Honda Odyssey 2005+

stickguy

$500 increase fro an EX_l would be great, considering the new features (the moonroof alone will account for that difference). That puts it around 29.5K, so even at MSRP it will be very competitive with the SIenna, which runs up around around 33K I believe for an XLE with leather and a roof.

rorr

Actually, the closest model Sienna to the Ody EX-L I've been able to figure is an XLE with pkg#14. This gives you the leather, moonroof, CD changer, and all the safety goodies. MSRP on this puppy ('04 prices) is nearly $34k. From what I understand, there is a price hike on the '05 Siennas (???). So figure the equivalent '05 Sienna XLE would run closer to $34.5k MSRP.

That's a $5k delta in the MSRP between the Ody EX-L and the comparable Sienna XLE (assuming the EX-L is indeed at $29.5k). Ouch.

The only thing I can't figure is, if the Ody will enjoy such a price advantage, why in the heck are they being so closed mouthed about prices? If my bread-n-butter trim level, which is expected to account for close to 50% of my van sales, had a $5k price advantage over it's main competition, I would be shouting the prices from the rooftops.

markhoot

Does the EX without leather have a power driver's and passenger seat? And 2 power doors? Thanks.

Mark

robertsmx

8-way power seat for driver w/lumbar support as well as Power Sliding door are standard in EX, EX-L and Touring.

rorr

Um....is that "door" singular, or "doorS" plural?

markhoot - I'm about 99.5% sure the EX has 2 power doors. It does not have a power passenger seat. I think(?) the Sienna XLE has added power passenger seat for '05 (hence, the price increase), but I'm not sure of this.

robertsmx

plural. "power sliding doors" standard in EX, EX-L and Touring.

andrewtran71

I think they are biased in terms of liking "performance" vehicles over quiet and cushy vehicles, but not when it comes to decibel readings.
For example, in their June 2004 issue, C&D gave the Sienna something like a 68dBA, T&C 69dBA, and Ody 70dBA @ 70mph, but they still ranked the Ody #1 over the Sienna because the Ody "performed" better in their opinion.

buckeye1

Toyota and Honda: 2 super vehicle makers.

I take C&D more for entertainment than for scientific revelations about the auto industry.

Unfortunately, we will have to wait for Consumers Report to arrive with more complete and objective findings about both minivans, imo.

beagle1

Thanks for the reply,if I get any info i'll post it.

heywood1

I read a lot of automobile publications, and I find reviews in 'Consumer Reports' to be among the worst. Maybe it's because they're written for the non-enthusiast majority. But it seems as though C-R is strictly focused on 'bang for the buck,' and overlooks some of the more subtle and subjective points.

I sure wouldn't consider C-R to be the gold standard of automotive reviews. Just MO.

andrewtran71

I don't recall CR doing interior noise level measurement.
So without actual numbers to support their reviews, how objective can they be?

andrewtran71

I think CR is good for overall reliability record.
Combine that with the JD Powers long term reliability report, and you get a better view of reliability.

Yeah, if I want a good review on cars, I look to Car magazines. If I want a good for stereo system, I look to stereo magazines. If I want a good review on LCD, Plasma TV, etc, I look to video magazines.
CR is just good for reliability reports, and there are other sources for that as well.

If you want to know which vehicle is quieter, smoother, cushier, handles better around corners, you look to car magazines, IMO.

rorr

"If you want to know which vehicle is quieter, smoother, cushier, handles better around corners, you look to car magazines, IMO."

And then TEST DRIVE IT. Try to avoid the common pitfalls of falling in love with a car based on reviews and photos (or website threads) and then 'living' with some annoying idiocycracy which bothers the heck out of YOU but wasn't on the reviewers radar screen.

badgerfan

Until I was sure Honda could design and build a decent automatic transmission for their minivans. Seems they have had nagging issues, large and small since they got into the minivan market.

lumbar

Wasn't the tranny recall based on a really small number of -actual- failures (as opposed to potential ones, I suppose)?

dofranck

Just got a call from my salesman. Apparently Honda shipped Ody's early from Alabama to avoid Hurricane. EX-L I'm wait listed for has MSRP of 30,810. I'm going in this weekend to take a look.

