Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

suydam

What’s up with the Encore? My neighbor accidentally crashed into me. She’s a wonderful lady but just this once, she was distracted by something and never even saw me entering the complex. Sigh. Her insurance is paying for repairs and rental. Four years to the day that we bought it!

Sandman6472

Was over at TD Ameritrade today doing my 2018 IRA contribution. Wife did our taxes before I went so we could decide on how much I should put into it to lessen our 2018 tax payment. Basically, the amount I put in brings us to getting a very small refund which is o k by me. We needed a way to lower our income for last year and this was the perfect way to do it according to her. I made less than 2017 but she made more and since she pays quarterly being an independent contractor, my contribution was just the right amount though I can put in up to $6500. For 2019, heard it goes up to $7K for us older folks.

suydam

Although I really want the Encore back, I will say it’s fun trying out a new vehicle for more than just a test drive.

Sandman6472

Haven't tried a new CX-5 yet but more interested in the CX-3 as it's the perfect size for my needs. Don't like the Escape as it just fits in the garage test but wish the Edge was the smaller size. They did a nice job with the Edge, one Ford I could see myself purchasing. Hell, now that they've fixed the transmission issues in the Focus, that could work to, especially the hatch but the powers that be at Ford have decided the American public no longer wants cars, just CUV's, SUV's and trucks. Dumb [non-permissible content removed] move on their part because there will always be folks like my wife who will only drive a smallish sedan, nothing else is even on her radar. I'd be happy with a smallish CUV to be honest but it has to have all the goodies which I'm willing to pay for if necessary. Wish BMW made something a bit smaller than the X1, and a little less expensive as that would be my sweet spot. For some weird reason, BMW is just one vehicle I'd like to own someday. Do absolutely love the 328i, the vehicle that showed me how good a German vehicle can be. But again, wish it was 8 to 10 inches shorter to hit my sweet spot. Anything 173" or smaller is that spot for me, with the Mini Cooper maybe being a tad too small. I've only had one test drive in one so I'd really need a longer time period to try one out. That's one vehicle I would like to rent for a week to see if it's something that I could actually live with. From what folks tell me, the ride can be a bit on the rough side and I really like a smooth riding vehicle. My VW Golf is the perfect vehicle at this time as it drives great, fun to toss around a bit and gets decent mpg's. Should have gone for the "SEL" model back in 2014 and learned a valuable lesson, well two lessons in 2013 and 2014. Never settle for any vehicle because one will never be truly happy with it. And it's worth it to spend a little more to get the exact model you want with just the right features on it. If not, you'll always be looking back and saying I shoulda spent the extra few bucks to get it right. And over the ownership time period, only comes out to a few dollars a dayI'm figuring. Get the color and all the options you really want, never settle because just ain't worth it. Do it right the first time and move on to something else.
Unfortunately, VW no longer makes the "SEL" Golf so I'm so out of luck here. Right at this moment,if they did, I'd probably just go and trade into one. Really want the push button start and the usb port with the safety nannies and a much better back-up camera. The one in my kids Cruze is really outstanding to be honest. She'll be home for the weekend so I'll finally take it for a spin.

Sandman6472

Just found out that we'll be working everyday through next the end of next week due to the event in Miami during that time period. Think it's a tennis tournament to be honest and their renting about 100 or more of our large "T" vehicles. The Tahoe/Suburban and GMC cousins and I even saw a few Nissan Armada's in the staging area. They all have to be cleaned/washed and filled with petrol and then we have to drive them to certain staging area's which we'll find out on Saturday and Sunday. We're going all over South Florida and getting a bunch of these "T's". Was in South Miami on Monday and some went to Vero Beach last Thursday and have a feeling that we'll be going back there tomorrow as well as West Palm Beach and maybe even Ft. Myers and Tampa to get our quota. Totally fine with me as I miss the long distance driving I used to do years ago which my bosses know. They come to me first thing as I always say yes to these trips. Just need to get enough rest and watch my movements so as not to have my back go out. Slow and steady and I'll be fine. My wife and oldest think I'm pushing myself too much here but have assured them that I'll be as safe as I can be. Just too much to be done and me being sidelined due to any spinal issues just ain't gonna happen! I won't let it!

xwesx

qbrozen said:

Seems like a good use of $13k. But... 5 owners?!
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/share/232848085

Sometimes you just have to share the love.

