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Subaru Legacy/Outback 2005+

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Comments

  • I hope these haven't been posted before but I found these two reviews of the new Outback. I think this will be my next new car and I'm waiting impatiently for the U.S. introduction.

    http://editorial.carsales.com.au/mellor/mellor.nsf/story2/93308E8- 7BCBC6C81CA256DB7000D68DF

    http://editorial.carsales.com.au/mellor/mellor.nsf/story2/DE25D25- 1F368246DCA256DD0000269AE
  • subah6subah6 Posts: 34
    I'd love to fly my new Outback H6 over to the States except its right hand drive ha ha ha. Seriously though, I'd love to go over to share some fun with some like minded people who are like us Aussies. You're on my first places to visit list.

    Anyway, I'll report back next week on my driving impressions.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Well, they sell right hand drive Subies here for mail delivery for rural carriers. It is about THE most popular right hand drive vehicle sold in the US!

    Importing a non-US spec car, even for a week or two, though, would no doubt be a VERY expensive proposition. Plus, if the poor thing were from Europe instead of Aussie land, our gas would probably do it in. I understand your petrol is about the only formula in the world even worse than ours!
  • With the newest rumor that we wont see the Legacy turbo until sometime in 2005, I will have to go back to obsessing about a Forester XT. The alternative is to ignore the odo on my '94 Explorer and go into a trance state for two years and thereby imagine I am having a pleasurable driving experience.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    OK, I was late to the chat, what did Patti reveal? The one tibbit that I caught was that it'll run on premium fuel, not surprisingly.

    -juice
  • Sad to hear about curtains not on entry due to cost!

    Glad to hear about full size spare.

    Thinking Honda CR-V, VW Passat wagon, etcetera are closer competition. Definitely the Honda Pilot is closer than the Acura MDX.
  • otis123otis123 Posts: 439
    Read the Australian reviews. Don't know how you go upscale in the US market w/out memory driver seat and power passenger seat (among other goodies)?

    Also, Subaru.... PUT THE DAMN CURTAIN BAGS IN ALL YOUR CARS AND GET IT OVER WITH, ALREADY! Then you can sell safety, safely...

    :-)

    Ralph
  • rangnerrangner Posts: 336
    Juice--why not suprised? I was. Variable valve timing from all other manufacturers doesn't raise the AKI; why should subie's AVCS?

    --Eric
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    So Ralph, tell us how you really feel. ;-)

    Full size spare. Whew. Thanks.

    Some times it's the little things that count.

    Eric: I meant the turbo, will the N/A 2.5l also require premium? That seems like a mistake.

    -juice
  • rangnerrangner Posts: 336
    yeah...I'd expect it on the turbo, but not on the normally aspirated version. They shouldn't mess w/bread and butter. Hopefully it will still use 87.

    Eric
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 28,609
    2005??? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooo

    '07 ML63, '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c, '14 Town&Country Limited; '18 BMW X2. 53-car history and counting!

  • Word is the engine is being refined much more than any current engine, perhaps making this a Phase3, who knows though. They need better efficiency plain and simple and that appears to be a main thing they are working on. To sell the number of vehicles that is projected they need it to be far more efficiency than an XT or even an STi to adequately deal with CAFE and the EPA. So we can only speculate on power figures, but I'd imagine we'll need a 6MT and the 5EAT to help with figures.

    Running pricing figure and if we see a 3-3.5% increase prices should be about $25,995 for the Sedan and about $26,995 for the Wagon of a 2.5GT based on JDM market changes. A Legacy 3.0R Wagon would likely come in around $27,995 with at Sedan at about $1k less. That's using prelim estimates, but if they are even close to that, it looks pretty promising.
  • wrxsoon1wrxsoon1 Posts: 158
    qbrozen (Rob), I'll second that emotion!

    Japan finally get's the Outback! OK, they've always had it just called it the Lancaster.

    www.apexjapan.com

    -Ian
  • Sorry if this is redundant but I just now joined in on this discussion (new Edmunds user).

    I was unhappy to see on the Australian Subaru site that the new turbo Legacy models don't appear to offer a manual transmission. It looks like you can only get a manual on the 2.0 liter flat four.

    Any news on what the official transmission and engine layout will look like when the '05 Legacy hits the United States?

