"That seems to be the new design rage among all manufacturers."
Not exactly -- most manufacturers have placed the shifter on the dash, but a lot farther down near where it usually resides. This is the first on-dash shifter I've seen up where the radio normally resides. Look again and compare it with the others.
What I meant is that many manufacturers are moving gear levers (both auto and stick) closer and into the dash area.
The location in the Wish is a few inches higher but since it's an auto as opposed to the stick in the Mazda, I'm not sure it's a valid comparison. Find a pick of a Wish stick and compare.
The CRV auto is way up in the dash and the stick is down low so there's no guarantee the stick in the Wish is in the same location.
Meade..I'm sure if Toyota were to put in a 5 speed shifter in the WISH that it will be done right. Remember you're talking Toyota!!
The Stream probably is being discontinued and replaced by the Edix/FR-V. Unfortunately nothing has been stated about the WISH or any other 6/7 passenger vehicles made overseas will be coming to NA. That's why I hope that the M5 does sell to bring the WISH and others to compete. I for one would love to have a WISH!
(1) First, I haven't seen any manufacturer redesign the dash to accommodate different transmission sticks. If the automatic's in the dash, I don't think the manual will be in the floor.
(2) Toyota is NOT the end-all to car design. I spent a good hour behind the wheel of a friend's Matrix not too long ago. I could not find a good seating arrangement; either the wheel or the pedals were too far away. The steering was unresponsive and the car accelerated like the '88 Hyundai Excel I owned in college. (BTW, this is coming from a guy whose first car was a Corolla and I loved every minute in it, so don't think I'm a Toyota basher.)
(3) Again, this is the Mazda5 discussion, not a "Mazda5 vs. X" discussion. Now, I'll be the first to admit that I'm guilty of joining in the latest off-topic diversion. But let's try and get back to discussing the 5, OK? I'm very interested in what Mazda's bringing here in a few short months, and I'd like to read more about this discussion's namesake than info about cars I can't buy unless I move to Japan or the UK.
The only thing we have to compare the Mazda5 with is the Matrix/Vibe and maybe the PT cruiser. So I have to agree these comparisons to non-NA offerings are moot. I have driven the Mazda3 and it is the best car in it's class and the Mazda5 is the same car with a volume-ized body, stretched wheelbase and a reprogrammed engine.
Speaking of more power, the obvious way to do this is with direct injection (ultra high pressure FI with clever injection timing) which boosts hp and increases MPG. The Civic gets this in 06 and the Mazdaspeed6 has it on the pumped-up 2.3.
TRACTION CONTROL PLEASE!
My only hope is that we get traction control. With all the additional weight going to the rear it seems traction control is a no-brainer. Since they already have ALB and EBD, it shouold be a piece of cake, but I have seen no indication they will do it, the braking features are straight out of the Mazda3 and that has no traction control. I am almost sold on the 5 but I have some definite traction requirements (albeit occasional) but it's enough to make me reconsider 4WD if we don't get traction control.
Without any more concrete information from Mazda, there isn't much more to talk about so I guess we can't help but get off topic, and dream about the Toyota Wish and other non-US market vehicles.
I tried e-mailing the mazdausa.com site and they couldn't give me any information - I asked for specifics about:
- DSC
- the lack of an armrest on the front passenger seat
- whether or not the NA version will allow you to walk through from the front row to the back or if there's a console in the way
I think it has been stated somewhere that the M5 will have stability control. I don't think I've seen any car that has stability, but not traction, control.
For me personally, if they somehow engineer it without traction control, it would be a deal-breaker for me.
"Given the relatively narrow width of the vehicle, it may be difficult to offer a walk-thru for non-anorexic customers. "
Geez, I'm thin and can fit into many small spaces, but I'm far from anorexic. If that's a typical opinion, then we may as well say that SUVs are designed for the obese, as that would be equally myopic.
I noticed Mazda3 NA has EBD but no DSC and no traction control, in the rest of the world it has DSC option which definitely does incorporate traction control as stated.
Mazda5 (Premacy) has DSC in Japan and I hope we do get it. Otherwise it may be a deal breaker for me as well.