Mr_Shiftright

There's a difference between "getting around" and being "passed around"

marcogallo1986

Lol lol lol

marcogallo1986

 Nice 20 firefighter, on the new tires for the X one. Will the new two used tires. I do remember the story a while back. 

omarman

I read a story about movie prop money passed around to buy used cars off CL. "Cash only!"

fushigi

Mr_Shiftright said:

Are We SURE We Want All These Safety Gadgets?

Yes, I am quite sure I want the safety gadgets. I don't give a flying **** what car repairs cost if the safety systems saves my wife's or my life, or reduces the severity of an injury. Besides, any accident-with-injury scenario would likely involve many, many thousands of extra dollars spent on emergency healthcare making a few hundred extra for windshield replacement seem like pennies.

For the record, I had my QX60's windshield replaced recently as it was cracked (don't recall an impact). SafeLite came to my office & replaced it and emailed me a coupon that I can use at my dealer to cover calibration. I haven't done that yet but will in the next few weeks. My total out of pocket was my $100 glass deductible. I think the windshield itself was around $700. And it does have all of the sensors - rain, forward collision, etc.

suydam

+1.

Mr_Shiftright

fushigi said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

Are We SURE We Want All These Safety Gadgets?

Yes, I am quite sure I want the safety gadgets. I don't give a flying **** what car repairs cost if the safety systems saves my wife's or my life, or reduces the severity of an injury. Besides, any accident-with-injury scenario would likely involve many, many thousands of extra dollars spent on emergency healthcare making a few hundred extra for windshield replacement seem like pennies.

For the record, I had my QX60's windshield replaced recently as it was cracked (don't recall an impact). SafeLite came to my office & replaced it and emailed me a coupon that I can use at my dealer to cover calibration. I haven't done that yet but will in the next few weeks. My total out of pocket was my $100 glass deductible. I think the windshield itself was around $700. And it does have all of the sensors - rain, forward collision, etc.

Well of course, but that presumes that these devices WILL save lives. We have seen other instances where the benefits have proven very elusive---such as ABS.

One could argue (not my position, but one could argue) that technology first creates problems for us (texting, infotainment, lack of uniformity in emissions and diagnostic systems among brands) and then gives us gadgets to fix them.

I suppose I should have posed a better question: "Do we want these safety devices on a car that's out of warranty?"

I suspect there will be lots and lots of people who will not repair these systems, and, even less fortunate, people who will have to abandon cars that are disabled by defects.

qbrozen

Was just reading up a bit on the 2020 Explorer. Sounds like a very nice upgrade, especially the move to the Aviator's RWD platform. Nearly $60k for the ST, though. OUCH! I'll be curious to see how much of a performance upgrade it is over the 3.0T versions, though.

suydam

Yes. I want them.

28firefighter

I want my wife's car to have the latest safety stuff at all times - as @fushigi said, if there is anything I can do that would increase the odds of her staying safe in a crash, I'm doing it.

kyfdx

Funny... I bought my son a vehicle that had the ABS and stability control disabled, along with airbag removal. I guess I'm a bad Dad.

28firefighter

My feelings there are a bit different (which probably makes no sense) - when someone is learning to drive, they need to learn how a car feels without a bunch of systems interfering or doing the work for them. I'd probably turn a lot of them off initially if the car had it for a new driver and then enable them later.

The biggest thing I'd disable is blind spot monitoring - too easy to use it as a crutch for actually looking.

But, for my wife who spends a lot of time commuting during rush hour and is a great driver and doesn't use those safety systems as a replacement for her own eyes, ears, and actions, I want them.

Mr_Shiftright

28firefighter said:

I want my wife's car to have the latest safety stuff at all times - as @fushigi said, if there is anything I can do that would increase the odds of her staying safe in a crash, I'm doing it.

