I think as the 80's wore on, some prices on low-end cars actually got cheaper, because they had to compete with Hyundai. For example, I think the Chevette was cut to around $4999 by 1986 or 1987 to compete with the $4995 Excel. And I remember one of my friends in college getting a 1989 or 90 Plymouth Horizon. Total stripper, with the exception of automatic transmission. I put a radio in for him. I think it was about $6,000. In contrast, one of my friends bought one of those "1988.5" Escorts, an LX model I think, and it was around $9,000 out the door I think.
Iacocca's first big splash came in 1956, as an assistant sales manager in the Philadelphia district, when he came up with "56 for '56," a marketing program to combat flat Ford sales. Under "56 for '56," customers made a 20 percent down payment followed by three years of monthly payments of $56 for a 1956 Ford.
A time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing.
Wow, 20% down! And to think nowadays they'll roll negative equity for you! On my 2000 Intrepid, I only had to put $2000 down, and then $347.66/mo for 5 years at 0.9%. Total OTD price was $22,389, so that's only about an 8.9% down payment. When I bought my Ram, it was $20,751 OTD, and the only down payment was the $1300 trade we got for my uncle's '97 Silverado! Its payment was around $358/mo for 60 months at 3.99% APR, but I paid it off within about 4-5 months.
The base price for a new 1956 Ford Crown Victoria four-door sedan was $2,337. Twenty percent of that would be $467.40. That leaves $1,869.60 financed over 36 months for about $51.93. Accounting for inflation, those figures are $20,302 - $4,057 = $16,245 / 36 = $451.25. Not UNreasonable by today's standards.
Today, there are folks who put no money down and stretch the payments out more than twice as long with a far higher monthly note.
@omarman said:
From Lee Iacocca's 1984 autobiagraphy:
Iacocca's first big splash came in 1956, as an assistant sales manager in the Philadelphia district, when he came up with "56 for '56," a marketing program to combat flat Ford sales. Under "56 for '56," customers made a 20 percent down payment followed by three years of monthly payments of $56 for a 1956 Ford.
$2,520 for a new car! That almost sounds reasonable.
$504 down payment.... what is that in equivalent currency today?
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
I don't have must recollection on car prices. In 87, my Dad bought an 85 Cierra for $8,700 IIRC. It was a 4 cyl sedan but had AC, wire wheel covers and nice 2 tone paint. That would be $18,700 today so that's pretty much steady with what comparable cars go for today
@MrShift@Edmunds said:
RE: 86 Alfa---price seems fair for what it is. For one thing, it is the older version with the rubber ducky whaletail, not nearly as desirable and the last versions of this car, made up to 1993 in the USA. (or was it 1994?).
Also, it is a "Graduate", which is Italian for "base model", with no AC, no electric windows, and downgraded interior.
So add to that the cosmetic issues we see in the photos, (shark bite on the front spoiler, and I think some shallow denting on the car's nose) and the asking price seems just about right to me, if the car runs out right.
The mileage is good---the bottom ends on these engines are indestructible, but the cylinder heads can show problems--mainly valve seat recession. This would be indicated by loud tapping noises from the engine, and a substantial loss of power.
On the positive side, the "Graduate" doesn't have the weight and added complexity of AC and electronic goo-gahs.
Worth a look, definitely. And no, it's not one of my old cars---I never owned a "Graduate".
Again, I appreciate the advice and the free appraisal.
I remembered that exactly two years ago, I was tempted by another Alfa and at the time, I basically asked the same questions. I went back and looked at those old posts and learned some more. That one was NEAR PERFECT! British Racing Green, tan leather, it even had a hardtop along with every other extra it could have had. Low miles too.
I think the seller wanted 10,700 for it. It was parked at our local car show and had attracted quite a crowd.
Pictures can make edgy cars look a lot better and I'm thinking that'll be the case here.
That's right...most leasing in the 1980s was done by corporations or individuals who wanted tax write-offs during the Reagan Boom-Boom years. Now the IRS doesn't let you get away with that so easily.
