Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous

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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 206,647
    sb55 said:

    Punch to report. 2021 Toyota Venza Limited replaced the 2014 BMW 535d.

    BTW, I was able to see how to edit my profile. But after changing it on the page, then it said I didn't have permission to change it. Is this a moderator only step?

    Once you click on "Edit Profile", look to the right hand side of the page, and click on "Signature Settings"

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  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623
    over the weekend I drove past a big Ford dealer near me. The front lot usually full of PUs was empty. but the main lot had quite a bit of stock. But it looked to be mostly just police Explorers. A sea of white SUVs with black steelies. Must have been 50 of them.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623
    might have missed the Maverick train. Saw something online today that the Hybrids were going to be hard to come by, because they already had over 80,000 preorders for them. Not sure about 2.0Ts.

    one dealer in Kansas had a video up today of a walk around of the first one they got in. Looks really good in person.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTMember Posts: 17,309
    edited August 2021
    @stickguy,
    I wonder if there is a minimum order allocation by dealer?
    Would help keep the smaller guys in the game.
    In other words, everyone gets a place or two in line.
    2020 Ford Explorer XLT
  • corvettecorvette United StatesMember Posts: 9,053
    One thing I've noticed, there don't appear to be many or any "early releases" of 2022 models. If the manufacturers walk the tightrope carefully, they can probably finagle it so that they are down to almost no 2021 inventory before they release any 2022 models for sale, and thus minimize the use of the typical "model year changeover" incentives.
  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoModerator Posts: 204,466
    sb55 said:

    qbrozen said:

    sb55 said:

    Punch to report. 2021 Toyota Venza Limited replaced the 2014 BMW 535d.

    BTW, I was able to see how to edit my profile. But after changing it on the page, then it said I didn't have permission to change it. Is this a moderator only step?

    If you are trying to change your signature, it is in a different place. When you get to the Edit Profile page, look on the right side for the Signature Settings link.

    Very interesting swap, BTW. Diesel 5-series wagon for a hybrid 'yota wagon.
    The former 2014 BMW 535d was a sedan. No 5 series wagons after 2013 (I think).
    My wife's eyesight isn't as great as it was (torn retina + some other issues) and she wanted some of the new safety features. We looked at an X-5, but it's out of our price range.
    This Venza is loaded and we had a deposit on one for over 3 months locally. 2 local dealers couldn't get one or even swap for one. We found a dealer 150 miles away and this one was a cancelled order, so it came together fast. We got $2800.00 off and they offered $1,000.00 more for the trade than the local dealer that would only sell a new car at list price. They even delivered it to us and drove the BMW away. Were ok with the whole thing.
    Congrats!

    My sister is very interested in the Venza, probably in the next year or two.

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  • tjc78tjc78 South JerseyMember Posts: 13,581

    @stickguy said:
    over the weekend I drove past a big Ford dealer near me. The front lot usually full of PUs was empty. but the main lot had quite a bit of stock. But it looked to be mostly just police Explorers. A sea of white SUVs with black steelies. Must have been 50 of them.

    Whenever I browsed there they always had a ton of fleet vehicles. They must have all the local PD contracts. Assuming this is the one on 561.

    2020 Volvo XC90 T6 Momentum / 2019 Volvo S60 T6 Inscription

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623
    yup. Winner.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623

    @stickguy,
    I wonder if there is a minimum order allocation by dealer?
    Would help keep the smaller guys in the game.
    In other words, everyone gets a place or two in line.

    that is the interesting part of the new system. There is no dealer allocation. Everything is buyers ordering online, then picking what dealer they want to get it at. So it looks like some small dealers got smart and are offering discounts, and publicizing it. So, people that aren't even local are assigning their orders to the little guys. They are going to sell a ton more cars than if they had to go with the usual allocation system where the big dealers got to hog most of the inventory.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 30,867

    We considered the Venza up until I found out you can’t get a moonroof. Very very odd oversight. That kills it for the wife.

    '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c, '21 WRX, '20 S90 T6, '22 4xE. 62-car history and counting! MB Sprinter and '92 Nissan Gloria on the way!

