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Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    fintail said:

    Looks like that A (a 28 or 29) got a sealed beam update probably in the late 40s. Sadly that one indeed looks like beyond redemption unless one is performing a labor of love.

    Yep, it's a tear-down right to the frame, and then the tedious process of walking over to a virtual mountain of parts, picking one up with your thumb and index finger, and restoring it. Then, when that's finished, you go back to the pile, and........
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    edited September 2018
    omarman said:

    "They say that the price of restoring a car doesn't depend on the amount of money put to finish the project; it’s in the journey throughout the restoration."

    Sometimes they say, "the best way to double your money is to fold it and put it back in your wallet."

    1. Add up all your restoration bills
    2. Divide by 2.5
    3. Calculate current market value
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    fintail said:

    You're going to need patience, and the right venue. There's a limited market for these. I think you should try Hemmings, maybe MBCA, and try your patience and try CL. If it is really exceptional, maybe BaT. I am sure you will price it realistically. I don't mind these cars and wouldn't mind having one if I had storage space, they are one of the high points of 70s chic - I still think of that green early car that was for sale in Spokane.

    isellhondas said:


    Ours is a 450 SLC and it just doesn't fit in with our short/long term plans. I hate advertising it but I wish I could find a home for it.

    Thanks. I haven't tried at all to sell it really. I have little patience for the flakes that Craigslist tends to attract. I would probably try discouraging some people from even looking at it.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    As it was born a 5-speed, coverting it back to a manual would probably be easy, but the cost of a LHD conversion would probably exceed the value of the car. JDM people learn to live with RHD - dicey passing, but easy parking.
    iluvmysephia1 said:

    Cool JDM

    That's a 1982 Nissan Bluebird that might make a nice daily driver, especially if you modified it back to a 5-speed stick and changed it to left-hand drive.

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    CL is probably the worst idea, especially if you are going to only use it. If the car is as nice as it sounds, it should qualify for BaT, and if your expectations are reasonable, could be a good bet. I don't see too many grossly underpriced cars slipping through the cracks there.
    isellhondas said:



    Thanks. I haven't tried at all to sell it really. I have little patience for the flakes that Craigslist tends to attract. I would probably try discouraging some people from even looking at it.

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    And when you're all done you might have 20K on a very good day.
    Mr_Shiftright said:



    Yep, it's a tear-down right to the frame, and then the tedious process of walking over to a virtual mountain of parts, picking one up with your thumb and index finger, and restoring it. Then, when that's finished, you go back to the pile, and........

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I run into quite a few cases of people taking on a restoration without a clear idea of how long and hard this road can be. Of course, some cars are a lot easier than others, and I suspect a Model A would be a walk in the park compared to a '59 Cadillac. There are some skill sets which are essentially if you're going to do the restoration yourself---welding, body work, upholstery work---all tricky for the rank amateur to learn.

    I've seen some big restoration bills in my day---recently $160K on a Mercedes 280SL (still not done) and $300K on an old Ferrari (still not done).
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    I can see it if you love the car or have a clear direction to profit (like with many old Ferrari), but I can't imagine laying down 160K to restore a Pagoda. And then you hit the big problem, you make it too nice to drive. A driver restoration is best, and even then, I estimate I could put 50K into the fintail without a lot of issue.

    Speaking of that project car, I had it out yesterday, and I notice what seems like more blow-by out of the dipstick area than I have noticed in the past. The car has been out on the highway and I drove it spiritedly in town, which may explain it, but it seemed more apparent. I hope that doesn't bode too unwell.

    Pic of the car from yesterday, a S550 cabrio pulled up beside me, which made for a fun comparison, also, the color of the sky works with the color of the car:



    Mr_Shiftright said:

    I run into quite a few cases of people taking on a restoration without a clear idea of how long and hard this road can be. Of course, some cars are a lot easier than others, and I suspect a Model A would be a walk in the park compared to a '59 Cadillac. There are some skill sets which are essentially if you're going to do the restoration yourself---welding, body work, upholstery work---all tricky for the rank amateur to learn.

    I've seen some big restoration bills in my day---recently $160K on a Mercedes 280SL (still not done) and $300K on an old Ferrari (still not done).

  • omarmanomarman Member Posts: 2,702
    Flat Top needs tires.
    Convertible Top With Factory Air and no issues?
    T Tops x 2 and a shed full of parts.
    A time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    I like the flat top, but a new set of wide whitewall radials shouldn't be more than a grand or so, why not do it and have the car ready to go?
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    fintail said:

    I like the flat top, but a new set of wide whitewall radials shouldn't be more than a grand or so, why not do it and have the car ready to go?

