Purchasing Used Vehicles

phoebe5

On the Bimmer I bought last year, carfax the dealer gave me, but autocheck comes up with frame damage, and said that when the car was sold at auction it was announced as a unibody damaged car. I did a ton of searches to find the bimmer I wanted, at a good price, and this one was the cheapest in a 500 mile search. I asked the sales manager numerous times if there was something wrong with it cause it was the best priced one I found, and he kept reassuring me there was not a thing wrong. But now I find out completely different. What should I do about this, if anything can be done?

qbrozen

last year? as in like 2 months ago? or as in a year ago?

if it was a year ago ... i think it may be too late. However, have you thought about collecting on the carfax guarantee (if possible)? What made you look into a different report after all this time?

I'm not a legal or even automotive expert, but MAYBE there is a lawsuit here. However, if it was a year ago, i don't know how you can prove what was said to you when you purchased it.

phoebe5

I bought it at the end of July.
I just saw a link for a free autocheck, and tried it out of curiousity. I am very, very particular about my cars and just wanted to make sure carfax was correct. I will check into the carfax guarantee, but I have heard that they are very hard to deal with to get them to honor it.

bolivar

Bought the car 6 months ago....

Have you seen any indication of previous damage?

Paint?

Bolts showing wrench marks under the hood?

Does it leak water?

Does the car drive/handle badly?

When does Autocheck indicate the damage was done, how long before you bought the car?

If after 6 months you did not find any imperfections in the car, I don't think you should go after Carfax. If nothing had been reported when you bought the car, I don't see how you can do anything now.

joel0622

I would guess that first of all you need to make sure Autocheck's information is correct. One slip of a key stroke on Data entry and you are the proud owner of a supposed rebuilt/salvaged/flood damaged car

phoebe5

yeah I'm taking it to a mechanic first before I pitch a fit, don't want to look like an idiot. :P

There are paint runs all over the back bumper, and in some spots on the body of the car the paint looks kind of thin to me. And the body is covered in tiny looking rust spots, but the BMW dealer says they aren't rust, but at the same time they are unsure what it is.The driver side windows leak like crazy at a car wash, but not at any other time. I really can't answer how it handles, I've owned to Jeeps previously so anything to me is an improvement over those. I'll have to check my autocheck papers when I get home to see the date. I'm thinking it was in early 2006 that the damage showed up, and it went to auction in June of 2006.

joel0622

Dang Phoebe5, that expalins why it was the cheapest one within 500 miles. If I would have seen runs in the paint and thin spots in the paint my Spidey Senses would have been buzzing from the git go.

phoebe5

We didn't notice it till about a week after I got the car caues it had been raining that entire week. It's the first used car I've ever bought, and I looked it over a few times, but I spent most the time just driving it and making sure it ran good. I didn't even notice the little spots till I was Zaino'ing it for the first time.

joel0622

What state do you live in?

Implied Warranty laws vary drasticly from state to state. For example here in TN you sign a Federal Buyers Guide and the car is your baby. That is unless we fix one thing for you after the Buyers Guide is signed, where in other states it is completly different.

frenchv

I've looked but cannot find anything here so far.

Can someone give me the pointer on how to inspect a used vehicle?

thank you.

metro123

http://www.tirekicking.net/

metro123

I was told once that dealers are not required by law to disclose previous body damage. (Not sure if this is true) I always ask the salesman if the car I'm interested in has been in an accident. I always get the same response. "Let's check the Carfax". As we all know, Carfax and Autocheck are not reliable sources for this information. The dealers probably train the salespeople to respond with this tool. Didn't Carfax just settle a class action lawsuit?

joel0622

Metro, would you rather they just replied "no". the Carfax option is a heck of allot better then what we had in the past and that was nothing

frenchv

:shades: Thanks you guys rock!

qbrozen

I certainly wouldn't expect a used car salesman to know the history of every car on the lot.

kyfdx

I certainly wouldn't expect a used car salesman to know the history of every car on the lot.

Agreed... I also wouldn't necessarily trust their answers... or anyone that is selling a used car.

joel0622

When you say anyone you mean consumers selling there cars on there own to right kyfdx?

kyfdx

Exactly... at least a salesperson can claim ignorance, though...