BTW the Mazda Japan Premacy site has a lot of new goodies (excuse me if this is old news). There is a concept movie apparently aimed at the Aussie, New Zealand markets. Also some interior measurements if you look around enough. Also a little DSC graphic "movie".
"For safety's sake, front, side, and curtain airbags are standard. Disc brakes do the stopping, and are supported by anti-lock and electronic brake distribution systems. The 2006 Mazda5 also includes stability control as standard equipment."
This standard equipment list which includes traction control, (stability control, by definition, includes traction control), is only currently offered by Mazda in the US on the RX-8, (no 3 or 6 has this available even as an option). Stability control is being shown to be an extremely important safety feature in avoiding accidents, especially rollovers. This is especially true in higher profile vehicles like the Mazda5. It's a must on my next vehicle shopping list.
The Mazda press release from early January on triplezoom.com mentions DSC but doesn't state whether or not it's an option.
However, a copy of the press release on Ford's media web site does not. Neither does the Mazdausa.com preview site nor the brochure given out at the auto shows.
Check out the new Mazda Premacy web site, in case you haven't:
Autoblog.com has preview pictures of this crossover today which replaces the Neon. It breaks cover next month at the Geneva show. 2.4L engine, seats five, swing out doors.
Keep in mind that this vehicle is the same width as the Mazda3. Therefore, it would be logical to extrapolate that the distance between the front seats is the same as in the 3, and equally logical to assume that the middle-row seats are basically copies of the front seats.
So ...
Could you easily walk between the front seats in a Mazda3 (assuming, of course, that the center armrest and console weren't there)? What is that width, about six to eight inches?
I don't think so, especially remembering that this vehicle will only have four or five inches' greater headroom than a 3 sedan. The "sideways stoop 'n squeeze" you'd have to perform to do it would be next to impossible, I'd think.
Besides, whatcha doin' walking around inside a car anyway? Shouldn't you have your seatbelt on?
My wife used to "walk" between the seats of my old Dodge Spirit to get to the fold-down rear seat access into the trunk. Now she does it in the CR-V and 1st gen Odyssey we own. Usually she is looking for something from the cooler or trying to get something for the kids. Yeah, she's supposed to wear her seatbelt, but sometimes it's easier to do that than pull over on the highway.
Your wife got out of her front seat, wiggled her way into the back seat, and then folded down a back seat and groped around in the TRUNK of your sedan ... ALL WHILE YOU DROVE DOWN THE HIGHWAY???
I remember when we had our 1st generation CR-V, it was no picnic using the walk-thru. Invariably you would end up elbowing someone in the head, tripping over the parking brake, hitting your head on the ceiling, or all of the above. And we're not large people by any means. I think for kids it would be OK. My son loved the walk-thru on the CR-V.
But it is slightly safer than if she had made like James Bond, climbed out onto the roof, slither along the roof to the back, and unlatched the trunk while grasping the rain rails with her feet.
It's not something I would want to do routinely, and I don't in my Sienna. But's it's something I'd like in case of an urgent problem or emergency with one of the kids.
Autoblog is speculating that the Opel Zafira is coming to the US as a Saturn - is there a thread here on that yet?
Subaru sells a clone in Japan they call the Traviq. But I'd rather not see any rebadged GM vehicles sold as Subaru here. It doesn't offer AWD or a boxer engine.
In Brazil the Zafira was mildly successful but it's older now. Competitors have surpassed it.
I've been saying for years that Saturn should bring over the Zafira. It fits their brand character much better than the Relay. Unfortunately, it was too expensive to build and bring over at European exchange rates, so it would have to be priced too close to the Venture/Caravan/Freestar. Maybe the Brazil/Thailand built ones would meet the required price points.
I was at the Toronto Auto Show Media Day today and they showed the Mazda5. They announced pricing starting from CAN$19,900! There was gasp of shock as people realized that was much lower than expected. It's a great deal on a great car. Most of the buzz suggested the 5 was one of the show highlights.
BTW: It was the same vehicle/colour as shown in Detroit, and the brochure was a simplified version of the one handed out at NAIAS.