    Some sellers are so clueless. Here you are trying to sell a car for $17,500, and you won't spring for $500. Makes the buyer wonder what else you are cutting corners on.
  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,289
    fintail said:
    I can see it if you love the car or have a clear direction to profit (like with many old Ferrari), but I can't imagine laying down 160K to restore a Pagoda. And then you hit the big problem, you make it too nice to drive. A driver restoration is best, and even then, I estimate I could put 50K into the fintail without a lot of issue. Speaking of that project car, I had it out yesterday, and I notice what seems like more blow-by out of the dipstick area than I have noticed in the past. The car has been out on the highway and I drove it spiritedly in town, which may explain it, but it seemed more apparent. I hope that doesn't bode too unwell. 
      
    Swap a LS into it, surprise all your friends.  B)

    2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    That reminds me of a friend of mine who has said he's going to have my car "stolen" like on the TV show where they take an old car and "restore" it, usually to an aesthetically displeasing spec.

    I can just see my car "restored" in orange with a billet steering wheel and a SBC under the hood.

    Although thinking of engines, the 4 cyl diesel in the Bluetec is almost exactly the same displacement, but 50% or more hp, and probably thrice as much torque. A modern MB I6 would be heading for triple the hp, that would be a unique resto-mod.
    ab348 said:


    Swap a LS into it, surprise all your friends.  B)

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    ab348 said:


    fintail said:

    I can see it if you love the car or have a clear direction to profit (like with many old Ferrari), but I can't imagine laying down 160K to restore a Pagoda. And then you hit the big problem, you make it too nice to drive. A driver restoration is best, and even then, I estimate I could put 50K into the fintail without a lot of issue.

    Speaking of that project car, I had it out yesterday, and I notice what seems like more blow-by out of the dipstick area than I have noticed in the past. The car has been out on the highway and I drove it spiritedly in town, which may explain it, but it seemed more apparent. I hope that doesn't bode too unwell. 
      

    Swap a LS into it, surprise all your friends.  B)

    https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=mercedes+fintail+v8&&view=detail&mid=40A85A7DCFB6C89C211040A85A7DCFB6C89C2110&&FORM=VRDGAR
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    Finland, because of course. Scandinavia has embraced some stereotypical aspects of American car culture more than many parts of the US itself.
  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,289
    Now there’s something you don’t see every day. 

    2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6

  • omarmanomarman Member Posts: 2,702
    A 70's Thing man. Thanks, Ed.

    Knock knock! Who's there? Orange! Orange who? Orange you glad it's 1975 again?

    Selling a 1 of 1 Trans Am with a 455 HD. Once restored this car can sell for 75,000 to 175,000.
    Orange you sorry it's not a Super Duty?
    A time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    The T/A is somewhat of a rare car (something like 250 made) but $100K for a beauty is more like it. Probably cost you more to do it up that nicely.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    I see the MB is doing the seat deflation thing, time for a re-stuffing.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    A Model A doesn't like to go much faster than around 40 MPH so freeways are out. a T is good for, what? Maybe 30-35 MPH? Also, what year did they start using starter motors? I don't like cranking a car. Even though I know all of the rules it still scares me. One good backfire and it's broken arm time or at the least, a dislocated thumb. and, no a T does not stop well! My Model A would lock up a wheel or two in a panic stop.

    Of course they are geared so low that taking your foot off of the gas is nearly enough to stop!
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    Some guy in London is pissed at me right now because I'm not interested in shipping my Mercedes to England.
    I thought one of you guys might snap it up!


    Make a smooth ride to San Francisco for sure!
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Yep they are primitive. A Model A should do 50-55 if it's in good shape. Brakes on the T or the A are absolutely terrifying.

    As for the T--remember, you are talking about a car 100 years old!
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    Isn't there a two speed rear end accessory that might add a few mph to an A? I wouldn't want to drive one on a local interstate anyway.

    Shipping the car to London, welcome to Craigslist! If a legit foreign buyer wants it, they can arrange their own shipping and have it picked up at your house, after you have the cash of course.

    I saw your ad, isell - you need some pics :)

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    isellhondas said:

    Some guy in London is pissed at me right now because I'm not interested in shipping my Mercedes to England.
    I thought one of you guys might snap it up!


    Make a smooth ride to San Francisco for sure!

    He can send a trucker to your house and they will gladly drop it off at the port of his choice. Let the buyer do all the work.

    RE: Model A going faster:

    Yes, you could buy one of these, hopefully with a free life insurance policy attached:

    http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/ruckstelldualhigh.htm



  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 20,723
    @omarman,
    To somewhat tie 2 of your car ad's together. My dad had 2 Things at the same time, both the color of that Mercedes.
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • texasestexases Member Posts: 11,107
    My dad’s 1911 Regal topped out around 50. Never on a freeway. And wooden wheels give me the heebie jeebies.  Hit a curb wrong, uh oh!
  • omarmanomarman Member Posts: 2,702
    explorerx4 said:

    @omarman,
    To somewhat tie 2 of your car ad's together. My dad had 2 Things at the same time, both the color of that Mercedes.

    Ah the orange Thing thing. The 70's were just...ripe for that autumn pallet.

