix. With the neaat Gp letters on the grill. Sharp car.

andre1969

uplanderguy said:

I remember starting in '83, all T-Birds and Cougars came with bucket seats and console. By that time I still occasionally would carry somebody in the center position of my Monte Carlo.

Fords of that era seemed like they had larger transmission and driveshaft hump, compared to GM and Mopar. Maybe for this reason, they simply gave up on offering a bench seat with the '83 T-bird? Then again, they were also trying to reposition the T-bird, and make it more "personal" and sporty. The previous model T-bird actually sold somewhat well in 1980, considering it was a bad year for the industry, but then it tanked bad in '81-82.

Now that I think about it, didn't the '83-86 LTD/Marquis eliminate the bench seat, as well? I remember my grandparents' '85 LTD having sort of a bucket seat setup, but each seat had a little storage bin and armrest built into the inboard side. I remember their '81 Granada coupe having a bench seat, but can't remember if it was split or not. Sometimes, that center spot would get used when they took a bunch of the grandkids somewhere, but as I recall, it was usually Grandmom that sat in the center. She was only around 5'2", though.

I know when I was younger, I used the center spot of my '80 Malibu coupe all the time, back in the day when a bunch of high school kids would all pile in. By the time I got my '82 Cutlass Supreme I was 23 though, and those days were over. Even more so, by the time my Mom gave me her '86 Monte Carlo.

I do remember getting 6 people in my '89 Gran Fury once, though. And, they fit better than you might think. That car wasn't so generous with shoulder room...around 56", but the driveshaft/transmission hump weren't that intrusive, the dashboard didn't really get in the way, and you didn't have the wheel well intrusion in the back seat that you got with a lot of downsized cars, which forces the ouboard passengers to twist inward.

kyfdx

High school: Librarian had a boat tail Riviera

Bought my first car at 18. '70 Galaxie 500 coupe. By coincidence, my junior year history teacher had the same car (I had graduated by then). Easy source of hubcaps. I have no idea where she kept finding replacements, though.

ab348

andre1969 said:

Now that I think about it, didn't the '83-86 LTD/Marquis eliminate the bench seat, as well? I remember my grandparents' '85 LTD having sort of a bucket seat setup, but each seat had a little storage bin and armrest built into the inboard side. I remember their '81 Granada coupe having a bench seat, but can't remember if it was split or not. Sometimes, that center spot would get used when they took a bunch of the grandkids somewhere, but as I recall, it was usually Grandmom that sat in the center. She was only around 5'2", though.

In the mid-80s LTD you could get either the standard bucket seats (that did not have anything like an armrest in between them, ugh, unless you bought the optional console) or a flight bench seat which had center armrests and some sort of a storage console. I always found that odd because the Granada that preceded it came with a split-back bench seat with fold-down center armrest.

One thing I either did not know or forgot about was that you could order a coach roof on the LTD from the factory. Ford called it the "formal roof".

andre1969

Did GM ever offer an explanation as to why they never offered the '80-85 X-body with 3 across seating up front? It was certainly wide enough, as the Celebrity/6000/Ciera/Century offered bench seating, and they were the same basic car.

For some reason, I'm thinking it had to do with some kind of cost savings. Somehow, elimating the seatbelt for a center spot saved them enough money to make it worthwhile? Something to do with getting it certified with the Feds, or something like that? Now, by the time the FWD A-body came out, I could see the case for keeping the X- at 5-passenger seating...make you spend a few bucks more for a Celebrity, over a Citation, if you wanted 6-passenger seating.

But, in April of 1979, when the X- was launched, that wouldn't have made sense. Unless, even then, they were trying to get you to move up to a Malibu/LeMans/et al if you wanted 3 across seating.

Anyway, whatever rationale GM used for the X-body, maybe that was also Ford's reasoning for the Fox-based LTD/Marquis?

ab348

You just made me look at the respective brochures for the Citation and Celebrity and I discovered something really odd. The Celebrity was an inch wider on the outside than the Citation. But the Citation had 3 inches more front hip room. I'm baffled.

BTW, the Malibu had about the same hip room as the Celebrity.

andre1969

That is odd...I just looked it up, and yep, the Citation has 55.1" of hip room up front, versus 52.3" for the Celebrity. And oddly, only 52.2" for the Malibu! All of these are 1982 4-door models.

I honestly can't see any rationale for why the Citation would be that wide. Heck, the 1982 Impala/Caprice 4-door only has 55.0" of hip room up front! I always thought a car would have 4-6" less hip room than shoulder room, because hip room takes the arm rests into account, and that's usually good for about 2-3" on either side. Also, door panels usually taper in a bit at the bottom. It's especially noticeable on some "fuselaged" cars. However, I think most cars have a bit of taper toward the bottom; few door panels are probably perfectly vertical.

