Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

stickguy

wow. someone actually making a truck that is like what PUs used to be! Wonder if Chevy still has that stripper model (the W/T for work truck). rubber grill, no options.

more surprised though that Ram isn't doing a smaller engine model too, for the real tight wads.

michaellno

The impression I got was that it was equipped with the V8, class IV hitch and transmission cooler to boost towing capacity - over 5 tons!

Wonder if it comes in any other color but white.

stickguy

yeah, I got that part. But many (most?) people using these probably don't tow much if at all, they just need to space and toughness. So a V6 model to same up front cost (if not much on gas) should sell well too.

They should make those wildly overpriced sidewall boxes standard too, if they really want to make it practical.

au1994

That's pretty handy. Does anyone remember when compact trucks were actually compact? The Tacoma and Frontier are huge compared to their predecessors.

houdini1

I wonder why Hyundai does not come out with a small, light duty P.U. maybe even a diesel, about the size of the last generation Tacoma? I think they would sell in droves if executed correctly.

stickguy

I would be interested. Heck, a baja might actually be very useful to me, although I would have to put the dog in the back seat!

as to compact PUs, pretty much all the companies already have one for overseas markets. Even Ford could replace the ranger (which looks tiny when you see one now).

crkyolfrt

I agree, they absolutely should. And now is the perfect time.
Is a Tacoma 48" between the wheel wells? Hyundai would be smart to ensure that.

You know...I am somewhat encouraged and think maybe there really is hope afterall for NA when it comes to the prospects of diesel use. In cars, trucks, SUV's etc. You can go back just 10 short years and there simply was nowhere near the chat about diesels (indicating desirability) on the forums like there is in the last couple years even just here on Edmunds. I am discovering there are legitimate diesel fans out there. What took you so long guys?

I suppose the more time that goes by the greater the distant memory of GM's V8 gas block diesel. In what? 3 short years they did 3 decades of diesel reputation damage.
Thankfully, people are starting to figure out that that negativity was not deserved and that GM wholly was responsible, and not the type of fuel used.

houdini1

I had a 1979 Mercedes 240 D. Absolutely loved it. It would run strong all day (once you got it up to speed). Only problem I ever had was the fuel line freezing on extremely cold nights, etc. I recall being in the garage some early mornings with the hood up and a hair dryer ! Thankfully I never owned a GM diesel.

hoosiergrandad

Don't know anything much about the latest diesel technology, but you used to be able to keep'em running in cold weather by adding a little of this or that anti-jell, or even by adding up to 10 per cent gas to No. 2 diesel fuel. (Disclaimer) I've never had any trouble doing it with tractors or trucks, but don't know how a TDI or a late model Mercedes would take to it.

andre1969

I agree, they absolutely should. And now is the perfect time.
Is a Tacoma 48" between the wheel wells? Hyundai would be smart to ensure that.


I did a little digging around online, and found that the Tacoma only has 41.5" between the wheel wells: http://trucks.about.com/od/2010toyotatrucks/fr/2010-toyota-tacoma-review.htm

I think just about any manufacturer that builds full-sized pickups is going to make the bed of their smaller pickups narrower than 48" on purpose, to protect the market for the big trucks. The only non-fullsized truck I can think of that has at least 48" is the Honda Ridgeline.

I've heard that the 2nd-generation Dodge Durango SUV had a little over 48" between the wheel wells. And this was one major reason why the Durango and Dakota parted ways in that restyle. Had they based the next Dakota on the Durango, it would've made the Ram somewhat redundant.

andre1969

That's the kind of truck I want! BTW, that '08 Ram I posted awhile back is still showing up at the Fitzmall website. 2008 Ram for $15,499.

But, I think I'm gonna try to squeeze a little more life out of my '85 Silverado.

crkyolfrt

"is going to make the bed of their smaller pickups narrower than 48" on purpose, to protect the market for the big trucks."

I think you are right on there.

