Mazda3 Hatchback

kyfdx

I think that is how I would rank them, as well...

bjewett

I'm a new (last week) owner of a Mazda3 hatch. Thanks for your comments earlier, Meade - you're right, you can haul the car into on/offramps like the P5. Miss that P5, though.

One curiosity: sometimes when I launch the car without gunning it too much, it feels as if the car accelerates, then hesitates, then takes off. It only has 350 miles on it, but I'm wondering if I am revving it just to the point where the valve timing switchover occurs. This is not noticeable at all if I rev it significantly when taking off from a stop. Thought I'd mention it in case someone else has experienced this. (I have owned plenty of manual trans cars). Otherwise it runs great, so I am assuming there is no misplaced vacuum hoses etc etc.

Brian

mdaffron

First, congrats! Tell me -- what color? Options? Maybe you've mentioned it elsewhere, but I'm lazy!

Second, you may very well be hitting the VICS or VVT point (I think it occurs around 3200 rpm, a little higher than the corresponding point in my old Protege ES.) Not sure.

I will tell ya this -- Mazda said they designed the car for high-speed handling, and they weren't lying. After more than two months of driving the car every day, I still find myself zooming happily along at 80 when I think I'm doing 55 or 60. The taller gear ratios in this 5-speed tranny are what are causing it -- I have a similar problem staying in third when I think I'm in fourth. The tranny is definitely different from the old Pro.

Combine that little 80-in-a-55 problem with my Velocity Red paint, and I can almost see the blue lights in my rearview mirror ... let's hope they stay at "almost" status until I learn how to pull in the reins on this little rocket!

:shades:

Meade

mdaffron

Last night I was merging onto a local expressway, and this dude who thought he was cool in his Lincoln Mark VIII (complete with big ol' V8 engine) slowed down in front of me on the on-ramp to about, oh, 7 mph. Of course, when we got to the end of the circular on-ramp, he floored it in an effort to maintain his mobile roadblock's control over my zoomability. However, both of the highway's two lanes were clear of traffic (and of, uh, "authority"), so I swung wide, dropped it into third and left his tail behind me, despite his roaring V8 and a HUGE cloud of blue smoke! Geesh, as I zoomed ahead, the view in my rearview mirror resembled that of being followed by the Space Shuttle leaving the launch pad! What a laugh. And to think I only got up to about 80 in a 65 completing this highly entertaining (well, for me at least) maneuver.

Meade

bjewett

Heh, it is easy to go fast in this car. I found that out during a test drive, when I found myself going a good 15-20 faster than it "felt." The salesman, sitting in back, laughed and asked if I instead wanted the smaller engine. "No."

I have the hatch (i.e. 2.3l), 5-speed, silver, abs & roof. That's it. Looking to add some electronics (inverter wired to battery, easily-connected scanner, etc). My old radar detector is falling apart, so I need to show some restraint, and keep an eye on the gauge. Seat-of-the-pants feelings aren't going to help here! The car is very responsive - impressive. Mazda hits another one out of the park. Hope they're making money for Ford - the volvo chassis and mazda tuning/building is working really well here.

Brian

fowler3

The reason you have problems holding to posted speed limits is because you drove your Protegés by ear, listening to the Pro's engine noise at certain speeds. The MZ3 has a very quiet engine which causes drivers to speed up trying to hear those same sounds. Ain't gonna happen.

You need to find new speed indicators so you don't have to rely on flashing blue lights.

fowler3

ezcompany

Hey everybody
sounds like you all got it down!
Thinking of getting the Special Edition (If the dealer can find one)
if aNOT

Will try to get:
-Winning Blue
-Leather Trim + automatic
-6 CD changed Moonroof option
-ABS and security package option
-Xenon Headlights option (i think comes with Tire Pressure monitor)

Any Pointers ? Anything I should lookout for ?
Thanks - ya'll ROCK!

I have read the reviews and my brother already owns one. So there is one in the family already

fowler3

"Ask the man who owns one." Best info you can get.

Fowler3

mdaffron

Good luck finding a Special Edition (or even a regular one with the options you listed) now. My dealership (Whitten Mazda in Richmond, VA) ranked 23rd in North America for sales volume in the first quarter of '05, and they just got in their last shipment of '05 Mazda3's last week. I was there yesterday (for an oil change, see below) and browsed the lot while I was waiting. They only had about a half-dozen 3 hatches, only one of which was an automatic. None had leather, and none had xenons.