@texases said:
That's only about 4% per year. The magic of compounding!
Except that inflation between 56 and the early 70s was a pittance, so it's more like 40 years. AND, 4% a year is a lot. A LOT. I mean, it isn't anything if every asset and dollar you have or earn appreciates at least that much annually. But, I don't know of many who can honestly lay claim to that.
Trends like this show a clear direction, but it's not the direction we want to be going.
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
Car manufacturers push leasing for a couple of reasons.
A lot of buyers although they won't admit it are "payment buyers". They don't want 700.00/mo payments for 72 months. By leasing they can afford the payments and drive a new car.
Also, at the end of the lease term the lessors HAVE to take some action. They can buy the car for the residual or they can walk away and have no car to drive.
So, chances are very good they will simply roll over into another lease and keep the lease treadmill going.
This isn't necessarily a "bad" thing. They drive a car for three years trouble free, under warranty. They never have to buy tires or a new battery.
They get a new car with better gas mileage (usually) and the latest safety features and technology.
Of course, the most practical thing to do would be to pay cash up front, maybe finance for 36-48 months, take good care of the car and drive it for ten years.
But that would involve (gasp) saving money and being prudent as our parents were.
My parents paid cash and bought new Buicks every ten years.
Some folks don't mind being payment buyers. I have one friend that goes from lease to lease, always going for the deal. With some of the subsidized leases, it can be tempting.
I've been thinking about getting something for my wife. She likes the Outback. CPOs are about 20. Do I put down 10 grand and pay 350 a month for 3 years or do I lease a new one for $269 a month with nothing down?
@xwesx said:
Except that inflation between 56 and the early 70s was a pittance,
For awhile in there, some cars even got cheaper, although that may have been more a matter of some mid-priced models moving downscale. For instance, a 1967 New Yorker started around $4200, which is about where a 1957 New Yorker started. I think Buick and Olds pretty much held the line on a lot of their prices as well, although you did have some upward creep on the low end with ritzier models such as the LTD, Caprice, and VIP.
Here's a couple dealer ads from '56/'57. Note the used '57 on the right, second from the top: original cost was $5200 new and advertised used price at $3900.
A time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing.
Now we just subsidize the real estate cabal by allowing part of that to be written off . yee haw
I don't know if people in the olden days were simply more "prudent" - lots of factors at play. Plenty of new cars were being sold then too.
@MrShift@Edmunds said:
That's right...most leasing in the 1980s was done by corporations or individuals who wanted tax write-offs during the Reagan Boom-Boom years. Now the IRS doesn't let you get away with that so easily.
@isellhondas said:
So, today I showed up for my 1:30 appointment with the Alfa seller. No show and no call.
Unfortunately I didn't have his number with me so I waited until after 2:00 and left.
Got home to find a message on our home machine (he had my cell number) telling me he had
just sold the car.
What a jerk! I had told him I was available at anytime and he was the one who picked 1:30.
So, I guess he just scheduled and earlier meeting time with the buyer who called after I did.
What ever happened to "doing the right thing"
Oh, well, not a big deal!
That's frustrating, and shows a lack of respect and sensitivity on the part of the seller for your time and interest. He obviously didn't consider how he would have felt if you hadn't showed up or called to cancel.
Fortunately, in the scheme of things, it's not a big loss.
I learned that in the car business. People were no shows at least half the time after making appointments. And, no...not a big loss. Based on what he had told me I probably wouldn't have bough it anyway.
@isellhondas said:
Today, I went to a VW show that was nearby.
I must be TOTALLY out of touch with reality when it comes to market prices.
In addition to tons of parts, junk, Mickey Moused up VW's, there were a few for sale.
A guy had a 55,000 mile (documented) Beetle for sale for 7500.00. It was a totally stock
1964 that looked like someone had painted it with Krylon.
As far as overall condition I would give it a 3 minus.
