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Honda Odyssey vs. Toyota Sienna



  • stickguystickguy Posts: 26,354
    keep them in perspective. Residuals are reported as a % of MSRP, not sales price. Hondas tend to have a smaller invoice -> MSRP spread, and to sell closer to MSRP, so the residual amount is going to be higher than a car that sells for way under MSRP.

    Who cares what the residual off MSRP of a GM car is if you paid 6K below MSRP? In real world terms, it might well work out to be the same actual depreciation.

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • Test drove Odyssey Touring & Sienna XLE Limited AWD today. Both very nice vehicles. Wife prefers Odyssey so that's what we'll get. Hate to give up the great deal on Sienna though. Over $3000.00 off MSRP. Hope Touring (RES/NAV) is worth the extra $2500 it's going to cost over the Sienna. More comfortable seats and non gated shifter on Odyssey won her over, although she was not happy with no power passenger seat. Still looking for the mysterious coin box.
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 26,354
    Had the chance to drive an Ody EX-L today. Very nice. My wife was wondering if she could skip looking at the rest of the choices on the short list and just get the Honda (the answer, of course, is "no", since that would spoil all my fun).

    Will try to get to the Toyota dealer this week to do a refresher drive in a Sienna (haven't driven one since last December). At least now an LE is in the cards, since she wants a power drivers seat, but I don't think we want to give up the moonroof, so it may require an XLE.

    Wonder what street prices on an XLE with the safety, leather and roof will be vs. an EX-L Ody?

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • I wonder if whatever is causing the CR-V engine fires could also cause the new Ody to catch fire? Isell/Jsmath - what is the word at Honda?

    I wonder if Honda had this figured out before the new Ody design was finalized?
  • raydahsraydahs Posts: 449
    "I wonder if Honda had this figured out before the new Ody design was finalized?"

    Apparently NOT!
  • steverstever Posts: 52,683
    I don't see that the CR-V issue has anything to do with Odysseys?

    Steve, Host
  • Probably not, but if they don't know the cause, then it's plausible that the 'feature' could be carried forward to new designs.
  • steverstever Posts: 52,683
    Doubtful - likely different rails, different relationship of the filter to the manifold, etc. Someone is blowing smoke :-) Next someone will be pointing sludgy fingers at Siennas!

    Steve, Host
  • raydahsraydahs Posts: 449
    "Someone is blowing smoke". Umm...The question was "I wonder if Honda had this (CR-V thing) figured out before the new Ody design was finalized?" The question was answered, apparently not "Honda engineers 'as puzzled as anyone' by recent CR-V fires". It wasn't an attempt to stir it up, mearly an attempt to answer the the question with factual data (no they don't have it figured out!). Most of us realize it's comparing Apples to Oranges and should have been asked in the Accord forum where the same engine is used!
  • steverstever Posts: 52,683
    Let's hope that no Odyssey's ignite in a month or two after they get their first oil change. Parts is parts, but I wouldn't be surprised if the CR-V team is on a whole different continent than the Odyssey design/engineering people. It seems a bit of a stretch to try to taint Ody's with CR-V woes (and those woes appear tiny as a percentage of '03/'04's CR-Vs sold).

    Steve, Host
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 26,354
    It doesn't appear that the packaging on the Ody engine is any different than last year (that is, the oil filter and hot parts haven't been rearranged). So, if the current models having been combusting, I don't think the '05s are likely to either.

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • "You don't think the factory-to-dealer incentive and cheap lease on the '04 Ody hurt resale values?"

    If the cheap lease deal has hurt the Odyssey then did not get the memo. They are saying my 2004 Odyssey EX-RES with 5,000 miles is still worth $25,900 to a dealer. I know these figures can be inflated but has a van identical to mine that they are selling for $25,998 with 5,000 more miles and no DVD system. My cap cost on the lease was $26,xxx.
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 26,354
    There were so many Odys sold at or near MSRP that, IMO, the relatively few sold recently at big discounts really won't affect future values. Remember, very soon there won't be any more '04s, so all the used ones will be on a level playing field (competing with the '05s), and what each person paid will be pretty much irrelevant.

    In this case (but not every case), people who scapped up an '04 for 3k+ off MSRP can end up with very little s/t depreciation.

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • There is no way on God's green earth that any car dealer would give you $25,900 in trade for a 2004 old-style Ody EX-RES--even against an '05 with inflated MSRP+ADM. With current incentives, Carsdirect's target price for a brand new '04 EX-RES is $25,900. So why would any dealer give you that much in trade for one now with 5,000 miles on it? Dream on.
  • ggsggs Posts: 30
    The Odyssey and CRV are based on two different platforms. There should be no reason to assume the two are related.
  • raydahsraydahs Posts: 449
    OK..........last time! My response was to the posters question related to the CR-V!

