Honda Civic GX

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  • cngazcngaz Member Posts: 10
    GM just finished taking orders for their last run of CNG trucks and thats it once this final order is filled.
    Its unbelievable how many CNG cars are available in Europe, but the US has only Honda for an OEM offering a NGV. They always concentrated on big fleets and government to buy their NGV's, not the public, and now they say they don't have the sales to support it, they (the OEM's) sure did it backwards. The general public is the largest motoring purchasing body in the US, and they over looked us.
  • yerth10yerth10 Member Posts: 431
    When it comes to CNG vehicles, its mostly the conversion work. OEM are not widely available.

    http://www.iangv.org/default.php?PageID=130

    There are 4.9 million CNG vehicles available worldwide.
    Still there is no vehicle for CNG market like Prius is for hybrids.
  • yerth10yerth10 Member Posts: 431
    Civic-GX has a big CNG tank which will give the vehicle a 200 mile range.
    Instead if they can provide a smaller tank with 50 mile range and a regular
    gasolene tank for 300 mile range.

    The cost of the vehicle will come down. After all everyone travels atleast
    around 50 miles for a commute and they can fill the natural gas with a device
    like Phill.

    It will also provide more trunk space for cargo.
    Just like a plug-in hybrid with 20-30 mile rage.

    I wish Honda tries this approach.
  • stevedebistevedebi Member Posts: 4,098
    "Civic-GX has a big CNG tank which will give the vehicle a 200 mile range.
    Instead if they can provide a smaller tank with 50 mile range and a regular
    gasolene tank for 300 mile range. "

    That would make it a mixed fuel vehicle, ineligible for HOV lane access.
  • cngusercnguser Member Posts: 59
    Forum users: Please note this site covers the world, not just Calif. In Arizona and other states such a vehicle CAN go solo in the HOV lanes with appropriate documentation, etc.
    Also, a GAS/CNG vehicle is classified as Bi-Fuel: Vehicles that have two fuel systems, allowing the driver to switch between gasoline and compressed natural gas or propane.
    Flexible Fuel Vehicles contain a single fuel tank capable of operating on alcohol, gasoline, ethanol-gas (E/85) or a combination.
  • stevedebistevedebi Member Posts: 4,098
    "Forum users: Please note this site covers the world, not just Calif. In Arizona and other states such a vehicle CAN go solo in the HOV lanes with appropriate documentation, etc."

    OK, I'll amend my post: vehicles which can run on either Gas or CNG are ineligible for HOV access in CA.

    Do you happen to have a listing of which states allow HOV access to multi-fuel vehicles? How about other countries?
  • wajsecy1wajsecy1 Member Posts: 1
    The press is not ignoring CNG, nor electric cars, nor hybrids. It is not easy for an editor to dig up information from the manufacturers, nor the buyers, and even locating regional "alternative fuel" interest groups is problematic.

    I spent six months as a Auto Editor for one of the Knight-Ridder Newspapers and had a syndicated column, I almost had to pull teeth to get information.

    We of the Automotive Press are VERY interested in these topics. We meet every other month for dinner in South San Francisco, and as Sec'y for the group I can add you to the
    Guest List, all you will have to do is pay for your own dinner.

    We are a pretty laid back bunch, and if you want to meet us
    then drop me an email: jsr@roscotech.com
  • cngusercnguser Member Posts: 59
    One would need to check with the respective state's motor vehicle division re HOV lane access laws - I have no specifics other than what I have seen posted on this and other forum sites. See also the Edmonds site for Natural Gas fueled vehicles forum
    http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.ef2c1e4
    Likely a similar scenario for other countries. In Canada, check with the respective provincial capitol.
    My guess is other countries may not have HOV lanes as we know them.
  • lakewood90712lakewood90712 Member Posts: 108
    At the pumps today: Long Beach Energy $1.48
  • 2gxowner2gxowner Member Posts: 10
    I have bought my wife a new GX and we were going to keep the 2003 for me, but I decided to buy a classic car instead. If interested let me know or check out the ad on craigslist.
    http://phoenix.craigslist.org/car/145949178.html
  • londnrlondnr Member Posts: 55
    SAD, SAD NEWS FOR LONG BEACH/L.A. AREA

    I know that the price in Long Beach is $1.48 today - but make the most of it. ENRG has got their wish and will be taking over the Long Beach Stations.