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623
    corvette said:

    One thing I've noticed, there don't appear to be many or any "early releases" of 2022 models. If the manufacturers walk the tightrope carefully, they can probably finagle it so that they are down to almost no 2021 inventory before they release any 2022 models for sale, and thus minimize the use of the typical "model year changeover" incentives.

    looks like discounts are few and far between on most everything. And inventories so short, no need for year end incentives. Dealers might be selling fewer cars, but they are making a whole lot more on every sale. Same with the manufacturers. Selling less, but offset by not having to pump huge incentives to move the metal.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623
    qbrozen said:

    We considered the Venza up until I found out you can’t get a moonroof. Very very odd oversight. That kills it for the wife.

    I was very interested too until I found that out. You get a nice big glass panel and the nifty electronic frosting trick, but not opening is no good to me! My wife, she probably would not care.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • tjc78tjc78 South JerseyMember Posts: 13,581

    No moonroof. That’s just nuts.

    2020 Volvo XC90 T6 Momentum / 2019 Volvo S60 T6 Inscription

  • ronsteveronsteve LooavulMember Posts: 1,050

    @qbrozen said:
    If you are trying to change your signature, it is in a different place. When you get to the Edit Profile page, look on the right side for the Signature Settings link.

    Very interesting swap, BTW. Diesel 5-series wagon for a hybrid 'yota wagon.

    I wouldn’t call the new Venza a wagon any more than a 2010+ Outback. Neither one has a lower overall height than my RDX. To me that screams SUV.

    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2013 VW Jetta 2.5SE
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 15,743
    edited August 2021
    I'm still in search mode right now; unless something else REALLY catches my eye(400Z maybe?), the four possibilities are:
    M2 Comp
    M4 Comp
    G42 M240i(RWD, and only if sunroof delete is still an option)
    2021 Supra 3.0
    I have a couple of friends who are professional automotive writers and I've questioned them at length about some other cars and they talked me down from a couple of cars and essentially agree that I'd be happiest in one of the above.
    I think back to a Car and Driver writer who used to proclaim, "Stop deadly four door brain rot!"- and I suppose his philosophy has influenced my current fleet as well as future acquisitions.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2014 M235i; 2009 Cooper Clubman; 1999 Wrangler; 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,380

    The four door vehicle really depends on where you are with kids and how often people are riding in the back. You can make it work with a two door but it sure is a pain getting kids out of car seats

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 15,743
    edited August 2021
    From about the time my son was two the Club Sport was the car we usually drove. When he turned three my wife bought another ti, relegating the 1993 Pathfinder SE to commuter sled. She only traded it for the 528i because we needed to haul our elderly mothers around.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2014 M235i; 2009 Cooper Clubman; 1999 Wrangler; 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaMember Posts: 15,761
    edited August 2021
    mjfloyd1 said:

    The four door vehicle really depends on where you are with kids and how often people are riding in the back. You can make it work with a two door but it sure is a pain getting kids out of car seats

    Yes. My mother had nothing but two door cars when I was growing up. I honestly cannot remember a single four-door car. Even the wagon (Pinto) and barge (Eldorado) she drove were two doors! That experience ruined me. I doubt I'll ever own a car with only two doors. Well, a car with more seats than doors... how's that? :D
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • corvettecorvette United StatesMember Posts: 9,053
    qbrozen said:

    We considered the Venza up until I found out you can’t get a moonroof. Very very odd oversight. That kills it for the wife.

    The RAV4 Hybrid has the same powertain, is less expensive, and some reviewers say the interior doesn't feel any smaller, but I'm not sure whether a moonroof is available.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTMember Posts: 15,288

    @sb55 said:
    Punch to report. 2021 Toyota Venza Limited replaced the 2014 BMW 535d.

    BTW, I was able to see how to edit my profile. But after changing it on the page, then it said I didn't have permission to change it. Is this a moderator only step?

    Congrats on the Venza! What color? Did your BMW have any problems? Aging issues?

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Unlimited 4Xe

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623
    So it is all an image or ego thing? Doors don't have any real relation to performance. I prefer 4 door because I spent a lot of time in my early days with 2 door cars and hated the overly long, heavy ones when dealing with tight parking spots, and especially in the garage where there is very little clearance. 2 doors just have no functional benefit IMO.

    but, to each his own.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 30,867
    edited August 2021

    @ronsteve said:

    @qbrozen said:
    If you are trying to change your signature, it is in a different place. When you get to the Edit Profile page, look on the right side for the Signature Settings link.

