Buying Tips - How Do I Get the Best Deal?

jmonroe

I know the prices for the new vehicles are pretty low so I am willing to go up in price by 4% - 6%. I think this is fair....

OK, I think I’ve composed myself now.

You may think it’s fair but you have to know the going price for the cars.You don’t up your offer at all until you know this. Do your research and you’ll know the price you’ll have to pay. Note, a large part of your research is knowing what the market price is for the cars in your area.

…am I being realistic?

In short you’re not being realistic especially for that Geo. There I go again.

jmonroe

oldfarmer50

"...if I can get $750-1000 for the Geo..."

Edmunds says about $750 private party. $50 as a trade.

isellhondas

I totally disagree with you as to the value of that Geo.

Goes aren't bad cars and the miles aren't all that bad.

What, exactly do you think you can buy for 750-1000 dollars??

Kirstie_H

No kidding. You can't get something that actually runs for less than $1K. It could be a great "beater" for someone with no $. No need to insure that puppy except for the minimum, either.

210delray

I agree with an earlier poster that you can probably do fairly well on a private sale with that Geo Storm (maybe up to $1500 or so if it's in nice condition). They do have a certain style that you can't find on today's cars.

But a dealer taking it in trade (and not "padding" its value to cover a higher transaction price on the new vehicle) is going to give next to nothing for it, I'd think.

As an example, when I bought my '04 Camry, I asked the dealer what he'd pay for my '97 Camry, which was in great condition, but had 111K miles. He said $2000 to $2500. This was on a 7-year old car of the same make. What's a Honda dealer going to give on a 15-year-old GM/Isuzu car?

I sold the '97 Camry on eBay for $4301. That's a fine example of why I haven't traded in a single car since 1978 -- I always sell them myself.

So those dealer ads that state, "if you've got a trade, you've got a deal" really grate on me.

british_rover

Thank you thank you that is what I was trying to explain.

You use the auction to fill up holes in the used car line up not till fill out the entire front line of used cars.

If you start doing this you won't be in business very long.

jetzzs

jb,

Thanks for your reply. There are many detailed reports on Prices Paid/Buying Experience forum of people getting Odysseys for $1000-1700 below invoice (posts #15370, 15355, 15467, 15463, 15469, and 15473 are only a few examples from June). Some even state that there was no trade-in. Are all these people omitting information about their trade-in? :confuse:

Several times I have seen people say that not other dealer in their area was willing to give them the price they were offering. I was wondering--does Honda give different amounts of dealer cash (or other incentive) to dealers that meet specific criteria?

lilengineerboy

When I've purchased used cars from a dealer they always make a point of telling me which cars were "traded in by nice old Mr. Smith who's been buying from us for 30 years".

There is an element of trust you have that I lack with respect to these comments. My favorite is when salespeople will comment on how it was purchased from this dealership yada yada and you can see the burned in outline of the badge for the dealer where it was originally sold, or it will have some sales documentation in the glovebox.

I typically totally disregard those types of comments unless they have paperwork to support it (and that is really nothing personal, I am the same way at work...bring data).

jmonroe

I totally disagree with you as to the value of that Geo.

Then I have to assume that if poster ‘mafinch’ shows up at your store you’ll give $750-$1000 for it.

Go getem ‘mafinch’ this is the guy you’ve been looking for but make sure you don’t get taken on the new car and/or in the F&I office. :surprise:

What, exactly do you think you can buy for 750-1000 dollars??

Well, at your store I couldn’t buy that Geo for $750-$1000 could I unless you would sell it without marking it up. Something tells me that ain’t gonna happen, huh? Futhermore, I already have a couple of throw-aways, why would I want another one?

jmonroe

Kirstie_H

I don't think anyone is advocating trading in at a dealership. This gem is private-party only.

1racefan

This is a private party car if there ever was one.