Interesting. From the perceptions I have formed hanging out in Town hall, I figured that the 5 was likely to be a smash hit in Canada (assuming it was priced right), even if it bombed in the US (not that I think it will).
Too bad they didn't have one at the Phila. auto show. I'm real curious to see this van-ette.
Probably wouldn't have gotten one instead of an Odyssey (it is the wifes car after all), but the stick shift would have been a big lure..
If I could have a do over, I might get the 5 for myself, and let her have a nice sedan, assuming we could cram all our junk in the 5.
...because it implies that an automatic-equipped 5 in the US would have a hard time breaking the $20k barrier. This would make things very interesting, if true...
MPV starts at CAN$27,595 for the GX, but I'm sure there's lots of rebates available.
Note as well that the $19,995 for the base model does not include things like AC. Add AC+auto and the price will start to rise.
It's worth noting DCX is offering PT Cruisers starting at CAN$15,998 and short WB Caravans for $19,998. Sure, the PT carries one less person, but as a microvan it is priced competitively and Consumer Reports says its quality isn't bad.
I thought that the US Mazda5 Sport was going to start at $18K and that would be slightly better equipped than the GS - 17" wheels, side airbags, cruise control standard. Add shipping, AC, and automatic and MSRP would hit $20k easily.
No mention of DSC from what I've read, though. Maybe MY2007 as I'm not in a rush to buy.
Yes, there has been a bit of de-contenting for Canada. When I looked at the US and Cdn brochures I saw that the base model in Cda loses AC and moves from 17" rims to 16". However, we get the all-important rocker sill extenders on the base model! Must be to keep the snow off of us.
...that anyone from Mazda has 5 minutes to spend reading this forum, and doubt even more seriously that anything they might read has any influence whatsoever on how much they choose to charge for this or any other car.
Pricing will be driven, as it always is, by the combination of where the perceived competition is, and the company's cost of doing business.
most car makers patrol the internet and various sites to watch what people are saying....but, like you, I seriously doubt that anything on the internet is going to cause the mfg to change it's pricing plans.
car makers are aware that if they overprice a car they can easily and quickly adjust with rebates and incentives. It's not as easy to make adjustments if they under price the car.
Not sure what to make of this yet as my Japanese is not too good, but it seems like Honda has a redesigned Stream(Latitude) on the horizon. The front looks similar to the refreshening of the Stream a year ago or so but the side/back is completely different. Here's a link to a few pictures: http://www.auto-g.jp/news/200502/18/topics08/index.html
Thanks Wheelz4 -- that looks quite sharp. Honda needs a junior Odyssey, and if the Mazda5 does well, maybe they will bring it over. From the photo, the Stream looks bigger than the previous one.
Here's the new Zafira, about to be launched in Geneva. It is about the same size as the Mazda5. Postings on other forums say/hope that this Zafira will come as a Saturn. This could work as Saturn has embraced the Opel design aesthetic. It would be much nicer than the Relay. Euro engines range from a diesel to a 200hp turbo. We'd likely get an Ecotec. The roof-mounted storage system is a cool idea, but I wonder how well it will hold up to wear and tear. http://www.autoindex.org/news.plt?no=1075
Mazda has the '5' on display at the Canadian Intl Autoshow in Toronto. While it is on a small turntable, and you can not sit in it, you can still get very close, and get a good look inside. With the rear seats occupied there is very little room for anything other than a few grocery bags, think Mini Cooper storage, maybe smaller. However with even one of the rear seats folded it opens up a fair bit of space. It appears to be perfect for a family like mine, Mom, Dad, two small kids, with the need once a month or so to pick up grandma. Prices in Canada will start at about 19,900.00, not including a/c, so around 22,000.00 with auto and air. Bravo to Mazda for taking a chance with this vehicle, and I predict it will sell very well here in Canada.
Comments
Not exactly -- most manufacturers have placed the shifter on the dash, but a lot farther down near where it usually resides. This is the first on-dash shifter I've seen up where the radio normally resides. Look again and compare it with the others.
http://www.triplezoom.com/gallery/generated//01%20Mazda/Mazda5/03- - - - - 8__scaled_600.jpg
http://www.carview.co.jp/magazine/photo_impression/toyota_wish/03- - .asp
Meade
The location in the Wish is a few inches higher but since it's an auto as opposed to the stick in the Mazda, I'm not sure it's a valid comparison. Find a pick of a Wish stick and compare.