    The change is scheduled to go into effect as early as next month. For those of us that have been faithful LBE customers we can kiss goodbye to reasonably and competitively priced gas. I have been going there for the last six years and will be sorry to see the change.

    ENRG is also going to change the Long Beach pumps to the more modern (crap) ones. LBE's pumps may have been old but they consistently gave the best fill in the Southland.

    The man responsible for maintaining the pumps at LBE did a marvelous job (I won't mention his name here) and he will be sorely missed.

    It seems that the powers that be in Long Beach shortsightedly decided that the operation wasn't profitable enough - of course their figures didn't include the cost savings to Long Beach with their fleet of NGVs. I suppose if you only focus on one number rather than the big picture you can justify any closure in the name of efficiency.

    Well done to ENRG you now have the bulk of the Southern California CNG users by the short and curlies. I am sure that even though T. Boone Pickens (owner of ENRG) admitted there was a glut of natural gas, we won't see one dime in savings. If LBE is selling at $1.48 I predict that ENRG will still be $2 plus.

    A sad day indeed.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    A good reason to go see PHILL. You get a better Fill at a lower price. I thought all you CNG drivers had installed units by now. It has to be a lot more convenient.
  • xkmailxkmail Member Posts: 36
    IS it hard to convert to LPG, its under $2 around here.
  • lakewood90712lakewood90712 Member Posts: 108
    First, the bad news , forget about trying to convert a vehicle built in the last 10 years to Propane(regulations and complexity of emmisions control systems)

    Another thing to consider , as propane is sold by liquid volume , and has approx 20 % fewer btu/gallon than gasoline , your fuel mileage will be lower. On a dedicated propane engine, this can be mitigated by using a higher compression ratio. (propane has an equiv. octane rating of over 120 , so no knock at 12/1 , just like cng/lng)
    Now the good news ,the us gov auctions off thousands of propane/gasoline bi fuel vehicles every year at good prices. These are either factory built or factory authorized conversions. To my knowledge , all are pickups or vans. Go to the GSA website , for auction info.
  • xkmailxkmail Member Posts: 36
    So in laymans terms is it cheaper for you to fill up at a public cng refill or at home. here in Los ANgeles CNG is $2.68 per gallon equivalent or 1 gallon gas = 5.66 gallons CNG ?
    I am a little newbiesh ehre please elaborae on how much it costs you to drive 100 miles/
  • xkmailxkmail Member Posts: 36
    I live in Oak HIlls which is all on LPG tanks in the front yard, we have no CNG unless I move to the City. Thats why I asked baout converting a cng honda to lpg
  • aclaypoolaclaypool Member Posts: 7
    I used to commute in my Honda 2001 Civic GX from Glendale to SF on a biweekly basis from 2001 - 2004 and from Glendale to LV on a biweekly basis from 2004 - 2006 (Ending May 5th due to a permanent move to LV).

    The mileage from Victorville D St pump to 2950 Ronemus Drive (LV 3600PSI) is 198 miles. Filling at Victorville or Barstow requires a Visa/MC. The pricing at Barstow is less expensive than Victorville. The fuel stations that I use in LV require a Haycock card. The station in Henderson has been down more than up.

    Misc: I alternate trips to LV in a 2005 VW Passat GLS TDI wagon (39K) and the 2001 Honda Civic GX w/ABS has 144K miles.
  • aclaypoolaclaypool Member Posts: 7
    Minor Revision:

    AB71 (Session 1999-2000) was revised by AB2682 (Session 2003-2004) to add access for up to 75K hybrid vehicles for the HOV lane.

    References:
    AB71 (Session 1999-2000)
    AB2682 (Session 2003-2004)
  • aclaypoolaclaypool Member Posts: 7
    Q: What if someone placed a GX logo on the regular civic, do they still get to park for free?

    A: I am assuming that you mean a CA DMV issued decal. In that case, the person would be violating CVC Section 21655.9(c) which is a misdemeanor.
    If it is just the GX logo and CNG diamond, that would not constitute a violation of CVC 21655.9(c).

