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So when it came time this fall to replace the Contour we looked at the 2008 & 2009 Focus first. However, it was virtually impossible to find a Focus in the SF Bay Area with antilock brakes--a requirement for us and an option our 2003 had. I looked at dealer stock on the Net, and found only a couple of Foci with ABS, and they were tricked out with all manner of other options (air foil, anyone?--looks silly on a Focus).
Why does Ford think ABS is an option only a very few will want? This isn't 1990... and Ford lost the sale because of its miscalculation.
I was lucky enough to find ABS on an otherwise "stripped" Cobalt for one of my two commuter cars, but couldn't find ABS on a lightly optioned Focus (which I purchased as my other car).
Dealers have told me that customers have asked them to dealer trade Focii and Cobalts to find one WITHOUT the ABS just to save a couple of bucks. But seldom do this when the money went into alloy wheels or an upgraded stereo system.
Unfortunately only a few of us, plus the IIHS, seem to value our safety...
I was looking online for a family member and found a Focus S with AT and ABS/ESC in the Albuquerque NM area. Those I admit are harder to find and run about $1000 less than an SE. But most probably want electric windows, doors, mirrors, etc.
I want to buy a 2009 Focus SE sedan. What is the reasonable OTD price for one with MSRP $18500. The tax is 7.5% here and plus employee pricing there is about $3500 rebate. Thank you.
Keep in mind that those same moving pieces are what give a dealer an edge. A lot of consumers don't know what rebates are available (research the manufacturer's website or Edmunds, here), don't know what options cost (options add up quickly on any car), and don't know what they are looking for. The internet is an amazing tool to do a lot of research. For example, in your post, you don't say - automatic or manual; options; packages. Those have an impact on how many competitve cars you can shop. If you go to fordvehicles.com, you can "build" a car on line and search dealer inventory within up to a 50 or 100 mile radius, then look at the window stickers. Print out the ones that look good, then email the dealer than has one you like (email several dealers) and ask for a quote - ask for MSRP (which you know, but ask anyway), rebates, and dealer discount. Ask what the OTD price would be with no trade. That is a good starting point.
While websites like this are a useful source of information, the car market is SO volatile right now that you shouldn't rely on last month's or even necessarily last week's deal. Also one dealer may be high, and another low. It's better to send out four or five emails and comparison shop. Dealers are desperate for business and will generally not waste your time these days.
Lowest OTD price I got from some dealer:
MSRP - $18,500
Employee pricing - $16,724.99
Rebate - $1,000.00
FMCC - $500.00
College student rebate - $500.00
Total - $16,183.16 ( This includes tax, tag, title)
I would like to calculate the invoice like this(Edmunds.com):
Base Invoice: $15,018
Options invoice: Auto tran: $709
Sync: $344
Driver's group: $361
Total Invoice: $16432
Rebates: Employee: $1500 (roughly)
Rebate: $1,000.00
FMCC: $500.00
College: $500.00
Holdback: $555 (3% of total MSRP)
True Invoice after rebates and holdback: $12,377
Tax(7.5% times true invoice): $928
Tag: $200(Roughly)
Cost: $12,377 + T/T = $13,505
So what would be the reasanable OTD price for this car now? Thank you. :confuse:
"Lowest OTD price I got from some dealer:
MSRP - $18,500
Employee pricing - $16,724.99
Rebate - $1,000.00
FMCC - $500.00
College student rebate - $500.00
Total - $16,183.16 ( This includes tax, tag, title) "
$14,724 as a sales price sounds great. I don't think you want to take the FMCC loan, currently 9.9% with good credit, unless you want to re-fi with a credit union after the 3 months lock in period necessary to get the rebate. Credit union rates are currently around 5%.
Check the web for the actual "employee pricing" price. The dealer should be willing to knock off another $1000. The employee pricing from what I've seen, by itself, isn't really that great, but coupled with a dealer discount, plus the rebates, is a great deal. You didn't mention dealer discount in your post and I'm not sure if it's already included in what you call the "employee pricing" price. The employee pricing price should be viewed as the new MSRP, in other words, not as the final discount.