The only rationale I can see for the Citation, is perhaps they didn't take the arm rest into account? Maybe they took the measurement behind the armrest, or between the B-pillars, or something?

I was also surprised that the '82 Malibu only had 56.7" of shoulder room up front, compared to 56.2" for the Celebrity and 56.3" for the Citation! They always felt bigger than that inside to me. However, I wonder if it's because in 1982, they took the Malibu a bit upscale? They were all Classics, so the padding in the door panel was thicker than, say, what was on my 1980 Malibu coupe. They also had a pull strap on the door, standard. For some reason I'd always thought the Malibu sedan was around 57.5", but maybe that was for the older, '78-81 base model? The extra padding might have accounted for that loss. Or who knows, they might have even done something dumb like measure it between the screw covers for the pull strap!

Just out of curiosity, I looked up the specs for my '79 New Yorker. Hip room is listed at 57.6", while shoulder room is only listed at 60.2". I didn't have anything better to do at the moment, so I went out and took a tape measure to it. I got about 55" between the arm rests, and about 61" door panel to door panel, at the point where the top of the armrest is. So, that 60.2" must account for some part of the door panel that's a bit more padded. As for where they got that hiproom number, I don't know...I was able to get a measurement of roughly that between the B-pillar trim.

berri

From a lot of rentals, I recall Citation's being a kind of wide feeling ride.

sda

I bought a used 82 Skylark Custom. It could have seated three upfront yet there was a hard plastic tray with a couple of compartments that separated the driver and passenger bottom cushion. There was a fold down armrest as well. That was a very comfortable and quiet car. I bought it with 81k and at 100k, the a/c was leaking, the rack and pinion needed to be replaced, the transmission no longer would lock up in 3rd gear, though it still shifted smoothly. The interior was still in great shape and it was nicely free of rattles and squeaks. I was able to sell it for what I paid for it, $1400.

uplanderguy

I seem to remember, but could be wrong, that when the X-cars were first introduced, they had three-across seating, but either by '81 introduction or midway through the long '80 run, they put the little compartments in the middle of the front seat. My guess at the time was that it might make you shop "up" for three-across seating.

Rack and pinion was a sort point in X-cars and the larger ones that came out in '82. Even my '85 Celebrity had "morning sickness". My dealer offered to pay for half the repair out-of-warranty, and I 'bit'. Afterwards I saw a letter in CR about a person whose dealer did the repair for free out-of-warranty. I cut out that letter and mailed it to my dealer asking "How is this person different than me?". In a week I got a check in an envelope in the mail for the half I'd paid the dealer--no letter or anything. So I got the repair for free.

sda

In the past few weeks, for some reason, I cannot attach any pictures. I have saved many of the cars that have been in our family to my Surface and have never had an issue attaching them to a post. Is there a known issue that is being addressed?

uplanderguy

Driving home to Kent, OH from Greenville, PA, around Warren, OH today, on the other side of the divided highway was a late fifties or early sixties, creamy-white 190SL with the wheelcovers with the creamy white insert, and M-B star. It looked totally stock.

PF_Flyer

We may have been at the National Museum of the US Air Force on Saturday, but I was still thinking of you guys

imidazol97

I remember that exhibit. 
I hope you enjoyed your visit to Riverside.

Next time Packard museum and Carillon park with a lot of Dayton auto history,  Kettering and Wright brothers, electric starter...

PF_Flyer

imidazol97 said:

I remember that exhibit. 
I hope you enjoyed your visit to Riverside.

Next time Packard museum and Carillon park with a lot of Dayton auto history,  Kettering and Wright brothers, electric starter...

Yea, lots to do! Was a long day. Left home at 4AM, then did 6 hours at the museum before driving another 100 miles to the hotel to get ready for a 4AM rollout for Indy

Then just another 500 miler back home on Monday morning, so about 1,100 miles onto the new Rogue, just to break it in

berri

Looks like an F-4 Phantom behind the car?

texases

Yep

imidazol97

PF_Flyer said:

Yea, lots to do! Was a long day. Left home at 4AM, then did 6 hours at the museum before driving another 100 miles to the hotel to get ready for a 4AM rollout for Indy

Was your hotel in Indianapolis, or did you have a long morning drive to get to Speedway?

andre1969

Here's a few survivors from the mean streets of Baltimore, taken yesterday...

First, this battle-scarred Monte Carlo, parked in sort of a no-man's land in between a school with bars on the windows, and public housing. I've been seeing it, in this same spot, for at least four years.

