Failed to mention. It was HOT in central Oregon. I have black leather in my Fusion. I usually put up sunshade but the angle of the sun was hitting a couple of the seats. I had to sit on a towel. I will be getting my windows tinted in the next few weeks, no doubt. :surprise:
I saw 3 Fusions today on the way home from work! This is the most I have ever seen in one day in about a 30minute commute home. 2 SEL V6's and one looked like an SE I4 that I could tell. Getting my windows tinted on the 28th. I will post new pictures on my carspace that evening for all to see how sharp the Fusion looks with tinted windows. Ford really should tint the Fusions with black leather interior, or darker interior.
I work at a company of over 700 people. I spotted a new Milan Premium V6 in white in our parking lot today. I had to go and take a look. Interior is very nice. Like the two tone leather. Now its time to find out who owns it.. :shades:
I'm eager to see what the hybrid engine option is going to run. And I hope Ford doesn't do like Toyota does with the Camry Hybrid and make it available only in heavily optioned $30K versions.
With all the options including AWD and Nav on the 2007 models, I wonder if the car will start approaching or passing $30K?
It will approach $30k with those options I'm guessing. Ford's navi is typically about $2000 and the AWD is around $1500-$1800 on the Five Hundred and Freestyle. A loaded (every single option available) 2006 Fusion SEL has an MSRP of $26,445. Add $3500-$3800 to that and you're up over $30 MSRP.
Keep in mind that you cannot get AWD on most competing makes/models and that's a pretty big deal IMO. I'd much rather have AWD on a sedan than stability control.
with this Nav system stuff?? Why is NAV so important to make a vehicle stand out? I prefer stability control, AWD, rear camera, rear back-up sensors and alarm, ect..to become an option way over a NAV system. To me its just another toy that will rarely if ever get used.
Because consumers are demanding it. And I'm sure there's some profit there as well.
We don't use our Navigation that often but when we do it's fantastic. We've used it several times when traffic is backed up on I75 - we just get off on the next exit, set preferences to not use major roads and hit HOME.
We don't use maps that often, but when we do it's fantastic. We've used them several times when traffic is backed up - we just open up the map get off on the next exit and find our way using the MAP. :P
There is a ton of profit in it. You can get hand held devices that will do the same thing for between $3-400.
We don't use our Navigation that often but when we do it's fantastic. We've used it several times when traffic is backed up on I75 - we just get off on the next exit, set preferences to not use major roads and hit HOME.
Unless I am several hundred miles from home I know the roads well enough to know the best routes and alternate routes home. The first time I used the nav system I have I used it to go to a friends house downstate. It sent me on the longest least direct route. While all interstate it was the longest way to go.
I also recently used it to go from where I work to my lawyers and it gave out a route that is best on a weekend but murder at rush hour. In short I trust my knowledge of the roads much more than a nav system.
I do have a hand held unit that I think is great and use it a lot for hiking, fishing and the like. Also use it in my car to check the speedometer/odometer. You can also set that hand held to sound an alarm when you get within a certain distance of a way point. I have used that feature to warn me of upcoming exits and known speed traps.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I do, that way I can control how much I make. If I want a little I can make just a little if I want more I just put in more. Plus its just better popcorn than you get in the microwave stuff.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Ok it doesn't...so why are we talking about pop corn?
Navigation is being made available because the system fits in the same hole in as the regular radio. Accordingly, it costs little for Ford to make this available and does add the profitability of the vehicle.
Personally I think a $350 StreetPilot would be a better buy then a $2,000 navigation system.
it goes to ahow ya.. I'm old school. To me personally, Nav is just another very expensive toy I would not use nor need. Once again, this is my personal feeling. I would rather Ford put the money into AWD, rear camera or back-up sensors, stability control, 2 more air bags, a 5 speed V6 availability/option... ect...
I'm with you. I couldn't see myself paying up to two large just for an animated map. And everyone I know who fell for it have used it just a couple of times per year. And have I mentioned that it typically makes using the radio or the AC much more complex and distracting?
With cell-phones now offering GPS navigation for a fraction of the price, in-dash NAV is yet another sad automotive fad.
Just give me a V6, ESP and curtain air-bags instead.