The CRV auto is way up in the dash and the stick is down low so there's no guarantee the stick in the Wish is in the same location.
The Stream probably is being discontinued and replaced by the Edix/FR-V. Unfortunately nothing has been stated about the WISH or any other 6/7 passenger vehicles made overseas will be coming to NA. That's why I hope that the M5 does sell to bring the WISH and others to compete. I for one would love to have a WISH!
(1) First, I haven't seen any manufacturer redesign the dash to accommodate different transmission sticks. If the automatic's in the dash, I don't think the manual will be in the floor.
(2) Toyota is NOT the end-all to car design. I spent a good hour behind the wheel of a friend's Matrix not too long ago. I could not find a good seating arrangement; either the wheel or the pedals were too far away. The steering was unresponsive and the car accelerated like the '88 Hyundai Excel I owned in college. (BTW, this is coming from a guy whose first car was a Corolla and I loved every minute in it, so don't think I'm a Toyota basher.)
(3) Again, this is the Mazda5 discussion, not a "Mazda5 vs. X" discussion. Now, I'll be the first to admit that I'm guilty of joining in the latest off-topic diversion. But let's try and get back to discussing the 5, OK? I'm very interested in what Mazda's bringing here in a few short months, and I'd like to read more about this discussion's namesake than info about cars I can't buy unless I move to Japan or the UK.
Respectfully,
Meade
Speaking of more power, the obvious way to do this is with direct injection (ultra high pressure FI with clever injection timing) which boosts hp and increases MPG. The Civic gets this in 06 and the Mazdaspeed6 has it on the pumped-up 2.3.
TRACTION CONTROL PLEASE!
My only hope is that we get traction control. With all the additional weight going to the rear it seems traction control is a no-brainer. Since they already have ALB and EBD, it shouold be a piece of cake, but I have seen no indication they will do it, the braking features are straight out of the Mazda3 and that has no traction control. I am almost sold on the 5 but I have some definite traction requirements (albeit occasional) but it's enough to make me reconsider 4WD if we don't get traction control.
I tried e-mailing the mazdausa.com site and they couldn't give me any information - I asked for specifics about:
- DSC
- the lack of an armrest on the front passenger seat
- whether or not the NA version will allow you to walk through from the front row to the back or if there's a console in the way
- 3rd row LATCH connectors (or not)
- 2nd row fold down tray tables (or not)
- power sliding doors
- rear DVD
For me personally, if they somehow engineer it without traction control, it would be a deal-breaker for me.
Given the relatively narrow width of the vehicle, it may be difficult to offer a walk-thru for non-anorexic customers.
Geez, I'm thin and can fit into many small spaces, but I'm far from anorexic. If that's a typical opinion, then we may as well say that SUVs are designed for the obese, as that would be equally myopic.
I noticed Mazda3 NA has EBD but no DSC and no traction control, in the rest of the world it has DSC option which definitely does incorporate traction control as stated.
Mazda5 (Premacy) has DSC in Japan and I hope we do get it. Otherwise it may be a deal breaker for me as well.
BTW the Mazda Japan Premacy site has a lot of new goodies (excuse me if this is old news). There is a concept movie apparently aimed at the Aussie, New Zealand markets. Also some interior measurements if you look around enough. Also a little DSC graphic "movie".
http://www.autobytel.com/content/shared/articles/templates/index.- cfm/article_page_order_int/8/article_id_int/251
"For safety's sake, front, side, and curtain airbags are standard. Disc brakes do the stopping, and are supported by anti-lock and electronic brake distribution systems. The 2006 Mazda5 also includes stability control as standard equipment."
This standard equipment list which includes traction control, (stability control, by definition, includes traction control), is only currently offered by Mazda in the US on the RX-8, (no 3 or 6 has this available even as an option). Stability control is being shown to be an extremely important safety feature in avoiding accidents, especially rollovers. This is especially true in higher profile vehicles like the Mazda5. It's a must on my next vehicle shopping list.