On the other hand the $12,377 price you are aiming for is absurdly low. If you can get it, or even anywhere close, you've hit an incredible home run.
Make sure you are happy with the car, by the way. It's not JUST about the price. Shop for a comparable Toyota (Corolla) and Honda (Civic) just to find out what they are charging now. That's the best way to know what kind of deal you have.
The price is 123XX+TTL
If they are talking 3000 or so off go see the mazda dealer. The mazda3 is judged best in its class year after year. The focus not so. You should be able to get an equivalent mazda3 for 16000 or less, and much more car. (i touring value edition auto) Compare them for yourself. Perhaps the Nissan Versa or Sentra would be next, Next the Hyundai Sonata (much more car for about the same price, and 2x the warranty.
Especially when you consider the wildcard of the Doestics financial viability. There is nothing compelling about a Focus now at less than $5000 off.
Good luck
--jjf
Well, depends on what you're looking for, and who's doing the judging, doesn't it?
OK, the enthusiast magazines/sites like the Mazda 3 -- good handling, fun to drive. But is that what all car buyers want?
For my brother, he wanted a decent car that was inexpensive and had ESC. You can get ESC in any '09 Focus, even a stripped Focus S with crank up windows. So he ended up getting a Focus SE with ESC for under $15K.
Want ESC in a Mazda 3? Sorry, you need to buy the higher trim car. Same with Civic. Same with Cobalt.
Want ESC in a Versa or a Sentra? Sorry, not available.
So if certain safety features are important to a buyer, and if cost is a factor, then the Mazda 3 does not compete well with the Focus.
When rating cars, car magazines/websites tend to emphasive acceleration, dynamic handling, and how fun a car is to drive. But many buyers are more concerned with how noisy a car is (big factor if you have a long commute); or how good the stereo system is; or how large the trunk is; or whether safety features are available; or whether it gets good gas mileage; or whether a dealer is readily available; or whether the car is considered reliable; or whether the car is assembled in the USA by Union labor; and so on.
"Best in class" means different things to different people. The Mazda 3 might be "best in class" for handling, but it certainly does not have "best in class" mileage; in fact, the sportier models have poor mileage for the class.
We owned a Mazda, and we liked it a lot. I have nothing against Mazdas, except I probably wouldn't get one now because there isn't a dealer within 100 miles of us.
Last point: we tried out a Versa (which I liked) when we were car shopping -- but my wife found the seating position uncomfortable, so we crossed that one off our list. Because of that bad front seat for my wife, it didn't matter at all to us that some car magazine rated it as "better" some other cars in its class.
Bodystyle:
4 door Sedan
Engine:
4-Cyl. 2.0 Liter
Transmission:
Automatic
Ext. Color:
Black
Mileage:
39,674
Im bidding $8700 before taxes and fees thusfar thanks!
Bill.
When I drove it, about 6 miles on freeway and off, it seemed to do just fine. After much discussion, we came to an agreed upon price of $10,900. All paper work completed, and late in the day by then, it was dark outside. The dealer put a dealer tag on it and told me to come back the next day to get the car detailed and have the window paper license tag put on it. So, I go back and they give me a car identical to the one I purchased to use as a loaner to get about town that day.
After driving the loaner car that day, it occured to me it handled differently in the way the automatic transmission shifted. It shifted smoothly and in a timely manner. The one I purchased did not, the engine was nearly screaming at 60 mph on the freeway. I do not drive over the speed limit if I can help it.
I called the dealership and discussed this with them. They tell me that someone will drive the car I purchased with me inside, and then the loaner vehicle (it had 15,000 miles on it). When I get back, no one has time, but I was told the car I purchased was working just fine. I was told that every car senses the driver driving habits, and it shifts like it should according to the driver????? WHAT?? Did I suddenly become an idiot? I don't drive like an idiot.
So I get in it to drive back home, about 30 miles, and the transmission still does not shift correctly. The engine is still screaming at 60 mph.