With cell-phones now offering GPS navigation for a fraction of the price,
IIRC cell phones don't use GPS, they use the system signal to determine where you are. That means if you are out of range (like driving in the middle of nowhere) you are out of luck using your cell phones "GPS". Not to mention there is a monthly fee for that use and in the course of two years will easily be more expensive than many car GPS systems.
I'll stick with my little hand held one.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
There are some cell phones with built-in GPS and there are cell phones that can connect to an external GPS via bluetooth. More and more phones with built-in GPS are coming. This will be the way to go in the future as they refine and enhance this with newer upcoming versions. Verizon's system can be used for $2.99 a day for those who think they will rarely use it.
It is $9.99 per month otherwise and you always have the latest maps (no need to purchase yearly updates to keep current) and you have an up to the minute live database of POIs it can route you to rather than the incomplete and static POIs in both built-in and other portable GPS units.
and the Verizon phones do have GPS built in. With Verizon, even though the phone has GPS built-in, the cellular network is used to assist the GPS so it can find your initial position much quicker than only using the satellite. Also, to end the need for lots of local storage and memory cards, the POI lookups, maps and directions are streamed over your data connection (so you don't have access to the navigation service if you are out of the network coverage area.) Once you have downloaded the route, you could conceivably continue being routed via the built-in GPS even if you lost the data connection by using the cached info (as long as you don't go off course and require re routing).
I don't use that service, but it looks good. I probably would have tried it if it came out before I bought the system I have now. I have a 2125 smartphone, Mapopolis navigation software and a BT-359 bluetooth GPS and it all works well and doesn't depend on the cellular network, but it took more effort to get everything installed and working than most people want to put into it.
I do like that it's all integrated in a normal-sized phone(phone, MP3 player, EDGE web access, navigation system etc.) and I carry the phone around with me anyway so I don't need to worry about hiding a portable GPS unit and iPod in the car. The bluetooth receive is probably smaller than an iPod Nano and could be hidden under something as small as a folded paper napkin or just kept on you in your shirt pocket. It works on batteries at least 11 hours and uses the same mini USB charger as my cell phone, so charging it isn't an issue since I don't need to carry around an extra power adapter. To save battery, it also powers itself off automatically after 10 minutes of nonuse. I can plug the phone into the aux input jack in my car and I have mp3s and the navigation commands simultaneously playing over the car stereo speakers.
Get a job where you're on the road a lot in unfamiliar territory and you'll appreciate nav. Even in familiar areas its useful to gauge how far you are from your destination. They aren't perfect, but it sure beats sitting on the side of the road with a map.
Navigation is not a fad - it's here to stay. The only questions are what features it will provide and how it will be integrated into the vehicle in the future.
We use it 20-30 times per year to find a specific address - something you can't do with a paper map. And no matter where I'm at - even if I don't know where I'm at - I can punch Home and get directions. How do you do that with a map?
We use it 20-30 times per year to find a specific address - something you can't do with a paper map.
Depends on where you are at. Chicago is on a grid system and it extends to many of the southern suburbs. Got an address and you can pinpoint it more exactly than most nave systems.
I can punch Home and get directions. How do you do that with a map?
Its called reading a map. And to tell the truth if you need a nav system to find your way home you need more help than a nav system can give you.
Now if you want all that I know systems that will give you all of that for 15-20% of what they charge for a car nav system. With the added advantage of being able to use them away from your car.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
bottom line: Nav is cool, Nav is modern, if you don't have it your not modern.
Just because I don't have a NEED, nor do I particularly care to pay $2K EXTRA for it, not having Nav doesn't make me not modern, just a sensible shopper!
I think Nav is a great piece of technology, and if it's a benefit to some people, great. I personally don't care for it, and don't see any logic to have it bundled into option packages with other features that I may want. I still use maps if I need to, and traffic isn't much of an issue in my day-to-day life.
Most people walk into a showroom floor to see the top of the line model, and then end up buying a base or mid-range. That top of the line model is what made them come into the dealership. You need a nav for that.