Only believe what you can see... and half of what you can read..

metro123

I'd rather the salesman answer honestly and let me make an informed decision about the vehicle. What bothers me is that the law protects the dealers and leaves it up to the consumer to discover previous accident damage. A dealer will knock 20 to 30% off the trade-in value of a car with an accident history but then will turn around and ask for full retail and leave it up to the next buyer to discover the repairs. Most car shoppers are not skilled enough to do this.

phoebe5

I am in Missouri.
The sales manager said he bought the car himself at auction, and reassured me nothing was wrong with it.
I contacted BMWNA and I am going to call a BMW dealer and have them inspect and see if they can find anything wrong with it.

hans4

Please help---I am new at this--
A dealer has offered me the buyout price for a leased 2004 XC70 w/ 25000 mi for $26,000. Also,the option to purchase an extended 100,000 mi/or/3 yr certified warranty for an additional $1500. I have been offered $6000 for my 1999 XC70 w/ 96000 miles. Dealer has assessed my car to be in Excellent condition (stated that rarely or never happens). He says there is no room for negotiation as the buyout price is stated on lease agreement (showed me a copy). Is this a good deal?

kyfdx

Is this your leased 2004 XC70? If you want to negotiate a lower price, you should contact the leasing company... They own the car, not the dealer.. the dealer is just facilitating the buyout.

That isn't to say that the leasing company will negotiate.. they might not.. but, that is really your only chance to get it cheaper.

regards,
kyfdx

hans4

It is not mine-it is the dealers & he says it goes to auction as they cannot buy it or negoiate the buyout price.

kyfdx

I'm not all that familiar with how Volvo Finance works...

But, I'll use BMWFS as an example. Vehicles that are not purchased by the original lessees are offered back to the dealer at wholesale value. This value is compiled from current auction reports, not the stated residual amount on the lease contract. This number may be more or less than the residual number.

I doubt VolvoFinance would go to the cost of sending their cars through an auction, if they could get the same amount by just selling the car to the local dealer, where it already sits.

Generally, residuals set by captive finance companies are generous, and the vehicle is usually not worth that amount. If the car is from an independent bank, then it is possible the dealer may be telling the truth... but, even an independent bank would rather sell a car where it sits, than send it through auction.

So.. is he telling the truth? I doubt it.. It might be hard for you to bargain on that particular car, though, as he would have to admit to a lie if he lowered the price.

I've been wrong before (many, many times.. according to my wife).. Maybe he can't buy the car.. I wouldn't sweat letting it go, if the price seems too high... Volvos come off lease every day.

regards,
kyfdx

metro123

A quick check on autotrader.com shows a number of XC70's with similar mileage in the price range you mentioned. That would lead me to believe that wholesale on the car is probably in the low 20's. I would think that you could get a couple thousand more off of that price with some negotiation. If the dealer is not willing to negotiate from $26,000 then see if they will bump up your trade value some more. A dealer will never come out and give you his best deal up front. There is always room to play but you will have to earn it by haggling.

javajane

We were driving a Venture (ugh, I know) until it was totalled this week in an accident.

We're looking for a 6-passenger (using the 3rd row just for occasional short jaunts with my parents- both fairly short individuals.) We want something AWD that's very safe as we were actually hit by an H3 and are still freaked out.

We're looking used under $20k. Chrysler Pacifica and Buick Rendezvous seemed to top our list due to availability and price but not so sure about the reliability. What else should we be looking at? Maybe a Ford Freestyle but we're not finding them around us.

hans4

Thanks for the info-
1)I tried getting more for my trade & he wouldn't budge-said no market for that year/mi--
2)asked to negoiate extended warranty -- said he is unable since price is set by Volvo--
3)questioned possibly to negoiate since car was contracted for 30,000 mi and turned in 4000mi below-- said car is more valuable to Volvo but does not affect bottom line--the figure on the contract stands firm
I'm out of ideas--no further ahead than before I haggled!

joel0622

Is it the only 2004 XC70 w/ 25000 mi within 50 miles of where you live? Call around, if thats what there bringing in your area then step up to the pump. If you can find several to compare, even better.

Ford tells us what we can buy the off lease cars for, and that is exactly what the pay off is. We usually wait till them to come back across the auction and buy them then

erics6

Under $20k, AWD and 6 passenger limits your choices. I'd probably look for a low mileage Ford Freestyle. Toyota Sieana AWD van is going to be more but is another possibility.

stevejco

I found a 2001 jetta GL manual with 105k miles on it, guy wants a little under 6k for it. Then theres a 2002 ford escape with the about 100k miles on it and going for the same price. its come down to one or the other between these two. I love jettas but as far as reliability goes with that many miles i'm not to sure, although the stick makes it a lot more up on the ford. Any one got an opinion on this.

guss

Don't walk, run away from the Jetta. Nobody buys VW products out of warranty. The Jetta's had a lot of problems with coils packs(some covered under warranty) and widow motors .