Another guy had a rusty 1963 with a 1600 engine and Kadrons. Maybe a 4 minus on condition.
Asking 5500.00.
A "Thing" that was total junk for 6500.00.
I left slowly shaking my head.
None of those were worth the asking prices, in my opinion. If those are the going market prices, I'd take a pass because for me they're overpriced by ~50%.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought those prices were nuts!
Some guys were saying that German parts are near impossible to find. Items like engine parts
and that the Chinese stuff is junk. A vendor had several boxes of German made Big Bore kits and he seemed to have a lot of activity.
I've also heard that the aftermarket body parts such as fenders are inferior too.
Seems folks at specialty shows ask more than is proper. Not sure if it's them being overly enthusiastic or if they hope that an enthusiasts show means passionate buyers.
So after driving the 300e around the past couple days, I'm no longer so sure I'm ready to cut it loose. Darn thing is just too nice and I'd be really hard pressed to find another like it.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
@qbrozen said:
So after driving the 300e around the past couple days, I'm no longer so sure I'm ready to cut it loose. Darn thing is just too nice and I'd be really hard pressed to find another like it.
There is a 300E that is for sale here in my town. Looks to be in good condition, but don't know how much they're asking for it.
@MrShift@Edmunds said:
Welcome to Craigslist, home of the Meander-thal.
I've heard Craigslist can be a lot of trouble. That's one thing that's been making me procrastinate about trying to sell my '85 Silverado. I figure the thing can't be worth more than $1500 or so, and is all the potential aggravation worth it?
If bought well, a W124 is hard to beat for the money. The engine is something of a gem, very smooth with enough power for adequate performance. My W126 had the same unit, behind the dual firewalls, was often virtually silent in many driving conditions.
@qbrozen said:
Seems folks at specialty shows ask more than is proper. Not sure if it's them being overly enthusiastic or if they hope that an enthusiasts show means passionate buyers.
So after driving the 300e around the past couple days, I'm no longer so sure I'm ready to cut it loose. Darn thing is just too nice and I'd be really hard pressed to find another like it.
i can help you with that--we can write an ad together than will eliminate/discourage 90% of the hassles.
Some hints:
"no trades"
"this is a cash only deal"
"sold as is, where is"
"no calls after 8 pm"
Use the anonymous e-mail feature on CL, and don't post your phone number "in the open". Put something like 935 OH FIVE THREE NINE
Ignore any e-mails about making a trade, shipping a car, cashing a check, making payments over time, or anyone offering to buy the car sight unseen. Just hit "delete" on those.
VW Big Bore Kits -- often the road to tragedy. People install the kits but (most of them) don't "do the math". They install flat top pistons, flycut the cylinder heads, and have basically built themselves a VW engine with 11:1 compression.....you got it.....KABOOM after the first long hill climb. They'll chunk a piston, guaranteed.
However if you know what you're doing, you can build a VW motor that will wallop any Porsche 912 or 356---but it just won't last as long.
@isellhondas said:
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought those prices were nuts!
Some guys were saying that German parts are near impossible to find. Items like engine parts
and that the Chinese stuff is junk. A vendor had several boxes of German made Big Bore kits and he seemed to have a lot of activity.
I've also heard that the aftermarket body parts such as fenders are inferior too.
@MrShift@Edmunds said:
i can help you with that--we can write an ad together than will eliminate/discourage 90% of the hassles.
Some hints:
"no trades"
"this is a cash only deal"
"sold as is, where is"
"no calls after 8 pm"
Use the anonymous e-mail feature on CL, and don't post your phone number "in the open". Put something like 935 OH FIVE THREE NINE
Ignore any e-mails about making a trade, shipping a car, cashing a check, making payments over time, or anyone offering to buy the car sight unseen. Just hit "delete" on those.
Shifty, that sounds like the beginning of a great Edmunds article. We talk all the time about getting the best trade in value, but there are times when a private sale is the right decision. Some do's and don'ts would be quite helpful.