The Dakota was the first non fullsize to have 48" between the wells. That is smart of Honda. Of course it requires dropping the tail gate, but then many 6' boxes u wopuld have to anyway..

roadburner

A 2001 with 79K miles for @$20K

corvette

Seems like a good value. A lot of work trucks are sold like that, although usually with a smaller engine. The coil suspension is supposed to ride much better than other full size trucks.

I would want power door locks, cruise control, and keyless entry on mine. I was surprised to see tire pressure monitoring on the option list--I thought it was mandatory now.

Sandman6472

And yet our '05 Mazda3 has needed almost nothing with 86k on it...and I'll bet most Mazda3's have had similar results. The Mazdaspeed is a different animal...more complex than the every day 3's & with a turbo no less. Just like your saying that the 5 & 7 Series are more complex, I'd say the same thing comparing our Mazda 3 to yours. More specialized equipment in your particular model.

Makes sense to me but gotta feeling your gonna rain on my parade here!

The Sandman :sick: :shades:

Sandman6472

My used '96 Corolla, bought in December of '97 with 16k needed a rear power window actuator when I took delivery. Since it was still under warranty, the Saturn dealer told me to take it to my local Toyota dealer to have it done as a warranty issue. Made sense at the time & that's what happened...it was fixed & everyone was happy. Must say that both Corolla's I had, an '88 & a '96, were pretty reliable dd's with stellar mpg's & if they had some style back in '06, I would've considered another one. But Toyota keeps doing their "Appliance Style" cars which are as exciting as watching a tree grow. Guess they no longer have a style department anymore.

Great cars with no personality...that should be their new tag line in their ads...lol!

The Sandman :sick: :shades:

Sandman6472

We did...'78 Bonneville Parisienne...piece of crap!!! Gone within 2 years...smelly & slow to boot with those frickin' glow plugs...folks hated it! Dad had an arrangement with the Pontiac dealer/owner that we'd buy his personal loaner every 2 years but this one was a lemon from day 1. The '80 two tone Parisienne was excellent...go figure.

The Sandman :sick: :shades:

roadburner

I'd say the same thing comparing our Mazda 3 to yours. More specialized equipment in your particular model.

Except for the fact that Mazda hyped the Mazdaspeed 3 as a high performance model that was capable of setting lap records at the 'Ring, even going so far as comparing Mazdaspeed to BMW's M division- a specially reinforced bodyshell, autobahn capable brakes, blah, blah, blah... And yet the shocks die by 26,000 miles? The EGR valve is DOA by 70,000 miles? The front brake pads and rotors cost more than the equivalent factory pieces for an E46 M3? I'm sorry, I can't give the car a pass- Mazda over-promised and under-delivered. I have NEVER owned a BMW that required anything more than brake pads after a summer of HPDEs, yet after one three day event the MS3 had a smoking turbo and a knocking LF strut. And I've since learned that the "autobahn tested" front brake calipers need to be rebuilt after five or six track events. Hmmm, never had to do that on any BMW I've tracked. Ever.
Look, I would never expect a standard Mazda family sedan to survive a track event unscathed, but the MS3 was supposed to be an entirely different animal. So in my case it turns out that the car that was supposed to be my daily driver/track toy can in reality only serve as a pedestrian commuter sled(a relatively boring one at that). And parts still keep breaking; I guess it wasn't track OR road tested.
Fooled me once...

crkyolfrt

I too think they should have made their new V6 available. (the one you can get in the new Grand Cherokee) With an optional 5 speed stick including a grand credit for choosing it.

And I say that feeling that I am not really a tight wad. That pwrtrain combo makes a lot of sense. I like that they made tire pressure monitoring crap, optional. I'd PAY THEM to NOT have that crap, if i had to.