    Very interesting swap, BTW. Diesel 5-series wagon for a hybrid 'yota wagon.

    I wouldn’t call the new Venza a wagon any more than a 2010+ Outback. Neither one has a lower overall height than my RDX. To me that screams SUV.

    You make the marketers very happy.

    I’ll put it this way… the Venza is 6” taller than a Dodge Magnum but 10” shorter than a Chevy Tahoe. If I am putting it in a category, I gotta go with the one it more closely resembles.

    I can accept CUV, if that makes you feel any better. ;)

    '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c, '21 WRX, '20 S90 T6, '22 4xE. 62-car history and counting! MB Sprinter and '92 Nissan Gloria on the way!

  • corvettecorvette United StatesMember Posts: 9,053
    qbrozen said:


    I can accept CUV, if that makes you feel any better. ;)

    My brain still auto-translates CUV as "compact utility vehicle," which really throws me off when we're talking about something relatively big like a Pilot or Enclave.
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAMember Posts: 13,084
    stickguy said:

    So it is all an image or ego thing? Doors don't have any real relation to performance. I prefer 4 door because I spent a lot of time in my early days with 2 door cars and hated the overly long, heavy ones when dealing with tight parking spots, and especially in the garage where there is very little clearance. 2 doors just have no functional benefit IMO.

    but, to each his own.

    2 DOORS are in fact, lighter than 4 doors, no matter how big the 2 doors are, 4 doors will be heavier because they are never twice as heavy.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTMember Posts: 15,288

    I went to the dentist tonight for my regular cleaning & had him check out the tooth that broke as a result of the auto accident. It’s a Wisdom tooth, it is really broken & needs to be extracted.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Unlimited 4Xe

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 15,743
    nyccarguy said:

    I went to the dentist tonight for my regular cleaning & had him check out the tooth that broke as a result of the auto accident. It’s a Wisdom tooth, it is really broken & needs to be extracted.

    Ouch! I've had two pulled; not fun.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2014 M235i; 2009 Cooper Clubman; 1999 Wrangler; 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 15,743
    To me, two more doors are like a hole in the roof- why get them if you are never going to use them?

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2014 M235i; 2009 Cooper Clubman; 1999 Wrangler; 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623
    well, why get doors that are 50% bigger and heavier if you don't need it?

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 19,904
    edited August 2021
    nyccarguy said:

    I went to the dentist tonight for my regular cleaning & had him check out the tooth that broke as a result of the auto accident. It’s a Wisdom tooth, it is really broken & needs to be extracted.

    That’s the gold standard for a lawsuit. The rule is : a least one broken bone. A tooth qualifies.

    A woman t-boned my father and claimed she chipped a tooth in the collision. Sued him for a million dollars. I’m sure his insurance settled for a lot less to make her go away.

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2004 Chevy Van, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • sb55sb55 On an Island in VermontMember Posts: 570
    nyccarguy said:

    @sb55 said:

    Punch to report. 2021 Toyota Venza Limited replaced the 2014 BMW 535d.

    BTW, I was able to see how to edit my profile. But after changing it on the page, then it said I didn't have permission to change it. Is this a moderator only step?

    Congrats on the Venza! What color? Did your BMW have any problems? Aging issues?


    Venza is "Coastal Gray" which is blueish in some light. Interior is "Boulder", which is light gray.
    The 2014 BMW 535d was CPO and we bought extended warranty that ran out. It was a great riding car, but it was in the shop a lot. Not a huge PITA because we always got a loaner. BMW replaced a lot of parts and we lost confidence in it. It threw a lot of CELs and the lead time for service became weeks out. One time it was in the shop for 3 weeks while they replaced the whole fuel system. I looked over our service records, and it was in the shop for warranty/covered repairs items about 14 times while we owned it for just over 5 years.