If you are comfortable with having people come to your house, don't leave your garage door open to display all your possessions.
Other things:
If you go on a test drive, set some rules before you leave
If the license plates go with the car in your state, be SURE you have the owner's full name, address and driver's license #, as he/she can rack up tickets on your plates.
Agree, fin.
i still have to fine tune a couple of things on it. I messed with the EHA valve and it seems to have improved the off-idle stumble a bit, but still not fully there yet. And I thought I had the odometer licked, but it stopped again today about a mile out from work. So I'll have to take that apart yet again and see what I can come up with. I've already removed the trip reset arm from the unit altogether to prevent it from kicking the gear off anymore.
But, yes, its quiet, its smooth, got plenty of pep (when you get the trans to downshift), the gas mileage ain't too horrible. I figure its possibly a $4k car to the right buyer. But then what could I possibly get for $4k that could compare?
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
@qbrozen said:
So after driving the 300e around the past couple days, I'm no longer so sure I'm ready to cut it loose. Darn thing is just too nice and I'd be really hard pressed to find another like it.
Q, I suppose the real question is whether there will come a time that you want to find another like it....
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
Regarding Craigslist, I haven't had any problems at all selling my cars through this medium. I sent five down the road this way in the last seven years. Craigslist's features, while still very simple, improved substantially over the years.
I'm trying to remember what I sold...
2007 Subaru Outback (six months old at the time)
2008 Subaru Outback (four months old - sold to a buyer 360 miles away and delivered via auto carrier)
1998 Dodge Grand Caravan
1973 Ford F250 Pickup (rolling chassis)
1998 Ford Escort LX
The only one I bought via CL was the Caravan. While that particular transaction was a pleasant one, we looked at a whole lot of really horrible automobiles before we found that one. Of course, they were all gems according to the ads!
In contrast, I am thorough and honest in my advertisements. I state the features it has, mileage, drivetrain, condition, any faults, etc., etc. Basically - no surprises. I don't want to waste people's time and I don't want mine wasted. So far, every person who came to look at one of my cars bought it (except the first person looking at the '73 Ford chassis; that was their own fault for not reading the ad completely).
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
I always use the hide email feature, no phone number. Can weed out the "bad smell" people better that way. If they sound ok I respond. Best to use a spare disposable email account.
I have sold at least 4 cars this way. Some quicker than others. So patience is important.
@stickguy said:
Best to use a spare disposable email account.
That's what I do too.
I keep forgetting about the jungle grapevines in these small towns. I posted something on craigslist this morning and then ran into a neighbor across the back alley and happened to mention it. Sold it before I had time to get back inside and take the ad down.
This area has an active Facebook "for sale" page that people like - you really know who you are dealing with up here, assuming you are a local.
@xwesx said:
Regarding Craigslist, I haven't had any problems at all selling my cars through this medium. I sent five down the road this way in the last seven years. Craigslist's features, while still very simple, improved substantially over the years.
I'm trying to remember what I sold...
2007 Subaru Outback (six months old at the time)
2008 Subaru Outback (four months old - sold to a buyer 360 miles away and delivered via auto carrier)
1998 Dodge Grand Caravan
1973 Ford F250 Pickup (rolling chassis)
1998 Ford Escort LX
The only one I bought via CL was the Caravan. While that particular transaction was a pleasant one, we looked at a whole lot of really horrible automobiles before we found that one. Of course, they were all gems according to the ads!
In contrast, I am thorough and honest in my advertisements. I state the features it has, mileage, drivetrain, condition, any faults, etc., etc. Basically - no surprises. I don't want to waste people's time and I don't want mine wasted. So far, every person who came to look at one of my cars bought it (except the first person looking at the '73 Ford chassis; that was their own fault for not reading the ad completely).
OK, I have to ask...WHY would you sell a 4 month and a 6 month old Subaru?