    References:
    CVC Section 21650-21664

    CVC 21655.9(c) states:
    No person shall operate or own a vehicle displaying a decal, label, or other identifier, as described in Section 5205.5, if that decal, label, or identifier was not issued for that vehicle pursuant to Section 5205.5. A violation of this subdivision is a misdemeanor.
  • my70s2my70s2 Member Posts: 1
    Hello all:
    I like to purchase the new 2006 model, it was displaced in auto shows but dealership has little details.
    Any suggestion would be appreciated.
    I live in the greater LA area.

    best
    Oliver
  • lakewood90712lakewood90712 Member Posts: 108
    Go to GREENCARCONGRESS.COM , go to monthly archives , select april 06 ,(a large file) scroll down to april 13 , 2006 story "Honda to extend Civic GX sales to New York" It has the 06 specs.I'd put a hyperlink here , but I'm too old and stupid for such task's.
  • thatdeonguythatdeonguy Member Posts: 52
    April 17 2006 American Honda Motor Co. has announced it will begin retailing its compressed natural gas (CNG) powered 2006 Civic GX to New York state customers this fall, reports Auto Racing Daily. Based on the all-new award-winning 2006 Civic, the Civic GX achieves a city/highway Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) rated fuel economy of 28/39 miles per gasoline-gallon equivalent. The ultra-clean Civic GX produces near zero emissions, makes owners eligible for significant tax credits, and can be refueled with a convenient home refueling appliance. The Civic GX is the only dedicated natural gas-powered passenger vehicle available to retail customers in the United States, though some other vehicles are available to fleet customers. The Civic GX, considered to be "Cleanest on Earth," is the only vehicle certified by the EPA to meet both and meets federal Tier 2-Bin 2 and ILEV zero evaporative emission certification standards. The Civic GX offers customers comfort and convenient features comparable to a Civic LX - the most popular trim level in the Civic lineup - including the same standard safety features that have earned Civic the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety's "Top Safety Pick - Gold" Award. Standard safety features include dual front airbags, side curtain airbags, driver's side impact airbag, front passenger's side impact airbag, ABS and Honda's Advanced Compatibility Body structure (ACE). Equipped standard with a 5-speed automatic transmission, its 1.8-liter, 4-cylinder engine delivers 115 horsepower and 109 ft-lbs of torque, both an increase of more than 10 percent versus the previous model. Natural gas fuel is primarily a domestically-produced fuel with a price that has proven to track below that of petroleum fuels, natural gas is approximately 25 percent less expensive than gasoline when purchased at a refueling station, and approximately 50 percent cheaper than gasoline when supplied by a home refueling appliance, the "Phill" - a natural gas home refueling appliance manufactured by FuelMaker Corporation, which allows the GX to refuel overnight directly from a homeowner's existing natural gas supply line. In addition to convenient refueling, Civic GX owners are eligible for tax breaks and incentives of up to $4,000 for the car and up to $1,000 for the purchase and installation of "Phill". Both GX and Phill benefit from the federal tax credits enacted Jan 1, 2006, for clean alternative fuel vehicles and fueling infrastructure.
  • jjamesonjjameson Member Posts: 6
    I noticed the new Civic only gets 4 stars for side impact for the driver, and thats with the side air bags.

    I wonder why it didn't do better in the Gov't crash test.
  • jazonjazon Member Posts: 9
    What happens when this law expires?

    Will the CNG cars still be allowed and not the hybrids?

    I'd hate to buy one for the car pool priviledge only to have the law expire and leave me hangin with a car thats hard to sell.
  • aclaypoolaclaypool Member Posts: 7
    In accordance with CVC 5205.5(k) and CVC 21655.9(e), the authorization or permission to use highways lanes or ramps designated for high-occupancy vehicles defined in CVC 5205.5 which are certain hybrid and alternative vehicles will be cease on January 1, 2008 unless a new statute is enacted.

    In other words, the permission to use HOV lanes will cease on January 1, 2008. Please note that a new laws may be passed which extend this date.

    I believe the Honda Civic GX will have continuing appeal to people with focus on certain environmental issues, reduced dependance on oil, metro area vehicle, reasonable MPGGE, and good safety record. The fuel prices for CNG will continue to be moderate in my opinion.

    Snipnet from the statute:

    CVC 5205.5(k) and CVC 21655.9(e)
    This section shall remain in effect only until January 1, 2008, and as of that date is repealed, unless a later enacted statute, that is enacted before January 1, 2008, deletes or extends that date.

