BMW 3-Series 2006

kyfdx

I keep telling you.. get the heated seats.. You can open the sunroof all year round...

corvette

There's something almost sensual about the way driving a manual feels. If the cost were the same, I would probably buy a DSG model, but part of me would still miss driving a manual.

hrc

Ahhh! Same reaction and same alternate color! I'm just a bit worried that the Artic looks like...how you say...femine. What are your thoughts?

Danny

odessit

I got dark blue – Monoco Blue they call it if I am not mistaken. It looks awesome! In some lighting condition it looks black. But mostly it truly shows dark blue. Just did not want to get color that most bmw owners will have in my area. But at the end don’t listen to noone – take whatever makes YOU feel good about YOUR car.
mike

morrow_rider

I don't really need navigation and adding iDrive would add quite a bit to the overall price. But it seems from browsing the manual that there are lots and lots of controls that you simply don't have unless you have iDrive. For example: can you adjust the Treble/Bass without iDrive. It would seem ludicrous that you couldn't, but the manual makes it look like you need it. What other functions are impossible without it?

So how important is it to get the iDrive? Consider also its effect on resale value: will people pay more for the iDrive 3 years from now? Or will they similarly consider it merely an expensive luxury?

Thanks,
Brian

blueguydotcom

I used to be a die hard manual guy (20 years of driving nothing but manuals and I'm 30 years old). Then I drove an A3 with DSG. If BMW had DSG, I'd get it and never look back. The shifts are lightning fast - 8 miliseconds v. 80 ms for the best humans.

Too bad BMW's SMG isn't as quick or as sophisticated as Audi/VW's DSG.

bryncerdd

Concerning the manual vs. automatic discussion: I sympathisize with all those preferring the manual transmission: the element of control, the pleasure of operating a well designed and executed piece of equipment, not to mention the basic pleasure of DRIVING, however you choose to define that. But consider that over the decades we have moved from three speeds, to four speeds (all we need, if the ratios are well chosen)), to five speeds, now to six speeds, and some few cars on the outer edges have seven speed transmissions. I wonder--do you really want to stir through all six, or seven, gears every time you want to reach cruising speed? I propose that in time, the bloom will wear off all that shifting. Manufacturers are faced with constant demands to increase average fuel consumption, and one way to do that, with all else that is in place, is to install ever higher ratios (or lower ratios, depending on how you think about such matters) in the final gears to increase fuel efficiency. I don't see any change from the broad trend. I propose it will become a bit tiresome, and an efficient automatic is the most obvious solution. I'd be happy to go back to a good four-speed, but I don't see that in the offing.

Bryncerdd

blueguydotcom

I wonder--do you really want to stir through all six, or seven, gears every time you want to reach cruising speed? I propose that in time, the bloom will wear off all that shifting.

I don't know a person who owns a 6 speed that actually shifts through all 6 gears. I usually jump from 3rd to 6th. When i need power immediately on the freeway, I slip to 4th. Not sure if I've ever used 5th gear.

Manufacturers are faced with constant demands to increase average fuel consumption, and one way to do that, with all else that is in place, is to install ever higher ratios (or lower ratios, depending on how you think about such matters) in the final gears to increase fuel efficiency. I don't see any change from the broad trend. I propose it will become a bit tiresome, and an efficient automatic is the most obvious solution. I'd be happy to go back to a good four-speed, but I don't see that in the offing.

I've heard nothing but great things about MB's 7 speed auto. VW's 6 speed DSG is smooth and sweet.

wstevec

Well I thought the Arctic looked like a light gray, very macho!!!

shipo

"I wonder--do you really want to stir through all six, or seven, gears every time you want to reach cruising speed? I propose that in time, the bloom will wear off all that shifting."

Hmmm, I got my first 5-Speed in 1979 (a sweet little VW Scirocco), and I've never looked back to the 3-Speed and 4-Speed transmissions I had before that. So, what's another gear? To be perfectly honest, regardless of the road or the conditions, my right arm and my left leg are so in tune with the process of running up and down through the gears, that I don't even conciously know that I'm doing it, except that is, for the viceral pleasure I get from the experience.