I see your point but it really is debatable if safety gadgets that "take over" control from the driver actually help them or imperil them. One could argue that they a) inspire over-confidence and b) don't always do the right thing in the right place.

Case in point--those videos on YouTube where you see a car maneuvering through a collision on the freeway--there's no computer that can do that. All it can do in that case is jam on the brakes and let you get creamed.

I'm much more amenable to passive safety gadgets btw.

28firefighter

For those shopping this month, I think this is going to be the month of hacker deals on the Outback Limited 3.6R. Low-ish MF, high residual, and some regional incentives. Local dealers to me are doing minimum 14-15% off on them before incentives.

Looks like Subaru is trying to move inventory ahead of the 2020 Outback XT. Each dealer in my area has like 25-30 of these on their lots in some varying accessory configuration.

au1994

28firefighter said:

For those shopping this month, I think this is going to be the month of hacker deals on the Outback Limited 3.6R. Low-ish MF, high residual, and some regional incentives. Local dealers to me are doing minimum 14-15% off on them before incentives.

Looks like Subaru is trying to move inventory ahead of the 2020 Outback XT. Each dealer in my area has like 25-30 of these on their lots in some varying accessory configuration.

Tempt me not, evil muse. As you may remember my wife and I swapped rides when we got the Crosstrek. So far she is not at all enamored with the X1. We both loved the 3.6R Touring Outback we drove in our looking process.

henryn

https://www.cnn.com/business/live-news/geneva-motor-show-2019/h_904a75881a0567b6350737e2d6ff16cc

Remember the Meyers Manx? A friend of mine owned one of those, and I had the chance to drive it a couple of times. A total blast.


QUOTE:
That crazy cute electric dune buggy concept car Volkswagen unveiled at the Geneva Motor Show may not be just a concept after all.

It has no doors, no side or back windows and only fittings for a simple cloth roof.

28firefighter

au1994 said:

28firefighter said:

For those shopping this month, I think this is going to be the month of hacker deals on the Outback Limited 3.6R. Low-ish MF, high residual, and some regional incentives. Local dealers to me are doing minimum 14-15% off on them before incentives.

Looks like Subaru is trying to move inventory ahead of the 2020 Outback XT. Each dealer in my area has like 25-30 of these on their lots in some varying accessory configuration.

Tempt me not, evil muse. As you may remember my wife and I swapped rides when we got the Crosstrek. So far she is not at all enamored with the X1. We both loved the 3.6R Touring Outback we drove in our looking process.

I had been considering bigger SUVs - the highlander, MDX, XC90 etc. But realistically we don't need the third row seat.

The Touring will not lease as well because the residual is 2% lower, but if you can handle taking a Limited, there is a ton of value to be had.

Here is a sample of what I put together assuming 15% off and then the $250 PNW regional cash and $500 lease incentive.

stickguy

I really liked the 3.6 outback too.. that’s the one I probably should have gotten. Oh well!

28firefighter

You really are not in love with the TLX, are you.

stickguy

And that lease calculation is a good $100 below what I was aiming for in December, based off Honcker (and even more below executive VIP).

au1994

28firefighter said:

au1994 said:

28firefighter said:

For those shopping this month, I think this is going to be the month of hacker deals on the Outback Limited 3.6R. Low-ish MF, high residual, and some regional incentives. Local dealers to me are doing minimum 14-15% off on them before incentives.

Looks like Subaru is trying to move inventory ahead of the 2020 Outback XT. Each dealer in my area has like 25-30 of these on their lots in some varying accessory configuration.

Tempt me not, evil muse. As you may remember my wife and I swapped rides when we got the Crosstrek. So far she is not at all enamored with the X1. We both loved the 3.6R Touring Outback we drove in our looking process.

I had been considering bigger SUVs - the highlander, MDX, XC90 etc. But realistically we don't need the third row seat.

The Touring will not lease as well because the residual is 2% lower, but if you can handle taking a Limited, there is a ton of value to be had.

Here is a sample of what I put together assuming 15% off and then the $250 PNW regional cash and $500 lease incentive.