The first year Escape (2001) had a lot of recalls. By 2002 they had started to get the bugs worked out. Parts will be cheaper on the Escape also.

bendogg705

Hey all,

I'm in the market for a used vw passat, 2004 or 2005 model with 35000 or less miles as a car for my wife (she wants the previous body style, but not too used). I'll probably have to buy from a dealer because there are not many for private sale in my area (missouri). Most of the cars I see are priced about 18-20K. Kbb lists trade in values at about 10,000-13,000 depending on condition, which I assume is near the auction prices as well. So, what's a fair offer? 15K? Will a dealer discount 4K off the asking price? Any advice would be appreciated. I haven't bought any used cars before, so I could use the help.

cccompson

Take a look at what they've sold for on ebay utilizing their "completed listings" tab. Anything that's "certified" will bring more.

dcchow

Hello,

I am looking to buy a used vehicle and wanted to ask what is the usual way a pre-purchase inspection is arranged?

Does the seller take the vehicle to the mechanic or the potential buyer? Is the procedure different if the car is at a dealership vs a private seller?

Lastly, is the car is still under its new vehicle warranty, is a pre-purchase inspection still recommended?

Thank you

cccompson

I don't know that it much matters who takes the car in but the buyer needs to be the one who picks the shop (or individual) and should be physically present at the time of inspection.

Regardless of any warranty, any used car should be subjected to an inspection. Have the dealer run a Carfax
on it also. If it's privately owned, spend $25.00 for a month's subscription and run it (and others) yourself.

Times might changing - just yesterday a local GM dealer balked at running a Carfax for me on one of their used cars. The upside is that made it easy to scratch it off the list!

dcchow

Thanks for the reply cccompson.

Do you know if dealerships require a deposit to be placed on the car or some sort of paperwork before they allow you to take their car to get it inspected?

cccompson

No more than is required for a test drive (driver's license and proof of insurance).

jaat

My apologies if I am using the wrong forum for my questions.

This weekend I got a deal from one the dealer for Highlander and wanted to take some opinions from the experts out here in this forum.

It is a 2006 2 WD, White Color 3.3-liter Highlander with almost 32K miles on it. It have leather seats, third row seat, Moon Roof and JBL sound system.

Dealer bought it from some Rental Car Company. KBB Retail Price for the above vehicle is $26500 and dealer is asking for $19995 + 10% fee (Tax, Title and document etc.). He said till last week, ticket price for the vehicle was $26995 and they reduced it as it is in their lot from last 40 days.

I was surfing the net and talked to some people and I was advised to negotiate for almost 25% of what is the ticket price for a used vehicle from a dealer.

Now how much should I negotiate on $19995? What can be the closest value for this highlander?

Thanks in Advance !!!

ronsteve

I'm not asking about the model in general, but a specific car.

My local Volvo dealer has a 2003 V40 with 55K miles, as a certified used vehicle. A check of the Carfax shows it's a clean, one-owner title, but there are a few things...

It was only ever titled in Florida (only one title number) as a lease vehicle, but it says it was registered as a commercial vehicle. However they show three different locations in different states... i.e.

Florida
DMV
Montvale, NJ

Florida
DMV
Jacksonville, FL

and the same for someplace in Texas.

Also, the Carfax also shows it's been in dealer inventory (or 2) for quite a while... sold at auction in TN in October 2006, then offered for sale at a Volvo dealer in SC, and now it's been at my local dealer since January. No owner and less than 100 miles from auction to last entry.

Is there anything about the title history, or the fact alone that it's basically been sitting since October, that should make me run away? Anything I should be looking more closely at based on this?

Thanx in advance...
--Ron

qbrozen

seems pretty normal. the changes you see could simply be different rental agencies. For instance, the car starts life at an Enterprise in FL, then moves to an Enterprise in TX ... or something like that.

However, given a volvo is not typically found as a rental car, my guess is it was actually a service loaner at different dealerships.

on a side note, i'd personally upgrade to a V50 ... an opinion you didn't ask for, I know. ;b

ronsteve

I'm not sure about the rental or service loaner theory. I've seen XC70's as rentals, but never a V40. And I thought the Carfax would say if it had a history as a rental. This one said "Registered as lease vehicle... Registered as commercial vehicle"

It's the "commercial vehicle" that makes me wonder. Maybe just registered under the owner's business?

What I'd wonder about as much or more is what has happened to it since it came off lease.

October 2006 there are entries showing it as being sold at auction in TN, then offered for sale at a Volvo dealer in SC. It changed hands in March (no new registration) and is now at my local Volvo dealer.

Is it unusual and/or a red flag for a certified pre-owned Volvo to sit for 6 months at 2 different dealers?