I take exception to this as well, considering that most car shoppers I know do all their research and pricing online, then hit the dealer to buy what THEY want, not what the dealer can sell them. Besides, with Nav and all the other technology items offered, you either get a car with 58 buttons on the dashboard, adding unnecessary steps to simple adjustments (look at M-B), or get a piece-of-crap interface system that also complicates commands and needs a dictionary-sized manual and a few hundred hours just to figure it out (BMW's famous iDrive comes to mind, as well as Audi).
You misquoted my question. I said how do you get home with a map if you're lost and you don't know where you are? I don't know where you live but here in Atlanta that's not hard to do and outside of the city it's even easier.
I never said it was the most cost effective solution, just contradicting your statement that it was a fad and unnecessary. How much it's worth is an individual decision.
I said how do you get home with a map if you're lost and you don't know where you are?
Well first of all my hand held which cost 6% of what a cars navigation system costs will tell me where I am. But to be honest I would say that anywhere within 200 miles (maybe 250) of my house (just outside of Chicago) I will not be lost enough where I can't figure out where I am within 5-10 minutes of driving.
just contradicting your statement that it was a fad and unnecessary
It is a fad unless manufacturers come down in their price drastically. Just about everyone I know who uses navigation systems bought theirs aftermarket for a fraction of the cost of what the manufacturers sell theirs for.
How much it's worth is an individual decision.
There gets to be a point that its not really a personal decision. Why would anyone get a system for $2,000 when they can buy another system that is just as good, will do the exact same thing for between $300-$700?
Nav systems that come in cars is a waste of money plain and simple.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Nav systems that come in cars is a waste of money plain and simple.
You said navigation was a fad and overpriced and unnecessary - period. You never qualified it as only applying to factory units. That's a slightly different argument.
a) prices for factory units will drop as more and more vehicles offer it making it more competitive
b) factory units are integrated with the vehicle making them easier to control (larger screen, integrated audio, steering wheel controls, etc.) and better looking
Some people will prefer the portables, others will prefer the factory unit (and are willing to pay for it) and still others don't want it at all.
That's why it's called an option - you can have it any way you want it.
Just wanted to share, one time I cursed a word at the Nav system and it shut off. It was done on purpose, go figure.
For my use, the factory NAV is perfect. Mapquest won't correct the mistake, plus if your in route and you need to make a detour, "Mapquest" wont be there to correct it, or head you onto the new route.
IN the new city I'm at, it's all named streets, which circle every which way. It also helpd at night where you can't really see the street cut, YET it's telling you "Turn right" (so you know your feet from it).
System also mutes the front speakers, when the assistant speaks, for clarity.
I can touchkey directly and enter the information, whereas some other aftermarket units you have to twirl the joystick and move around, to pick the correct letter, which I found frustrating.
Of course integration is a big part which I prefer it, don't like having extra wires, or things perched above the dashboard, all un-tidy and such, or extra adapters needed.
Comments
No sign of a "Problems and Solutions" thread for Fusion as of yet. Not bad for a brand new design being out almost a year.
http://media.ford.com/
BTW, when I read triplets I was thinking Fusion/Milan/Mazda6...so maybe these are actually quadruplets.
Fusion/13,691/71,089
Milan/3,194/17,462
Zephyr/2,264/15,672
Total/19,149/104,223
Mazda6 5323/37,266 June/ytd
And the add-on keypad doesn't seem to be as secure or as integrated...anyway, on with the non-keypadded Fusion/Milan discussion!
Getting my windows tinted on the 28th. I will post new pictures on my carspace that evening for all to see how sharp the Fusion looks with tinted windows. Ford really should tint the Fusions with black leather interior, or darker interior.
or "So how do you like the new Hummer?" "Was that Hummer comfortable?"
OH WAIT this is the Ford Fusion forum...sorry. I just saw those Hummer posts and thought that was the topic.
Mark.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Ford Fusion/Mercury Milan: Warranty/Extended Warranty
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
It will approach $30k with those options I'm guessing. Ford's navi is typically about $2000 and the AWD is around $1500-$1800 on the Five Hundred and Freestyle. A loaded (every single option available) 2006 Fusion SEL has an MSRP of $26,445. Add $3500-$3800 to that and you're up over $30 MSRP.
Keep in mind that you cannot get AWD on most competing makes/models and that's a pretty big deal IMO. I'd much rather have AWD on a sedan than stability control.