Today while shovelling the end of drive (a twice daily event lately) not one, but two 88 or 89 Chev p/u's went by with the unmistakable 4.3 V6 sound. I know for a fact that one of them was a stick on the floor, and if you think that is a bit unusual, get this...they were both 4x4's!
Interestingly, another 88 or 89 Chev 4x4 went by that had the 6.2 l diesel that GM used before the Isuzu V8. I see that one go by all the time. The exhaust smell suggested that that old engine is in a very good state of tune. And FWIW, no less than 3 Dodge Cummins dsl 4x4 also went by...one of them was a dually I also see all the time. As you can tell, there are a lot of pickups in the area. Yes, most are 4x4, and an impressive number are diesels. Very rare to see a small p/u in this area, but if you do, even those are usually 4x4 Rangers/Mazdas outnumbering Tacomas and Frontiers at least 10 to 1.

mark156

Yes, I had one too. A 1981 Oldsmobile Delta 88 Royal Brougham diesel, Sandstone beige with matching vinyl top, burgundy velour. I was just starting to sell Real Estate and wanted good fuel mileage and a large car.

The Olds did get reasonably good mileage but it was a piece of crap. At three years and 48,000 miles, the engine died. I was using about a quart of oil every 1,000 miles. I died on me and had to be towed at least 3 time if remember correctly. The torque converter on the transmission would not work sometimes. Junk, junk, junk!!! :sick:

I have never bought another GM product and will never again. I'm stubborn and my one man boycott made Oldsmobile go out of business!! HA! :P

In fact, after the Oldsmobile, I bought all foreign cars until '96 when I bought a Jeep Grand Cherokee and then again in '99, a Jeep Grand Cherokee (owned by Mercedes at the time).

Mark156

roadburner

I bought all foreign cars until '96 when I bought a Jeep Grand Cherokee and then again in '99, a Jeep Grand Cherokee (owned by Mercedes at the time).

I've owned four domestics since 1974; a 1974 Monte Carlo, a 1973 Bronco V8(inherited from my father), a 1984 T Bird Turbo Coupe(manual tranny), and a 1999 Wrangler(which I still own). I think of the Jeep as being at least part German due to the Daimler Chrysler connection, and I've increased the German parts content by adding Bilstein shocks, Hella headlamps, and MB Quart speakers. Funny thing; I bought the Jeep to use as a parade car in an election campaign and I planned to sell it immediately after the election and go back to driving my 1993 Pathfinder work beater. It turns out we all liked the Jeep so much that I sold the Nissan instead.

isellhondas

Except for a few exceptions, five speeds simply do not sell and Jeep knows this. They would never build such a car.

Honda listened to a small but very vocal crowd a few years ago and they offered a six speed manual in Accord sedan V-6's. Since the manual coupes were near impossible to sell, they really should have known better but they built them anyway.

Against our wishes, Honda sent us two of those V-6 manual sedans. They were both there a year later. I remember someone finally sold one and another store made us VERY happy when they requested on on a dealer trade.

I'm sure someone's head rolled over that decision!

crkyolfrt

On the other hand, the type of person who seeks out a diesel is not your average tire kicker either. If they want a diesel, there is a very real possibility they want a manual.

As for your Accord example, not 1.5 weeks ago I was reading right here on one of the forums about a few, I think 2 but maybe even 3, and 4 if i included myself, all lusted in memory of how cool it would be to have a manual in the V6 Accord. They went on to say that they were available but extremely rare and hard to find.

I know you have (often) said that manuals were a hard sell at your dealership. FTR, I believe you. But all this really proves is something that we know to be true with lots of varying vehicles and configurations and even other consumer goods. Demographics. Just because something doesn't sell in one location, doesn't mean it is not actively sought after in another. This...anomaly, if you like, has even been expressed in colour (color) choice. Some locations can sell green cars til the cows come home. Others, wouldn't dream of stocking a green car, let alone a brown one. Others still can't keep enough silver or black in stock.

I firmly believe there are other more tangible reasons why some locations, (and the nation in general) sell fewer autos, and it is because as the nation has grown, so has congestion. And aside from the obvious strengths that an auto has whilst in that congestion, new drivers seem to be able to handle the numerous other cars around them as they try to change lanes on dozen lane freeway, easier with an auto than a manual. Same for congested downtown core traffic. Autos are easier for the masses.

