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Jeep Liberty Diesel

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Comments

  • I agree , you might try doing 3 things.

    1/an oil change with 0w40 mobil 1
    If she hasn't had an oil change in awhile ,I would take her in. I generally treat her like a car,and every 3000 miles,or 3-4 monthes get an oil change.
    2/ fuel filter change,and air filter checked.
    Also fill up with a premium fuel from a B.P ,or Shell.
    There are 2 grades of diesel. 3 if you include bio-diesel.
    3/After she is warm up bring her in for the tec to check out the noises ,and fluid levels of the tranny,tranfer case.
    this may be a factor for the performance as well.
    I am not saying for sure.

    Generally poor "old" fuel is the cause of loss of power and poor fuel economy.
    In the winter, fuel has a tendency to on water .
    There are additives on the market to help reduce the water in fuel. I suggest "power service" ,or stanadyne,or Lucas products,with a fuel stabalizer ,water seperator,and cetane improver in it. Kleen Flo is good for taking water out of the fuel. Power service has a red bottle "911" that is a water eliminater.you could try that.
    You generally see these products at gas stations that serve diesel fuels,like truck stops.
    It may take a week before you notice any changes.
    Try this first before you bring her in the shop.
    Good Luck ...
    Lightnin3...
  • levanlevan Posts: 1
    Farout,
    The boost pressure solenoid filter is in the 2006 service manual, but not in the 2005 manual. The filter is on both year model libertys. It is listed in the dealers parts book as a vacuum solenoid filter,it retail for about 8 dollars. It is located under the hood on the passenger's side behide the air filter assy. It's a round filter about 2.5 to 3 inches long and the diameter of a quarter.
    levan
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    caribou1: I called two other dealers, and both agreed that 12,000 mile differentials fluid change was unreasonable for my driving. one said 45,000 was more than enough and the other suggested schedule A 62,000 miles. So the dealer I bought it from was attempting to drain not only the differentials but my billfold as well. Bless their pea picken hearts!
    You wont believe this but every word is fact. After using the 10 gallons of kerosine and 48 oz of the Cetane booster/anti-gell/lubercant the engine runs like a jack-rabbit. The engine runs much smoother and now when I punch it at 50 mph or even up to 70 mph it has some great get up and go. I am amazed! I got 22 mpg with the 50/50 mix, and 24 mpg with the next fill up with diesel. What do you think happened? Any idea? Maybe I should bottle this mix and call it FAROUT'S SUPER DIESEL GO JUICE. With this CRD nothing seems to be a surprise.

    Farout
  • Farout, I think you cleaned some kind of gunk off with that witches brew.
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    levan: Welcome to what I call the "test market" Jeep Liberty CRD Forum" Thanks for the information. The filter is listed in my Owners Manual Schedule B Diesel Engines. The problem was no dealer knew what it was. Can you believe that! The price here in Missouri is $9.00. + tax, and anything else they can add on. Mine ate 28,500 miles is just like new. The shop manual the dealer has calles it the other name. Glad to have you respond!

    Farout
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    steve05: The dealer willingly replaced all 4 gaskets! The rear doors turned out fine. The front doors leak air just as before! So.... they ordered the strips that the windows seat into when they close. If this fails they will have the body shop see if the door is off kilter. The air leaks we have are totally unreasonable to expect even a old Yugo to have. Our 2006 Liberty does not leak air so I know this is not expecting too much. Hope this helps.

    farout
  • arvmanarvman Posts: 95
    Hey Farout,you're a braver man than I for trying that mixture.I'm glad the results are good,think I may try that as well,sounds like I'll be changing that fuel filter sooner than thought too,even at the price they want for it.Nice to see some positive feedback,this rig may yet get the bugs worked out.Do you plan on keeping the CRD for a while?I plan on having mine for a long time,cheers...........
  • caribou1caribou1 Posts: 1,354
    Farout: kerosene should not hurt the engine but it has less BTUs than proper diesel fuel. For sure you must have cleaned something apart from the boost pressure sensor ;)
    You can also imagine you 'diluted' the source of your EGR related issues? Who knows :confuse:

    Since I cleaned my boost pressure sensor, I used two tanks of fuel and I cannot see any increase in mileage. My engine always behaved like a "jack-rabbit" since I got rid of my EGR problem. My tranny works better than most manuals, and friends who own modern common rail engines are just beginning to understand how well this tranny works compared to their 6 speed gearboxes. They have to play with the clutch in the heavy traffic; we don't :shades:
  • I would stay with Elememt. I am one of many owners of Jeep Liberty Diesel 2006. I only have 25000 miles on it and I have major emmision problems. check engine light came on about a week ago and the codes read
    Insufficient EGR flow. Mass air flow problem (hot wire), and turbocharger airflow. My warranty expired about a month ago. My mechanic told me there is bulletin out on the same issue and I do not what it means.
  • This is my first posting, but have been following it since '05.
    I have a 2005 Jeep CRD . First a run down of problems,
    1)Oct. Front ball joint recall. Had to replace leaking rear seal. 2) Fail injector, took 5 days for the dealership to get a part. I was out of town and had to get a motel and rental car. 3) Nov.Failure of repaired rear unit took 3 days to repair, another rental car. 4) F37 recall done. 5) 17 days later, loud bang, engine light on, can't shift past 3rd gear, towed away from home. 5) 8 days later, no word on the repair of the transmission. Living in NC, not sure if this qualifies for the lemon law. Any help here? Regards ">link title :sick: :sick: :sick: :sick:
  • synlubessynlubes Posts: 184
    mine is a 05 liberty march build about same problems fixed but ten thousands miles now and no problems
  • Mine went to the shop Monday for the F-37 and an oil loss issue.

    When doing the flash update to the PCM, it locked up, so they had to order another. Then today, they found my oil leak. It was the Turbo. They are waiting for a gasket now.

    Originally, they told me that they would not give me a rental. I contacted Chrysler and told them since it was a recall, they should provide one. (I don't have a 2nd car). Chrysler called back and said "Sorry, Charlie" I said "I'll remember this when I drive by the Cherolet dealer coming back from picking up my car" 30 minutes later, I had a PT Cruiser to drive for 3 days whilst they fix the Jeep. :-)

    Tony :sick:
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    arvman: Using Kerosine was not being brave in any way whatsoever! I was not paying any attention to what I was doing.....that's just plain dumb!
    I just got a quote from a Jeep dealer on doing the following. Water/fuel filter, 2 differentials, Transfer case, Transmission service, and a oil change. Would you believe $920. Now that is not even close to what I can afford to drive!
    I am very seriously trying to see what I can do without having a dead herd of elephants to pay off as well. If I can't find a more reasonable price from a Jeep dealer, I doubt I will hang on to this "Green Beast".

    farout
  • Do you have the Chrysler part number for the boost pressure solenoid filter? After an hour with the parts guy here, he finally decided it was called the Boost Pressure Sensor and said it was $48 and was on nation-wide back order.

    I did clean the one I had and have already noticed a difference in the way it runs. It was so carboned up that I thought the portion that needed cleaned was solid. I didn't realize that it had grooves and metal electrodes inside until I started cleaning it.

    Thanks!
  • bullheadbullhead Posts: 125
    caribou1-

    Is there specific post of yours you might recall that provides some guidance on 'how' you got rid of your EGR (problem)? You can't keep teasing us like this! Doesn't it involve chewing gum and a sledgehammer?
  • nescosmonescosmo Posts: 453
    Farout... Just change your fuel filter and forget about the differentials and transfer cases those oil if you think about it it will never need change. how many cars in this place had ever had the tranny oil change and differentials; I for a fact will never change any of those oil. so don't worry so much about the green beast and drive it. \it will never fail///

    Nescosmo.
  • nescosmonescosmo Posts: 453
    Guys..... I was searching the web and found a place that you can have all the parts numbers for the jeep and others vehicles the web place is ( www.berrysprinter.com/05kj.pdf )
    The 05 can be change for 06 or any other year.
    check out.....

    Nescosmo.
  • winter2winter2 Posts: 1,801
    Why even bother taking your CRD to the dealer at all for the servicing you are discussing here? Any reputable garage can handle these items for you for much less than the bloody dealer is charging. Just save your receipts and make sure they use the correct fluids.