    2021 Toyota Venza Limited, 2017 Chevy Silverado LTZ Ext. cab with 6.2 V-8, 2007 Mazda MX-5 Miata PRHT

  • corvettecorvette United StatesMember Posts: 9,053
    nyccarguy said:

    I went to the dentist tonight for my regular cleaning & had him check out the tooth that broke as a result of the auto accident. It’s a Wisdom tooth, it is really broken & needs to be extracted.

    Ouch! I had all four of mine pulled in my early 20s under general anesthesia.
  • au1994au1994 GAMember Posts: 2,769
    Congrats on the punch @sb55.

    Sounds like a good deal in this crazy market. With all the issues the BMW had I don’t blame you for dumping it since it was now out of warranty.

    2021 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4xe Granite Crystal over Saddle
    2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
    2011 BMW 328i Jet Black over Tan

  • corvettecorvette United StatesMember Posts: 9,053
    sb55 said:

    BMW replaced a lot of parts and we lost confidence in it. It threw a lot of CELs and the lead time for service became weeks out. One time it was in the shop for 3 weeks while they replaced the whole fuel system. I looked over our service records, and it was in the shop for warranty/covered repairs items about 14 times while we owned it for just over 5 years.

    I know a lot of people here have had good experiences, but this seems to be a cautionary tale about owning European cars out of warranty.
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 15,743

    @stickguy said:
    well, why get doors that are 50% bigger and heavier if you don't need it?

    If the car itself isn’t heavier it’s a non issue to me.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2014 M235i; 2009 Cooper Clubman; 1999 Wrangler; 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 15,743

    @corvette said:
    I know a lot of people here have had good experiences, but this seems to be a cautionary tale about owning European cars out of warranty.

    BMW diesels have a pretty solid reputation for developing numerous issues as they age, so I’m not surprised. The quality of the dealership’s service department is also a major factor.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2014 M235i; 2009 Cooper Clubman; 1999 Wrangler; 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • 28firefighter28firefighter Seattle, WAMember Posts: 8,569

    My understanding is those diesels also go through a midlife teething phase and then smooth out in terms of issues. But probably not an engine I’d gamble on.

    2021 Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2008 Infiniti G35
  • ronsteveronsteve LooavulMember Posts: 1,050

    @qbrozen said:

    @ronsteve said:

    @qbrozen said:
    If you are trying to change your signature, it is in a different place. When you get to the Edit Profile page, look on the right side for the Signature Settings link.

    Very interesting swap, BTW. Diesel 5-series wagon for a hybrid 'yota wagon.

    I wouldn’t call the new Venza a wagon any more than a 2010+ Outback. Neither one has a lower overall height than my RDX. To me that screams SUV.

    You make the marketers very happy.

    I’ll put it this way… the Venza is 6” taller than a Dodge Magnum but 10” shorter than a Chevy Tahoe. If I am putting it in a category, I gotta go with the one it more closely resembles.

    I can accept CUV, if that makes you feel any better. ;)

    SUV vs CUV seems pedantic to me. And why would marketers like me? It was definitely NOT a good thing when the Outback stopped being a wagon. When I got the RDX I was settling, as wagons at my preferred age/mileage/price point were near impossible to find.

    The Venza most closely resembles Edge/Murano/Outback.

    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2013 VW Jetta 2.5SE
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTMember Posts: 17,309
    As far as I can remember, definitely subject to scrutiny, the Outback has always been a lifted wagon,
    Subaru concurrently had a wagon version of the Legacy.
    2020 Ford Explorer XLT
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTMember Posts: 17,309
    Ford pickup model size comparison.

    2020 Ford Explorer XLT
  • au1994au1994 GAMember Posts: 2,769
    I gotta say, that Maverick is a sharp looking little rig. That color in the comparison is cool.

    2021 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4xe Granite Crystal over Saddle
    2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
    2011 BMW 328i Jet Black over Tan

  • au1994au1994 GAMember Posts: 2,769

    As far as I can remember, definitely subject to scrutiny, the Outback has always been a lifted wagon,
    Subaru concurrently had a wagon version of the Legacy.

    Yes, thats the way I remember it as well.

    The Legacy XT wagon was a good looking sleeper for a while.

    2021 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4xe Granite Crystal over Saddle
    2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
    2011 BMW 328i Jet Black over Tan

  • ronsteveronsteve LooavulMember Posts: 1,050

    As far as I can remember, definitely subject to scrutiny, the Outback has always been a lifted wagon,
    Subaru concurrently had a wagon version of the Legacy.