But you won't sell an auto to someone who doesn't want one. I have found that there are very very few fence-sitters on this.

But getting back to my original point, you show me 10 people who seek out and prefer a diesel, and I'll bet you at least 7 or even 8 of them would prefer a manual if given the choice. Why? Well there are numerous reasons, but torque is one of if not the most predominant one. When you have gobs of torque all over the place just up from idle, there isn't much gear shifting required, so why not have it sit in a gear that you are giving away zero to slip/loss?

isellhondas

V-6 Accord manual sedans were only produced for two years and they didn't sell well in ANY part of the country although I don't doubt they may have sold a bit better in other parts of the country.

They even quit making 4 cyl leather EX Accords last year. They simply didn't sell enough of them to bother.

And I agree, that certain cars will sell better in certain areas. Here in the Seattle area, we have lots of hills and LOTS of traffic. Not a fun place to drive a manual.

As far as diesels and manuals, you are probably correct. diesels appeal to VERY few people at least around here and it would make sense that if those rare people want a diesel, they would more than likely want a manual too.

If diesel fuel were priced where it should be, I'm sure more people would want one.

Lastly, I actually did sell a lot of automatics to people who came in looking for a manual but I don't think I ever sold a stick to a person looking for an automatic.

Over the years, a lot of my hard core manual fans simply got tired of constantly clutching and shifting or they came to realize that the automatics had greatly improved over the automatics they used to despise.

Or they found out that we really didn't want their three year old hard to resell car with a manual.

houdini1

Thanks, I eventually learned that little trick of adding some regular gas to the diesel. It helped, but also hurt performance and I was never comfortable doing it.

houdini1

That is really a shame because those late 70's Oldsmobiles with gas engines were pretty good cars. They all started going down hill in the 80s.

stickguy

Hey, I tried my best here!

- owner of a 4 cyl, leather, EX, stick shift accord! (would have gotten the V6, but too cheap!)

isellhondas

Yep, those gas Olds engines were great!

GM really went through some dark times. People stood in line and paid top dollar for them only to find out that they didn't last long. As used cars, they were impossible to sell because of their reputation.

And, they laid another egg with their 6.2 truck engine. Another junker.

I did know a co worker who bought an Olds Cutlass Diesel brand new. It had a five speed manual which I guess were extremely rare.

It never gave him a lick of trouble intil he sold it with over 100,000 miles.

His was the exception and he knew it!

isellhondas

Hey, you did your share!

It's too bad there weren't more like you!

andre1969

I did know a co worker who bought an Olds Cutlass Diesel brand new. It had a five speed manual which I guess were extremely rare

Lemme guess, a '79 Cutlass with the tiny 260 V-8 Diesel? For whatever reason, Olds offered that 260, both gas and Diesel, with a 5-speed. However, the 231 could be had with a 3- or 4-speed stick, while the 305 could only be had with a 4-speed stick. And, of course, a 3-speed automatic was optional on all of them.

dunno why the 260 was so special, that it got the 5-speed, though?

From what I've heard, the 260 Diesel wasn't nearly as bad as the 350. But it was a gutless wonder, with something like 85-90 hp, compared to around 120 for the 350. Maybe because the 260 was the same basic block, as the 350, but probably had more meat on it, since it wasn't bored out as much? And, having less hp and torque, probably meant it didn't stress out the block as much?

crkyolfrt

I am pretty ssure that Cutlass diesel was Detroit engine (same co that made big truck engines) From what I understand it was a very good engine and delivered impressive fuel economy. While the hp numbers seem low, (i didn't know they were that low) I'll bet the torque figure was just fine. I also didn't know u could get them with a stick. I have a feeling Cda never got any sticks. What a nice car that would have been. They were quiet, rode well, roomy, good trunk, good visibility and were basically good cars. Make mine a wagon with a 5 dpeed stick.