Here I sit, hating the car, the dealership, and the entire experience. Being a female of 55 years, it appears I made a bad mistake. Thanks FORD. As soon as I can get rid of this car, I will NEVER walk into a Ford dealer lot again. Nor will I ever purchase another Ford.
And has anyone ever heard of something this ridiculous in their life? Has anyone had an experience with the automatic transmission in the 2008 Focus acting up?
Hating the dealership etc isn't really fruitful. So many people have complaints with Toyota,Ford,Honda dealerships etc it all cancels out. The dealers are independent franchises and not directly related to the manufacturer. Even Saturn and Scion dealerships get the same complaints.
Don't know what being dark when you drove means, but if so you were fortunate there were no cosmetic problems, as they aren't covered by warranty. You can get the tranny fixed at one of the dealers, get a loaner car, etc.
Looks like you got a decent price, its got 5yr/60000 mi power train. Enjoy the car
Good luck
--jjf
I purchased a 2008 Focus SE last week. It is a program car, with about 11,000 miles on it. It was late in the evening, nearly dark, when I test drove the vehicle. The dealer had 4 to choose from. I chose the one with the lowest mileage. It is an automatic transmission.
When I drove it, about 6 miles on freeway and off, it seemed to do just fine. After much discussion, we came to an agreed upon price of $10,900. All paper work completed, and late in the day by then, it was dark outside. The dealer put a dealer tag on it and told me to come back the next day to get the car detailed and have the window paper license tag put on it. So, I go back and they give me a car identical to the one I purchased to use as a loaner to get about town that day.
After driving the loaner car that day, it occured to me it handled differently in the way the automatic transmission shifted. It shifted smoothly and in a timely manner. The one I purchased did not, the engine was nearly screaming at 60 mph on the freeway. I do not drive over the speed limit if I can help it.
I called the dealership and discussed this with them. They tell me that someone will drive the car I purchased with me inside, and then the loaner vehicle (it had 15,000 miles on it). When I get back, no one has time, but I was told the car I purchased was working just fine. I was told that every car senses the driver driving habits, and it shifts like it should according to the driver????? WHAT?? Did I suddenly become an idiot? I don't drive like an idiot.
So I get in it to drive back home, about 30 miles, and the transmission still does not shift correctly. The engine is still screaming at 60 mph.
Here I sit, hating the car, the dealership, and the entire experience. Being a female of 55 years, it appears I made a bad mistake. Thanks FORD. As soon as I can get rid of this car, I will NEVER walk into a Ford dealer lot again. Nor will I ever purchase another Ford.
And has anyone ever heard of something this ridiculous in their life? Has anyone had an experience with the automatic transmission in the 2008 Focus acting up?
Yesterday morning, and again today, I saw an ad from Villa Ford in Orange CA for an '09 Focus SE Coupe for $10,988, broken down this way:
Sale Price $13,488
Fact Rebate $2,000
Ford Cred Reb $500
The ad said they had 2 at this price; I called them just after 9am and both were still available, in silver and dark blue. I was down there by 10, drove the silver one, and took it.
Final price was $12,778 out the door (sticker price was $16,875). I didn't take the $500 Ford Credit rebate, since I'm on the board of a small employee owned credit union (even though Ford Credit could beat our rate).
The good news is I beat our 1% sales tax increase that takes effect April 1, and I got a great value compared to even what I'd get in a Hyundai, let alone comparing it to Honda, Toyota, and Nissan.
Additionally, this car isn't made in Mexico as I thought, it was made at the Wayne Assembly Plant. One car won't make or break Ford or the employees of that plant, but I'm glad I could do a little bit for Ford, who I consider the best of the domestic automakers and for the people of Michigan.
Stick shift?
The car is maxed out with heated seats, moon roof, sync, etc.
The email from the dealer has
list price = $21,020.00
internet price = $15,400.00
OTD = $16,771.09
with ford credit @ 8.9% including $500 rebate.
I've been approved by chase for $15K at 5.6%
OTD = $17,271.09
According to this http://www.bankrate.com/brm/calc/rebatecalc.asp
I save $974 over the life of the loan by taking the lower interest rate.