That’s strong. Yes we could live with a Limited. More color options on that model anyway. Now I’m off to check trade-in and payoff on the X1.

28firefighter

Our X1 is seriously flipped. Only way we're getting out of it is with a lease transfer.

au1994

28firefighter said:

Our X1 is seriously flipped. Only way we're getting out of it is with a lease transfer.

I’m pretty sure I’m in the same boat. That was the case last August when I looked and by my mental calculations, we’re still pretty underwater. May be closer to the end of the year till we’re even Steven.

xwesx

The problem with all these safety features is exactly what you all have said (though not in these words): They sell based on the illusion of providing MORE safety. However, there are two things working against them:

1. The risk of being in a crash, let alone an injury-worthy crash, is incredibly small.
2. The probability that the gadgets prevent an actual crash scenario is unknown.

Just between these two items, a reasonable person questions the value proposition. Next up, though, is the most poignant argument against them: The more gadgets a driver has, the less attention that driver pays to driving. Regardless of how much you may argue to the contrary, it is undeniably true: The more time passes with them, the more you rely on them. What this means is that your vehicle is MORE likely over time, not LESS, to be in situations where a collision is imminent unless the safety systems (or driver) takes action. And, whether or not a collision occurs, this means, quite simply, that your risk is now greater.

And, if something doesn't go as algorithmed, that car is more likely to crash... not less.

Peace of mind counts for a lot. Everything, in this case, as was demonstrated in several posts above. However, don't think about it too much, because if you do, you will recognize that your loved ones are no safer with the gadgets than without them. Protective equipment, such as crumple zones and airbags, are a far better investment, because these other "proactive" nannies only reduce the probability of a collision if you first assume that driver attentiveness is the same in both cases, which is a terribly false assumption.

Mr_Shiftright

Cars are pretty dangerous if you really think about it (don't think too much, though). I mean, here you are, in 2 tons of hurtling steel, running down the road at 50 mph say, and coming your way, perhaps no more than 5 feet away from you, in the opposite direction, is another 2 tons of hurtling steel. There is no barrier. You have no idea who is behind the wheel. They were given a license after studying a pamphlet for two hours and puttering around the block at 15 mph.

So yeah, looking at it this way, you'd want all the peace of mind, and protection, you can get.

qbrozen

au1994 said:

For those shopping this month, I think this is going to be the month of hacker deals on the Outback Limited 3.6R. Low-ish MF, high residual, and some regional incentives. Local dealers to me are doing minimum 14-15% off on them before incentives. Looks like Subaru is trying to move inventory ahead of the 2020 Outback XT. Each dealer in my area has like 25-30 of these on their lots in some varying accessory configuration.

Tempt me not, evil muse. As you may remember my wife and I swapped rides when we got the Crosstrek. So far she is not at all enamored with the X1. We both loved the 3.6R Touring Outback we drove in our looking process.

I had been considering bigger SUVs - the highlander, MDX, XC90 etc. But realistically we don't need the third row seat. The Touring will not lease as well because the residual is 2% lower, but if you can handle taking a Limited, there is a ton of value to be had. Here is a sample of what I put together assuming 15% off and then the $250 PNW regional cash and $500 lease incentive.

That’s strong. Yes we could live with a Limited. More color options on that model anyway. Now I’m off to check trade-in and payoff on the X1.

Honestly surprised you’d consider swapping an X1 for an Outback. The CVT alone kills it for me. 

au1994

Well, the CVT doesn’t really bother us. For some reason neither of us are crazy about the X1. It’s a nice little car. Good power, handles well and good use of space, but its just...ok. We both find it noisy but that could be remedied by new tires which at 23k on the OEM Pirellis is probably coming by the end of the year.

My wife prefers a bigger car, so she’s a fan of the Outback. With the 3.6 its got plenty of power and actually handles really well. For the money, they come well equipped in either Limited or Touring trim.

I’ll probably end up with the X1 again at some point. That will probably just hasten its departure! Since I don’t commute as often I’d love to find a used Wrangler but the resale is just insane on those.