Gas is expensive, and it's relatively fuel effecient. Kind of low mileage (overall), if it has been properly maintained, and remains maintained, it will probably run until at least 110,000 miles. School will be starting back up next month, and plenty of college and high school kids are looking for rides....I would slap a for sale sign on it and possibly put it in AutoTrader for $1500. I bet you could get $1000 out of it easily. The point is this is NOT a car to be traded in.

jmonroe

I don't think anyone is advocating trading in at a dealership. This gem is private-party only.

Which is why I said awhile back that this car (gem, notice how close to Geo that is?) should be sold outright and shouldn't even be driven to a dealers lot for fear of being charged a parking fee during the negotiating process.

jmonroe

oldfarmer50

"...I typically totally disregard those types of comments..."

So do I. When they say this I say "really? Can I have his address?" If I'm being scammed that will show it.

My point though was not weather to trust a salesman but rather how do you value your trade. If the salesman thinks he can build value by telling you his car is a one owner dealer serviced gem, why is a similar car not worth more as a trade?

asafonov

So do I. When they say this I say "really? Can I have his address?" If I'm being scammed that will show it.

Quite likely, even with a legitimate one-owner trade in, a dealership will not disclose this information due to privacy issues - unless the previous owner gave explicit permission (why would he/she?) This is one thing you get when you trade in - an assurance that a subsequent buyer will not come after you. In a private sale, any "As Is/Where Is" bill-of-sale paperwork notwithstanding, this is may not be the case depending on state law.

(Of course, I am not in the business, so what do I know...)

blufz1

More decor for your yard?

stickguy

I have 1 friend that I know did this. He went to look at a used car that had just arrived (lease turn in). The salesguy was trying to find him one, so friend ended up there within a couple of hours of it arriving on the lot.

Well, at one point he was alone with it, and took a look at the owners manual. The prior owner hadn't bothered to take their info page, so he knew who had it before, so he just called them right then. Not sure if they minded, but they did give him a glowing report on the car, which he proceeded to buy.\

The piece I would like to see is the service/warranty history, and if the car was serviced there, they can give yo uthat without sharing the owners name.

isellhondas

Well, I try to stay clear of the "Prices Paid" Forums because it's hard for me to bite my tongue sometimes.

A lot of these "detailed" so called prices paid simply didn't happen. Call it puffery, one-upmanship, BS or just forgetfulness, you can drive yourself nuts trying to match some of these prices.

We all pay the same for our cars.

joel0622

They won't give you the address, but hell all you have to do is ask to see the title to the car. That will show you if it is a one owner or not.

isellhondas

I think you ought to stuff 750.00 or 1000.00 in your pocket and go into the real world and find out exactly what you can buy for that amount.

We wouldn't sell it, we would sell it to a wholesaler and the wholesalers would be fighting over it. You may not believe this but those are actually quite popular.

And, yeah, we just might pay 750-1000 for it since we could wholesale it for that much or more.

Are you confusing this car with a Geo Metro? That would be a different story!

greanpea68

After all, when you take a trade-in, you have to take that car... When you go to the auction, you can pick the car you want to put on the lot.

We do a lot of dealer trades instead of buying at auction also. The differance is when you buy wholesale from another dealer you already have a relationship with you get a better look at the trade from a professional who actualy looked at the car, and took it for a little drive. Compared to going to auction and getting what you get.

greanpea68

I am looking for a user car and came across a 2002 Mitsubishi gallant at 70K miles for around 5700$.. The downsides with the car are the interiors have lot of cigarette butt holes (on the cloth surface.. cant see the foam though), and its first owner was a rental company. Its already had 3 owners. Not sure if i should go with this deal. In general, whats the take with smokers cars(for non smokers) and rental company ones.