Fair question. Is it the car I'd really buy for myself? No, its not. It was purchased for the wife and now she has adopted my Volvo for herself and won't give it up because it has been so much more reliable and consistent.
Other side of the coin is that I might have to sell the Benz to pay for a summer vacation this year, in which case I obviously wouldn't get the chance to turn around and buy something I'd want for myself anyway.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I have bought a couple of cars through CL with good results but I know what questions to ask.
How long have you owned the car?
If the stutter and say they are selling it for a friend or that they just bought it but the wife didn't like it etc I figure the seller is probably a curbstoner. No thanks.
Is the title in your name and do you have it?
Make very sure they have it!
If they tell you....
" The A/C isn't working but I'm sure it only needs a charge"
This means the A/C is shot or has a major leak...same difference.
" It could probably use a tune up"
The engine is shot or there are major problems.
" The gas gauge, dashboard lights and the radio aren't working but I'm sure it's just
a loose wire somewhere or a fuse"
Yeah, right!
" It's in good condition for it's age"
This means it's a rough, edgy car.
" Well, it has 250,000 miles but they are ALL freeway miles and, besides, these
cars run forever"
Comments
Those 80's prices seemed a bit high but I guess not, looking at my files.
My '82 Tercel cost $6,150 plus tax and I had to buy a radio for it.
The '89 Voyager was $13,100, including $100 doc fees. The initial sticker had $3,000 in ADM on it.
I think as the 80's wore on, some prices on low-end cars actually got cheaper, because they had to compete with Hyundai. For example, I think the Chevette was cut to around $4999 by 1986 or 1987 to compete with the $4995 Excel. And I remember one of my friends in college getting a 1989 or 90 Plymouth Horizon. Total stripper, with the exception of automatic transmission. I put a radio in for him. I think it was about $6,000. In contrast, one of my friends bought one of those "1988.5" Escorts, an LX model I think, and it was around $9,000 out the door I think.
From Lee Iacocca's 1984 autobiagraphy:
Iacocca's first big splash came in 1956, as an assistant sales manager in the Philadelphia district, when he came up with "56 for '56," a marketing program to combat flat Ford sales. Under "56 for '56," customers made a 20 percent down payment followed by three years of monthly payments of $56 for a 1956 Ford.
Wow, 20% down! And to think nowadays they'll roll negative equity for you! On my 2000 Intrepid, I only had to put $2000 down, and then $347.66/mo for 5 years at 0.9%. Total OTD price was $22,389, so that's only about an 8.9% down payment. When I bought my Ram, it was $20,751 OTD, and the only down payment was the $1300 trade we got for my uncle's '97 Silverado! Its payment was around $358/mo for 60 months at 3.99% APR, but I paid it off within about 4-5 months.
The base price for a new 1956 Ford Crown Victoria four-door sedan was $2,337. Twenty percent of that would be $467.40. That leaves $1,869.60 financed over 36 months for about $51.93. Accounting for inflation, those figures are $20,302 - $4,057 = $16,245 / 36 = $451.25. Not UNreasonable by today's standards.
Today, there are folks who put no money down and stretch the payments out more than twice as long with a far higher monthly note.
$2,520 for a new car! That almost sounds reasonable.
$504 down payment.... what is that in equivalent currency today?
$4,350
http://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/inflation.php?amount=500&year=1956
I don't have must recollection on car prices. In 87, my Dad bought an 85 Cierra for $8,700 IIRC. It was a 4 cyl sedan but had AC, wire wheel covers and nice 2 tone paint. That would be $18,700 today so that's pretty much steady with what comparable cars go for today
770% inflation in sixty years. That's just insane.
Again, I appreciate the advice and the free appraisal.
I remembered that exactly two years ago, I was tempted by another Alfa and at the time, I basically asked the same questions. I went back and looked at those old posts and learned some more. That one was NEAR PERFECT! British Racing Green, tan leather, it even had a hardtop along with every other extra it could have had. Low miles too.
