BMW European Delivery

ultrarunner

The previous time I did European Delivery with my brother we did not have to pay sales tax in California because the car was operated for 90 days prior to being operated in California.

The word is operated. Storage, transit and preparation do not count towards the 90 days.

I don't know about other states.

markjenn

There are some shenanigans you can play with some DMVs to make it appear as if the car was bought new in Germany, used outside the state for a specified period of time, and now is being brought into the state as a used car. Probably the easiest way to do this would be to register the car in a neighboring state with low sales tax, then register it in your home state later.

These schemes have risks and almost always amount to circumventing the spirit if not the letter of the law, so you need to figure out what level of trouble you want to go to and what comfort level you have with skirting your state's tax laws. And you need local advice from people who have done it - not talked about it, done it.

- Mark

seivwrig

Just pay the sales tax. You use the roads and other services that you state provides.

hgeyer

Where I live, licensing fees and gasoline taxes pay for the roads, sales tax on a car goes to the general budget.

If I buy a television in a neighboring state do I turn around and pay taxes to my home state - no.

If I go on a vacation to Europe, do I report my souvenir purchases to the state treasury and fork over sales tax - no.

Even if I go to Canada (who, like Europe has a value-added tax that doesn't apply to foreign visitors) and buy some stuff, do I pay local taxes on it - no.

I believe that state governments use the licensing process to protect a lucrative revenue source. Not that I don't understand that tax revenue is fungible and would be replaced by a tax on something else, I just find the practice of taxing cars uniquely as hypocritical.

PS-Don't get me going on the sales tax treatment of leases in Illinois (20% over a 3-year lease, 33% in the city of Chicago) -

innerloop

If you brought back a 3-series as a souvenir, you'd pay a lot more than sales tax. You're supposed to pay an import tariff on anything you bring in over $350 or so. And it wouldn't fit in the carry-on.

seivwrig

I have not figured how to get around the VAT in Germany. It is much easier to do in England. The sales tax in Germany is 17.5%. Compared to most European countries, we actually get our BMWs cheaper (check the price for a 330i in the U.K., also consider the a la carte on options). I understand that our governments are not good at handling our money. To tell you the truth, the governments are too big and start looking like the governments in Europe with less benefits for th middle class. I think even if you were in the Military and bought a BMW in Germany, you would still pay taxes upon your return to your home state. this is still cheaper than the taxes in Germany. I bought my CD changer in Germany tax free, thanks to my brother, but saved a little more than if I had went through Eurobuyers. Even if you bought the car in another state, you would pay the taxes to the state you register the car in.

jb_shin

Not sure how different states handle the sales tax issue, but I have "heard" from many on roadfly.com that they did not have to pay the sales tax. Correct me if I am wrong, but one of the reasons that US price is lower than that of German home market is because 17.5% VAT is not included. Instead, BMW rolls in the import tariff and applicable federal tax, etc into the US MSRP, which still comes out to be lower than the 17.5%.

I have purchased my car via military/diplomat program, and I am not sure how VA would collect sales tax from me when the car is clearly a used car being brought into the state. Perhaps the law is different if the car were brought in from other state vs. foreign country, but I am not so sure. I am certain however, that I do not pay customs duty upon returning to the states. The gas guzzler tax still applies, but I do not recall the exact wording on the customs web site (or EPA).

seivwrig

I have heard different things. My parents never brought a car from Europe when we moved to the U.S. I think in your case, taxes could not be collected. I think those situations where individuals buy a new car prior to going back to the States, I believe the car is treated as new. But I could be very wrong. I guess it is worth researching.

ipatty13

Because the sales tax issue is a state-specific thing, I did some research on Virginia last week. That relevant statute states that a sales tax is due for any car purchased and brought into the Commonwealth within 12 MONTHS! Ouch.

There is an exception, such as if you're bringing the car into VA (within 12 months of purchase) from another state, provided you can show proof of sales tax paid to the other state.

Looks as though we Virginianites cannot get out of paying sales tax even by keeping the car the max. 6 months allowed for ED. ;-(

If anyone has info to the contrary, please post...

jb_shin

That still leaves me wondering, though. I know many people buy cars from MD dealers for various reasons, and pay MD sales tax, which is slightly lower than that of VA. I actually did this when I bought my Integra in 1994. I do not remember having to pay anything else. I imagine it would be easy for VA to enforce it at the DMV. I can't imagine the dealer paying it for me, and they never mentioned anything.

ipatty13

Interesting, because I am a VA resident, but am purchasing a bimmer ED through a MD dealer.

The dealer told me I would be paying the VA sales tax, and I didn't question it because paying tax in the titling jurisdiction seems to be reasonable.