    In 2010, the Outback's greenhouse got ~4 inches taller. Wheelbase grew almost 3 inches but overall length reduced by about 1 inch. IMHO a quantum leap into SUV-land.
    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2013 VW Jetta 2.5SE
  • jmonroe1jmonroe1 Pittsburgh areaMember Posts: 4,448
    sb55 said:

    nyccarguy said:

    @sb55 said:

    Punch to report. 2021 Toyota Venza Limited replaced the 2014 BMW 535d.

    BTW, I was able to see how to edit my profile. But after changing it on the page, then it said I didn't have permission to change it. Is this a moderator only step?

    Congrats on the Venza! What color? Did your BMW have any problems? Aging issues?

    Venza is "Coastal Gray" which is blueish in some light. Interior is "Boulder", which is light gray.
    The 2014 BMW 535d was CPO and we bought extended warranty that ran out. It was a great riding car, but it was in the shop a lot. Not a huge PITA because we always got a loaner. BMW replaced a lot of parts and we lost confidence in it. It threw a lot of CELs and the lead time for service became weeks out. One time it was in the shop for 3 weeks while they replaced the whole fuel system. I looked over our service records, and it was in the shop for warranty/covered repairs items about 14 times while we owned it for just over 5 years.

    Good luck with the Venza. After owning a troublesome car you deserve it. You paid your dues.

    As for the old BMW, if the factory didn’t authorize the whole system change out BMW has to be furious with that dealers service department for throwing darts trying to solve the problem. You’d think a dart would land in the right spot after a few tries but some service departments must be downright unlucky or bad.

    jmonroe
    '15 Genesis just like jmonroe, '18 Legacy Limited with 3.6R (Mrs. j's)
  • sdasda Indian Land, SCMember Posts: 5,571

    My understanding is those diesels also go through a midlife teething phase and then smooth out in terms of issues. But probably not an engine I’d gamble on.

    I can do without any type of mid-life crisis. Pass.

    2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623

    Ford pickup model size comparison.

    Nice chart, but wish they would add width. That’s probably more important than length in terms of Parking and fitting in the garage doors!

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623
    IMO the outback, Audi all road and Volvo V60CC are all just jacked up AWD station wagons.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,037
    edited August 2021
    The new Maverick is 72.6 inches wide, and so should fit into even a narrow garage.

    https://media.ford.com/content/dam/fordmedia/North America/US/product/2022/maverick/pdf/2022-Ford-Maverick-Technical-Specifications.pdf

    I think if I were getting a Maverick I'd spring for the 2.0T and AWD.
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2018 Honda CR-V EX AWD (wife's)
  • au1994au1994 GAMember Posts: 2,769
    edited August 2021
    I think I have mentioned that patience is not one of my virtues. Today in my weekly Jeep Chat status check I was given the same old ‘gathering the parts and materials’ answer so I asked that my case be escalated.

    Will it do any good? Probably not but I will take my hollow victory as it at least made me feel better.

    Oh and as if I needed another reminder that I married well, I pointed out a Wrangler in our color to my wife the other night. She liked it and wanted to know if ours will ‘sit up high like that one’. So yeah, she wants a small lift and bigger tires.

    Of course that will probably change when she sees the cost!

    2021 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4xe Granite Crystal over Saddle
    2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
    2011 BMW 328i Jet Black over Tan

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,623
    edited August 2021
    benjaminh said:

    The new Maverick is 72.6 inches wide, and so should fit into even narrow garages.

    https://media.ford.com/content/dam/fordmedia/North America/US/product/2022/maverick/pdf/2022-Ford-Maverick-Technical-Specifications.pdf

    I think if I were getting a Maverick I'd spring for the 2.0T and AWD.

    Thanks. I’ve looked it up before but don’t remember details. That is a manageable size. Ranger IIRC is maybe 75” wide? Just thought it would be handy if Ford did a front view also showing width.

    I go back and forth. The turbo AWD is more traditional truck, right down to poor MPG. the hybrid though, seems like a neat option. I guess it depends on what you really need.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

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