Shop around, though. You might get a good deal (compared to an '06) on one of the last 2005's; either that or wait a couple of months for the '06s to show up.

Meade

mdaffron

I used the first little tear-off coupon in my "Free for 36,000 miles" oil change book at the dealership yesterday. The 3 had about 3,100 miles on it when I had the little operation performed.

I've read some strange reports on the 3's oil filter here on Edmunds, so I went up to the parts counter and asked if I could see the oil filter for a Mazda3. Sure enough, the reports were correct. It's a little cartridge filter that looks like a small air filter -- about the size of a half-height Coke can (like you get in hospitals). You have to remove some kind of housing and install this little puppy. The parts guy said many car makers are "going back" to this kind of filter, and that this was a popular oil filter style in years past.

Anybody got any input on the design of the housing and how hard or easy it is to get to? Easier/harder than working with an "old fashioned" filter? Better performance? Etc.? Needless to say, since my oil changes will be free for 36,000 miles, it'll be a while before this really concerns me very much.

Meade

lifestar

That's something I'm looking into as well. There's a web site that details on how to convert the cartiage system to use a spin-on type of oil filter, esp. good for DIY, but I bet it'll void the warranty. Probably, if I ever do that, it would have to be after the warranty is up. The only thing I wonder about is if the quick oil change shops like JiffyLube would be able to do this kind of oil changing.

z71bill

The parts guy was correct - this is the type of filter that was used before the spin on type was invented. It was / still is used on many larger industrial engines and some farm equipment.

I can't say for sure if this is true - but it sounds reasonable - the service manager at my dealership told me that the reason for the change - which he thought was going to start showing up on many more vehicles - is being driven by the high cost to comply with the environmental regulations for handling used filters. Many places do not allow the used oil filters to be tossed in the trash can anymore - my understanding is some states require the filter be taken apart - with the paper part being processed and the metal part being recycled. This is expensive -

Obviously if you are a DIYer the EPA will most likely not break down your door and arrest you if you throw away one filter - but the dealerships are a much bigger target.

I also think that keeping the service dollars in the dealerships pocket by making it hard for the DIYer is also one reason.

mdaffron

http://www.mazda6tech.com/articles/maintenance/2.3l-cartridge-filter.html

mdaffron

http://www.aitchison.org/robert/Mazda3/Mazda3DIYOilChange.htm

Looks like one helluva lotta work -- maybe it's time to toss the messy drain pan and free up some space in the shed by getting rid of those ramps, and (after 36K miles, of course) take the dealership up on those $24.95 oil changes.



Meade

z71bill

How Men and Women Change the Oil

Women:

1. Pull up to Jiffy Lube when the mileage reaches 3000 since
the last oil change.

2. Drink a cup of coffee.

3. 15 minutes later, write a check and leave with a properly
maintained vehicle.

Money Spent:
$20.00 Oil Change
$1.00 Coffee
----------------
$21.00 Total

Men:

1. Go to auto parts store and write a
check for $50 dollars for oil, filter, kitty litter, hand
cleaner and scented tree.