I think the VA tax on cars is 3%. Is MD lower?

jb_shin

Well, I just looked over my old sales paper and it shows that the tax was 3% of the price. So the dealer must have collected the VA sales tax.

loubct

I will be placing order next month for ED pickup in May for 2003 CIC SP,CWP,manual,bi-xenon. I wanted to know what type of options others have aquired in the past and where (stateside vs Germany). I am considering tint,alarm,windscreen and others.

ipatty13

many people pick up wheel locks at the ED center ($22/installed) and Factory Alarm at the dealer near the ED center. I heard that the Alarm runs $ 180 there (plus installation if you don't do it yourself), which is much cheaper than stateside.

I will be doing this in January, so I'll let you know then how my experience goes.

nirvanaor

Just need to know the info on ED for 325 or 330Ci.Is there a website where I can find how the whole process works or should I just go to the dealership (which happens to be not at all friendly here in FL)and ask them .
How much on average u can save if u get it through ED?
Can u get it to be shipped to any dealership in USA and do u get all the perks from that dealership that u usually get if u buy the new car from that dealership?
How do u ship it from Germany?

ultrarunner

Picked up my European Delivery car stateside this afternoon. Everything about ED was great.

The only problem I noticed is that my Roundel tire stem caps were replace with plain metal. Somewhere between Harms Munich and my delivery the switch was made.

Anyway, outside of the stem caps, I would recommend European Delivery to anyone thinking about it.

seivwrig

Nirvanor:

Some basic information can found on bmwusa.com. Also, pcbrs gave an excellent web site. ED cars can be bargained. Rizzo's method is one good way (see www.e46fanatics.com faq page). You have to go to a dealership to this or use you could use www.eurobuyers.com. If you don't buy from a dealership, you will forfeit the perks. Postoak or ipatty13 can probably give you the pros and cons on buying from a local or out of town dealership.

Ultrarunner:
This is the exact reason that I did install anything in Europe. You kind of add things at your own risk. From reading many posts, it seems that anything that is bolted down is fine. Everything else does not make it to you dealership, this can include license plates (thank God, I have both of mine) You must take you manual case, front plate, first aid kit and safety triangle or you will end up having to buy them from Eurobuyers

ultrarunner

I agree with you about adding things to your BMW while on European Delivery, that is why I didn't. The valve stem caps came with my 325iT in Munich.

I thought that is was a nice touch for the European Delivery Center to provide complimentary floor mats, roundel valve stem caps and a full tank of gas.

The Harms agent assured me that any original supplied equipment other than the first aid kit and warning triangle would be replaced if stolen enroute. (I even made a point to ask about the caps.)

I would advise future European Delivery buyers to add the Roundel Caps to their carry on luggage to insure their safe arrival home. My 2 cents

By the way I spent a relaxing Saturday afternoon detailing my new 325iT. I drove about 2,800 miles in Europe and a lot of that was in heavy rain. I probably went a little overboard when I removed each wheel to clean and wax both sides of each rim. (the Shippo method I recall)

It's looking very sweet right now!!

nirvanaor

I am really really really ...thankful to all u guys who were really really really.. helpful.
The URL that pcbrs gave me all I needed to know and I forwarded to couple of my friends who already have a bimmer and are planning to get a new one.
I went to the dealership to try out the 330i and 325i again.Currently they are runnin a lease special for 39 months rather than 36 months and rate is good.
Is 325i or 330i getting a face lift in mid of 2003? Did any of u have a problem with streptonic?
I have never been to europe so I was wondering if any of u guys can recommend places where u can enjoy the drive.

nirvanaor

I didnt know that the ED prices are negotiable but www.e46fanatics.com says it is?
So whatever the dealership told me as the "base price" is MSRP?
325i $25855
330i $32180
without the options&destination etc

seivwrig

To find European Delivery Invoice prices, check www.eurobuyers.com or www.bimmerfest.com. Some dealers around the U.S. will give you $1200 to $1500 above invoice. I guess we need to keep a list of the BMW centers and the sales agents. If you let me know what you are trying to purchase and can give you an idea of the invoice pricing.

buffagm

Hey everyone, looking at the earlier posts some one recommened Hotel Uhland as a good value during ED pickup, as I will be Munich next week, if anyone know the distance between this hotel and the delivery center and the airport, and its proximity to a train station, please let me know. Thanks. (Also, let me know if anyones doing pickup on Dec. 9th)

ggoodloe

Hotel Uhland. 45 min train fm airport to hotel, 10 minute walk from train station to hotel. Fm hotel to subway to ED center 15 minutes plus a 10 minute walk each way. Hotel cost me $72 and was good for the price. They have a web page which will give you all info you could want. www.hotel-uhland.de/enwelcome.html

rwenger

I am planning to pick up a 3 or 5-series sport wagon in Munich and drive it into northern and central Italy (Tuscany). We have a villa for a week south of Florence. I've read that there are problems with theft, etc. Does anyone have advice about this? E.g., any particular advice about what features of parking lots that are safe one might look for, etc.