sdeggo

That is exciting news, I am going to call my dealer, I will let you know if mine is early too.

stickguy

Well, is $30,810 is the true MRSP (w/o any delaer adds or other optins) then it is quite a bit higher than the speculation of $29,500. Without discounts, it's starting to get high enough that it competes with more "luxury" vehicles.

jchan2

is still less than the cost of a Toyota Sienna XLE w/ PKG #14

dfc101a

The price you were quoted is a straight EX-L - no NAV and/or RES?

awesome9again

The 05 Odyssey looks like the 96 Odyssey station wagon.

qvee

I agree with your assessment on the '05 pricing. We will see what the market will decide.

lumbar

If no Nav and/or RES, the comparable '04 would be MSRP 28980 -including- destination charge. That would be quite a bit out of line with speculation/Honda "leaks" as to the price increase.

lynnw

I dont know about that?! My sister has an '03 and when she took her Ody to the dealer because the tranny was slipping she was told that they ALL had that problem and they did not have a fix for them at the time. They actually told her she would have to live with it. That was last year some time. She got her recall letter on the tranny last month and still has not taken it in (because of hurricanes, I live in Florida) but when she does, it will be nice to know if they really do fix the problem. It is really annoying. I have driven her van and had it "act up" on me and it just feels like the whole thing just stopped running. Scary.

lynnw

If that price is without nav/res then one could see that same van up to $34,000 with it added on. Sounds like the touring will be up around at least $37 or $38K. I knew that the price would be up there.

lumbar

I obviously don't have any knowledge of your sister's particular situation, but, as a general matter, it is not that unusual for dealers to claim, as something of a cop-out, that a particular problem that they cannot fix is present in -all- vehicles (or is in fact more widespread than it is). I can only pass along that Honda itself indicated that the problem that generated the recall was actually found in (I believe) from 3-4 dozen higher mileage vehicles. Now if they're lying, that's obviously a different story....

amykkbc

Toyota always overprice their stuff, and w/ a lot more stuff in their package that you don't want. Hence, people are almost always getting 3K +/- or 10% discount off the Toyota, which brings it to Ody.'s level. And hence, that's why most people will pay Ody. at MSRP, and a Toyota at $3000 or 10% discount.

dofranck

I'll check out the EX-L on Saturday and report back on specifics (pricing, destination, and options).

stickguy

a 2K increase for the EX-L is a lot more than had been speculated, including from many of the magazines, etc. that supposedly had "official" info. In any case, it gives away any price advantage they had over Toyota. That of course assumes that Honda will continue to have a fairly narrow spread of invoice to MSRP, and the prices are initially at or close to sticker, and TOyotas continue to be discounted 1.5 -2K.

I think my point is, you can cross shop and pick the one that floats your boat the most, and the price (big surprise here) will end up being close.

But, if the pricing is more than the market cares for, than the 1K off MSRP deals may come sooner than expected. SInce I was mentally prepared for about 29.5 MSRP and paying about that, 30.8 -1K ends up about the same place.

Maybe they should pull a Ford, and set the price to 35K, and offer 4K rebates at intro!

mochisushi

I just called my salesman. According to him, Honda may have shipped them, but in Denver, they will be held at the rail yard until the 22nd. He also said that everyone "plays by the same rules". It will be interesting to see if your salesman is telling the truth. I hope so for your sake...Good Luck!!

lumbar

In all fairness, at this point, I don't think we can assume without hearing more from the poster, that the price did -not- include either NAV or a DVD. This may be wishful thinking, but the numbers seem to work without factoring in a destination fee.

cabaiste

dofranck,
Does the EX-L you ordered have RES/NAVI or not and does the price quoted by the salesperson include destination charges?

aaaedgarpoe

I have been looking for a new car for 2 years now. After spending about 1 1/2 to 3 hours each day for this period reading web site after web site, forum after forum, I have come to the conclusion that Honda has had the best success in providing $ for $ value to the consumer, be it reliability, safety, comfort, or performance. I would rate Toyota a little behind Honda; there are numerous things that show me Toyota is less sensitive to the consumer than Honda. Toward the bottom I would put Ford and GM, which is sad for me as I have not forgotten the Bataan Death March, and many other things. I don't have any real comment on the other auto manufactures since it is easier to distinguish the best from the worst then to distinguish shades of gray. I think the factor than makes Honda the best is the management’s mindset: thinking of the longer term, or at least longer term than any other company’s top management.