2. Discover that the used oil container
is full. Instead of taking it back to recycle, dump in hole
in back yard.

3. Open a beer and drink it.

4. Jack car up. Spend 30 minutes looking
for jack stands.

5. Find jack stands under kid's pedal car.

6. In frustration, open another beer and drink it.

7. Place drain pan under engine.

8. Look for 9/16 box end wrench.

9. Give up and use crescent wrench.

10. Unscrew drain plug.

11. Drop drain plug in pan of hot oil; get hot oil on you in
process.

12. Clean up.

13. Have another beer while oil is draining.

14. Look for oil filter wrench.

15. Give up; poke oil filter with screwdriver and twist it
off.

16. Beer.

17. Buddy shows up; finish case with him. Finish oil change
tomorrow.

18. Next day, drag pan full of old oil out from underneath
car.

19. Throw kitty litter on oil spilled during step 18.

20. Beer. No, drank it all yesterday.

21. Walk to 7-11; buy beer.

22. Install new oil filter making sure to apply thin coat of
clean oil to gasket first.

23. Dump first quart of fresh oil into engine.

24. Remember drain plug from step 11.

25. Hurry to find drain plug in drain pan.

26. Hurry to replace drain plug before the whole quart of
fresh oil drains onto floor.

27. Slip with wrench and bang knuckles on frame.

28. Bang head on floor board in reaction.

29. Begin cussing fit.

30. Throw wrench.

31. Cuss for additional 10 minutes because wrench hit Miss
December (1992) in the left breast.

32. Clean up. Apply Band-Aid to knuckle.

33. Beer.

34. Beer.

35. Dump in additional 4 quarts of oil.

36. Beer.

37. Lower car from jack stands

38. Accidentally crush one of the jack stands

39. Move car back to apply more kitty litter to fresh oil
spilled during step 23.

40. Test drive car

41. Get pulled over; arrested for driving under the
influence.

42. Car gets impounded.

43. Make bail. Get car from impound yard.

Money Spent:
$50 parts
$12 beer
$75 replacement set of jack stands; hey the colors have to
match!
$1000 Bail
$200 Impound and towing fee
---------------------------
$1337 Total

mdaffron

You can get cat litter at the auto parts store???

Man, now I shouldn't have any delays changing Dustbunny's poop box anymore!

Meade

P.S. I found that last post very enjoyable, and (in some parts) astonishingly accurate!

kyfdx

No joke... That is why the dealer does mine..

Very funny..

blueguydotcom

Always stopped at the dealer for my oil changes with my protege. But I did them every 7k miles as the car was used exlusively for long drives - 90 miles a day.

lifestar

Are we allowed as an option to choose what brand (or we could bring out own?) of oil we want in the mazda 3? I know the driver's manual specifies a 5w-20 oil, but that kind reduces engine life while raises performance. It may not be an issue for me right now, but living in Boston with our Nor'easters during winter can be brutal to the engine. I would rather have the oil be at a 5w-30 type, can I specify to the dealer that I want that kind of oil?

mdaffron

How Meade Used to Change the Oil

1. Go to Jiffy Lube

2. Explain to employee that all I need is an oil change

3. Turn down floor-mat shampoo

4. Decline full-car detail for only $75 extra

5. Sit down in waiting area to read 8-month old copies of "Glamour" and "Newsweek"

6. Try, then spit out, burned & watered-down coffee-like beverage

7. Decline "new car smell" air freshener; pay for oil change

8. Drive car a mile down street; note strange smell

9. Get out of car; look underneath to find new oil coming out in a stream

10. Walk back to Jiffy Lube to find out why wrong filter was installed

11. Jiffy Lube has car towed back to Jiffy Lube

12. Correct procedure performed after second "whack" at oil change

13. I am refunded my original service fee

14. Three hours later, I am on my way again

That, my friends, is why (with very little embellishment) I stopped using Jiffy Lube about 15 years ago. I've been doing my own oil changes ever since -- until now, with the 3. The only good thing about having oil changes done at the dealership? Well, at least in litigation-frenzied America, having someone to point your finger at!

Meade

mdaffron

Gonna be hard, since the manual recommends 5w-20 in all climates. Your dealer may put it in for you, but at the expense of your warranty.

Meade

lifestar

I thought it wouldn't void the warranty as the manual only recommends that we use the 5w-20 oil. So if we did it ourselves, the warranty would still be valid, but just that we didn't follow their recommendation (not requirements) for motor oil type.

kyfdx

Not sure of your technical background.. but, I wouldn't substitute my judgement for those of Mazda engineers...

Seems like a non-issue to me... Just use what came in it....

autonomous

the manual only recommends that we use the 5w-20 oil. So if we did it ourselves, the warranty would still be valid, but just that we didn't follow their recommendation (not requirements) for motor oil type.

Well, then wouldn't Mazda be right to say that they are not required to do warranty work that you request/recommend? As a do-it-yourselfer remember to keep all the paperwork of materials and services done to prove that you were following the schedule of recommended service. I guess the question you have to ask is what's a warranty worth? Or as Clint would say, do you feel lucky? :P

z71bill

If outside temp is real cold why would you want to use 5W-30 (rather than 5W-20)?

The first number (5 in 5W-??) means when cold the oil is like a 5 weight oil - thin & easy to flow - just what you want when the temp is below 0. Both the 5W20 & 5W-30 should be close to the same at start up - just what you want on a cold morning. The second number (20 or 30) is the weight of the oil after the engine has warmed up.

I can't understand why you would want to use a "heavier oil" when the temp is cold.