    I am going to have transfer case, differential service done at 20K miles for $165 at a local independent garage. The dealer wants $340. I will also have the trans serviced too including flush for $89. The dealer wants $139.

    I will be calling the dealer tomorrow to see if they can undo part of the F37 recall. The power is down and I am wondering if either the new software or the cold weather is raising hell with the performance. I had no performance loss in cold weather last year.
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    Winter2: I too felt the F37 lowered power and spunk in passing and goind up a hill. I was ready to try to clean the Pressure booster sensor infact. However, maybe due to dumb luck I put 10 gallons of Karosine in by by mistake. After seeing what a stupid mistake it was I called a Tec at the Dodge diesel garage. He said to add 48 oz of PS lubercant/cerane booster/anti-gell. I did and it has run as never before agter I went threw the tank of 50/50. I don't say it will work for anyone else but......

    I called more Jeep places and I got the price lowered from $920. to $610. I will check some independant garages tommrow.

    farout
  • Hello All!

    A while back someone posted an airbox mod that included cutting a larger air intake hole. It was a website link with some photos. I've gone back quite a ways looking for it, but I can't seem to find it. Any one remember what I'm talking about and perhaps still knows that web page? Also it seems there was a muffler swap involved - 2-1/2 incher I think?

    Also - there is a company marketing a couple of plug-in modules for the CRD - one is a power boost, the other is for fuel mileage only - Painless Performance Products. ( www.painlessperformance.com ) I plan to get these after I turn about 20k. I still am just barely over 12k & it's back to the dealer for the little yellow stinker light - this will be the 4th trip for malfunctions in less than one year.
  • Hello again! I just checked that website (painless performance) and the modules plug inline with the boost pressure sensor and the fuel pressure sensor. Amazing coincidence that we have been talking about how an - unclean- Boost Pressure Sensor can make your Libby run poorly, and here is a module that plugs inline with the sensor and the onboard computer to alter the sensors output and change the performance of the engine. It also offers a "fuel economy" mode, like most other diesel power modules. There are 3 modules - ranging from over $200 for just the "fuel economy" module to over $400 for the top of the line, 10 power level, fuel economy, and fuel, oil and boost pressure gauging readout model - that's right - the top of the line model will read out the oil, fuel, and turbo boost pressure for you on its tiny little screen. It also claims not to leave a footprint on the onboard computer, so it won't >directly< void the warranty. I think I may spring for one of these sooner than later. Remind me again at what mileage is my Libby's little Dr. Rudolph Diesel's engine actually "broken in?"
  • steverstever Posts: 52,462
    Found this using the Search This Discussion tool for "airbox":

    tired_old_dave, "Jeep Liberty Diesel" #6591, 30 Jun 2006 5:52 am

    There were some other hits that I didn't skim, so try a search if that's not the one you remember.
  • Dude! I'm a little embarassed at how easy you made that seem. I was scrolling back through the forum page by page trying to find it. Now I have that website bookmarked. Thanks bunches!
  • tidestertidester Posts: 10,059
    I'm a little embarassed at how easy you made that seem.

    With just a little practice, you'll be a pro in no time at all! Watch out, Steve! ;)

    tidester, host
  • caribou1caribou1 Posts: 1,354
    Bullhead,
    - My turbo doesn't have variable vanes like yours does, it has an 'old fashion' waste gate and it's boost pressure is mechanically regulated. My turbo is of a 'standalone' type. The only difference with yours is that mine takes a fraction of a second more than yours to reach maximum boost pressure.

    - The vacuum solenoid (with the $8 'sipping' filter) that controls the turbo vanes on your truck is already present on mine. It is used for opening the EGR valve that does not precede the Flow Control Valve that you have. Your is more recent. My EGR valve used to flow exhaust gas directly into my intake manifold without any metering.

    - My remedy consisted of disconnecting the suction line that opens the EGR valve. It's a simple vacuum plug ;)
  • Chryslers part number for this is 05140331AA. Their parts book calls it a Air Temperature Sensor. Goes for about $50.