Questions:
What do you think about the $17,271.09 OTD price? I think it's too high.
I want to buy this weekend; should I tell him?
Will telling him "if he gives it to me for $16K OTD I'll go get it right now" help?
I haven't told the dealer how much I've been approved by or the rate.
Should I? Could it help me get a lower OTD price?
FYI: the local mazda dealers offered me Mazda 3's for 2K less but with only auto and ac - nothing else! One guy offered me one with no ac! I live in Miami!
Try it out, maybe it would work, but that would sound like a heck of a deal.
"Wish I could help but I'm giving it to you with no dealer fees"
That was from a small town dealer in central fl where my mother lives.
I tried a local dealer and got an OTD price of $299 more.
So now I'm pretty comfortable that the price is fair.
Anything less than that and you are better off getting 5-10 bids on a 09 M3. Bigger interior dimensions and a much better auto all around, even if a thousand or so more. That said may be worth it even if $5000 off the Focus. The M3 sells for about 3k off msrp, putting a nice i touring value edition with alloys and auto in the 15k range or less.
Also the 09 Hyundai Elantra gls auto for 13-14k-ish before the Focus but still behind the M3.
Good luck
-jjf
many banks/credit unions will refinance at new car rates.
I also have the $500 College rebate and the $1500 Drive the Difference.
What do you think?
Car prices have been jacked up recently because of the $3500-$4500 cash for clunkers vouchers from the govt. This may last a few months.
Good luck
--jjf
This is something I've never heard of, is that really something that's done for a new car? Or is this just the new way for the dealer to put the usual "ADP"?
This dealer did some really creative things with the invoice, which I had mostly corrected, and this dealer fee still remained.
It seems the old car sales practices that kept me from buying new are still alive and kicking at some places.. I have to admit it was quite an unpleasant experience, being as unprepared as I was walking into the Ford dealership. My fault in being sucked in by the C4C program deadline.
In my area the fee is much more modest, typically $99-129. I've read of fees as high as $500-600 in some markets.
I hope you at least got the $2000-3000 rebates on your new Focus (or were those only on the '09?).
No rebates at all- there was a tristate ford rebate for the 2010 that I saw listed online for 1000, but this dealer didn't seen to know anything about it, and I didn't see it on the ford website, so maybe it was outdated or in error.
Obviously, with demand that high, and many people entering the door who hadn't bought a new vehicle since the Reagan Administration, normal discounts disappeared supplanted by $4000 gov't vouchers straight into the dealerships and factory's pockets.
With some clunkers worth $1500 and up, many could have done better or as well a month before the gov't certificates. The flood of demand driving prices up cancelling out most or all of the $4000 govt check.
Just another $3 billion to the gov't debt clock.
--jjf
Thanks for the info- I really didn't think that add on fee was really on the level, but it's good to know it's not unheard of-
No rebates at all- there was a tristate ford rebate for the 2010 that I saw listed online for 1000, but this dealer didn't seen to know anything about it, and I didn't see it on the ford website, so maybe it was outdated or in error.
Thanks
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MFG Bulletin Date: 20090201
Component: FUEL SYSTEM, GASOLINE:STORAGE:TANK ASSEMBLY:FILLER PIPE AND CAP
Bulletin Summary: FORD: VEHICLES MAY EXHIBIT A MALFUNCTION INDICATOR LIGHT (MIL) ON WITH DIAGNOSTIC TROUBLE CODE (DTC) P0456 (VERY SMALL EVAPORATIVE EMISSION SYSTEM LEAK DETECTED; VERY SMALL LEAK 0.020" (0.51 MM) DIAMETER). *PE
Date added to datbase: 20090219
Failing Component:
Power Train:Automatic Transmission
Summary:
4r27e transaxle no 3rd or 4th gear--built on or before 1/29/08.
It was not a Focus, but my kid wore out 2 tires in 6000 miles. They had a 60K mi warranty, so the tire manufacturer gave him two new tires and he paid only for mounting and balancing
They wanted to charge $299 for VIN etch but waived the fee on my request. Overall, the experience was very smooth and cordial.