Also, I may drive the car back to Munich rather than dropping it in Florence. Any opinions about that choice?

Finally, I'm getting mixed reports about when BMW will stop making the 5-series sport wagons. Some say March 2003. Others say May 2003. Any advice about how I can get a definitive and reliable answer to that? In either case, the car would have to sit from 2-4 months before I picked it up in July. How serious a problem is that?

Thanks for whatever information you can provide!

jb_shin

So far I have heard from my sales guy (at the Berlin dealer owned by BMW AG) that the 5 series will be made until the end of March. The Feb production orders were taken until the end of Nov. and the March production orders will be taken until Christmas time, with holiday and all. However, there was a story on www.bmwm5.com that Fox news had a report that the production will be extended until June. I am not sure how reliable that report is, but so far March deadline seems to be what is generally accepted.

As for driving into Italy, you may want to make sure that the tourist insurance provided by BMW AG will cover you while in Italy, as many rental car insurance, and auto insurance will not cover you in Italy.

seivwrig

Your insurance will cover your car but I have heard that the claims is a bear. There was someone on the 3 series list that took their car to Italy without any problems. They drive quite wild down there. You might want to get the wheel locks, and alarm installed in Munich. If you must drive to Italy, drive your car back to Munich or someone else will be puting the mileage on your car for you (think valet!!! or better still Ferris Buhler). Cars dropped off in Italy are driven back to Munich (no transporter).

buffagm

Hey everyone, I decided on a hotel for ED, the Marriot in munich, it was $60 a night for 2 nights, with taxes $140. Seems like a fair price, if anyone is interested, I got it on priceline, I seleced Munich city north. Also, if someone here has stayed there, please let me know how it was and how accessible the Airport and the ED center are from the hotel. Thanks.

johnny330i

I also stayed at the Marriot when I did ED during late Oct. There are 2 easy ways to get to the airport via public transportation. One is to take the U6 train to Marienplaz and then take the S8 to the airport. Takes about an hour. The other which is even easier is to take the bus across the street from the U6 station straight to the airport. This takes about 45 minutes. You can buy the tickets from the hotel and they run every 15 to 30 minutes.

The Marriot hotel is only 3 stops away from the ED center. Just take the U6 north 3 stops to Friedmann, 10 minutes away. Enjoy your trip!

nirvanaor

Have been reading about offering 1500-2000 on invoice to the dealers for ED.I was wondering if that 1500-2000 amount is above the base price (invoice without options ) or is it

base price(invoice price) + all the options (invoice prices)+ 1500-2000?

That brings me to the question of if you can actually get the invoice price on the options as well ?

bpajax

I'm picking up a 325i (Steel gray with sand leather, PP, step, CWP, HK) in mid-March. Planning to drive from Munich south through Austria into Northern Italy and then back north into Switzerland, dropping the car in Zurich.

Has anyone done a winter pick-up? How were the driving conditions? Does Switzerland require snow tires? Any input/suggestions appreciated.

ipatty13

when people talk about x-amount over invoice, the invoice includes 3 basic items:
1. invoice base price of model selected
2. destination fee
3. invoice price of all options

1+2+3+ (dealer profit) + taxes/title/license = out-the-door price

(there should be no MACO fee on ED; tax, title & license fees are in addition to the invoice price)

nirvanaor

After all the help I got from u guys I was able to get my offer accepted by 3 dealerships for 900 over invoice (invoice base price and invoice options )outside Orlando FL .The dealership in Orlando showed me the same attitude that they are famous for .Rizzo method really worked for me.
325i sedan
ED Base price 23530
Premium pack 2455
Sports Pack 1275
streptonic 1210
xenon 635
fold seats 430
profit 900
dest& hand 695

Let me know if anyone else wants to get a good deal I would be more than happy to give them details
My question would my dealership here in USA provide me the floormats or the ED centre.I want to get the steering wheel trim ,anti theft from munich, any ideas.what else is good to get from there ...

ipatty13

For those who have dropped off their cars in Europe, did you take both plates with you? I've often read about people taking the 'front plate', but I haven't heard about anyone taking the back one, as well.