I can at least understand the logic some people use - wanting a heavy oil (10W-40 or even 20W50) when it is real hot out and they are driving hard / towing a heavy trailer. Not saying I agree with these guys - too heavy an oil will cause just as much (if not more) damage than a too light of an oil.

The reason some companies - Ford (Mazda) & Honda use 5W-20 is it gives a small increase in MPG. If you think about it for an engine to use less gas it must be generating less friction - I would think less friction is a good thing.

fowler3

...people want to change a dozen things when they buy a new car? The wheels, the oil type, the headlamps, the audio head, the seats, you name it. Maybe the car companies should just sell parts and buyers put their cars together. No warrenty worries and expense for the companies.

Of course, I've seen a few cars on the road that looked exactly like they were made from parts bins, whatever they found they used.

fowler3

z71bill

I can understand functional things - the first thing I did after buying a new PU truck was to get a spray on bed liner and Tonno cover - but then I added a bug deflector, step bars and put on a set of larger AT tires - functional - yes - but my truck only goes off road 3-4 times a year. I thought it looked pretty good - still do - but I have seen at least 50 trucks that are not only the same body style and color (X-cab, pewter Z-71) - but also have the exact same add ons. So much for a custom vehicle.

I think much of the add ons are people just trying to be a little different.

I agree that when it come to things like what oil to use - it is hard to go wrong by using what is listed in owners manual. The only reason I would ever go with an oil that is heavier would be if I had a high mileage engine (say 100-150K) that was starting to burn oil - at that point who cares.

mdaffron

My stepmother recently purchased a Toyota Highlander. Guess what?

blueguydotcom

.people want to change a dozen things when they buy a new car? The wheels, the oil type, the headlamps, the audio head, the seats, you name it. Maybe the car companies should just sell parts and buyers put their cars together. No warrenty worries and expense for the companies.

Much of scion's success comes from the fact toyota noticed gen x and more gen y like to mod their cars. so toyota made the scion, released the cars with decent features at a low price and then offered trd/toyota parts for install and warranty right from the dealer. boom instant success...

it's definitely becoming the wave of the future as people like to personalize their stuff.

lifestar

I guess I would fall into that category. :P Ever since I got my new Mz3 Hatch I've been so tempted to make changes and add-ons, improvements to the car. I think partially to personalize it as mentioned, but it might be b/c amongst my generation, there is a distrust of what the dealerships are really telling us how much performance our cars can really get. I mean, do a quick search on ebay and you will find hundreds of listings on how to improve engine performance, lights, steering, etc. It's an attitude of "the car's good, but is this as far as it can go?"

Anyhows, thanks for the info about the oil. To clarify, I was thinking more about the 5w-30 type of oil b/c that has been the type of oil that I used with my previous car, the Protege. Plus, the summers here in Boston can get pretty hot at times (the city's built on former swamp lands!), so I thought it would be better to go with the -30 oil instead of the -20.

holdsg1

Just wondering if anyone who recently (in 2005) purchased a MZ3 HB seriously looked at a Toyota Matrix instead? I noticed no comparo amoung the discussion threads here, so I thought I might just ask the MZ3 board denizens what they think of the Matrix.

blueguydotcom

She couldn't get away from it fast enough. Very different philosophy behind the matrix. It doesn't seem geared toward performance or basic luxury. This could be a result of its age too but held up to the Mz3 the poor matrix was not in the same league.

My friend was coming from an Acura though, so for her it was really a challenge between the TSX and the Mazda3. In the end she liked the versatility, plus entry lux feel and the sharp handling over the TSX.

david6

Well, wife and I bought the Mazda3s sedan (although I was inclined towards the HB) and we looked very seriously at the Matrix. Seems like a good car, not sporty like the MZ3, but more roomy/functional. Engine/tranny seemed good, handling fine, satisfactory drive, and we really liked the flip-up glass in the hatch when compared to the MZ3 HB having to lift the whole door for groceries. As a truck owner, I really liked the apparent functionality of the car. However, I felt the materials seemed cheaper in the Matrix, and I preferred the interior of the MZ3.