I have worked as an electronics reliability engineer for 20 years in a non-auto industry.

ace1000

The CanadianDriver First Drive review says that the price in Canada will range from the low $30,000's to the mid $40,000's:

http://www.canadiandriver.com/testdrives/05odyssey.htm

indy93

I still say Honda is in the business of making money. Honda is not a religion! What is going to dictate the final pricing is not how little they can raise the price for all the wishful thinkers out there but ....how much is their new ODY is worth next to the new Sienna! There is not going to be any $5,000.00 alpha, beta or delta no matter what anyone thinks...because they don't have to charge much less than Toyota to sell all they can make! Wishful thinkers out there you only hope is the low end price leader version. (LX)

dofranck

The car I ordered is a straight EX-L without Navi/RES. The 30810 includes destination.

andreab

Saw the new Honda last night - here in Virginia. I asked the dealer how they managed to get them in so early - he said due to the hurricane in Alabama - they are shipping them out immediately. They had three on the lot - 1 EX and 2 EX-L. Wanted to see some of the new colors - but did not have any. The cars are nice, but was not able to test drive because they had just literally gotten off the truck and were parked in the lot. Will be able to test drive later today.
Saw the RES, pretty cool. Lazy susan is also an interesting feature. I really liked the instrument panel, and the gear shift is really different as well. Will probably go back to test drive tomorrow. We are still waiting to see a touring though, which is what we really want. Still did not have any brochures (frustrating), still waiting on that as well.

dfc101a

Thanks for the info. Nothern VA? Did you see sticker prices on those models?

laguy1

I went down to the local dealer (Los Angeles) yesterday to inquire about the Ody, and he informed me that the first batch they will get will be within the next 5 days, but they will arrive without "Window Sticker", and thus customers can look at the van, but cannot test drive it for another week or so.

He claimed that even the salespersons will not be allowed to drive them for a few days. I don't know about others, but I don't recall a car being hyped up so much, nor so eagerly anticipated. On the bright side, I now see more Siennas sitting around in dealer's lots!

lynnw

I hardly think that they did the recall for a couple of dozen vans. My sister had the tranny problem from the get go, and she hardly had any miles on it since she received it brand new. I personally believe that maybe they are not being truthful in their reason for the recall since a widespread recall for a few dozen vans is not cost effective. In a case like that I would imagine they would notify the dealership service departments how to repair the tranny on a TSB instead of recalling the entire fleet of vans. I would think they would not want to advertise that "all" their new vans had the same problem with something as important as a transmission because it could hurt their sales. If it was a little rattle or vibration then I could believe it, but a transmission? I dont know about that.

masterpaul1

My take on the matter is that Honda learned from Daimlerchrysler mistakes on there tranny issues and how they handled them back before the 2001 redesign. Because a lot of people say, including Honda, that their vechicles are reliable; making a recall on all trans. would really hurt them I believe. As far as the anticipation of the new 2005 Ody. I believe that you will have a lot of the current Ody owners trading there old Ody's in for the new 2005 Ody. In time we will see if the new Ody is all that the hype says it is, as far as reliability is concerned. The Ody as a whole buy different car magazines and places like Edmunds says its #1 as to opinion. But when you look at the numbers for total sales for a year of all car manufactures, you will see a different story. I really do hope Honda fixed the problems with there trans. It's a shame that some people here in Edmunds had to have their trans. replaced as much as four times before 100k miles or just over that. To me that is not reliable, since the trans. is a very important part of the vechicle.

