Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

Mr_Shiftright

Here's a guy who has it ALL WORKED OUT FOR YOU, but only for 1974 & up Pintos.

(I don't judge---my business is enabling)

stickguy

I love the idea of a Pinto V8 conversion. I always wanted something like that. The even more exciting (but much rarer) bird for me is a Chevy LUV with a V8. I built a model of one when I was a kid. always kinda wanted a real one, though I am sure it would drive like crud!

my guess though is something like is falls into the category of cheaper to buy one done than to do it yourself, but hey, you already got the Pinto. Sort of, once you tow it 2,000 miles home!

Here's a nice looking one:

xwesx

stever said:

How about just grabbing all your toys and just moving south? Well, leave the plow behind. The economy isn't getting any better up there.

The thought has crossed my mind! If I wasn't living in a half-finished house, I would be sorely tempted to do so. Even still, any bath we take on the place is still money in my pocket.

stever

We finally learned to remodel and spruce "immediately" when we buy a house so we can enjoy it. You wind up having to do a lot of that when you put it on the market anyway, so you may as well bite the bullet early. It'll be interesting to see how your kids tolerate remodeling when they go out on their own.

Our old Anchorage house just went on the market - the buyer lived there a good 17 years. It tripled in price (we sold in '99 for about what we paid for it 15 years before, not that long after the recovery from the last bust). She'll be doing good if she drops the price $20k and unloads it in the next month or two. You guys are a long way from the bottom I'm afraid. The bust may enable you to take advantage of some cheaper construction labor this summer though if you did decide to finish out the house.

The Pinto? Dump it. Projects are easy to find.

xwesx

stickguy said:

I love the idea of a Pinto V8 conversion. I always wanted something like that. The even more exciting (but much rarer) bird for me is a Chevy LUV with a V8. I built a model of one when I was a kid. always kinda wanted a real one, though I am sure it would drive like crud!

my guess though is something like is falls into the category of cheaper to buy one done than to do it yourself, but hey, you already got the Pinto. Sort of, once you tow it 2,000 miles home!

I was half-thinking of just doing the work there and driving it home!

But, I need to read through that link that Shifty provided to see just how much is involved with this whole thing. I really shouldn't even consider it, but the seed is already planted.

stickguy

I read it all. Not that bad. Heck, looked easier than your driveway diff rebuild. Just make sure you pick the right components to minimize fabrication.

That thread was 10 YO though. From some later posts, sounds like you can now get some pre made pieces like crossmembers to save a bunch of work.

Heck, largely looks plug and play once you swap out some mounts and the cross member. Just stick with an old school carb engine!

isellhondas

xwesx said:

Okay, guys. Give me a reality check here.....

I received a call from my brother in Oregon: My Pinto's home for the last two decades may be at risk. So, here's the question: Keep the Pinto, or don't keep the Pinto?

I don't want to try finding a new storage location for it, as it *definitely* isn't worth it. But, with my Subaru fiasco in full swing, I'm thinking maybe about doing something a little retro-crazy. Small block crate engine, manual trans, LSD for the rear axle. Not crazy power or anything (maybe 250 horses), just a fun retro car as a "new" daily driver.

I'm thinking about an $8K-10K budget. Am I off my rocker again?

Without wanting to rain on your parade, I think that would be a total waste of money!

stickguy

When a project starts with driving a 47 YO PU from Alaska to Oregon to tow a pinto back, what possible downside could there possibly be?

xwesx

isellhondas said:

Without wanting to rain on your parade, I think that would be a total waste of money!

My parades are always in the rain, so no problems there! Hahah.

So, next question.... what's worse: Putting money into something you can enjoy but has no ROI upside, or the depreciation hit on a new(er) vehicle?

My thought is that it doesn't really make any difference as long as you enjoy the rig while you own it!

xwesx

stickguy said:

When a project starts with driving a 47 YO PU from Alaska to Oregon to tow a pinto back, what possible downside could there possibly be?

Oh, heck no. I am not going to put that many miles on my truck for something like this! It is an intriguing idea, though.....

xwesx

stickguy said:

Heck, largely looks plug and play once you swap out some mounts and the cross member. Just stick with an old school carb engine!