    They said "if whatever is causing the CR-V engine fires could also cause the new Ody to catch fire". (Key question) "I wonder if Honda had this figured out before the new Ody design was finalized". As the dated link (Posted Date: 9/21/04) states "Honda engineers 'as puzzled as anyone' by recent CR-V fires".

    The Odyssey was supposed to be released on 9/22, the design was probably finalized months ago. So therefore the answer to the question is………….NO, they didn’t have it figured out before the design was finalized!

    I'm well aware of Honda’s platforms; see the last sentence in post #41. I can't believe how blown out of proportion this link has become, in the future I'll be more careful not to say anything that could be misconstrued........done, end of explanation, see ya!
  • I've spent countless hours and months reading anonymously through Edmunds to determine if we would buy a Sienna, Odyssey, or Quest. My wife and I have been driving our 2 kids (3 years old and 9 months) around in a 2003 Jetta Wagon TDI with a huge Thule topper and things are just TIGHT. I've been completely transformed into a minivan advocate and will not consider an SUV again in the near future. Minivans are just too practical and accommodating.

    After much, much anticipation of the 2005 Odyssey, I have been to a Honda dealership 3 times since last Saturday and test drove an EXL with RES tonight. We then went back to the Toyota Dealership and drove the Sienna XLE. I've been to Nissan, Toyota, and Odyssey dealerships on at least 3 occasions (5 for Nissan).

    My impressions of each vehicle are:

    Chrysler Town & Country: Lots of useful storage. We sat in the top of the line $37,000 van and I was so unimpressed with the interior styling - leather looked really cheap and controls looked dated - that I choose not to test drive. This was a complete personal preference. I was trying to like it since my grandparents just bought one and love it.

    Nissan Quest: Tons of fun, poor reliability. Last time I looked at a Nissan the steering column cover was wobbling and this affirmed my perception of questionable quality. However, I love the sunroofs, dash, and styling. If I was more comfortable with Nissan Quality and resale value - this might have been at the top of my list. Man, does that full length skylight ROCK. Why can't Odyssey copy this?

    Honda Odyssey - Practical and Sporty, a tad low on luxury. I still feel that the Sienna takes the cake on Luxury, but the new 05 Odyssey is oh so close. The Odyssey feels smaller for some reason than the Sienna. I think it has less internal volume and the side and rear windows are proportioned differently which causes the impression of a more cramped minivan. Engine is more responsive and seemingly powerful than Sienna. The ease of use of the rear fold down seats is phenomenal and better than the Sienna. Once you start the motion of the flip down, the seat folds down on its own under gravity and spring tension. Super easy.

    Toyota Sienna - luxury and soft ride, lacking in power. A few more standard features (compass, power rear, etc). Sick of over pricing of features. Many Toyota dealerships can't say anything when I show them the ~$32,410 price for EXL with DVD Res (2005). The competition between the Sienna and Odyssey is now hairsplitting. I can't seem to have anybody even offer me a Sienna XLE for the price of the Odyssey with DVD Res. I tried, I emailed 8 or 9 dealerships in Colorado a few days ago.

    Trying to have fun is at least half my money. Therefore, we decided to go with Nighthawk Black Pearl with Ivory interior on an EXL with DVDRes. I think the Black Odyssey will have a bit of "attitude" with the tinted windows and chrome wheels. This is FUN! We went in to place a deposit on a Sage Brush Pearl Odyssey with Ivory seats, but that was placed on hold earlier in the day. At first we were disappointed, but a Nighthawk Black Pearl Honda Pilot was on the showroom floor and my wife was completely impressed with the color. The black has a blue hue under certain light which is a nice effect.

    After test driving the Sienna within 1 hour of the Odyssey, my wife jumped out and looked at me with a big smile and said the Sienna was no longer in the running. As a matter of fact, she said she would not buy the Sienna unless it sold for LESS than the new Odyssey. Hence, we have a $500 deposit holding our new Odyssey to be built at the end of the month and delivered by the end of October. All the Odysseys on the lot at John Elway Honda in Denver, CO were sold. I think 3 hondas coming in had deposits. They were only getting about 10 to 15 hondas over the next 3 months and I snatched up one of them.