I think the seller wanted 10,700 for it. It was parked at our local car show and had attracted quite a crowd.
Pictures can make edgy cars look a lot better and I'm thinking that'll be the case here.
Stay tuned....
That's only about 4% per year. The magic of compounding!
$504 down payment.... what is that in equivalent currency today?
About $4300
2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])
Another different thing about the market of eons past - virtually no private parties leased.
That's right...most leasing in the 1980s was done by corporations or individuals who wanted tax write-offs during the Reagan Boom-Boom years. Now the IRS doesn't let you get away with that so easily.
Leasing currently is pushing 28% of the market. (Business Insider)
Except that inflation between 56 and the early 70s was a pittance, so it's more like 40 years. AND, 4% a year is a lot. A LOT. I mean, it isn't anything if every asset and dollar you have or earn appreciates at least that much annually. But, I don't know of many who can honestly lay claim to that.
Trends like this show a clear direction, but it's not the direction we want to be going.
Car manufacturers push leasing for a couple of reasons.
A lot of buyers although they won't admit it are "payment buyers". They don't want 700.00/mo payments for 72 months. By leasing they can afford the payments and drive a new car.
Also, at the end of the lease term the lessors HAVE to take some action. They can buy the car for the residual or they can walk away and have no car to drive.
So, chances are very good they will simply roll over into another lease and keep the lease treadmill going.
This isn't necessarily a "bad" thing. They drive a car for three years trouble free, under warranty. They never have to buy tires or a new battery.
They get a new car with better gas mileage (usually) and the latest safety features and technology.
Of course, the most practical thing to do would be to pay cash up front, maybe finance for 36-48 months, take good care of the car and drive it for ten years.
But that would involve (gasp) saving money and being prudent as our parents were.
My parents paid cash and bought new Buicks every ten years.
Some folks don't mind being payment buyers. I have one friend that goes from lease to lease, always going for the deal. With some of the subsidized leases, it can be tempting.
I've been thinking about getting something for my wife. She likes the Outback. CPOs are about 20. Do I put down 10 grand and pay 350 a month for 3 years or do I lease a new one for $269 a month with nothing down?
For awhile in there, some cars even got cheaper, although that may have been more a matter of some mid-priced models moving downscale. For instance, a 1967 New Yorker started around $4200, which is about where a 1957 New Yorker started. I think Buick and Olds pretty much held the line on a lot of their prices as well, although you did have some upward creep on the low end with ritzier models such as the LTD, Caprice, and VIP.
At first glance this Alfa looked pretty good!
http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/cto/4429065710.html
Then I looked at the other pictures!
Here's a couple dealer ads from '56/'57. Note the used '57 on the right, second from the top: original cost was $5200 new and advertised used price at $3900.
Now we just subsidize the real estate cabal by allowing part of that to be written off . yee haw
I don't know if people in the olden days were simply more "prudent" - lots of factors at play. Plenty of new cars were being sold then too.
Sign me up for that '56 Lincoln Premiere convertible, stat!
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
So, today I showed up for my 1:30 appointment with the Alfa seller. No show and no call.
Unfortunately I didn't have his number with me so I waited until after 2:00 and left.
Got home to find a message on our home machine (he had my cell number) telling me he had
just sold the car.
What a jerk! I had told him I was available at anytime and he was the one who picked 1:30.
So, I guess he just scheduled and earlier meeting time with the buyer who called after I did.
What ever happened to "doing the right thing"
Oh, well, not a big deal!
Welcome to Craigslist, home of the Meander-thal.
just sold the car.
That's frustrating, and shows a lack of respect and sensitivity on the part of the seller for your time and interest. He obviously didn't consider how he would have felt if you hadn't showed up or called to cancel.
Fortunately, in the scheme of things, it's not a big loss.
I learned that in the car business. People were no shows at least half the time after making appointments. And, no...not a big loss. Based on what he had told me I probably wouldn't have bough it anyway.
Today, I went to a VW show that was nearby.