    It never ceases to amaze me why Subaru can't offer a manual tranny in the flat six. What a great engine.

    I can think of nine very popular sedans in the US that come with a manual tranny and a six cylinder engine --- from a variety of manufacturers like Acura, Nissan, Lexus, Audi, BMW, Jaguar, Cadillac, and even Mazda. Why can't Subaru do the same?

    Am I crazy or is Subaru missing the boat with a great opportunity to capture market share? Audi sells a boat load of A4's in the states with Quattro AWD, a 1.8T engine, and a manual tranny. Do you think those buyers are getting the 1.8T because the truly prefer it over the 3.0 V6? No, most are buying that configuration because they can't afford the V6.

    Subaru could easily offer the flat six/6 spd in the legacy for less than what most people end up paying for a comparably equiped 1.8T A4 Quattro 6spd. What a shame!
  • As I'm told and have seen they are bringing a lightweight 6-speed manual without the DCCD (which is STi specific) and some of the race-duty gear that tranny brings along.

    I believe the reason the Aussies and a few others have not gotten a manual transmission is because they are just behind the U.S. abusiveness and their distributors probably figured it wasn't worth it to just bring a 5MT. They are likely to within 12 months or so from the release get a manual version with this lightweight 6MT gearbox which is said to have no problems keeping the power in check. It's coming, but just as the U.S. folks are waiting to hear some word on the new Legacy, um yeah, that's coming too. Just a lot of things in limbo right now.

    Okay, back to padded room after thinging about the wait...
  • they tested the Japanese version and was estimated $29,000. 3150 lb. 270 hp 240 or 250 torqe. and 0-60 6.3 seconds.

    6.3 sec.!?? I was expecting less than 6 seconds.
    Just hope the U.S. version is faster, if not we'll have to fix than. Don't we.

    flash the chip and bigger turbo?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    What, that's not quick enough for ya? ;-)

    We gotta be able to afford insurance on the things.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,788
    6.3 isn't quick enough? Come on... This car is not meant to be an in-your-face street brawler; it's meant to be a GT, which is what it is.

    Bob
  • wrxsoon1wrxsoon1 Posts: 158
    mylegacy - It won't need a bigger turbo, just the chip reflash and open up the exhaust a bit.

    BTW, 6.3's plenty fast for me. Just get it here already!!! I hope there's room in that padded room for me too sube555lgt.

    -Ian
  • hondafriekhondafriek Ottawa CanadaPosts: 2,984
    What does it take to satisfy some people, damn car isn't even here yet , and already its too slow, too pricy,not big enough, still too bland, I give up!

     Cheers Pat.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 28,609
    Isn't that lighter than the forester XT while having more power? so it SHOULD be faster than that.

    Yeah, get it here NOW and we'll decide at that point.

    '07 ML63, '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c, '14 Town&Country Limited; '18 BMW X2. 53-car history and counting!

  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    LOL Pat!

    I'm pretty reasonable. All I want is an 8 seat mininvan/roadster that gets 50mpg on tap water. For free. ;-)

    -juice
  • I'm not quite sure what you're getting at, but I see a Hummer H2 in that link.
  • jlemolejlemole Posts: 345
    But it did come with a pop-up ad for Maxim magazine showing the posterior view of a very scantily-clad women, so at least I can be thankful for that!

    Jon
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 11,104
    I deleted the post since it's not relevant to the Subaru discussion. If you want to check your link and try again, that's fine.

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    Share your vehicle reviews

  • Here's the new 2005 subaru redesigned legacy review that everyone wants from auto express
    go to
    www.autoexpress.co.uk
    then type in the search box subaru legacy review then search for subaru legacy AWD under roadtest.. it seems like it is very sporty but the car still seems short on room thats the biggest problem...
  • akasrpakasrp Posts: 170
    anybody?