We don't use our Navigation that often but when we do it's fantastic. We've used it several times when traffic is backed up on I75 - we just get off on the next exit, set preferences to not use major roads and hit HOME.
There is a ton of profit in it. You can get hand held devices that will do the same thing for between $3-400.
We don't use our Navigation that often but when we do it's fantastic. We've used it several times when traffic is backed up on I75 - we just get off on the next exit, set preferences to not use major roads and hit HOME.
Unless I am several hundred miles from home I know the roads well enough to know the best routes and alternate routes home. The first time I used the nav system I have I used it to go to a friends house downstate. It sent me on the longest least direct route. While all interstate it was the longest way to go.
I also recently used it to go from where I work to my lawyers and it gave out a route that is best on a weekend but murder at rush hour. In short I trust my knowledge of the roads much more than a nav system.
I do have a hand held unit that I think is great and use it a lot for hiking, fishing and the like. Also use it in my car to check the speedometer/odometer. You can also set that hand held to sound an alarm when you get within a certain distance of a way point. I have used that feature to warn me of upcoming exits and known speed traps.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I do, that way I can control how much I make. If I want a little I can make just a little if I want more I just put in more. Plus its just better popcorn than you get in the microwave stuff.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Navigation is being made available because the system fits in the same hole in as the regular radio. Accordingly, it costs little for Ford to make this available and does add the profitability of the vehicle.
Personally I think a $350 StreetPilot would be a better buy then a $2,000 navigation system.
Mark.
Well before you say that put one of those Jiffy Pop things under your hood before your drive home today and see what happens.
Personally I think a $350 StreetPilot would be a better buy then a $2,000 navigation system.
Agreed, But I do well with my little $130 Magellan.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I'm not much of a popcorn fan, but last time my wife made herself some she did it that way.
With cell-phones now offering GPS navigation for a fraction of the price, in-dash NAV is yet another sad automotive fad.
Just give me a V6, ESP and curtain air-bags instead.
IIRC cell phones don't use GPS, they use the system signal to determine where you are. That means if you are out of range (like driving in the middle of nowhere) you are out of luck using your cell phones "GPS". Not to mention there is a monthly fee for that use and in the course of two years will easily be more expensive than many car GPS systems.
I'll stick with my little hand held one.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
More and more phones with built-in GPS are coming.
This will be the way to go in the future as they refine and enhance this with newer upcoming versions.
Verizon's system can be used for $2.99 a day for those who think they will rarely use it.
http://support.vzw.com/swf/vz_nav/verizon_navigator_demo.html
It is $9.99 per month otherwise and you always have the latest maps (no need to purchase yearly updates to keep current) and you have an up to the minute live database of POIs it can route you to rather than the incomplete and static POIs in both built-in and other portable GPS units.
Could you give the models? My guess is that these are rather expensive to get.
Verizon uses their system and is not true GPS.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
and the Verizon phones do have GPS built in. With Verizon, even though the phone has GPS built-in, the cellular network is used to assist the GPS so it can find your initial position much quicker than only using the satellite. Also, to end the need for lots of local storage and memory cards, the POI lookups, maps and directions are streamed over your data connection (so you don't have access to the navigation service if you are out of the network coverage area.)
Once you have downloaded the route, you could conceivably continue being routed via the built-in GPS even if you lost the data connection by using the cached info (as long as you don't go off course and require re routing).
I don't use that service, but it looks good. I probably would have tried it if it came out before I bought the system I have now.
I have a 2125 smartphone, Mapopolis navigation software and a BT-359 bluetooth GPS and it all works well and doesn't depend on the cellular network, but it took more effort to get everything installed and working than most people want to put into it.
I do like that it's all integrated in a normal-sized phone(phone, MP3 player, EDGE web access, navigation system etc.) and I carry the phone around with me anyway so I don't need to worry about hiding a portable GPS unit and iPod in the car. The bluetooth receive is probably smaller than an iPod Nano and could be hidden under something as small as a folded paper napkin or just kept on you in your shirt pocket. It works on batteries at least 11 hours and uses the same mini USB charger as my cell phone, so charging it isn't an issue since I don't need to carry around an extra power adapter. To save battery, it also powers itself off automatically after 10 minutes of nonuse.