And what caveats can anyone offer in general about a used vehicle that's been sitting that long?

Oh, and qbrozen, with the extra weight of the V50 I'd be holding out to find a T5 if I was to go the newer route. But thanx!

cccompson

My two cents is to steer clear of any newer car that's been in different states because it makes me wonder if there's been a lemon law issue. Not saying that's the case here - it's just a general rule for me.

Another thing - Carfax reports can contain erroneous information.

jlawrence01

I'm not sure about the rental or service loaner theory. I've seen XC70's as rentals, but never a V40. And I thought the Carfax would say if it had a history as a rental. This one said "Registered as lease vehicle... Registered as commercial vehicle"

The Volvo V40 was a COMMON corporate fleet vehicle and was heavily marketed as a "premium" selection by Ford Fleet.

bigman35

What do you think?

ronsteve

It depends on the vehicle, and how you drive.

If we're talking Honda or Toyota (great resale value, i.e. high residuals) or something with heavily subsidized lease deals, and you drive "lease miles" (10-12k/year, certainly no more than 15k), then leasing could be good for you.

If you drive a lot of miles, leasing will most likely be bad for you due to mileage penalties. If you're looking at a car that doesn't hold its value well, the low residuals would mean you might not save as much (payment-wise) by leasing.

If you're looking at a European luxury car, CPO may very well be the way to go, especially if you drive a lot of miles.

ronsteve

The Volvo V40 was a COMMON corporate fleet vehicle and was heavily marketed as a "premium" selection by Ford Fleet.

That said, I'm guessing it was somebody's company car. Now, do I run away from it on that basis?

A previous poster mentioned lemon issues, but since it shows the same Florida title number for the entire time, and it was over a year before the address change from NJ to FL shows up, I'm not so concerned about that aspect.

Now the fact that a Volvo dealer in SC got it in October and couldn't sell it in 4+ months before it came to my (NC) Volvo dealer, that might be a little disconcerting.

If nothing else, it's a Volvo CPO, so almost anything that just plain breaks should be under warranty, but would still be a pain.

And on less of a title note, is it worth an extra $3k to step up to a V70 (also CPO) that's a year newer and has a few less miles and a more clear-cut one-owner history?

qbrozen

a newer v70 with fewer miles? i say absolutely. have you driven both? honestly, i see no comparison. the last gen s40/v40 was really not a very nice car. many consider it a black mark on volvo.

i'm surprised the v70 is that cheap ... or is it the v40 is overpriced?

ronsteve

Haven't actually driven either yet. I know I want to get into a wagon for practical reasons (current ride is a 2002 Accord coupe), and I had seriously looked at some new Subarus but just seemed like a lot of compromises.

But after I "cheaped out" of getting a new Subie, the thought of a CPO Volvo crossed my mind. Like I said I haven't driven either example... but I had an S60 as a rental last July and liked the way that drove, and my running partner drives an '04 S40. Not a striking car, but a nice hp-to-weight ratio in the Volvo scheme of things.

i'm surprised the v70 is that cheap ... or is it the v40 is overpriced?

That's a good question... maybe a little of both? The V40 is an '03 with 55K, asking $16995. (I've noticed CPO V40s get borderline silly money) The V70 is an '04 2.5T with 46K, asking $19995. Both are CPO.

qbrozen

i think you are right. a bit of both. Actually, the V40 seems overpriced to me. At least in my area. Your area could be different. I'm thinking that's about a $14k car here.

The V70 ain't bad. Miles are a bit high, but being an '04 helps. I'm thinking $18.5 or maybe $19k.

Drive both. I really think you'll have no doubt which one is the better buy.

ronsteve

The V70 ain't bad. Miles are a bit high, but being an '04 helps. I'm thinking $18.5 or maybe $19k.

Retail?! Certified?! Then I need to move where you are if I want to get a good price on a Volvo!

The V70 I was talking about appears to have been sold. I shoulda known it wouldn't last at the listed $19995 (KBB was a lot higher, but Edmunds TMV was right in the ballpark).

Within 300 miles of me, there are 5 certified '04 V70s... the base models have listed prices of $19995 (57k) and $21775 (45k). Now the three 2.5T's have anywhere from 33k to 61k on the clock, and their listed prices are all in the $23's. At that point, I might as well find a new Subie if I want a wagon badly enough.

Hell, the only certified '03 2.4T within 300 miles has 50k and is listed at 21995.

I might take a look at the V40 anyway, or just wait... someone did say in here that "Volvos come off lease every day." For now, my '02 Accord drives really nicely, and it's paid for. Just a pain in the butt if I want to take the bike somewhere.