This does not sound like a very good deal. I can remeber selling 2002 rentals in 2003 with 15,000 miles for $9500. That was retail. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I wouldn't suggest a friend to make that investment. It has had 3 owners in 5 years. There might be something wrong with it. I would suggest to keep looking.

greanpea68

The piece I would like to see is the service/warranty history, and if the car was serviced there, they can give yo uthat without sharing the owners name.

ealerships can only tell you what warranty work has been done. The only service work they can tell you is what has been done at their dealership. If the work was done somewhere else they wouldn't be able to provide thta unless it was warraty work.

greanpea68

A lot of these "detailed" so called prices paid simply didn't happen. Call it puffery, one-upmanship, BS or just forgetfulness, you can drive yourself nuts trying to match some of these prices.

I get a kick out of those forums too. They hardly ever list what they got for trade in. Or if they do they don't tell you evrything :lemon:

I'm pretty sure those deals are madse up on the trade in. :P

isellhondas

Forget the possible trade in aspect.

Some people jsut love to outdo the next guy. A lot of those prices just never happened.

Then people read these and take them as gospel. They will go nuts trying to match or beat these prices. People have a tendency to believe what is appealing to them.

greanpea68

I agree people are nuts about getting the best deal.

It is so funny, people forget why the maroney label was created in the first place. To protect the buyers in case some one didnt know.

kyfdx

The dealer auctions in my area have what they call "ride and drive".. They actually have a track that you can take it around... and, those units come guaranteed against major mechanical problems.

Of course, that's only for late models.. With hundreds to pick from, an experienced used car buyer would rather go to the auctions and find 10 good cars at one time, than wait for something to hopefully fall in his lap from another dealer.

For example, if a BMW dealer wants 15 off-lease 3-series on his lot, he's going to the BMWFS auction. He's not going to wait around for turn-ins.

I think the chances of a salesperson having any actual idea of how any particular used car was acquired by the dealership is pretty darn small.. Ever try getting accurate info about previous history? An exercise in frustration.

regards,
kyfdx
visiting host

british_rover

For example, if a BMW dealer wants 15 off-lease 3-series on his lot, he's going to the BMWFS auction. He's not going to wait around for turn-ins.

Actually BMW has the Full Circle program so each dealer is required to retain a certain percentage of their lease turnins.

Sure they might buy a few from BMWFS auction or from their lease return system but again that is just to fill holes in the lineup. Keep in mind that the lease return auction for BMW, and most other makes as well, is limited to franchised dealers of that make.

We have a goal to sell 15 used cars a month. If we hit that goal everyone is happy and everyone makes money. With only three sales guides at the dealership if we sell 15 used cars it is pretty much guaranteed that at least two of us will hit the used car bonus.

In order to sell those 15 used cars we need 22-25 cars on the lot minimum. If we only have 18 used cars on the lot we need to buy a couple of more to fill out the lineup. We would try to buy those from the other dealers in the area or wholesalers we work with. If we still needed to fill a couple of holes then we would buy them from an auction.

greanpea68

Yeah what BR said.....

oldfarmer50

"They won't give you the address..."

Usually I just ask the question to see if the salesman is being honest. I mean, if some stranger called you up asking about a car you sold, what would you say? "Yea, I'm glad I got rid of that piece of junk, it leaked more fluid than the Titanic"

Having said that, on my last two car buys the salesman did give me enough information to identify the previous owners. That and a Carfax report showed one owner vehicles. I didn't feel the need to call them but I could have.

I have to laugh at the assertion of privacy protection in this day and age. You can find out most people's life story by using Google. I'm about as computer dumb as they come. If I can do it a pro can find out what beer you're drinking before you pop the top.

jmonroe

We wouldn't sell it, we would sell it to a wholesaler and the wholesalers would be fighting over it. You may not believe this but those are actually quite popular.

Now I’m really confused. If you had something that is so popular that it’s going to be fought over why wouldn’t you keep it and sell it yourself? Are you sure you’re in the biz? :confuse:

Are you confusing this car with a Geo Metro? That would be a different story!