I must be TOTALLY out of touch with reality when it comes to market prices.
In addition to tons of parts, junk, Mickey Moused up VW's, there were a few for sale.
A guy had a 55,000 mile (documented) Beetle for sale for 7500.00. It was a totally stock
1964 that looked like someone had painted it with Krylon.
As far as overall condition I would give it a 3 minus.
Another guy had a rusty 1963 with a 1600 engine and Kadrons. Maybe a 4 minus on condition.
Asking 5500.00.
A "Thing" that was total junk for 6500.00.
I left slowly shaking my head.
None of those were worth the asking prices, in my opinion. If those are the going market prices, I'd take a pass because for me they're overpriced by ~50%.
Asking prices = Your First Amendment Rights. Sounds like these vehicles will stay epoxied to the owner's garage floors for a long time to come.
The "Thing" can bring good money if they are anywhere near decent--but they are rust buckets by nature.
You could probably order all the catalog parts for a new 1964 Bug for the same amount of money as restoring that one. VW aftermarket is HUGE.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought those prices were nuts!
Some guys were saying that German parts are near impossible to find. Items like engine parts
and that the Chinese stuff is junk. A vendor had several boxes of German made Big Bore kits and he seemed to have a lot of activity.
I've also heard that the aftermarket body parts such as fenders are inferior too.
Not a surprise there!
Seems folks at specialty shows ask more than is proper. Not sure if it's them being overly enthusiastic or if they hope that an enthusiasts show means passionate buyers.
So after driving the 300e around the past couple days, I'm no longer so sure I'm ready to cut it loose. Darn thing is just too nice and I'd be really hard pressed to find another like it.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
There is a 300E that is for sale here in my town. Looks to be in good condition, but don't know how much they're asking for it.
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2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
Did that Beetle have semi wide-whites? I saw an old Beetle with matte paint and whitewalls today.
It'd be a project to get any car to this mileage
I've heard Craigslist can be a lot of trouble. That's one thing that's been making me procrastinate about trying to sell my '85 Silverado. I figure the thing can't be worth more than $1500 or so, and is all the potential aggravation worth it?
Cash in hand is worth it. Cheap sells quick. Just be prepared to weed through some flakes, and don't plan your life around prospects.
But there are serious people looking, and if you price right, they will show up quickly.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
If bought well, a W124 is hard to beat for the money. The engine is something of a gem, very smooth with enough power for adequate performance. My W126 had the same unit, behind the dual firewalls, was often virtually silent in many driving conditions.
i can help you with that--we can write an ad together than will eliminate/discourage 90% of the hassles.
Some hints:
"no trades"
"this is a cash only deal"
"sold as is, where is"
"no calls after 8 pm"
Use the anonymous e-mail feature on CL, and don't post your phone number "in the open". Put something like 935 OH FIVE THREE NINE
Ignore any e-mails about making a trade, shipping a car, cashing a check, making payments over time, or anyone offering to buy the car sight unseen. Just hit "delete" on those.
VW Big Bore Kits -- often the road to tragedy. People install the kits but (most of them) don't "do the math". They install flat top pistons, flycut the cylinder heads, and have basically built themselves a VW engine with 11:1 compression.....you got it.....KABOOM after the first long hill climb. They'll chunk a piston, guaranteed.
However if you know what you're doing, you can build a VW motor that will wallop any Porsche 912 or 356---but it just won't last as long.
Shifty, that sounds like the beginning of a great Edmunds article. We talk all the time about getting the best trade in value, but there are times when a private sale is the right decision. Some do's and don'ts would be quite helpful.
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Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and let us know! Post a pic of your new purchase or lease!
MODERATOR
2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
But wait, THERE'S MORE!
If safety is an issue for you:
Other things:
If you go on a test drive, set some rules before you leave
If the license plates go with the car in your state, be SURE you have the owner's full name, address and driver's license #, as he/she can rack up tickets on your plates.