I was thinking of using an "old school" EFI engine, mostly for FE and clearance reasons. Reading through more on this, it seems that I'll need to source a rear end as well. I'll have to try to recollect what the transmission that's in there is. Apparently there are bell housing differences on the various C4 transmissions that would make using the one off my '69 Econoline problematic. I want to say that the Pinto has a C4 in it already, but it's been about eighteen years since I was under that car. Plus, I'm not sure whether it would be able to handle the torque from a 300-horse 302.

I really would like to put a manual in it, though. Funny enough, the car had a manual when my mother purchased it, but she swapped in an automatic because her partner at the time "couldn't drive a stick." What a lame excuse to neuter a car.

fintail

Fun trip in the old dear this morning. I started out early, thought I would hit the highway and go to the oddball auto auction, then out to lunch - RT about 100 miles. The auction is maybe 30 miles from home. At about 25 miles, I could smell a stinky burning scent - I couldn't tell if it was something outside the car, or inside. I continued on, as all the gauges looked normal - I assumed it was outside or another car. Unfortunately, once I was off the highway, I could still smell it, so I pulled over at the auction. There was a small amount of smoke coming from the drivers side rear wheel, and it smelled terrible - brake linings. I stopped there and browsed the auction, thinking some time would cool it down, and thought about what it could be - either a normal brake that just barely engaged, or the parking brake stuck a little (the car drove normally, didn't feel sluggish or chained to anything). I returned to the car maybe 20 minutes later, no smoke, and drove off. I had an idea to get on an empty road and hit the brakes moderately a couple times, maybe this would make them adjust. I did this, drove a few miles on the highway, pulled over - no smoke. I then continued on to my destination, and back home - no smoke, and the smell is slowly dissipating. I don't think I will drive the car on the highway again until I have it looked at by the indy mechanic who I take it to for service.

It looked nice today, ran as nice and smooth as ever, and got a thumbs up and some looks:

berri

Hopefully you dodged a bullet!

fintail

Hopefully just a sticking brake pad or parking brake issue. I checked the brake fluid a few times during the drive, no issues there anyway.

xwesx

Fin, I imagine this is a solid axle, RWD car? You might want to make sure you don't have a leaking axle seal. Horrible-smelling stuff, that gear oil, and it will ruin your brake shoes pretty quickly, too. From your description, this kinda sounds to me like the problem you're having. I have experienced this on both my C20 and my Econoline.

stickguy

Fin, for you next car. Buy that beige if rail at the auction. Which even has a stick shift, on the floor! Stick in a modern motor, do some modest brake and suspension upgrades, and you got a nice sleeper. For way less that a used E550.

fintail

Thanks for the heads up - I will mention that when I take it in. It is a swing axle RWD car, but for as long as I have owned it, there's been just a little seepage back there - no drips, still pretty clean, but not perfect.

The smell was pretty bad too, I swore I could still smell it 12 hours later at home.

xwesx said:

Fin, I imagine this is a solid axle, RWD car? You might want to make sure you don't have a leaking axle seal. Horrible-smelling stuff, that gear oil, and it will ruin your brake shoes pretty quickly, too. From your description, this kinda sounds to me like the problem you're having. I have experienced this on both my C20 and my Econoline.

fintail

It sold, I think I saw that car over the summer. It was very clean and rust-free. I was really tempted, but I don't know what I would do with a non-runner. It would have been a good frankencar conversion - even a modern 4 would make it a rocket, as these are light cars.

stickguy said:

Fin, for you next car. Buy that beige if rail at the auction. Which even has a stick shift, on the floor! Stick in a modern motor, do some modest brake and suspension upgrades, and you got a nice sleeper. For way less that a used E550.

xwesx

fintail said:

Thanks for the heads up - I will mention that when I take it in. It is a swing axle RWD car, but for as long as I have owned it, there's been just a little seepage back there - no drips, still pretty clean, but not perfect.

The smell was pretty bad too, I swore I could still smell it 12 hours later at home.

Ah, a single hinge swing; I'd never seen that design before! Looking at the housing, I cannot tell where the seal is located (e.g., at the wheel hub or at the differential), but even if the seal is at the differential, it looks like the housing is solid all the way to the hub, so fluid leaking into/through there could still terminate inside the brake drum. It is really easy to tell if that's the problem once you crack it open, and it doesn't take much to smell all kinds of terrible.

When the wheel bearing shattered on my Econoline, I wasn't sure I was ever going to be able to smell anything else again!