To be honest I was confusing it with a Geo Metro. How many Geo things are there anyway? However, it’s still a 15 year old car. Fortunately, I don’t know anyone who would have to buy this car even as a beater. Does this car have any safety features, even air bags? :sick:

jmonroe

british_rover

Most major Franchised new car dealers have a policy of not selling used cars beyond a certain age unless they are some kind of special interest car.

For example we would sell a low mileage 1997 Porsche 911 that was in good shape but wouldn't sell a similar 1997 Honda no matter how nice it was.

The Geo Metro was really a Suzuki Swift.
The Geo Storm was really a Isuzu Impulse.
The Geo Tracker was a Suzuki Samurai.
The Geo Prizm was a Toyota Corolla.

jmonroe

The Geo Metro was really a Suzuki Swift.
The Geo Storm was really a Isuzu Impulse.
The Geo Tracker was a Suzuki Samurai.
The Geo Prizm was a Toyota Corolla.

No wonder I was confused. I noticed you said "was" for all of the above, I guess this means they're now on their way to being collectors items that will bring high prices at trade-in time .

Thanks for the education.

jmonroe

jipster

Does this car have any safety features...

I believe the drivers kneecaps would be the only protection offered on this vehicvle.

From what I recall of the Geo Storm, it's a small 2 seater... semi-sports car. I haven't seen one though in about a decade. Thought they all would have rusted and turned to dust by now.

british_rover

Nah like I said they were the Impulse which was an ok car. Most of them suffered the fate of all cheap cars. Their owners did not take care of them.

isellhondas

It seems like you just want to argue...unusual for you but, not a problem either.

We just don't keep higher mile cars, especially domestics. These do have a market but it's not our kind of store.

Fifteen year old Hondas and Toyotas sell quite well and we are happy to keep nice ones.

As far as safety features, not everyone is hung up on this. I know I wouldn't be if I was looking for the most car I could buy for 1500.00.

I am glad you now realize what kind of a Geo we were talking about.

jmonroe

Thought they all would have rusted and turned to dust by now.

Well I know you're not in the biz so what do you know? :P

I'm being told they're worth a lot at a Honda store somewhere in the state of Washington.

jmonroe

jmonroe

Fifteen year old Hondas and Toyotas sell quite well and we are happy to keep nice ones.

Why ain’t I surprised that you said that, although I am a little surprised you mentioned Toyota.

As far as safety features, not everyobe is hung up on this. I know I wouldn't be if I was looking for the most car I could buy for 1500.00.

I realize that some people can’t afford cars with safety features but when you have to go to work you buy what you have to. I thank God every day I don’t have to live like that. But please don’t down play safety features especially air bags.

I am glad you now realize what kind of a Geo we were talking about.

See, even I’m learnable.

jmonroe

210delray

You forgot one:

The Geo Spectrum was the Isuzu I-Mark.

Also, the Geo Tracker was the Suzuki Sidekick, not the Samurai. GM refused to sell a Samurai clone because of its rollover tendencies, so the General waited until the next generation Suzuki came along (the Sidekick).

lilengineerboy

One small correction:
The Geo Tracker was a Suzuki Samurai.

The Geo Tracker was a Suzuki Sidekick

Also, the Geo Storm really wasn't that terrible of a ride, especially the GSI. The engine was kind of trashy, but it had an incredible redline, a really great manual transmission, and very good brakes. There was an Isuzu Impulse XS wagon-bak (talk about sale-proof) that was in the fleet at one point. It got great mileage, was powerful enough, and I can't believe how much crud could fit in that car. It was also easy to drive in the snow.
It had a driver's side airbag, but I don't know how much faith I have in 15 year old explosives. When that car was totalled in a frontal collision, the airbag was MIA.

british_rover

Oh man the Spectrum I can't even remember what that looked like.

Samuri Sidekick bah they were both Suzukis.

isellhondas

You are suprised I mentioned Toyota?

Oh, I think I've always been brutally honest in my postings and I hope others will agree with me.