    References:

    AB2628 (Assembly Session 2003-2004)
    CVC 5200-5206
    CVC 21650-21664
    AB2628 (CVC 5205.5) compliant vehicle list compiled by CA ARB
  • xkmailxkmail Member Posts: 36
    So the price at Victorville is currently $2.68
    How much did you pay to fillup and how far did you drive?
    Was Victorville cheaper or more than filling at home, by how much ?
  • aclaypoolaclaypool Member Posts: 7
    Actually, I recently filled at Barstow at around $2.09 - $2.20 GGE and the next refill was in Las Vegas, NV at CNG facility near Charleston and I-15. Once, I receive the monthly statement from Haycock the cost per gallon will be known. The blended cost of fueling in LV is around $2.00/GGE

    I do not have a phill so, all my fuel purchases are at vendor CNG stations.
  • aclaypoolaclaypool Member Posts: 7
    Back in 2001, the Honda Civic GX was sold to fleet purchasers. I found Chris in the fleet department at Sierra Autocars (Honda) a pleasure to during the purchasing process.

    The service departments at Sierra Autocars (Monrovia) and SF Honda (SF) have provided me with great support during my five years of ownership.
  • freedmlfreedml Member Posts: 43
    Check Robinson Honda in Torrance www.scottrobinson.com. They used to have about a dozen GXs in stock.
  • 2005xfr2005xfr Member Posts: 1
    Yes, but.... there is a NEW ASSEMBLY BILL to extend thru 2012!

    Click Here -> AB2600
  • big_mike92882big_mike92882 Member Posts: 3
    I'm thinking real seriously about purchasing a Civic GX, but want to wait for the '06 body. I'm not an environmentalist wacko, but there are real good economic reasons to look at the car. I don't think that gas will drop much below $3 anytime soon, and with either installing a Phill unit in my garage or the City of Corona selling $1.81 gge CNG it's way worth it (along with the time savings for HOV lane travel). I drive 25k miles/year in the basin and down to San Diego, so I have the ability to live within the fueling range.

    Right now it seems like the CNG Civic runs under the radar due to the less convenient fueling compared to hybrids.

    Would any of you owners have reservations and not purchase a GX again? Right now I'm driving a 4 1/2 year old Subaru WRX with 111k miles that's getting to the edge of that mountain where the car's value will really start to drop as miles further pile up (and twice/week unleaded premium fillups are getting old at $40+).
  • cngazcngaz Member Posts: 10
    The 06 is really nice, it now seats 5 instead of 4 and has better lines on the outside, I've had a lot of CNG vehicles and the Honda has been the best.
    They showed an 05 Stock GX in the NGV Zone at the Clean Cities Convention in Phoenix and a stock 06 a the Honda Booth, but for the opening ceremony they unveiled a customized 06 with the real fancy graffics and custom wheels. They used it for the ride and drive one afternoon at the conference, you won't ever drive anything sweeter!
    I wanted to keep it to demo in Arizona. If all the manufacturers got cars onto the street that looked like this, there would be no shortage in demand for NGV's! Is Ford, GM and Daimler-Chrysler listening???? ;)
    Dave
  • stevedebistevedebi Member Posts: 4,098
    "The 06 is really nice, it now seats 5 instead of 4"

    Huh? My wife's 2002 Civic seats 5. Does the CNG version seat less people, maybe a CNG tank between the seats or something?
  • thatdeonguythatdeonguy Member Posts: 52
    Yes siree the GX civic's only have 4 seats.
    There is no seating in the middle of the back seat.
    No place for the middle passangers shoulder belt to anchor with the CNG tank in the way.

    AND we only get 2 little speakers in the front doors
    Another two reasons to buy the 2006 GX!
  • stevedebistevedebi Member Posts: 4,098
    "AND we only get 2 little speakers in the front doors
    Another two reasons to buy the 2006 GX!"

    Awww, come on, that's just down-right cheap. Don't tell me there is no room on the back parcel shelf for a couple of speakers?
  • lakewood90712lakewood90712 Member Posts: 108
    IT'S NOW ON THE HONDA WEBSITE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • yip_choiyip_choi Member Posts: 4
    Hi,

    Does anyone has a spare CNG tank/cylinder in case you run out of gas? I found this from a tank at the bottom of the website:
    http://www.altfuels.org/cleannbk/caadays/day18.html
    I did ask Mark who refers the 2000psi tank can only hold 0.5 gallon CNG. Well, it will help my Civic to run another 15 to 20 miles in case of running out of gas. If there are a lot of other country have NGV, there must be a business for this kind of tank. Does anyone know where I can buy one of this tank? Just want to keep it in case running out of gas or need to be towed.
    Thanks!!!