If it is the seal, and the seal is on the inner end of the axle shaft, the fix will likely be somewhat expensive given the labor involved.

fintail

Yep, it's an unusual arrangement compared to American cars of the era, it has independent suspension. I will mention that when I take it to the shop in a few weeks. My mechanic is pretty good, and I am sure he will catch it if that is the issue. The rear brakes also date back to 1999 or 2000, I think, so who knows what might go wrong there, too.

It's a MB - even with an old one, mechanical issues are never really cheap, I am prepared. It came in under budget last year, so this makes up for it

xwesx said:

Ah, a single hinge swing; I'd never seen that design before! Looking at the housing, I cannot tell where the seal is located (e.g., at the wheel hub or at the differential), but even if the seal is at the differential, it looks like the housing is solid all the way to the hub, so fluid leaking into/through there could still terminate inside the brake drum. It is really easy to tell if that's the problem once you crack it open, and it doesn't take much to smell all kinds of terrible.

When the wheel bearing shattered on my Econoline, I wasn't sure I was ever going to be able to smell anything else again!

If it is the seal, and the seal is on the inner end of the axle shaft, the fix will likely be somewhat expensive given the labor involved.

explorerx4

Started out looking good, but...
http://hartford.craigslist.org/cto/5531526620.html

Mr_Shiftright

What a R-A-T.

toomanyfumes

It's funny seeing some of the overpriced classic cars that sat on people's lawns last year, making another appearance, same price.

ab348

Interesting story in the news locally about a woman whose 2013 E-class Benz sustained $14,000 of damage in a crash while it was being serviced at the dealer:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/dealership-accident-insurance-1.3536094

While I am a bit suspicious of the "poor me" attitude being expressed by the owner of the Benz, I am also somewhat dubious of the dealer's actions. I think the diminished value claim is true to an extent, though I don't know how you would ever get an insurance company to pay for that. I figure this sort of accident while in a dealer's care must happen from time to time. How are they usually handled, I wonder?

Mr_Shiftright

Not familiar with insurance law up there but here in California what would happen is that the owner of the car would make a diminished value claim against the insurance company of the driver who hit the car.

So let's say her car is worth $27,500. The diminished value is maybe $4,000 or so.

hpmctorque

berri said:

Hopefully you dodged a bullet!

Funny how some problems fix themselves. Hope your inde finds nothing wrong.

gsemike

2006 BMW 325

http://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/5530091492.html

Not a project but thinking about this. I only do 6 or 7k a year, so I'm OK with the miles. I know it's a curbstoner, but besides that, what do you think? What do I need to watch out for?

Mr_Shiftright

Well ...dealer-serviced, so there are records of maintenance one presumes, to back up that claim.

High miles generally aren't kind to BMWs but a car with exceptional care might be okay. I'd look for suspension and cooling system problems, or perhaps records to work done to these areas of the car.

fintail

I am taking it in in about 2 weeks. I am optimistic. I might drive it before just to see what happens. I miss driving it, and it's been under 3 weeks.

hpmctorque said:

berri said:

Hopefully you dodged a bullet!

Funny how some problems fix themselves. Hope your inde finds nothing wrong.

fintail

I took the old car out for a short drive today, wanted to see how the brakes were behaving, and visit a car wash to clean off the engine before it goes to the shop (it has a little bit of gunky blowby out of the dipstick, I like to keep it clean for when its on the lift). It started ran as well as always, and had no braking issues, I never would have known there was a problem. I only got it to about 45 mph though. It'll go in about 2 weeks from now, and we will see - I really suspect a sticking parking brake or rear brake pad.

explorerx4

Be the only one on your block with one of these!
http://hartford.craigslist.org/cto/5553757286.html

stickguy

my wife would kill me.

but other than the drivers seat, strip off the silly stuff, and sounds like it might be an OK little car, with all the work done to it.

toomanyfumes

The list of what he fixed on that Rabbit is about how much I repaired in the year and a half I had my 1975.The frame finally rotted where the control arm attached. Off to the junkyard, car was 8 years old. Fun car, though.