Said another way, I don't suspect that the bloom will ever wear off for me. If it was going to, it would have happened two years ago when I spent months in a cast and was unable to shift for myself. I swear, prior to getting that cast removed, I was actually counting the minutes until I could drive a car sans slushbox. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

psyran

I debated between the Arctic and Sparkling Graphite for awhile. Even changed the color before it hit the production line. Drove my dealer crazy I think. finally settled on Arctic. Car probably arrives this week, but even as recently as three days ago, upon seeing the Arctic and Graphite side by side (at a different dealership than where I ordered), I started having doubts again. But in the long run, I think I will be happy with the Arctic. (BTW, I am a really macho cool older guy and I will be driving Arctic , LOL)
psyran

shipo

"I keep telling you.. get the heated seats.. You can open the sunroof all year round..."

Hmmm, I find myself wondering what the leather seats in my car would look like today if I did something like that. So far we've had an easy two inches of rain in the last 24 hours, and we have another inch and a half forecast for the next 24 hours. We had a wet spring and summer last year, then over 100 inches of snow this winter, and now a wet, wet, wet spring. All of that water has conspired to create a pond in our back woods that is well over an acre in size, and still growing. I love sitting on the back deck and listening to all of the frogs and critters and such, but YIKES! here comes a black cloud of black flies and mosquitoes heading directly for us! RUN! ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

dl7265

Ok, after the sun went down and the movie let out, i tried your experiment.It appears you CAN turn off the snowflake and basically be on vent. Also oddy enough if you lower the temp all the way down to 60 it does NOT engage the compressor, without selecting the snowflake. Hope this helps.

DL

shipo

BINGO! As I suspected, the "Snowflake" button has the ultimate control over the compressor. By engaging both the "Auto" and "Snowflake" button at the same time, then the Auto program is left to its own devices as to when to engage the compressor and when to turn it off. By turning off the "Snowflake", you remove the compressor from the "Auto" program and it is forced to make do with outside air, which more often than not up here in New Hamster is quite sufficient.

DL, thanks for performing this little experiment for me. As they say in the local New England vernacular, you are wicked :shades:

Best Regards,
Shipo

P.S.
Instant translation for those of you who don't understand New Englandese (like me three years ago before moving up here): "wicked :shades:" = "way cool"

corvette

I meant, SMG, which I think is similar, although I've never driven one. Most normal automatics shift faster than I do, but the parasitic losses are greater with an automatic, so there is effectively less available power.

dl7265

Hmm everytime i see Artic it looks different. It seems to depend on lighting and interior color. Of course the Graphite also changes colors. tonite under the lights and with a grey interior I thought it look ummm baby blue.

DL

paule

A '70 Challenger......one of my dream cars! Probably not from a cornering, easy to shift manual transmission perspective but man I just love the looks of the old E bodies!

Yet one of the vehicles I still would want to own.
So Shipo, fess up. Big block, small block, Hemi Orange? Need some specifics here!

shipo

Okay, a 1970 Challenger SE (small rear window) with the "Gator Grain" vinyl top, 318 2-BBL 3-Speed on the floor, manual (non-power) steering, leather seats, and a honking (for its day) four speaker stereo. I bought it in 1977 right after I got out of Uncle Sam's Misguided Children, and promptly proceeded to correct many of the shortcomings of the car.

First to go were the Uniroyal Tiger-Paw bias belted white-wall tires. Ugh! Those were replaced by a meaty set of BF Goodrich Radial T/As. The car had 118,000 miles on it when I bought it and the number five exhaust valve was badly burned, so I managed to find a badly rear-ended Challenger T/A, complete with a 340 SIX PAK, the hood and the SHAKER Scoop! Unfortunately the New Process 4-Speed transmission was destroyed in the accident and there was absolutely no way I was going to mate the 340 Six Pak to the 3-Speed, so I was still running around on seven cylinders. Some time in 1978 I found a big block Super Bee that had a 4-Speed that had been rolled many times, mercifully not damaging the tranny, so I was in business, or so I thought. I pulled out the tired engine and transmission from my Challenger, and attempted to fit my assemblage of parts together, only to find that the bell housing from the Super Bee wouldn't fit the 340, and while my bell housing from the 318 easily bolted onto the 340, the big block version of the New Process 4-Speed wouldn't mate up with my bell housing. Fortunately a quick trip to the machine shop to enlarge the central hole on the back of the housing solved the problem. Once installed in the car, I installed a standard Challenger R/T dual exhaust system, including the rear panel under the rear bumper and the retangular "Dual-Dual" chrome exhaust tips. This engine/tranny swap also required me to find a new shifter as the one from the Super Bee had already been sold. Right about then Hurst was selling the "Super Shifter II" (if memory serves), with a red "T" handle that served as a reverse lockout. Needless to say, moving from the long throw 3-Speed to the short throw Hurst was wonderful.