    -srp
  • All usdm Legacies and Outbacks are assembled in
    Franklinville, Indiana. that plant has already announced shut down for re-tooling in early March 04. That makes sense; you cant call a new model the 05 model unless you release it after March 15,04. The consensus is that we will see initial production of 2.5 and 3.0 N/A Legacies and Outbacks on the lots by April .
        The turbo is going to be a 2.5 L , not the 2.0 already in asian release. They are still tring to get the engineering fine tuned for acceptable fuel efficiency numbers / CAFE compliance. Ill be surpised if we see it before July. Expect a wide price range from base models to the loaded 3.0's...they need to sell lots of 2.5 N/A's to get average fuel milage within CAFE.
    Mark
  • sebberrysebberry Posts: 148
    Actually, the plant is in Lafayette, Indiana, just to be picky.

    The following link is for the plants website, on the left you can actually tour where your favorite car is made :)

    http://www.subaru-isuzu.com/slide/main_menu.html

    Cheers
  • Here's a link to recent US production news in Indiana for the new models. Sounds like Subaru is as eager to get the new models out as we are to get them.

    http://www.lafayettejc.com/news20031115/200311150local_business10- - 68873041.shtml

    Sebberry, thanks for the plant link. Looks like the new SUV concept is parked in their lobby.
  • subah6subah6 Posts: 34
    I picked up my Outback H6 3.0R (new spec) last Thursday and have driven 500kms already. Any current H6 owners out there are going to love the new H6. The Outbacks have generally been evolutionary, but this latest H6 from the previous model is a GIANT LEAP forward. This motor/auto set up is just awesome. So much power right from when you put your foot on the gas. Exceptionally smooth and very quiet but with a subdued but nice exhaust note.

    A friend of mine (who has a BMW 325 coupe) said it is as good as his but with more power. He also said he won't bother with a BMW next time he'll get a Liberty (Legacy) H6 and pocket AU$35-$40,000 (US$25-$29,000). He was that impressed! He didn't want to stop driving it.

    The cabin fit out is excellent and very modern and the seats are more comfortable than last model. The dash is well designed and also the interior light accentuations which light up the various switches in red is very nice.

    Brilliant car! I can see why the Outback's stablemate the Liberty/Legacy got japan's car of the year.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    OK, I'm green with envy. I already like the H6, so a giant leap sounds pretty good to me!

    -juice
  • Thanks for correcting me...now I wonder who makes cars in Franklinville and which state that is in?

    I think the "crossover'car in the lobby is an Isuzu Axiom, not a new Subaru 7 seater. That would be too easy.

    Subah6...congrats on the new OB! Please post your impressions on the new OB, features, ride quality, fit and finish, performance. Dont leave out the problem areas in your enthusiam ;-).

    Mark ( very envious)
  • subah6subah6 Posts: 34
    Mark,

    I have very few problems with the new H6. The interior colour (English spelling of colour) of the H6 (not the 2.5's as they are black interior) is a cream colour which is not conducive for keeping clean, so I'll have to be careful! Another problem is the trip computer selection button which is a scroll through selection process in one direction. In other words, you have to keep pressing the button to scroll through all the various functions of the trip computer. With each press you go from:
    1) Km's/litre (for the US it will be probably mpg)
    2) Average km's/litre (Ave mpg) since last trip button reset.
    3) km's left to go in tank at ave consumption
    4) Elapsed time since you last turned on the car
    5) Outside temp
    It would be nice if they had an up/down function button rather than just the one button which you have to scroll through to access all the functions.
    The centre console covered storage bin has a power outlet socket in it, which is fine, but when you put CD's it it now they rock (no pun intended) side to side when going around corners as the socket takes up space in the console box and thus leaves a gap.
    Other than that they have thought out the dash, switches and various functions of all these areas very well.
    Remember, "one man's meat is another man's poison", so what I like/dislike may/will be different from someone elses like/dislikes.
  • akasrpakasrp Posts: 170
    do the whole proud parent thing. would love some real world photos if/when you can....

    _srp
  • and keep posting reports as you discover new things about your 3.0 Outback.the scroll-down computer sounds exactly like that on my wife's Audi A6..Ive tried to remember to play with it at the stop lights or in te driveway, so I dont have my eyes off the road for as long as it takes to find the screen you want.
    The light leather interior looks great in the pics. It might be harder to keep clean, but Ive discovered that the tan leather in my 94 explorer is a lot cleaner than the gray leather in my wife's 99 audi..its all about who drives the car and picks up behind the kids !

    mark ( now more envious!)
  • sebberrysebberry Posts: 148
    I just noticed that in the SIA Virtual gallery the nose from a 1990 Legacy

    http://www.subaru-isuzu.com/qtvr/index.htm.