The 6.2 were too? Or were they? I know the 6.5 was a better engine but to what degree i am not sure. I think they turbo'd the 6.5 didn't they? The guy who has one that goes by my drive all the time, is either the 6.2 or 6.5. He oils it, and the exhaust smells like it is in a good state of tune, so my guess is he is happy with it and expects it to last a long time still. It's a 4x4. Might even be a stick..

andre1969

The 6.2 were too? Or were they? I know the 6.5 was a better engine but to what degree i am not sure.

I don't know much about the 6.2, but I heard it was at least a dedicated Diesel block, and not a converted gas engine. Wasn't that one outsourced as well, perhaps to Detroit Diesel? One thing that was kinda cool about that 6.2 is that you could get it in a half-ton truck. In later years, you had to get a 3/4 or 1-ton truck if you wanted a Diesel.

My uncle had a 1994 GMC Sierra with the 6.5 and yeah, it was a turbodiesel. IIRC, it actually had the same bore and stroke as a Chevy 396, which led me to believe it might've been a converted gas engine too, but that was merely coincidence. Anyway, my uncle's was nothing but trouble. He bought it used in late 1996, with only 20,000 or so miles on it. There was always some sensor or computer component or something failing on it, and it seemed like it went back to the dealer for service every few weeks. He finally got fed up with it and in May, 1997, traded it for a new Silverado with the 4.3 V-6, which he still owns.

crkyolfrt

Interesting..that's right about the half ton!..I had totally forgotten about that. Sorry to hear about the 6.5. I guess the 6.2 was the better engine. Yes it was no gas block. Pretty sure that was only the 350 Olds gas block was only one. One of these days I'm gonna flag this guy down and ask him about his truck if he isn't in a hurry anywhere. He never seems to be. I have a feeling his is a half ton. I'm gonna look closer for full floating rear axle when he goes buy next, but I'm pretty sure it's a light one.

qbrozen

Even at $17k, it would be overpaying... but not by much. Call $17k the end of the world on that M5.

28firefighter

We replaced the torque converter and that eliminated the active symptoms with transmission. Warranty did indeed pick up the tab. Also the car received a DME update, and will be going back again 2 weeks to finish up having two oil leaks fixed (one in the VANOS oil line, and the oil filter housing gasket).

I'm also going to let him look at the Transmission Fluid. At this point, I have nothing to lose by letting him do it because it is out of warranty as of tomorrow. This place uses a method of draining the fluid, and looks at it - if it has a lot of particulates in it, they put in a fluid additive and add just a little new fluid to top it off, and put the old stuff back in with a new filter. If it is clean, they put in all new fluid with a new filter.

Not sure what I'm going to do when it is completely fixed. I really do love the car...

crkyolfrt

" if it has a lot of particulates in it, they put in a fluid additive and add just a little new fluid to top it off, and put the old stuff back in with a new filter. If it is clean, they put in all new fluid with a new filter. "

I didn't follow this scenario. If the old fluid has particulates in it, what is the advantage of a fluid additive over replacing with new fluid in both cases?

Glad to hear they got you fixed under wty. 6 days is cutting it close. What would the tab had been if you were paying?

28firefighter

The idea is that the transmission has been functioning with the particulate-laden fluid for so long, that removing it and replacing it with all clean fluid could actually accelerate the demise of the transmission. The fluid additive is put in no matter what - I'm not sure what the stuff is called off the top of my head.

Without the warranty picking up the tab, the torque converter would have been about $800 for the part, and another $1000-$1200 in labor.

isellhondas

I have yet to see any additive that can replace worn parts.

Maybe they just want it to hang in there until the warranty expires?

stickguy

seems odd to me. I always thought it was the particulates floating around that were going to do the damage? And if the innards were starting to shred, it wasn't long for the world anyway.

I do know that power flushes can be dangerous since it could disturb "sediment" and push it into small orifices, totally clogging up the tranny, but I just don't see how draining the crap out is going to make it fail sooner.

also, this is why you should buy a car with a stick shift! BMW owners with manually trannys don't have to go through this.

houdini1

I'm not sure what the stuff is called off the top of my head.