With the mechanicals in order (which included some suspension work that I haven't mentioned), I had the vinyl top removed, the rear window replaced with a normal rear window, and had the entire thing painted black. What a ride! The only additional modification I made was to the vacuum secondaries (the front and rear set of 2-BBL carburetors). I had read somewhere that if you drilled out and tapped the orifice to the diaphragms that controlled the activation of the secondaries, then you could take a couple of small hex key plugs, and drill them out to different diameters, thus being able to "tune" when the secondaries would come on line. Larger holes for cruising in Escondido on Friday nights, smaller holes for normal day-to-day driving. This arrangement worked out well until I managed to get five speeding tickets in less than a month. :-(

A friend of a friend made me an offer for the engine, the Shaker Scoop and the hood that was WAY more that I could afford to pass up, so I rebuilt the 318, milled and ported the heads, and put a nice little 650 CFM Holley on it. Even still, it was fast enough to get me into trouble, so I had to really keep my foot out of it. By 1982, I had been transferred from San Diego to Los Angeles to Atlanta to Detroit to San Francisco, and then finally to Chicago. That was where my Challenger met with a set of thieves who stole it, stripped it, and broke what they didn't strip (ie, they broke every instrument, every light that they didn't want, every window, and slashed the seats and the headliner). It was found sitting on its belly, full of urine, by the Chicago Police under the "El" tracks just north of Irving Park Road. :-(

Thus endeth the saga of my wonderful 1970 Dodge Challenger. I would still have it today if it hadn't met with such an ignominious fate.

Best Regards,
Shipo

dl7265

Your quite welcome. And by the way if I was cool I would have held out til next year for a 330i Sport 6 speed via ED

DL

shner

ANYONE HAVE EXPIRIANCE WITH THIS? DOES IT HELP IF YOUR CREDIT IS NOT THE BEST?

PrePay
If you prefer cash transactions, you can save yourself some money through PrePay leasing. Instead of paying cash for your new or Certified Pre-Owned BMW, you can pay for a portion of the car through a prepaid lease. A PrePay lease consists of a single upfront payment (including a security deposit) that will be less than the sum of monthly payments on a traditional lease. And you still have all the lease-end options of a standard lease. (Please note: The PrePay option cannot be combined with Multiple Security Deposits.)

onebuc

Me too, actually yesterday was the day.
I would like to thank everyone for the wonderful discussions that prepared me for the task. For those in the Tampa area I found it very easy to get 1K below MSRP on a 325i w/ auto. I feel I did'nt even have to negotiate and may have been able to shoot even lower. There was no trade in and I was told they would build it the end of June for late July delivery.
325i auto, power seats, Arctic w/ black and poplar. Can't wait, Oh and for what its worth; the Arctic was the wifes choice and its her car :P Terry

hpowders

I also live in the Tampa area. Who did you go with-Bert Smith or Reeves?
Thanks.
hpowders

erickpl

Two years ago? It's been THAT long that your leg was in a cast? Man, I've been around here a while...

-Paul

dvand17

I guess I'm like most folks and was debating between the Arctic and the Graphite. I think choosing between the two depends on what your interior looks like also. I think the Graphite looks excellent with the black leather interior, and only saw the Arctic with the grey interior. Can't say I was a fan of the Arctic, but if it had a better interior color choice, then I think it would have made the car look a bit more "masculine." I did think it was a bit feminine, but shoot, it's a bimmer, so get whatever color makes you happy!

erickpl

Green/natural brown combination... classic colors that don't attract the red/blue lights nearly as much.