    If you click on that it brings up a Quicktime VR tour, Drag to the right until you see the front of the Legacy, and zoom in (hold the shift key). Read the sticker on the windshield. Could that be the very first US made Legacy?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    That info would be cool on a road trip. To see the real-time mileage at different speeds, I mean.

    -juice
  • Congrats on your H^- Subah6. I am excited about the trip computer- my partners' Passat has the trip computer and it actually proves useful.

    Just a few questions that I have:
    - Are the window panels (window up/down and power locks) lit up on all doors? Only the driver door window button lights up now.

    - Are their driver seat memory settings?

    Thanks!
  • subah6subah6 Posts: 34
    akasrp,

    Not good at posting pics. Where do I post them to?

    Subawannabe,

    The carpet is also light coloured, but I got around that by buying the black Outback carpet mats (from the 2.5lt version which has a black interior) which match the dash top of the H6 which is black. Gives a nice two tone effect which is actually quite effective. I like it better than using the correct light coloured carpet mats and easy to keep clean to boot (no pun intended)

    Pathtomax,

    The window up/down buttons (all doors) have a small light on them that illuminates when the lights are turned on. It is about 3/16" x 1/16" on the switch and lights up red like all the other highlite lights. Looks very effective and upmarket. I guess like the Audi's & BMW's. These highlite lights are on all the audio buttons, climate control buttons etc etc.
    I forgot to say that my standard spec doesn't come with a power drivers seat either. I definitely don't miss it from the old H6 as it was slow. My wife is shorter than me and it was always a pain to move the seat after she drove it as it took so long to move. The new H6 premium I'm sure does not have memory on the seat, but you never know the US may get memory.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I'll host any photos, just e-mail to me, it's in my profile. Any format, I can convert to JPEG.

    If you could, try to show the things people have been asking about.

    -juice
  • otis123otis123 Posts: 439
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    E-mail 'em to me, the address is in my profile. I'll host them the same day.

    -juice
  • redkey1redkey1 Posts: 270
    There are some great pics of the subaru liberty (legacy), however I can't beleive how expensive they are! A top of the line GT premium is $55990 AUD, which echanges to $41k USD!!!!! There is no way that would float in the US....that is more than a 330xi. Any ideas how much they will run over here?
  • subah6subah6 Posts: 34
    redkey1,

    Don't forget we have an import duty of 15% on cars and there is a luxury tax that kicks in at AU$50,000 or there abouts, so these two put the price up a bit. You cannot compare our prices (Australian) to the US prices as it depends on what the Yen/US$ exchange is and how Subaru will price it for the US market. Also are the GT's going to be made locally in the US? This will make a big difference to the price.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    US prices tend to be lower. Lower than UK, even compared to Canada, with a weaker currency.

    -juice
  • sebberrysebberry Posts: 148
    Congratulations on the new H6!!

    I have a few questions here for you...

    First,
    I asked quite a while ago and didn't notice if you had responded.

    I find the current H6 to be fairly roomy for me, 6'2, 220lbs, with the seat all the way back, I am a perfect distance from the wheel. How does the legroom in the new model compare to the old current one? More specifically, the distance from the steering wheel to the pedals, as my knee keeps hitting the wheel.

    Second, how much more expensive (%) is the new H6 over the previous one? (MSRP). I know that exchange rates and pricing is different for each country, but it might give us some guidelines as to how much more we can expect it to be.

    Third, how do you find the steering? Is is still fairly heavy like the current version or has it been boosted a little more? Personally, I like the heavier feel, I feel more connected to the car and it feels more accurate.

    Fourth, what is the quality of the audio system like? (I assume you don't have the McIntosh system?) How does it compare to the current one? Is the speaker setup similar?

    Lastly, how easy are the climate controls to operate being lower down and in front of the gear selector?

    Okay, enough questions for now, I'll let you answer.

    Cheers!
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Good news, I have it from a very reliable source that the US-spec Legacy GT will be shown in Detroit.

    My guess is the Outback will be shown in LA. I'm dying to see the 7 seater, but no word on that one. I hope we don't have to wait until April, at the NY Show.

    -juice
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