Then, on the way out of the city, this Cutlass Supreme sedan...

It still looked solid, but every time it hit a bump, the rear bumper shimmied like it was about to fall off. If you think a '76 Eldorado convertible going across railroad tracks is bad, you ain't seen nothing yet!

Oh, and check out this cute little thing that Baltimore passes off as police cars these days...

stickguy

Don't wanna ask what you were doing in that neighborhood!

andre1969

stickguy said:

Don't wanna ask what you were doing in that neighborhood!

"Bored as hell and I wanna get ill
So I went to a spot where my homeboys chill
The lack of booze, be makin me sick
I pulled up in my 0-3 Bu-ick
They greet me with a 40 and I start drinkin
And from the 8-ball my breath start stinkin
Love to get my girl, to rock that body..."

Nah, nothing that exotic. Had to run my uncle to John's Hopkins for some procedure where he had to be sedated, so he needed a driver.

kyfdx

andre1969 said:

stickguy said:

Don't wanna ask what you were doing in that neighborhood!

"Bored as hell and I wanna get ill
So I went to a spot where my homeboys chill
The lack of booze, be makin me sick
I pulled up in my 0-3 Bu-ick
They greet me with a 40 and I start drinkin
And from the 8-ball my breath start stinkin
Love to get my girl, to rock that body..."

Nah, nothing that exotic. Had to run my uncle to John's Hopkins for some procedure where he had to be sedated, so he needed a driver.

"Twenty twenty twenty four hours to go
I wanna be sedated
Nothing to do, no where to go o,
I wanna be sedated"

Michaell

kyfdx said:

andre1969 said:

stickguy said:

Don't wanna ask what you were doing in that neighborhood!

"Bored as hell and I wanna get ill
So I went to a spot where my homeboys chill
The lack of booze, be makin me sick
I pulled up in my 0-3 Bu-ick
They greet me with a 40 and I start drinkin
And from the 8-ball my breath start stinkin
Love to get my girl, to rock that body..."

Nah, nothing that exotic. Had to run my uncle to John's Hopkins for some procedure where he had to be sedated, so he needed a driver.

"Twenty twenty twenty four hours to go
I wanna be sedated
Nothing to do, no where to go o,
I wanna be sedated"

Nice Ramones reference!

ab348

I see Charm City is still looking for its charm.

kyfdx

Hey.. we'll be in Baltimore in July!

@andre1969 Can you be my personal tour guide? I'll provide my own central nervous system depressants.

Michaell

kyfdx said:

Hey.. we'll be in Baltimore in July!

@andre1969 Can you be my personal tour guide? I'll provide my own central nervous system depressants.

Are you planning to double the attendance at an Orioles game?

explorerx4

Baltimore does have some good attractions.

kyfdx

Michaell said:

kyfdx said:

Hey.. we'll be in Baltimore in July!

@andre1969 Can you be my personal tour guide? I'll provide my own central nervous system depressants.

Are you planning to double the attendance at an Orioles game?

There are two of us, so maybe triple!

Actually, a Sunday game against the Red Sox will be well attended. They just hop on the train and come down to see their team.

explorerx4 said:

Baltimore does have some good attractions.

And... food!

explorerx4

@kyfdx,
I'll take crab over lobster any day.

xwesx

I was in Baltimore in 2009, Orioles were in town with lots of games being played. My supervisor was trying to get me to go to a game, and even offered to pay, but I really wasn't that interested. I finally told him that if I wasn't willing to spend my own money on it, then I also wasn't willing to spend his money.

explorerx4

Camden Yards is a very nice ballpark.
The concourse area has some nice alcoves with some comfy stuffed chars to sit in.
Kind of reminded me of a ship.
Also, at the time, first time I saw a carving station in the same area of the ball park.
Our usher would come down to first row between innings and do magic tricks.
A pretty good experience.
Our town Memorial Day parade only had a couple of old cars, a Model A and a Miata.

tjc78

Love Baltimore.  Go at least once a year for an event that my wife’s industry hosts.  We always spend the night and then the following day at the waterfront. 

Miss Shirley’s is an absolute must for breakfast!  Fells point is great for nightlife.  Awesome bars !

kyfdx

We are big fans of MLB games, when we travel.

So far:

Pittsburgh
Cleveland
Wrigley
St Louis
San Diego
Seattle
San Francisco
Oakland
Cincinnati (hey, out of state, though only 4 miles away..lol)

Baltimore and DC on this upcoming trip.

Michaell

kyfdx said:

We are big fans of MLB games, when we travel.