I can plug the phone into the aux input jack in my car and I have mp3s and the navigation commands simultaneously playing over the car stereo speakers.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Overpaying for something you will hardly ever use is cool? Let me correct your statement.
bottom line: Nav is a fad.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
We use it 20-30 times per year to find a specific address - something you can't do with a paper map. And no matter where I'm at - even if I don't know where I'm at - I can punch Home and get directions. How do you do that with a map?
Depends on where you are at. Chicago is on a grid system and it extends to many of the southern suburbs. Got an address and you can pinpoint it more exactly than most nave systems.
I can punch Home and get directions. How do you do that with a map?
Its called reading a map. And to tell the truth if you need a nav system to find your way home you need more help than a nav system can give you.
Now if you want all that I know systems that will give you all of that for 15-20% of what they charge for a car nav system. With the added advantage of being able to use them away from your car.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Just because I don't have a NEED, nor do I particularly care to pay $2K EXTRA for it, not having Nav doesn't make me not modern, just a sensible shopper!
I think Nav is a great piece of technology, and if it's a benefit to some people, great. I personally don't care for it, and don't see any logic to have it bundled into option packages with other features that I may want. I still use maps if I need to, and traffic isn't much of an issue in my day-to-day life.
Most people walk into a showroom floor to see the top of the line model, and then end up buying a base or mid-range. That top of the line model is what made them come into the dealership. You need a nav for that.
I take exception to this as well, considering that most car shoppers I know do all their research and pricing online, then hit the dealer to buy what THEY want, not what the dealer can sell them. Besides, with Nav and all the other technology items offered, you either get a car with 58 buttons on the dashboard, adding unnecessary steps to simple adjustments (look at M-B), or get a piece-of-crap interface system that also complicates commands and needs a dictionary-sized manual and a few hundred hours just to figure it out (BMW's famous iDrive comes to mind, as well as Audi).
I never said it was the most cost effective solution, just contradicting your statement that it was a fad and unnecessary. How much it's worth is an individual decision.
Well first of all my hand held which cost 6% of what a cars navigation system costs will tell me where I am. But to be honest I would say that anywhere within 200 miles (maybe 250) of my house (just outside of Chicago) I will not be lost enough where I can't figure out where I am within 5-10 minutes of driving.
just contradicting your statement that it was a fad and unnecessary
It is a fad unless manufacturers come down in their price drastically. Just about everyone I know who uses navigation systems bought theirs aftermarket for a fraction of the cost of what the manufacturers sell theirs for.
How much it's worth is an individual decision.
There gets to be a point that its not really a personal decision. Why would anyone get a system for $2,000 when they can buy another system that is just as good, will do the exact same thing for between $300-$700?
Nav systems that come in cars is a waste of money plain and simple.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
You said navigation was a fad and overpriced and unnecessary - period. You never qualified it as only applying to factory units. That's a slightly different argument.
a) prices for factory units will drop as more and more vehicles offer it making it more competitive
b) factory units are integrated with the vehicle making them easier to control (larger screen, integrated audio, steering wheel controls, etc.) and better looking
Some people will prefer the portables, others will prefer the factory unit (and are willing to pay for it) and still others don't want it at all.
That's why it's called an option - you can have it any way you want it.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
There are now portable units about the size of a baseball that give you all the features of the factory systems for about $300....
Plus you can use the portable on your walking tour of NYC.
Mark
For my use, the factory NAV is perfect. Mapquest won't correct the mistake, plus if your in route and you need to make a detour, "Mapquest" wont be there to correct it, or head you onto the new route.
IN the new city I'm at, it's all named streets, which circle every which way. It also helpd at night where you can't really see the street cut, YET it's telling you "Turn right" (so you know your feet from it).
System also mutes the front speakers, when the assistant speaks, for clarity.
I can touchkey directly and enter the information, whereas some other aftermarket units you have to twirl the joystick and move around, to pick the correct letter, which I found frustrating.
Of course integration is a big part which I prefer it, don't like having extra wires, or things perched above the dashboard, all un-tidy and such, or extra adapters needed.
But thats just me....