    William
  • cngmikecngmike Member Posts: 20
    The only problem with this system is that it is not legal. The Department of Transportation has very stringent rules regarding the transportation of natural gas, far more stringent than that of gasoline. The tank has to be secured to withstand 5-Gs. Now if you wanted to do it anyway---- you could use any cylinder (oxygen, nitrogen, etc) as long as you don't exceed its rating. the parts that you need from there are readily available. I would make sure that you have a regulator and relive valve so you do not over fill the cylinder!!!
  • markf57markf57 Member Posts: 38
    And I see the MSRP has jumped several thousand from 05 to 06! :mad:
  • lakewood90712lakewood90712 Member Posts: 108
    5 passenger now , must be the high cost of an extra seatbelt and cupholder :D
  • thatdeonguythatdeonguy Member Posts: 52
    Don't forget the two additional speakers in the rear.
    Plus no more CVT!
    I wonder how much a 2006 GX will go for in a couple of years on ebay ;)
  • big_mike92882big_mike92882 Member Posts: 3
    Aaaah, supply and demand. Between the new body and $3.35 unleaded, they figure they can squeeze a few extra $$ out of people and it won't affect sales!
  • markf57markf57 Member Posts: 38
    What do you mean not more CVT? It is still showing with CVT on the Honda website.
  • lakewood90712lakewood90712 Member Posts: 108
    06 Civic Hybrid still has the cvt , but it's a 5 speed auto for the GX now.
  • nostrom0nostrom0 Member Posts: 44
    All the 2006 Civics have a 5-speed automatic transmission and some have manual.

    LX
    • 1.8-liter, SOHC i-VTEC® 4-cylinder engine
    • Drive-by-Wire Throttle System™
    • ULEV-2 (Ultra-Low-Emission Vehicle)
    • 5-speed manual transmission
    • Available compact 5-speed automatic transmission

    "
  • taz1975taz1975 Member Posts: 1
    let my 01' gx sit for 2 months would not start tank says empty towed to fast fill all it would hold was 2 gals. still says empty and won't start. any suggestions would help :sick:
  • thatdeonguythatdeonguy Member Posts: 52
    Taz:
    What a bummer. If the tank only took two gallons that is a pretty good sign that there is fuel in the tank. The gas gauge still shows empty? Could it be an electrical problem with the fuel tank solenoid valve that shuts off the gas when the key is turned off. I can hear that valve in the trunk click on & off when I turn the key from ACC to ON. Or could it be the fuel pressure regulator shut off solenoid valve in the engine compartment. Have you checked the manual fuel shutoff valve in the rear wheelwell, below the fuel door? The Civic GX supplemental service manual is great for showing how to trouble shoot the fuel system electronics. GOOD LUCK!
  • 2gxowner2gxowner Member Posts: 10
    We had a very similar problem with out '03. Wife drove to work and the car would not start when she left to come home. I took the trailer and towed home to have Phill show it was full eventhough the gauge showed empty. Took to Honda the the Pressure Regulator had failed. They replaced the regulator and car worked fine again after. A pricey fix, but was under warantee. Might push on Honda if they want you to pay for the repair. Good luck.
  • rstrst Member Posts: 73
    I had the opportunity to drive the new 07gx. I currently drive the 06. The new car has more power and is quite sporty looking. As a new design, it has a new "space-age" dash that is very pleasant to view. There is noticeably less engine noise and the car has less overall road noise. It is a definite improvement over the last model. Honda is really going out of their way to get the public to go the cng route. These cars are probably not money makers because of the low production numbers. But, once/if the word gets out they are the only game in town. They should be at the dealers soon.
  • nfpjeffnfpjeff Member Posts: 1
    I am confused too.

    I am selling my 03 GX because I am moving and have it in for service (60K). Doing the 60K service, front brakes and fluid, flush coolant, change A&B fuel filters, change CVT fluid, adjust valves. But I stopped short of the fuel tank part because they wanted $650!

    I sold my 01 GX back in 04 with 60K miles on it. It now has 103K and the owner is considering the service in July. Seems like the removal and "reseating" is not really necessary - nor is it something that should be done.

    What do you think?
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