One of our cars is a 1989 Buick Le Sabre T-Type that we bought new. It doesn't get driven much but I never give a thought to it's lack of airbags when I do take it out. Heck, the entire collector car hobby would die if people worried constantly about what "could" happen.

I grew up driving old Volkswagens that had seatbelts and nothing else.

My point is, not everybody worries about such things but if you do, you shouldn't buy a car without the safety features that are important to YOU.

But, where does it stop for you? How about side air bags, side curtain airbags ABS brakes VSC and all of the other safety items that do make a difference.

My only point is/was...1500.00 doesn't buy much and a Geo Storm wouldn't be a bad value for that kind of money.

british_rover

Ahh the T-Type that is a good car. Why can't Buick make something cool like that again?

Heehhe I drove the 1959 Rover to a car show 45 minutes away on Sunday.

No seat belts
No power brakes
No padded dash and the steering wheel would probably cut me in half if I hit something.

You just have to drive a bit more defensively and leave extra room all around you.

lilengineerboy

The Geo Spectrum was the Isuzu I-Mark.

The Chevette was related to the I-mark as well IIRC

jmonroe

But, where does it stop for you? How about side air bags, side curtain airbags ABS brakes VSC and all of the other safety items that do make a difference.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fanatic about safety features because I've driven far more miles without them than with them and I know there is no substitute for good/safe driving skills. However, I am glad I have all of the ones you listed, in Mrs. jmonroe's 06' Sonata LX. I don't know what VSC is but her car has ESC. Imagine all of that standard equipment not a penny adder for any of them on a throw-away. But we've already beaten that horse to death.

Lots of safety stuff and I don't ever want to find out how well they work. Kinda like that warranty that you and I feel is great but we never want to find out how great.

jmonroe

jmonroe

Heehhe I drove the 1959 Rover to a car show 45 minutes away on Sunday.

No seat belts

Now that I couldn't put up with.

I put seatbelts in my used 56' Chevy in 1961 after I saw a Sailor (passenger on our plane) get thrown out of his seat, breaking his shoulder, during a cross wind landing when I was in the Navy as a crew member of a transport squadron because he refused to put on his seatbelt. He was an old salt, flew lots of miles and didn't need one.

I just don't feel comfortable without a seatbelt ever since. I gather your state doesn't have state inspections because here in PA, all cars have to have seatbelts regardless of how old they are. Needless to say I'm in favor of this law.

jmonroe

oldfarmer50

"...I thank God every day I don't have to live like that..."

You rich guys are something, with your fancy air bags and indoor plumbing. I bet you even have a fresh coat of paint on your trailer.

jmonroe

I bet you even have a fresh coat of paint on your trailer.

Yeah, that too (did that just this past spring).

jmonroe

erad98

I have a 7-year old GMC Yukon XLT with a little over 100,000 miles in that is in excellent condition (per dealers). I have been offered from $7,500 to $10,000 by the dealers I have spoken with (Car Max offered $8,000). Here is the dilemma that I need your help with: I'm not sure whether to buy a new sedan or hold off until the Yukon dies a noble death. The Yukon has served its purpose well but I am ready to down-size to a more efficient and nimble sedan. My best guess is that I should hold on to the Yukon for another 1-2 years. I am concerned that I may then have a vehicle that is worth significantly less as trade-in value. I am also concerned that if I wait until the Yukon finally dies with a fatal/expensive issue that I will have missed a reasonable opportunity to cash-in on the remaining value of the vehicle. Help!! Thanks.

snakeweasel

My advice is figure out what your car payments would be, keep the Yukon and put that car payment into an interest saving account. Now if you keep the Yukon for a few more years any loss in the value in your Yukon will be recovered by 1.) your use of the vehicle and 2.) several thousand dollars in that account for an additional down payment.

joel0622

I bet you even have a fresh coat of paint on your trailer.

I don't know if this is true or not but, I heard they make two story trailers for rich people.