Mark
However, a copy of the press release on Ford's media web site does not. Neither does the Mazdausa.com preview site nor the brochure given out at the auto shows.
Check out the new Mazda Premacy web site, in case you haven't:
http://www.premacy.mazda.co.jp/
So ...
Could you easily walk between the front seats in a Mazda3 (assuming, of course, that the center armrest and console weren't there)? What is that width, about six to eight inches?
I don't think so, especially remembering that this vehicle will only have four or five inches' greater headroom than a 3 sedan. The "sideways stoop 'n squeeze" you'd have to perform to do it would be next to impossible, I'd think.
Besides, whatcha doin' walking around inside a car anyway? Shouldn't you have your seatbelt on?
Meade
http://www.premacy.mazda.co.jp/img/appeal1-p0.jpg
http://www.premacy.mazda.co.jp/img/appeal1-p4.jpg
The site is Flash heavy so I can't link to it directly, but the Karakuri setup we won't be getting in NA is mighty nice:
http://www.premacy.mazda.co.jp/img/appeal1-p1.jpg
http://www.premacy.mazda.co.jp/img/appeal1-p2.jpg
Use their measurements and see what you have left to "walk" between.
Good Lord, man!!!
Meade
I remember when we had our 1st generation CR-V, it was no picnic using the walk-thru. Invariably you would end up elbowing someone in the head, tripping over the parking brake, hitting your head on the ceiling, or all of the above. And we're not large people by any means. I think for kids it would be OK. My son loved the walk-thru on the CR-V.
But it is slightly safer than if she had made like James Bond, climbed out onto the roof, slither along the roof to the back, and unlatched the trunk while grasping the rain rails with her feet.
Autoblog is speculating that the Opel Zafira is coming to the US as a Saturn - is there a thread here on that yet?
In Brazil the Zafira was mildly successful but it's older now. Competitors have surpassed it.
-juice
Isn't that what we do all day here? LOL
-juice
Isn't that what we do all day here? LOL
Ah I see. We spend the day sharing what I call cocktail party fodder which results in Jeopardy brain!!
Dirt cheap, too. Priced below a Civic.
-juice
BTW: It was the same vehicle/colour as shown in Detroit, and the brochure was a simplified version of the one handed out at NAIAS.
What is the base price on an MPV there?
-juice
Too bad they didn't have one at the Phila. auto show. I'm real curious to see this van-ette.
Probably wouldn't have gotten one instead of an Odyssey (it is the wifes car after all), but the stick shift would have been a big lure..
If I could have a do over, I might get the 5 for myself, and let her have a nice sedan, assuming we could cram all our junk in the 5.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Note as well that the $19,995 for the base model does not include things like AC. Add AC+auto and the price will start to rise.
It's worth noting DCX is offering PT Cruisers starting at CAN$15,998 and short WB Caravans for $19,998. Sure, the PT carries one less person, but as a microvan it is priced competitively and Consumer Reports says its quality isn't bad.
No mention of DSC from what I've read, though. Maybe MY2007 as I'm not in a rush to buy.
-juice
This forum is probably a counter-indicator
Jaz
Pricing will be driven, as it always is, by the combination of where the perceived competition is, and the company's cost of doing business.
car makers are aware that if they overprice a car they can easily and quickly adjust with rebates and incentives. It's not as easy to make adjustments if they under price the car.
http://www.auto-g.jp/news/200502/18/topics08/index.html
http://www.canadiandriver.com/news/05toronto/topten.htm
Subaru follows these threads - when the 2003 Forester came out they listed 8 things that were added that we had asked for.
-juice
Here's the new Zafira, about to be launched in Geneva. It is about the same size as the Mazda5. Postings on other forums say/hope that this Zafira will come as a Saturn. This could work as Saturn has embraced the Opel design aesthetic. It would be much nicer than the Relay. Euro engines range from a diesel to a 200hp turbo. We'd likely get an Ecotec. The roof-mounted storage system is a cool idea, but I wonder how well it will hold up to wear and tear. http://www.autoindex.org/news.plt?no=1075