    Bosch part number is 0 281 002 437. Getting it from Bosch is much more expensive, about $120.
  • bullheadbullhead Posts: 125
    I know that the flow control valve will throw a code if it is not sensing flow. But, what does it do besides function for the EGR system? Is it involved in changing turbo vane geometry ?
  • goodcrdgoodcrd Posts: 253
    I just returned from a 2,800 miles round trip to Oklahoma. The CRD ran fine. Going through Missouri and Oklahoma averaging 70 MPH got 29.5 MPGs. This was the best this little jeep has ran since new. Don't listen to the dealer's about over servicing your CRD. They will bleed you dry. I change my Engine oil every 12,500 and fuel filter at 25K. The diffs and transfer case fluids should be changed every 30K "only" if you tow or beat your beast. Don't let the dealers scare you out of your hard earned money.
  • caribou1caribou1 Posts: 1,354
    Bullhead,
    There are many sensors and I think we have to understand how and why they are involved:
    - Right behind the air filter element you have a combined flow and temperature sensor. The indication this sensor will give is the status of the air filter element (blocked or not) and here the temperature of the air I believe is redundant to the sensor underneath the battery. The combined temperature and flow sensor checks that if there is flow, the temperature of the dual probe has to change. It will also send out an alarm if the engine runs and the turbo intake air is not filtered in case of accidental disconnection.
    - After the turbo you measure the boost pressure. When pressure is set, the vanes need eventually be moved to limit the flow of air to avoid building an overpressure. After a short time if there is no or not enough pressure, there will be an alarm saying the intercooler may be disconnected or the vanes are not responding.
    - Then you have the temperature and barometric pressure (built inside the ECU)that allow an evaluation of oxygen contents in the air. This is mainly for cold starts because the oxygen monitoring is done later by the lambda sensors of the catalyser.
    Once the engine is warm, the lambda sensors take over and control the position of the EGR Flow Control flap for recirculating exhaust and eventually asking for a post injection to re-establish a better catalyser efficiency by changing it's temperature with a 'cloud' of unburnt fuel that will produce heat once in the catalyser element.

    All this is like a recipe; you need to understand the logic behind it.
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    Bullhead,

    The short answer is that when there is competition between intake pressure and exhaust pressure and EGR flow is needed, the EGR flow control valve restricts the intake side to guarantee that the exhaust side wins just to cover the spread. This indirectly affects turbo vane geometry because it is impossible for the turbo to make any yardage against this defense and a biased referee. ;)
  • bullheadbullhead Posts: 125
    Thanks caribou1-

    Your explanation of it was not wasted on me since I've been a student of this Jeep since before I bought one.

    Running the diverted EGR exhaust back to exhaust (perhaps an auxiliary tail pipe!) would be the only reliable remedy to circumvent the plumbing mess they made. Now I have not had any problems with my CRD; do all service myself. However, the city/ stop-n-go fuel mileage is suspiciously low (17mpg in winter w/ my lug wheels mounted), which really costs me for my relatively short daily commute into the city. Vehicle weight, inertia don't explain that well enough, so I suspect 'foul' play. That technique could also provide benefits of more open exhaust, which diesels are known to like.
  • caribou1caribou1 Posts: 1,354
    Siberia, you don't have boost pressure when the EGR flows it's gasses in the intake manifold. The EGR only performs when the engine stays at a 'plateau' (steady regime) under no load or no change of load. I haven't compared the operating pressures yet to understand which one prevails :confuse:
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    Caribou1,

    I enjoyed you explanation especially, "asking for a post injection to re-establish a better catalyser efficiency by changing it's temperature with a 'cloud' of unburnt fuel that will produce heat once in the catalyser element." I believe this is new information to the forum.