Agree, fin.
i still have to fine tune a couple of things on it. I messed with the EHA valve and it seems to have improved the off-idle stumble a bit, but still not fully there yet. And I thought I had the odometer licked, but it stopped again today about a mile out from work. So I'll have to take that apart yet again and see what I can come up with. I've already removed the trip reset arm from the unit altogether to prevent it from kicking the gear off anymore.
But, yes, its quiet, its smooth, got plenty of pep (when you get the trans to downshift), the gas mileage ain't too horrible. I figure its possibly a $4k car to the right buyer. But then what could I possibly get for $4k that could compare?
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Q, I suppose the real question is whether there will come a time that you want to find another like it....
Craigslist certainly attracts a lot of strokes, tire kickers and joyriders. A seller HAS to eliminate those non buyers.
I always put PLEASE, SERIOUS BUYERS ONLY!
If they start price grinding before they even see the car, I'm done with them!
Regarding Craigslist, I haven't had any problems at all selling my cars through this medium. I sent five down the road this way in the last seven years. Craigslist's features, while still very simple, improved substantially over the years.
I'm trying to remember what I sold...
2007 Subaru Outback (six months old at the time)
2008 Subaru Outback (four months old - sold to a buyer 360 miles away and delivered via auto carrier)
1998 Dodge Grand Caravan
1973 Ford F250 Pickup (rolling chassis)
1998 Ford Escort LX
The only one I bought via CL was the Caravan. While that particular transaction was a pleasant one, we looked at a whole lot of really horrible automobiles before we found that one. Of course, they were all gems according to the ads!
In contrast, I am thorough and honest in my advertisements. I state the features it has, mileage, drivetrain, condition, any faults, etc., etc. Basically - no surprises. I don't want to waste people's time and I don't want mine wasted. So far, every person who came to look at one of my cars bought it (except the first person looking at the '73 Ford chassis; that was their own fault for not reading the ad completely).
I always use the hide email feature, no phone number. Can weed out the "bad smell" people better that way. If they sound ok I respond. Best to use a spare disposable email account.
I have sold at least 4 cars this way. Some quicker than others. So patience is important.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
That's what I do too.
I keep forgetting about the jungle grapevines in these small towns. I posted something on craigslist this morning and then ran into a neighbor across the back alley and happened to mention it. Sold it before I had time to get back inside and take the ad down.
This area has an active Facebook "for sale" page that people like - you really know who you are dealing with up here, assuming you are a local.
OK, I have to ask...WHY would you sell a 4 month and a 6 month old Subaru?
Just curious...
Fair question. Is it the car I'd really buy for myself? No, its not. It was purchased for the wife and now she has adopted my Volvo for herself and won't give it up because it has been so much more reliable and consistent.
Other side of the coin is that I might have to sell the Benz to pay for a summer vacation this year, in which case I obviously wouldn't get the chance to turn around and buy something I'd want for myself anyway.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I have bought a couple of cars through CL with good results but I know what questions to ask.
How long have you owned the car?
If the stutter and say they are selling it for a friend or that they just bought it but the wife didn't like it etc I figure the seller is probably a curbstoner. No thanks.
Is the title in your name and do you have it?
Make very sure they have it!
If they tell you....
" The A/C isn't working but I'm sure it only needs a charge"
This means the A/C is shot or has a major leak...same difference.
" It could probably use a tune up"
The engine is shot or there are major problems.
" The gas gauge, dashboard lights and the radio aren't working but I'm sure it's just
a loose wire somewhere or a fuse"
Yeah, right!
" It's in good condition for it's age"
This means it's a rough, edgy car.
" Well, it has 250,000 miles but they are ALL freeway miles and, besides, these
cars run forever"
Hmmm...no surface streets at all?
" It has a couple of parking lot dings"
Sure!
What do you guys think bout this one?
http://seattle.craigslist.org/est/cto/4444602503.html
Too far gone? Not worth the trouble and expense?
Maybe?