-Paul

onebuc

Reeves,

don't forget about Ferman Palm Harbor when you negotiate. Terry

shipo

I got the cast on in early January of 2003, and the purple fiberglass job didn't come off until mid April (IIRC), only to be replaced by an enormous removable walking cast, which I used until some time in June. Of course I was already back in the 530i in April even though I had to take the walking cast off every time I got in the car. :-/

By Summer 2004 I was pretty much able to walk without a limp, and even tried running a little by late Summer. That turned out to be both good and bad. The good news was that I was able to increase the range of motion in my ankle, but due to all of the damage to the soft tissue, not as fast as my body wanted to increase the miles. The result was some severe shin splints and a stress fracture by last October. :-(

I'm in the process if easing back into running yet again, and so far so good, I even played Soccer a couple of days ago for the first time since my fall, and oh damn am I sore. Fortunately it's all good sore. ;-) Maybe by the time I get my E90 I'll be fully back in shape and ready to take some driving lessons and do a little racing. :shades:

Best Regards,
Shipo

hrc

Hehehe! I'm hoping with all hope that my Artic with Black leather will look great! All 330i's that my local dealership has in Artic are with the Beige/Tan or Grey interiors, so I didn't get visual confirmation on how my color combo will look! Of course having the sport package will make the car look better no matter what color right?! The dealership did have a Sparking Graphite w/Black Leather and as I said before, it's a really dark color combo IMHO, but I think I would've gotten that if it wasn't for my wife-to-be. I think I'll be happier that I listened to her in the long run, marriage can be sticky at times, so I have to pick my battles!

BTW, they gave me the same ETA time for my car, late July or early August.

About price, we are currently stuck at $1500 above invoice, I of course want $500 over, but I think the best I can hope for is maybe $1000 over...

Danny

shipo

How does "Wifey-To-Be" like manual transmissions? I ask because that seems to be something of a recurrent theme here in the 3-Series discussions.

Best Regards,
Shipo

hrc

Hi Shipo! Monica is not crazy about it, but it's my car...hence the compromise on the color!! If this was her car, she would for sure opt for the STEPTRONIC! She has driven manual before, but it's been a long time. My current car is a manual, but she refuses to drive it unless it's an emergency, plus I think it's embarrassment for her (she's an attorney) to be seen in/driving a modified Honda that I think is tastefully upgraded. But even I have now grown out of *upgrading* my cars, heck, with the 330i, I don't have to do anything anyways!

BTW, she will drive the 330i a few days a week, something she never did with my current car. I have to hope she takes extra care in driving/parking the car, I'm worried!

Danny

blueguydotcom

BTW, she will drive the 330i a few days a week, something she never did with my current car. I have to hope she takes extra care in driving/parking the car, I'm worried!

lol. I'm dating a girl from Italy and she told me she's always driven manuals - automatics are pretty darn uncommon in europe. Well, she's here without a car and it's getting to be a hassle to pick her up all the time so I offered her the use of one of my cars (anyone wanting to comment on loaning cars, don't bother, I loan mine out like people loan DVDs). She told me, "Oh no, you don't want your cars crashed up." What? "I can drive but I hit a lot of things." Okey dokey, offer rescinded.

Regarding e90 Arctic...my SA ordered his car that way. He told me on the test drive of the e90 that he thinks he made a mistake. The dealership had the color and he found it too weird. He asked me if I wanted a nicely optioned, barely used e90 in arctic white in a month or so. I passed.

hrc

"Regarding e90 Arctic...my SA ordered his car that way. He told me on the test drive of the e90 that he thinks he made a mistake. The dealership had the color and he found it too weird. He asked me if I wanted a nicely optioned, barely used e90 in arctic white in a month or so. I passed."

Artic White? The Artic I'm refering to is more like a sea-foam green. Are you refering to Alpine white? I'm confused!

BTW, I would have rescinded the offer too!

Danny

r_l_edison

Has anyone heard when the all-wheel drive E90 will go on sale and if there have been any changes/improvements with the all-wheel drive system? With the advances in DSC (did they really do away with the locking rear differential?), is it still worth the extra money and the wait to get the all-wheel drive...especially when the weather here in Washington D.C. doesn't really necessitate all-wheel drive :confuse:

0audilicious0

That's how I knew that I found the perfect woman. We were on a date and she very skillfully was driving a manual through the hilly streets of San Francisco.

Women who drive manuals... I'm getting goosebumps thinking about it.

shipo

Personally I wouldn't bother. Hell, I live in New Hampshire and I still don't bother. I am a firm believer that a winter tire equipped RWD car is safer in the snow (and cheaper too) than an AWD car with All-Season rubber on the wheels.

You also need to be aware that if you want to Sport Package and AWD, what you will actually get is the SP interior (seats and steering wheel), but the non-SP suspension, wheels and tires. Said another way, a RWD E90 SP will run rings around an AWD E90 SP in the Summer, and a RWD E90 SP shod with winter tires will run rings around that same AWD E90 SP in the Winter. That means that to my way of thinking, the "xi" is a lose-lose-lose deal (more expensive-worse summer handling-worse winter handling).