So far:

Pittsburgh
Cleveland
Wrigley
St Louis
San Diego
Seattle
San Francisco
Oakland
Cincinnati (hey, out of state, though only 4 miles away..lol)

Baltimore and DC on this upcoming trip.

We've got to get you to the 3rd oldest ballpark in the NL

kyfdx

That is unreal. After Dodger Stadium and Wrigley?

stickguy

dodger stadium is the 3rd oldest in all of MLB behind Wrigley and Fenway.

Michaell

kyfdx said:

That is unreal. After Dodger Stadium and Wrigley?

Yep. Will celebrate its 25th birthday next season.

kyfdx

Michaell said:

kyfdx said:

That is unreal. After Dodger Stadium and Wrigley?

Yep. Will celebrate its 25th birthday next season.

That’s wild. Plenty of non-stops to Denver. My wife has never been. Maybe, next summer.

Michaell

kyfdx said:

Michaell said:

kyfdx said:

That is unreal. After Dodger Stadium and Wrigley?

Yep. Will celebrate its 25th birthday next season.

That’s wild. Plenty of non-stops to Denver. My wife has never been. Maybe, next summer.

Good beer within walking distance of the ballpark, too

kyfdx

Why would I care about that?

Michaell

kyfdx said:

Why would I care about that?

Because we've met twice, and both times beer was involved.

PF_Flyer

imidazol97 said:

PF_Flyer said:

Yea, lots to do! Was a long day. Left home at 4AM, then did 6 hours at the museum before driving another 100 miles to the hotel to get ready for a 4AM rollout for Indy

Was your hotel in Indianapolis, or did you have a long morning drive to get to Speedway?

Hotel is in Anderson, about a 35 minute drive to Gate 10 to go into turn 4 parking. And leaving that hotel at 4AM was WAY better than leaving at 5AM Gates open at 6 and we were parked and out of the car at 6:25. Last year with departure at 5, we were only about a mile further back in line, but didn't get parked until almost 9.

And being in line INSIDE the gate lets you be right in the middle of the party!

kyfdx

When we were infield participants, we slept in our car the night before, in the field right outside.

That might have been a few years back..

andre1969

ab348 said:

I see Charm City is still looking for its charm.

Heck, even Hitchcock managed to make Baltimore look depressing, back in the 60's!


Interestingly, in the morning, I actually drove very close to that location. Even though it's mostly a matte painting, that particular street does exist, and those row houses, as well as the one close up on the corner, are still there. That painting makes it look like the street goes right up to the harbor, where in reality, it's probably a good 700 feet between the end of that street and the water. Plus, these days, there's a high school, the road I drove past on, and a bunch of luxury condos, between that street and the water.

explorerx4

Tomorrow I'm going to my 45th High School reunion.
Going to take the Mustang.
It's about 50 miles each way, so I'll stay off the interstate.
Will be fun to bring the same car to the 45th that was at the 20th.

tjc78

explorerx4 said:

Tomorrow I'm going to my 45th High School reunion. Going to take the Mustang. It's about 50 miles each way, so I'll stay off the interstate. Will be fun to bring the same car to the 45th that was at the 20th.

That’s awesome!!

Why stay off the highway?  

Is it an automatic?  If so, have you had the TV bushing replaced with a brass one?  Forgive me if I’ve asked you before but I lost a tranny to that damn $1.00 part.

explorerx4

@tjc78,
The car is of course old, and it's very original.
A much better experience driving it under 60 mph.
You did mention that bushing before.
I kind of looked into it, but it hasn't been to a shop in a while, although it has a lot of needs.
Been cleaning it up, but haven't really washed it.
It just keeps going, so I just keep driving it.

fintail

My 20th was a few years ago. I considered driving the fintail, as I bought it when I was 18 and a few people might remember it. But caution prevailed, as it is a few hour drive and I didn't want to risk any issues. Also, I could then show up in a late model MB and be the show off, as such cars stick out a little in the small town (where my mom still lives). Even a relatively ordinary E sedan, on every corner here, got a little attention there.

I like these lines, almost reads like a poem:

"The car is of course old, and it's very original.
A much better experience driving it under 60 mph.
You did mention that bushing before.
I kind of looked into it, but it hasn't been to a shop in a while, although it has a lot of needs.
Been cleaning it up, but haven't really washed it.
It just keeps going, so I just keep driving it."

Sounds exactly like my old car.

explorerx4 said:

Tomorrow I'm going to my 45th High School reunion.
Going to take the Mustang.
It's about 50 miles each way, so I'll stay off the interstate.
Will be fun to bring the same car to the 45th that was at the 20th.