28firefighter

Regarding the X1, I have to say that the stock Pirellis are absolute hot garbage. Even my wife commented this morning that the car rides night and day better with the Goodyear Eagles. If she notices, it is a huge difference.

kyfdx

I tried to talk my wife into an X1, instead of being stuck on the X3. But, she couldn't get the old X1 out of her head. Said she didn't want something that looked like a hatchback.

So... she has an X3.

But, after having an X1 as a loaner, last month.. I have to say the X3 is a nicer vehicle, all the way around.

au1994

28firefighter said:

Regarding the X1, I have to say that the stock Pirellis are absolute hot garbage. Even my wife commented this morning that the car rides night and day better with the Goodyear Eagles. If she notices, it is a huge difference.

158% agree on that. The Subaru with its OEM Falkens is night and day better

stickguy

I like the X3 way more than the X1. Though I never drove the current generation, just sat in it. The wife would like it a lot better too. I only drove the X1. She wasn't there for that.

au1994

The X3 is nice, haven’t driven the current gen though. I think what we have determined is that for the money, there are better values out there other than the X1.

28firefighter

Depends on what kind of money you're talking. A former loaner (like mine) in the upper 200s - mid 300s with driveoffs and MSD is still a pretty good value for a compact SUV.

For someone who wants to get into the brand but needs a bit more space, it fits the bill.

corvette

28ff, she’s comparing very worn Pirellis to almost new Goodyears, though. 

28firefighter

The Pirellis were garbage from day one. Hindsight being 20/20 I should have pulled them off and put on a decent of Michelin all seasons and put the RFTs in the garage for lease end.

kyfdx

Funny... we just replaced our Goodyear runflats with Pirelli.

28firefighter

kyfdx said:

Funny... we just replaced our Goodyear runflats with Pirelli.

My condolences.

fintail

Car browsing outside my desired price range.

This might be the most perfectly spec'd E on a local lot, of course it has to be a wagon:



That color:

stickguy

I do like the blue/gray on that G.

the front end of that E class reminds me of a Buick.

corvette

28firefighter said:

kyfdx said:

Funny... we just replaced our Goodyear runflats with Pirelli.

My condolences.

The Pirelli P4 Four Seasons I put on my Altima were outstanding. I think those are the only Pirellis I've had.

28firefighter

Yup. Those are good. The tires we had were Pirelli P7 Cinturato runflats. 

stickguy

I had P4s on my Mazda 626 back in the Mid-90s. Outstanding on ice. I think they were P4s.

kyfdx

28firefighter said:

Yup. Those are good. The tires we had were Pirelli P7 Cinturato runflats. 

That's what we bought.

Drove them on a six hour round-trip this weekend.

They track better than the Goodyears, which seemed to wander a bit. They are a little rougher over road imperfections.

No experience with wet or snow conditions, yet. They don't get great reviews.

Like many OEM tires, the Goodyears were too expensive to buy as replacements. The alternative was Michelins, which were a three day wait. My tire dealer was able to get the Pirellis the same day. (at $300 less for the set).

These are 245/45-19.

fushigi

28firefighter said:

My feelings there are a bit different (which probably makes no sense) - when someone is learning to drive, they need to learn how a car feels without a bunch of systems interfering or doing the work for them. I'd probably turn a lot of them off initially if the car had it for a new driver and then enable them later.

You'd be doing a huge disservice to the new driver.

Car tech advances and becomes the norm quickly. A new driver today, unless they're very cash-strapped and can only afford 15+ year old beaters, absolutely will have more and more of the safety systems. Much better for them to learn to drive while knowing how those systems work and how they change the driving dynamic than to encounter them and have to adjust on the fly, potentially in an emergency situation.

The easy example is ABS. Non-ABS has lockup, lots of noise, and generally a major loss of steering capability. With ABS the stopping distances are indeed a little longer but we're explicitly taught to "stomp and steer" and expect the pulsing/shudder from the system as it works (as designed). A driver who has to make an emergency maneuver to avoid a collision does very different things with v. w/out ABS.