    Indeed, there is boost pressure when EGR flows its gasses into the intake confirmed by direct observation of boost pressure and air inlet temperature. It is only under certain conditions that there is not. :surprise:

    Under hard acceleration or heavy load there is high boost and the EGR valve is in fact closed or reduced. However, when traveling at 55 mph and 2,400 rpm with overdrive locked out there is high EGR flow and low to moderate boost. As power is applied the AIT drops and the boost climbs, thus EGR flow is reduced. Other than when coasting, there is no time when boost is not observed. As long as the exhaust gas pressure is higher than the boost pressure EGR can flow even to extent that inlet flow is refereed by the EGR flow control valve for enhancement.
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    Bullhead,

    I should just give up on humor. I meant no insult to your abilities. By the way, my brother's nickname is "Bullhead".
  • bullheadbullhead Posts: 125
    Siberia-

    Not a problem. I just appreciated the long answer caribou1 provided, too !
  • caribou1caribou1 Posts: 1,354
    Siberia,
    The use of the post injection is described in the Bosch training books, the "Yellow Leaflets" if I remember well:

    - the post injection occurs after the compression cycle of the cylinder and increases the combustion temperature from 200C up to 250C.

    - this unburnt mixture induces a temperature elevation of more than 100C in the oxydising catalyser to help consume all hydrocarbon compounds and solvable particles.

    Such conditions are used to rapidly build up the temperature in the catalyser when starting a cold engine. For those who read french, here is the article published by PSA, the leading local diesel engine manufacturer:
    http://www.psa-peugeot-citroen.com/document/presse_dossier/fap_1999_04_151017847- 928.rtf
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    Caribou1,

    Does the post injection provide any explanation of the black smoke during transition to hard acceleration or is the effect more subtile? I am in new territory here. :blush: I read in a trucker's magazine recently where increasing the exhaust temperature prior to the turbo or retaining more heat in the exhaust gas increases turbo efficiency and fuel economy. A procedure was described to modify the exhaust manifold to do this - ported, polished and coated.
  • I explained in earlier posts that after the F37 recall that it seemed that it would shudder and twice stalled when approaching a stop. It felt like when driving a stick, one applied the break without engaging the clutch.

    In fact, I was right. The tech thought that the tranny fluid level had to be checked while in neautral. Instead it had to be checked while it was in Park. So, I was a quart low. Instead of downshifting, it sucked air. Added a quart of fluid. Runs great.

    That's my update.
    Boiler
  • caribou1caribou1 Posts: 1,354
    Siberia,
    The black smoke produced during heavy acceleration is usually a previous accumulation of "dry" soot the exhaust blows out because it is not well attached to the pipe or muffler.
    The post injection is intended to bring unburnt gasses into the oxydising catalyser so they burn inside the catalyser and make it warmer.
    The exhaust temperature is increased from 200 to 250 Celsius inside the cylinder by post injection, and this is before the turbo. Does this improve turbo efficiency: in principle yes because the higher the temperature, the higher the pressure ...
    Will the polished inner surface of the exhaust manifold improve something: I could think so, it should reduce the loss of temperature by contact with the outer wall with less turbulences, just like isolating it thermally but without the risk of burning through the gaskets ;)
  • Just FYI, Jeep has finally updated their website (jeep.com) with info about the new Grd Cher CRD if you're interested....mileage is posted as 20 city 25 hwy for 2wd, 20/24 for 4wd. The lowest trim level it's available on is the Limited, and even then it's a $3k option! It looks like sticker prices will be in the upper 30's at a minimum, or about $8k more than a similarly equiped Liberty was. I live in the Dallas/Ft Worth area, and haven't found a dealer that has one yet, though the Patriots are starting to show up now....