Now, if you really want a gonzo, full tilt boogie, winter driving machine, get the AWD system AND a second set of winter tires. However, for DC, I simply don't see the need to go over the top like that. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

shipo

You know the old addage, "If you want to know what someone will look like when they get older, simply look at their parent of the same gender." Well, something to that effect anyway. ;-) When I first met my mother-in-law (to be), I remember being very impressed that she was driving a car with three pedals under the dash.

Back when I was still in a cast (recent thread), she came up here to help out a bit, and drove me around in my 530i 5-Speed. There she was, 98 pounds of 68 year old "Muzzy" sitting in the left seat, busting hump along our local 2-lane twisties, grinning from ear to ear. Fortunately Mrs. Shipo is cut from very much the same mold. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

jagg

Hey all. I'm probably going to take the plunge and get a 2006 3 Series. I was also leaning towards the lexus GS330, but they priced that out of my range.

I test drove both models this weekend and loved it. Couple of questions though:

1. I'm torn between the 325i and 330i. Obviously the 330i has more power, but is it worth the extra $6000? I'd like a powerful car, given the way i drive, but i'm not such an enthusiast that it would really matter. Is there really a difference between the two? Would i be unhappy if i chose the 325 based on cost, even though i could afford the 330?

2. On the same issue, what about resale value on the 325 vs 330? Would one hold value better than the other? I probably would not go for power seats in either, since it doesn't really matter to me, would that also affect resale?

3. I would probably get the car with the basics, no additions, except maybe satellite. Are there any 'must have' options that i'm missing?

4. On the satellite issue. The dealer said it would be $500 extra, but i know you can buy units for under $100 now. Is there an advantage to getting one installed at purchase?

5. I'm also exploring the lease option and the dealer said that the lease numbers on a 325 were much worse than a 330. Has anyone heard this?

Thanks for any help.

shipo

"Obviously the 330i has more power, but is it worth the extra $6000?"

The price difference depends upon which options you want; it can be as small as $3,300.

"Would i be unhappy if i chose the 325 based on cost, even though i could afford the 330?"

The fact is that the E90 325i has nearly as much power as the outgoing E46 330i. While I have yet to drive an E90, my bet is that the power of the 325i will be good enough to satisfy you in the long run.

"On the same issue, what about resale value on the 325 vs 330? Would one hold value better than the other?"

Probably not by much (no more than a percent or two either way), if at all.

"On the satellite issue. The dealer said it would be $500 extra, but i know you can buy units for under $100 now. Is there an advantage to getting one installed at purchase?"

An aftermarket satellite unit will be just that, an aftermarket unit. The integrated system from BMW will be fully controllable by the standard dash and wheel mounted controls. Is that worth $400? It is to me. You'll have to answer that one for yourself though.

"I'm also exploring the lease option and the dealer said that the lease numbers on a 325 were much worse than a 330. Has anyone heard this?"

Last I heard it was the other way around. Were I in your shoes, I might be inclined to find a different dealership based simply on that one statement.

Let us know what you decide. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

davidd3

Less than half of the $6,000 price difference between the 325 and the 330 is attributable to the 330 having more power. Note that the 330 includes as standard equipment the following features which are optional on the 325: power seats for $995; upgraded stereo for $1,200; and xenon headlights for $800. Also, the 330 has larger wheels and tires, as well as chrome trim on the exterior. I'm not sure what value to assign to these features. But I am thinking that the price of the extra power is probably about $2,500 for those who would otherwise option up a 325 with the features that come standard on the 330.

I have heard from multiple sources that the current situation is that the 325 is being leased on more attractive terms than the 330.

blueguydotcom

Women who drive manuals... I'm getting goosebumps thinking about it.

Man, you're telling me. I met a girl in France...to die for. Portuguese, speaks 5 languages, snappy, sarcastic, loves movies and she drives a BMW manual...like a crazy person. Her way of handling that car around Paris and the suburbs...now if only that pesky husband were out of the picture. :shades:

Artic is a color I associate with snow, hence I wrote white. My bad. In the right light it is kinda white. Also blue and purple and like so many pastels on the rainbow.

blueguydotcom

The chrome on the car is one thing I'm hoping I can get taken off and replaced with black trim. Debadging would be nice too.