Can I take both with me? If not, will the back plate be shipped with my car to the U.S. dealer, so that I can get it at U.S. pickup?

seivwrig

On the floor mats discussion on Bimmerfest. There is no discussion. A 3 series does not come with floor mats. So your options are the following: deal with what the ED center gives you, try to get dealership to get you floor mats (you don't get a choice here either), or buy your own with BMW logo and heel pad. I had that Eureka moment when that came up. I don't always on Bimmerfest because the sarcasm can be vicious.

I took off the front plate. Your vehicle has to be shipped with the rear plate. With an Italy dropoff, you must have both plates on the car. I requested to my salesman that I want my rear plate upon it return to the States. I have heard of many cases, primarily in NJ, that the plates get taken.

hgeyer

Harms (the transport company) will want to keep the back plate on the car so that they can track/move the car within Europe. You can take the front plate off. You may need a thin-blade screwdriver to take off the screws that BMW uses to affix the plate - it's a type of push-screw that wouldn't easily come off with the tools in my 330i's tool kit.

The rear plate will be with the car when it arrives at the dealer. My salesman warned me that these plates are popular "souvenirs" for the porters who clean and prep the car, so I'd recommend making your salesperson aware of your desire to reclaim the rear plate.

If you're interested in mounting your Euro plate on the front of your car in the US (assuming your state doesn't require a front plate), remove the plate-holder in Germany (it snaps on) and take it with you as well. If you can't, post a message and I can give you the part number to get a Euro front plate holder (the number is NOT easy to find - the part is).

ultrarunner

I had already removed my back plate just outside of Harms Munich drop-off point. Harms was not too happy but it was already too late because I no longer had it with me. (The back plate was much cleaner. You can use the screw driver in the BMW tool kit)

I also brought the tool kit and the warning triangle with me. Unfortunately, the BMW Logo valve stem caps sere remvoved somewhere between Munich and the USA. I had even asked the Harms agent about taking the caps and he said it is not necessary.

jb_shin

I would be cautious about driving in the south of Germany and Switzerland, as the mountain regions get quite a bit of snow at times. Even if you stick to the autobahns, the road is not always cleared right away. Most Germans will not drive a car (especially a real wheel drive) in winter without proper snow tires. You may need to be flexible with your plan and pay close attention to the weather.

sandtrapppp

I was planning to pick up my car at the end of feb and was also planning to drive around in Germany and Switzerland but from ur msg it deosnt seem like a good idea without proper tires?
I was wondering if u have addresses of websites where I can get info about driving and visiting some attractions when I am there.

bimmer12

If I were to order a car today, what is the average time to pick it up in Germany? 60 days?

bpajax

BMW suggests ordering your vehicle 90 days prior to your desired pick-up date in Munich. They might be able to do it sooner, depending on what you are ordering and the manufacturing schedule. Your salesman can find out. Go to www.bmwusa.com for full details of the ED program. Also, check out http://www.angelfire.com/ri/EuroDelivery/dex.html

jb_shin

If your sales person has allocation that can be swapped out, it can be done in around 30 days, but usually a bit longer. Otherwise, a normal order will take about 90 or longer.

jb_shin

I live up north in Berlin, so can't help you much with southern part. I used Michelin guide and it has some good information.

hgeyer

Cross-posted from the 3-series board:

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/134596287_sink15.html

I hope that no one's car is in transit at this time.

gohuskies

I left my 330 CIC with Harms in Muenchen last June and the first aid kit and the styrofoam block for the hardtop disappeared in transit. Neither BMWNA or my dealer would replace either item. Suggest you carry the first aid kit with you if you want it when the car arrives in the USA.
My rear plate did arrive and I displayed both Fatherland plates until my state plates arrived.

hgeyer

One other piece of advice: When taking the First Aid kit back home, put it in your checked luggage. One of the pieces is a set of surgical-type scissors - these will be confiscated by airport security if you put them in your carryon.

jb_shin

It is not stolen, BMW takes them out before shipping the car. In Germany the law requires every car to have the emergency triangle and the first aid kit. For some reason, it doesn't seem to be the case in the US, and BMW simply does not provide them in US spec. cars.

gohuskies

TO:jb shin
Are you saying that BMW has Harms remove the First Aid Kits and Safety Triangles before shipping? As stated, my first aid kit and top block disappeared but my triangle arrived in my tool kit. BMW must have missed my triangle.
Do you know what BMW does with the items?

matt333

put it back in other ED cars?

seivwrig

I believe that the info kit that BMW sends before you go on ED, tells you that the First Aid kit and triangle don't travel with the car. As far as the top block, no se!

nirvanaor

Heard that 2004 would be available in the market in 2003 April with SMG transmisson (one used in M)

Is it true.

When would the prices be available for 2004 model.

How early you can cancel your ED order?