    Twocycle2
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    twocycle2: In a recent article I read that in actual road tests the best that was archived was 19 mpg. The way I see it that is proberly is a good real world mpg to count on. Remember there are many CRD owners that struggle to get 19 in our four banger. I wonder how much extra the cost of up keep will be?
    I doubt, should I live long enough to see my "Green Beast" paid off or to the point I can trade it off, without loosing my shirt and first born, I would ever own a diesel ever again. (I still have 5 more years to go)
    Oh I went through all our repair tickets, here is the brake down. 37 things have been repaired under warranty. there has been three items that have been repaired four times. Of the 14 times we have been in for warranty repair 11 of those trips have had two trips required to fix the problem. Of the 11 trips 6 have required three trips to fix the problem. Of the 6 trips two problems still are not fixed and waiting for parts. Of all the items gone wrong only 5 problems were related to the engine. We bought the CRD on Sept. 29, 2005. The Lemon Law in Missouri is only covered for one year from the date you buy the vehicle. I have not been without the vehicle more than 2 days total. I have become very well educated on all the DCX booklets on all the DCX vehicles. I think day time TV is an insult to any person with morals. I have come to know the service writers by first name, of three DCX 5 Star dealers, and several of the Tec's. I am sick of waiting rooms, and the salespersons offering me to test drive new vehicles! Just to give you an idea the nearest dealer is 45 miles away, and the one who seems to know more about what they are doing is a Dodge dealer which is 65 miles away.
    Has anyone else become so sick and tired of Customer Care telling you "I am so sorry for your inconviense"! If there is a vehicle made on this earth that actually takes care of the problems the first time, Please tell me what it is! I have bought 13 DCX vehicles in the last 11 years. I don't think it makes a tinkers dam!
    (can you tell this is one of my bad mood days?) Call it a senior citizens just yacking at the wind day.

    Too old, and way farout!
    Farout
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    Farout: You complain too much! Your attitude sucks! So what do you expect anyone in the froum to do about your problems? We have our own problems to take care of! You old people talk to much! Go talk to yourself!!!

    I think I will.......Now I am answering myself.....

    farout
  • steverstever Posts: 52,462
    lol, better be careful or Tidester will email you about being uncivil to yourself. :shades: :shades: :shades:
  • tidestertidester Posts: 10,059
    Farout,

    I must caution you. We do not take kindly to personal attacks on our members -- by anyone! ;)

    tidester, host
    Sorry - Steve MADE me do it!
  • We had hoped that this day would never come for you. It is good for the body and soul to scream. B_H and T-O-D.
  • ABSOLUTELY HYSTERICAL

    I've read your last post three times and have LOL all three! :D

    My saga is similar. I almost traded even for a 4 door Ram 1500 4x4. Alas, it had a Hemi. I read the owners manual and it preferred mid-grade. I woke up. Trading even would still cost me $1000/year more in fuel costs.

    Farout, though different by age, we both have a vehicle that will outrun, outclimb and outpull anything in its class :) ...but it can't pass up a service station... :lemon:

    Thanks for the laugh,
    Boiler
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    boilermaker2: Sometimes we need to sit back and laugh at our situation, and sorta get a better grip. I am glad to expose the more stubborn serious side of me. Who else knows my good points and those less desirable temperaments of my personality than me?
    I have come to the conclusion that the "Green Beast" and me are in competition for whats in my billfold. So far the "Green Beast" is ahead, but I don't give in very easy.
    We have been blessed with rain snow and now ice once again today, but the sun is out!

    Farout
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    Dave: You do not have the market on the "tired old" part! I am not real sure but didn't you get something to replace your CRD? I get a little confused, so if you still have your CRD please excuse me. If you kept it hows it working for you? .....or hod do you like what you replaced it with?

    Farout
  • Farout,

    I have yet to get less than 22mpg in the city and that's driving pretty hard around the Aurora CO area. Especially when most people around here cant seem to go past 43 or 44 in a 45 zone where I just want to do 50 so I can ride in 5th gear instead of hearing the RPMs scream unnecessarily over 2000 trying to sputter around at 45.

    The only other vehicle I have owned that was repairless up to 160k miles was my 2001 Jetta TDI. That thing was a tank. How many thing I hit with it, and what kind of crap did I do to that engine that should have stopped it in its tracks. Still I had a hard time getting that car of get less than 40mpg, I might get 38 if I drove around town in second gear at 3400 rpm. Only prob is we been so blessed with Snow and Ice this year that front wheel drive just doesnt cut it in Parker, Aurora CO area with 36inches in the street every single weekend.

    Love that CRD for what other vehicles cannot do that it can do and go get you a different one before this one makes the rest of your hair fallout. Hell sell Green Beast on Ebay just like all the other Lemons out there, I bet you pull down 20 plus.. ;)
  • Saw your post and wished you the best. Yes, better_half's daily driver (and our road vehicle) is the H3 with the 3.5 Inline 5. Like fine wine it gets better and feels better every trip.
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