In the end, after the wife had done several test drives, I finally drove the Matrix and found that (maybe on that particular day, in that particular car) the seat made my rear end very uncomfortable. So with that, added to the overall apparent superiority of the MZ3 (in our opinions) and the fact that we still have a larger vehicle for carrying bigger stuff, we went with the MZ3. I would reconsider the Matrix when replacing my Ranger. It's just not built for the same target market concerning driving/utility as the MZ3, I'd say.

autonomous

You're right they are worth comparing. My impression of the Matrix is that it is larger (more along the lines of a mini SUV), seating is more upright, well equipped (including a versatile rear trunk), underpowered (unless you get the buzzy top end engine) and bulletproof in terms of reliability. The Mazda3 Sport Hatchback is tighter and sportier, well equipped (the trunk is not as large as the Matrix), moderately well powered for its size and weight (although I would not complain if it went up a notch) and has excellent reliability according to Consumer Reports. Both have much going for them. So you can go out to the dueling dealerships and have them fight for your sale; you'll end up with an excellent car at an excellent price.

mdaffron

I have a friend who traded his two 2000 Protege ES's for two Pontiac Vibe GTs (aka Toyota Matrixes -- or is it Matrices? Anyway ...). I had the opportunity to drive his Vibe about 10 miles around my suburbs one day immediately after driving the 3 hatch that my dealership had loaned me for the weekend. Got right out of the 3 and into the Vibe.

No comparison.

You sit up high, minivan-style, in the Vibe. And the Vibe, even in his version with the larger engine, was slow to accelerate from a stop. From one stop sign we had to go straight up a hill, and the car just didn't seem to be interested in doing it even though I had the accelerator mashed to the floor. (This was an automatic, btw.) And the car leaned much more than the 3 into turns.

It was a bit larger inside, but that didn't appeal to me either. I didn't like the feeling of sitting tall. It also screamed "American Car" inside -- but that may just be Ponti-YACK's styling. No thanks, I love my 3 hatch.

Meade

fowler3

Toyota's designers couldn't decide what they wanted it to be. They added GFX on the front but it looks odd. Then they seemed to concentrate more styling ideas on the backend making it looked pinched. You sit up high, yet they wanted it sporty, so they over-did the dash with plastic-chrome. Maybe that's why they named it Matrix, better than MishMash.

The only thing I would be tempted to change on the HB wold be those 17" wheels to nicely styled 16s and get thicker rubber on the ground for a quieter ride. Although, I put almost the same tire spec on my Protegé's 15" wheels, 205/50s and they are quiet and smooth. Otherwise, the HB is the better of the two offerings (sedan vs HB).

folwer3

ezcompany

I just picked up the Mazda 3 - 5 door Hatch from the dealer yesterday (VERY HARD TO FIND). I was excited and never looked for the SUB.
where is the Subwoofer, the sound system is BOSE and I can count the 6 speakers, I guess the 7th one is the SUB. But where is it located ? I can't find the box ?
help please

fowler3

I don't think they have a SUB, I thought all Mazdas came with 6 speakers. On the otherhand, I do recall somebody mentioning a SUB being in the spare tire area.

fowler3

ezcompany

Cool - I'll check the spare tire area in the morning.
Got another question: seems like the xenon does not project too far away..just a couple of feet in front of the car..seems too short to me ??? does anyone else feel the same way ?

cti

I thought something was wrong with my xenon headlights at first. I figured there was no way they could be projecting the light for such a short distance.

Then I realized that they were tilted as far down as they could go so I turned the dial all the way to '0' (or maybe it was '3') and, voila, after 10 seconds the ligths were much better.

claudius753

Does anyone have the automatic 3s HB? How does the tranny perform?

The 3s HB is one of the cars I am considering atm, but I would prefer to get an auto. How is it on gear hunting and hills? I know it has the manual mode, but I am more interested in how it does on its own...

Maybe i should just bite the bullet and get the 5 speed.... :confuse:

carlisimo

Engineers have to design things as a compromise that will work for most of the buyers. They have to use cheaper materials and methods than they'd usually like to, for one thing. But they also design for the average conditions and average buyer.

So when they recommend what kind of oil to use, don't take it as gospel... they're not talking to YOU specifically. They just assumed most people didn't live in Boston, nor want to give up a few hp.

To put it simply: "tuning" something doesn't mean making it better - it means making more how you want it to be.

(Oh and you guys adjust your lights... please don't make them aim high enough to look like high beams...)

fowler3

I drove a 3 and the AT seemed fine to me, although I didn't go any hills. The manual option lets you hold 3rd gear going up and discending grades. For the most part Mazda's AT cars do very well on steap hills. I've never had to downshift my Protegé's AT in mountainous country.

fowler3

claudius753

Forgot to ask, when is the MMC scheduled for the 3? Didn't it come out in 2003 so I would think the refresh would be around the 06 or 07 models. I didn't see any Mazda 3:Future Models thread.

mdaffron

Mazda usually does a refresh every three years, so I would expect to see a different front end style or something else minor in late 2006 as a 2007 model.