SAWDUST !!

akangl

I haven't been on in over a week and wow, lots to read through. My kids have been keeping me busy...."Mom! Drive me here!". Have only had the Pilot 10 days and its already well over 850 miles. Already has its first boo-boo out of the way too, broke the driver's side foglight sometime in the first 48 hrs. Its not all the way through, but has a nice hole in it from a rock, not as tough as the '07s foglights.

Had the running boards and vent shades installed last week, very happy with both. They do exactly what I was hoping they would and the Pilot looks a littler more like an SUV. Tuesday the Pilot gets an iPod adapter and HIDs, after that I might look into an autostart, not the Honda one though, its too quirky.

28fire.....sorry to hear about more problems with your car, hope it settles down after this and you can drive it for a bit without worry.

28firefighter

The car is back to normal right now, save for the leaks which aren't causing it to drive differently. There is nothing more that we could report to get replaced under warranty.

We'll see.

Sandman6472

Hope all the problems stop now so you can enjoy it. Saw a gorgeous '04 or '05 titanium looking 3 series at a light earlier & it took my breathe away...looked to have a grayish interior also. Nice looking ride and would sure be fun to own it. But then the light changed & I was pulled back into reality...such is life. Luckily the Mazda needed petrol when wifey got home so I got my speed fix just going up to the station. Man, with 86k + on it, it still hauls [non-permissible content removed] so smoothly & shifts so gently I get a smile on my face each time I get to drive it!
Will definitely hate to see that puppy go but the mileage is plain awful for a four cylinder engine. Really need something that breaks 30 in city driving with the same attributes as the M3.

The Sandman :sick: :shades:

stickguy

says a lot that even with these issues, you still love it enough to want to keep it. Any appliance type car and it would be toast by now!

Good thing that if I was to finally get my own BMW it would be a stick, with an NA engine. So no HPFP or TC to fail!

roadburner

says a lot that even with these issues, you still love it enough to want to keep it. Any appliance type car and it would be toast by now!

Tell me about it; every time I walk out to the detached garage and see the gas cans for my mowers I look over at the Mazda parked next to them and I fleetingly wish for a box of matches... :mad:

28firefighter

My mother would love nothing more than to see this car ceremonially burned. But alas, my parents don't live close by so the car remains.

roadburner

I told my wife I might go look at a 370Z or a Mustang 5.0 and her exact words were:

"Don't even bother looking at anything else; just find the right BMW. You and I both know that you won't really be happy with anything else- and I don't want to listen to you complain about the car you are driving for another four years."

Bless her heart...

28firefighter

Burner,

While you are online, let me run something by you. So the car I'd say is about 95% normal save for this one thing...When I'm cruising at say 65mph, the transmission is in 5th gear. If I lightly lay onto the accelerator (say to slightly increase speed but not kick it to downshift), instead of the engine revving, the power bogs and drops instead of increasing, and then if I continue to lay in it will eventually start revving again and downshift if I continue into it.

What would cause that? Fuel delivery issue?

roadburner

It could be a number of things- MAF sensor, a small vacuum leak, throttle body, fuel pressure regulator... it's really difficult to say. Me, I'd try cheap and dirty fix method #1: Add a large bottle of Techron to an almost empty tank of gas and then fill up with a good brand name fuel such as Shell. The stuff works, and if you have a few dirty injectors or severe valve/combustion chamber deposits it might well resolve the issue.

28firefighter

I've been able to rule out the MAF and Vacuum Leak thing since it was just smoke tested as part of the diagnostics while it was in the shop and they also checked the MAF. There is an existing oil leak on the vanos line and on the oil filter housing gasket that I suppose could be letting in some air to mess things up.

I'll try that Techron stuff out, too bad I just had to fill up today. Granted, I put 80 miles on it, so it shouldn't be long.

Thanks!