    I can go into many other details, but I'm glad the search is over. All minivans offer great features. I can't look down on any person for choosing an Odyssey, Sienna, or Quest because I still like features on all those models. But for me, the new Odyssey styling, performance, and features pushed us into the Honda camp. In my mind, there is more to get on this vehicle than all others. I can't wait for the new van, if anything to help our cramped lifestyle!
  • official info finally on the honda website.
  • samnoesamnoe Posts: 731
    There is one thing I could not understand. Why do people rate Sienna’s acceleration “sluggish”? few years ago we never dreamed of minivans having more than 200 hp and about 220 lb.-ft. Now Toyota offers 230 hp, which should be more than adequate, and it have 242 lb.-ft. @ 3,600 rpm, and curb weight (Limited FWD) is just 4165 Lbs. (according to Toyota).

    Now The Odyssey, although it has some more hp, it has just 250 lb.-ft. of torque @ 5000 rpm, and the curb weight (Touring) is 4630 Lbs.! (According to Honda).

    You should already know that lb.-ft. of torque @ xx rpm is more important for acceleration than horsepower. Can anybody explain me how Sienna is sluggish?

    I still remember (not too long ago) when the Sienna came out how everybody was impressed with the smooth power. Now because the Odyssey raised the bar to 255 hp, Siennas all of a sudden are getting "sluggish"??
  • Not much difference there in price between Ody Touring w/NAV+RES and Sienna Limited w/NAV+RES.

    Now if Toyota can get their smart engineers to put a 6-CD changer behind the NAV screen instead of a single CD player, and give the Sienna the same Lexus NAV, but keep the price the same, it will be even more interesting.
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 26,354
    The engine is fine. I think the problem is the tranny dragging it down.

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • Tran, it's not hard for Sienna to have a 6 cd changer WITH NAV. My wife's Lexus RX330 has both. That's one of the reasons I may go with the ODY Touring, but it doesn't have the HID lights. I guess nothing is perfect.
  • MSRP for both Sienna XLE Limited and ODY Touing with NAV and RES are bout the same. But You can get $2000-$3000 off Sienna's MSRP now. So it makes the Sienna quite a bit cheaper than the ODY.
  • "it's not hard for Sienna to have a 6 cd changer WITH NAV. My wife's Lexus RX330 has both."

    Yeah, I know. I was being sarcastic. A $25K Honda Accord has Voice Activated Navigation AND a 6-CD changer, and yet a $39K Sienna Limited has NEITHER. Instead, the Sienna has a mediocre NAV with a single cd player!

    By the way, I can get $4K off MSRP on the Sienna Limited w/NAV+RES in OKC.
    So street price right now for the Ody does not look good at all.

    I'm sure it's not hard for Toyota to put a decent metal chrome grille on the Sienna either. Heck, Hyundai put some serious heavy metal chrome on their $26K XG350 sedan that would put my Lexus LS400 to shame.

    It's not hard for Toyota; they are just not willing.
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 26,354
    The Ody headlights might not be HID, but boy are they big. Especially noticable when you see an '04 parked next to an "05.

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • The CRV fires are being caused by the gasket that is supposed to be replaced on every Honda during oil change of the filter. It is a crush gasket that needs to be brand new every time you get a new oil filter. Honda mechanics know about this and know what to look for. Jiffy Lube guys DO NOT understand the importance of changing out the gasket. Now, every new oil filter will come with this gasket. Other lube guys will put a new gasket over the old one on the vehicle. As you drive away from Jiffy Lube with 2 gaskets on, oil will get on the exhaust and catch fire. All 9 incidents where this has happened has been traced to oil changes done elsewhere than a Honda Dealer. So that's the deal, oil on the exhaust due to 2, or more gaskets on the oil filter. Also if you change the oil yourself, wipe up any excess oil on the frame, lines, or exhaust. I watch all our mechanics change oil and they let it run down from the oil filter along a shop rag into the old oil collection bucket.

    Does that help. Also our 4 05 Odysseys are gone, sold at MSRP. The Toyota salesman came by to find out why Sienna sales are so slow. Sienna has got a issue now with the new Odyssey, everyone likes the nice ride and powerful engine, drive by wire and standard VSA, 3 curtain airbags, side bags, dual stage frone, ACE body structure.......and the list goes on......
  • ggsggs Posts: 30
    This thread is about Honda Odyssey vs Toyota Sienna. There's no reason to hijack the thread by mentioning CRVs here.
  • Congradulations on your new 05 Odyssey, they are awesome. Your wife will love it. Did the safety and performance get you? What was the clincher?
  • Didn't you just buy a new Sienna? Buyer's Remorse?
  • Have you driven the new 05 Odyssey yet, the luxery will astound you. We sold all 4 at MSRP, sold one with a deposit and people are coming in looking for the 05, sold out, waiting for more...sound famaliar? The Navi is off the hoook, press the button for open/close, the Navi screen tilts down to access the 6 disc in dash changer, how cool.....
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