Mr_Shiftright

Might be ok if it had real machine guns.

isellhondas

So, is this seller totally NUTS or have I lost touch with the market.

http://seattle.craigslist.org/est/cto/5545924437.html

stickguy

That is certainly an old one. Would not be that surprised if one that nice could pull serious money.

texases

Kinda, but not totally nuts. Early Beetles are pretty collectable.

fintail

If it's really a pristine concours car, it is optimistic, but not insane. Ovals have a cult. If it was a split window, even more. Bellevue huh, I will have to keep an eye out.

Mr_Shiftright

Well he's pushing it a bit but you will find concours quality early Beetles selling in the $25K-$27K range, and the trend is upwards. So if it's too high in 2016, it'll be just right in 2018.

Mr_Shiftright

A client forwarded this AD to me and asked my opinion. I felt the car was overpriced. What do you all think?


https://classics.autotrader.com/classic-cars/1965/dodge/dart/100755151#.VyETp2rNAnE.email

stickguy

It is just an old car. Appears solid enough, but well worn. Nothing at all exciting about it. I wouldn't be considering a slant 6 dart at that money. No upside either if you start restoring it.

texases

Maybe a little high, but how many clean '65 Darts are out there? Not that a base car like that is very interesting, though.

stickguy

You see that sometimes, when someone unearths "the best" original unit of some car. But if no one has an interest, you are left looking for that rare buyer that has some emotional attachment to one (1st car, stuff like that).

Hey, I would get excited about a yellow stick shift Gremlin, but pretty sure I might be the only person. So if you found a time warp one, or a 20K mile Granada, it still isn't going to be worth much.

andre1969

I like the color. But, I always hate when a car looks shiny like that at a quick glance, but then you pop the hood and it looks like that. Makes me think it had a quick, cheap repaint at some point. And, I think I had that exact same model of Kenwood stereo in my '68 Dart! Bought it from Circuit City in 1993 IIRC...put it in my '82 Cutlass first, and when that car crapped out I put it in the Dart.

Also, looks like it just has the tiny 13" wheels. If that slant six is the 225, it wouldn't be too bad in a lightweight car like that (no a/c, most likely the 2.93:1 axle), but if it's just the 170, it would be a dog.

texases

If you go to the web site, there's lots more pics, it's a 225. Vrooom!

isellhondas

I have a soft spot for old Darts with that rock tough slant six but I also think the seller is reaching for the moon.

It is a hardtop but it isn't the top model with bucket seats etc. The seats have been reupholstered which makes me think the odometer has gone over the top at least once.

I wouldn't try to restore it but it could make a good daily driver for someone.

uplanderguy

Some interior shots would be nice. It looks clean and bone-stock from the one photo, although I'd rather have the Dodge AM than the aftermarket radio he mentions in the ad.

Original cars have become more of interest, generally, in the hobby the past several years it seems. I'm told the 'HPOF' class at the huge Hershey meet is increasingly popular. The thinking is, "They're only original once". I would take a less-than-showy model if it was an excellent original, although Darts aren't my thing. I have no idea of values of Darts, but assuming an excellent original interior and excellent running condition, I don't think I'd personally go over $4,500 or so. That's just me though.

EDIT: I see others mentioned underhood pics. It took me three attempts before the small row of pics appeared. I'd say aftermarket seat trim and lower door panels. Around the wheel looks sketchy and underhood, ugh. Dash probably cut for that radio. Missing a hub cap. I wouldn't go more than $4K max. The interior is a turnoff to me as I like original or authentic. I'm far from a Mopar expert but I have to believe that seat and lower door trim is replacement aftermarket.

ab348

This one appeared on my email alerts today. It was at $200 early this morning, now over $7K. You don't see many of these fuselage cars in this kind of condition so I believe the mileage to be accurate.

1971 Plymouth Fury Gran Coupe

uplanderguy

Here's the 270 interior per the brochure (I'm a huge fan of this site):

http://www.oldcarbrochures.com/new/171110/1965 Dodge Full Line/1965 Dodge Full Line-03.html

Maybe that sale car's interior is original or a redo that approaches the original, but in optional all-vinyl? Calling andre!
Looks like the piping is white, which would not be original or authentic.

uplanderguy

That Gran Coupe certainly looks original/authentic, in and out. All I'd do is put whitewalls on it!

I remember looking at new ones and it seems like in our town, anyway, a lot of them were that very color.

Weren't the Gran Coupes a pillared coupe with fixed rear windows? That's what I'm remembering, anyway.