martyb

My local dealer got in 4 '05s in the last 24 hours, including a Touring. They pulled an EX-L RES around for me to look at and I spent a half and hour or so climbing all over it. I have never owned an Odyssey, but I have looked at the most recent generation and I think the '05 is a big improvement. The exterior is tolerable, but not such that I was drawn to it. I personally like the new styling better than the new Sienna. Without having the benefit of driving one yet (I was told I could drive one tomorrow - they said they cannot even sell one until tomorrow), the interior is where the new Od really shines. The only puzzling thing to me was the 2d row center seat - not sure how useful it will be, but it can be removed or turned into a console, so no harm there. The window sticker for the EX-L RES was $32,410, and I was told the cost of the RES is $1,600. The sunroof was very nice, the bigger screen on the RES is an improvement, the floor mats are beefier, seats are comfortable, gauges are cool and very easy to read, controls on steering wheel are nice, and engine is QUIET at idle - almost NO vibration. The only things I think the model I was in was lacking are telescopic steering wheel and electric front passenger seat controls. I'm telling you - the dash in this thing looks much better than the fake woodgrain in the Sienna, IMO. The aluminum is a nice touch, but not overdone. I'll be going back to drive one soon. I was told NO discounts for the time being, but also no markup "unless demand is such that it makes sense." Dealer said Honda will start aggresively marketing around 9/21. He did not have any brochures yet.

lumbar

Based on a couple of pretty credible posts here I'd say that the price increase is quite substantial (at least on the EX-L with or without Nav/DVD). I figure it to be about 6.5%.

This is not an attempt to indicate that the vehicle isn't -worth- it, that the market will not bear it, or that it isn't competitive with other vans etc, etc, etc., but only to cast doubt on those sources (perhaps even from inside Honda) who indicated the increase would be in the $500-800 range (a more "normal 2-3%). Don't I remember some talk about "$3,000 worth of upgrades" for $500?

stickguy

At almost 31K for an EX-L, I can't see dealers getting away with ADM stickers for very long. THe seet spot in the market is 25-28K (current EX TMV, Sienna LE). the market for 30K+ minivans IMO is somewhat limited.

THe LX may end up taking a bigger share of sales, along with the EX. I assume that will be about 29K?? based on the extra content of the EX-L

oddmom

Saw several Odysseys in Chattanooga today and took a close peek at a silver w/black touring. Couldn't drive it today though. They must have had at least 10 of the vans. There were six or eight on a truck and I think four on the lot or getting prepped.

Here's what they quoted me for a touring w/navi: $41,755.57, out the door. I wanted a touring with navi and res and he could NOT give me a price.

@. Also, the quote seemed a little high? ($38,544 before tax and lic). AND they are seriously lowballing me on my trade in. I know the argument, it's a new model blah blah, but still, not feeling good about it! Now I'm not sure if I'm going with another Odyssey or a Lexus.

Don't know if this helps, but I haven't seen much posted regarding price.

odync

The Touring either comes without Nav/Res or with Both...not with just Nav.

I really hope that its not over 41K out the door...I don't think I want to go that hight...
I hope that dealer is wrong.

heywood1

So MSRP for an EX-L/RES is $32,410? I paid $33,106 for my '04 Sienna XLE AWD (w/Pkg #17). Admittedly, my van does not have RES, but it DOES have AWD, a power lift gate, and a telescoping steering wheel. Otherwise, the two vans are similarly equipped. Either I'm not seeing the huge 'value' advantage Honda lovers preach here, or the the '05 model has had a hefty price increase-- or both. (And I think $42K for a 'Touring' is nuts....)

oddmom

That's what I THOUGHT! Grr, see that's another reason why I left. They can't get their story straight (what they'll have available), either. I knew it was with nav and res, but toward the end of the conversation when I mentioned something about the res, he said "oh, this quote doesn't include that!" I said it should and that's when I said see ya. I'm waiting to hear from my old dealer in Ohio. I just don't think I'm going back to the one here. sheesh.

oddmom

Is there a link anywhere to see the '05 exterior colors?

I've seen the silver, dark grey, and white. Saw a picture of the red and silver. Heard there is a gorgeous new light blue metallic but I can't find anything online. Thanks.

badgerfan

You guys are talking prices way up in the luxury vehicle range. Honda better have some available in the low to mid $20K range or they won't sell a lot of them.

My coworker picked up a new 2005 Grand Caravan SE+ (with stow and go) for less than $20K plus TTL. Of course this was a nice but not luxury version of the Grand Caravan, no DVD, leather seats or Nav system, but for the price, he got a very nice van. I can't imagine sinking $30K+ into a rolling box, no matter how nice it is!