Meade

ezcompany

I did crank em up all the way after that dude pointed out that its the dial on the left. now that you mentioned not to aim them high - I don't think they go that high, I was behind a car and it still looked like they were ok. Might dorp em just a notch.
It does look sick though, at night, these two teeny weeny bulbs unleashing hell.
Good point though.

edweissman

When I set out to get a new car, my initial thought was to buy an AWD vehicle. (My wife and I have a vacation place in the Berkshires, in SW Massachusetts). Being on a somewhat limited budget, I first looked at a Subaru Forester (my wife having a Subaru Outback wagon). I'm a bit overweight, and I found that, no matter what I did, the Subaru was a "tight" fit if I wanted to ever sit in the back. Out it went.
I then went and looked at the Matrix AWD (in the XR - midrange model), which I had looked extensively at at the NY Auto Show. Although the "fit and finish" seemed good (but not exceptional), the acceleration was sluggish and had me concerned about entering onto a highway. I was also concerned about whether the vehicle would struggle getting up a hill if it was carrying any sort of load.
At that point, I reconsidered whether I needed AWD, and, deciding against that, I went and test drove the Matrix XR FWD, the Kia Spectra5 hatchback, and the Mazda5 hatchback.
Of the three, the Matrix was still the slowest from a standstill.
The Spectra5, for the price, was far more impressive than the Matrix. In many respects, it's a Matrix clone with better low end power and some interesting standard features (including side curtain airbags). However, I was concerned whether it would hold up (it's in its first model year); it had a fair amount of body lean in turns (more than the Matrix) and getting one with ABS is difficult.
The Mazda3 is the smallest of the three vehicles in terms of carrying capacity, but has the longest wheelbase. The rear seating was the equal of the Matrix and the Spectra5, and did not suffer from the "claustrophobia" that some complain about sitting in the rear of the Matrix.
The M3's powertrain was noticibly quicker off the line than either the Spectra5 or the Matrix. The EPA ratings were slightly below the Matrix, but better than the Spectra5 (despite having approx. 30 more horsepower).
The fit and finish of the M3 was better than either the Matrix or the Spectra5, although neither of them was poor. The front seating in the M3 is noticibly more comfortable than either of the others.
And then there's the driving experience. The M3 is a fun car to drive. It's responsive, handles tightly, and asks to be driven on a challenging road, while at the same time being a comfortable highway cruiser. The other two are not in the same class.
So: should the M3 be compared to the Matrix or the Spectra5? I don't know. To me, it's not a station wagon, so it would not be fair to compare it to (e.g.) a Ford Focus wagon. On the other hand, to compare it to a Matrix or Spectra5 at this point may not be fair, as both of those are something more like mini-SUVs.

bunk1968

I am going to purchase a Titanium Mz3 hatchback with a manual trans and with ABS package and Moonroof Package.
They gave me a price of $17150 with the S-Plan. With tax and plate transfer it came to $18262.
IS THIS A GOOD DEAL????
** I got an extra $500 off of this price with the Gerber rebate. Thanks again to whoever first introduced us to that rebate!!
I AM VERY CURIOUS TO KNOW IF I GOT A GOOD DEAL BESIDES THE GERBER REBATE??????!!!
Thanks!
Oh, and if anyone wants to add their opinion, which is a better color to own, Titanium or Black?

holdsg1

Thanks to all for the well thought-out responses.

I find it interesting that people have the perception of the Matrix as a small SUV, when in reality it is just a taller Corolla. But perception is in the mind of the beholder.

I agree with all of you on the performance advantage of the Mazda vs. Toyota. Fun to drive is a lust factor, which has me leaning towards the Mazda. If all we ever cared about was reliability, we would all just drive the same car, right?. Plus you can load the MZ3 HB with a lot more goodies, like leather, which are unavail on the Matrix. I remain concerned about some other issues with the MZ3, particularly AC. I live in a hot climate. A tough decision, but one that I kind of like kicking around in my head for the past few days.

Thanks again for your input.

Sylvia

If you ask your question in the discussion Mazda3: Prices Paid & Buying Experience , you are more likely to get answers and learn what others are paying.