Shipo, you're the ED guy, can you order BMWs for euro delivery with special requests like no badging and no chrome?

shipo

BMW has changed their approach on the ED "Specials" a couple of times over the last few years, so I'm not too sure what the current version of the truth is. Having said that, I believe that there is A) still a little more flexibility regarding things like badging (easy to remove anyway) and chrome, and I'll have to check my notes, but if memory serves, there is a BMW dealership not too far from the ED center that can quickly effect all kinds of custom mods that are WAY cheaper to do over there than over here.

If I run across anything, I'll let you know.

By the way, debadging is easily accomplished with a blow-dryer, some dental floss (not the braided kind) and a little goo-gone. It seems to me that in the E46 3-Series discussion there was a thread about debadging from about 2001. You might try a search.

Best Regards,
Shipo

david325xi

On several BMW forums recently, there have been posts where people mistakenly said that the Comfort Access feature allows both entry to the car and starting of the car without the use of the key fob. This is only half right. The Comfort Access feature allows you to unlock the car door without pressing any button on the fob, and then to lock the vehicle upon exiting, you touch a marked spot on the door handle. However, to start the car, you still have to insert the key fob into the slot in the dash, as this unlocks the steering wheel. I wish the Comfort Access feature did allow for starting the car without inserting the fob in the dash - like Mercedes Keyless Go - that would have been great. Not sure why BMW didn't design it this way - there is no real convenience in not having to use the key fob to enter the car if you still have to dig it out of your pocket to start the car anyway. So, I think the comfort access may not worth the extra $500 bucks.

The Comfort Access feature is explained on the BMW website.

r_l_edison

Shipo,

Thanks for the quick response. So you feel strongly that a RWD with the appropriate tread is the best value all around, and will sufficiently out-perform an AWD, even in wet or snowy/icy condition, except in the case where the AWD has improved tread as well? You really think that the AWD, even with it's all-season tread, doesn't provide a measurable enough of an increase in safety and security in handling changing road conditions over the RWD to warrant the additional expense? The manner in which people drive here in D.C., even when the roads aren't slippery, gives credence to any increase in handling and traction you can find to help you avoid their erratic driving. Also, I grew up in Wyoming, so all-wheel drive was a necessity out there almost year round, and the lessons learned from the differences between RWD and AWD are deeply ingrained in my psyche :surprise: Thanks again for the input

3boy

How long would you expect for the actual purchase price of the 325i to come down? Right now it seems that $1000 of MSRP seems to be standard -- when would you expect it to be $2000 off MSRP? Thanks in advance.

shipo

There have been a number of tests performed by the car magazines that seem to bear out my impression. While it is true that if you take two like cars (BMW 3 or 5-Series, Mercedes C, E or S-Class, Chrysler 300, or Infiniti G35), one with AWD (with All-Season rubber) and the other with RWD (shod with Winter rubber), the AWD car will most likely have more accelerative traction. On the other hand, the RWD car is a few hundred pounds lighter, and probably has better F/R balance. Those two things combined yield better handling at the limit and much better braking when compared to their respective siblings.

Me, even though I live in a hilly area where it is not unusual to snow well in excess of one hundred inches over the course of a winter, I'll pick RWD every time, and then with the money I've saved on the price of the car, I'll buy a separate set of winter wheels and tires.

Best Regards,
Shipo

onebuc

My situation has really changed since a deposit yest. After a deposit and belief that a vehicle would have to built late June for late July delivery, they found my car (almost) ready for delivery. They are scrambling to get this car here for delivery to close by the end of the month. Here are the numbers granted they are cutting me a break for 2 items I did'nt order on my car, they are satallite prep and power front seats. MSRP 33815/ Invoice 31065, my deal 32300, thats 1235 over invoice and 1515 below MSRP. They are there now, just hit it at the end of the month, don't know if anyone can say 2k below MSRP is a reality for some time.

kyfdx

That is a pretty good deal on a car that has a fairly low MSRP...

I think as you get near the $40K range, the discounts might be a little bigger...

r_l_edison

That sounds reasonable to me, although I'd doubt you'd ever convince my dad about that Any suggestions/favorites for a good set of performance winter tires for a 330i? Is there such a thing as "performance" winter tires?

BR,
Randy

kyfdx

Goodyear Eagle Ultra-Grip
Pirelli 240
Bridgestone Blizzak LM