    In 1979 my cousin and his wife bought a Dodge conversion van for full sticker around $18K. I drove it once and it was just a van. With orange paint, black stripes captain's chairs and shag carpet. We called it the great pumpkin.
    A time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    A fun pic of my project car from last month's MBCA event. This randomly became the W111 section, my car has some rich relatives:


  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    No offense, but I do like the convertible next door to your's. btw - appears you have those camera blocker lenses over your license plates B)
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    Aged driver quality W113 on BaT - insane to restore it, but it might be useful as-is once a few needs are addressed - same color as my car. Being at BaT, it isn't cheap.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    The 250SL is the rarest of the "Pagoda" roadsters, but not the most valuable by a long shot---the 280SL is the one most buyers want, as they are more powerful and better appointed.

    I hope the car gets preserved, but there is no way in hell anyone is going to come out ahead on this. You could possibly patch up the floors, slather them with goop, replace missing pieces, try to work up the paint as best you can, spiff up the interior here and there, get it running well and just enjoy it as it is.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    You could sink 100K into it, plus the 25K purchase price, and never run in the black.

    Or maybe put 15K in it, make it sound and roadworthy, and have a nice sunny day driver.

    Nice color anyway, and it has the correct color code on the body tag.
  • ab348ab348 Member Posts: 20,289
    Coincidentally I had looked at that 250SL listing earlier today. The color drew me in. Odd in that parts of it look quite decent but the interior is not good and there are some spots on the underside that seem very questionable. Most dubious of all are the rockers, at least on one side, that appear to be pop-riveted into place and then covered with stone chip and more blue paint.

    2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    fintail said:

    You could sink 100K into it, plus the 25K purchase price, and never run in the black.

    Or maybe put 15K in it, make it sound and roadworthy, and have a nice sunny day driver.

    Nice color anyway, and it has the correct color code on the body tag.

    $100K? That would be a cheap restoration on that car. More like $150K to do it "right". Basically it needs to be torn apart.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    ab348 said:

    Coincidentally I had looked at that 250SL listing earlier today. The color drew me in. Odd in that parts of it look quite decent but the interior is not good and there are some spots on the underside that seem very questionable. Most dubious of all are the rockers, at least on one side, that appear to be pop-riveted into place and then covered with stone chip and more blue paint.

    Scary.
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,359
    I got more sucked into the blue gremlin they also have running. Not quite the same level of financial exposure!

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    I think W113 rocker covers bolt on like that, also pointed out in the ad. However, I see a few other areas of possible decay disaster. Spend 150K to maybe get 100K when you are done, sounds good.





  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,688
    Wow. That thing ran up to $40K in the final ten minutes. Someone must *really* want it!
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Well, they GOT it---and good luck, poor soul.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    Insane money for that car. In that condition, it would have been lucky to hit much over 10K a mere 15 years ago.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    You can buy VERY nice ones of these for $60K. So $20K isn't going to get this poor bidder anywhere near a ROI.

    Honestly, the information is out there to make intelligent decisions on classic cars.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    People with more money than sense, they make the world go round.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I doubt that even explains it. If you can flush $40K down the toilet, why not $60K for a much nicer car?
  • omarmanomarman Member Posts: 2,702
    That's a good question. If you have the means to live well then why bid on something like that?
    A time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,423
    Maybe the color stoked some emotions. There has to be some kind of catch here that we aren't seeing.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Believe me. It was just a uninformed bid by someone who didn't know what they were doing. I know the value of these cars inside out.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    edited September 2018
    Well, let's see. Paint and chrome dinged up. Not run in many years. Torn seats. Top shrinking. Top bows damaged. Wood trim missing in places. Muffler holed. Oil leaks. Holes in floors. dash leather dye coming off, mickey mouse wiring under dash, carpets deteriorated. VIN plate in wrong place, headliner on hardtop stained, surface rust on engine compartment components, perished bushings throughout the suspension, transmission leak, rusted brake lines, rusted rocker panels, rusted perch points for suspension, rusted beauty rims and hubcaps (some of them).

    So there you go. Good luck at $40K.
  • gsemikegsemike Member Posts: 2,413
    Long Island Craigs

    https://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/d/1985-dodge-ramcharger/6700288887.html Ram Charger. Sellers says needs work but it actually looks pretty decent.

    https://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/d/classic-77-ford-pick-up-ford/6676318120.html 77 Ford Ranger. Seller claims 66k miles

    https://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/d/1988-pontiac-formula-firebird/6700220478.html 88 Formula. I Liked these back then. Black, stick, solid roof. Would like more pics

    https://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/d/bumblebee-28/6700201205.html "Bumble bee Z" features include insane seller

    https://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/d/1985-chrysler-lebaron/6700192362.html 85 LeBaron. Don't see these everyday

    https://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/d/1990-bmw-325i-e30/6700086034.html "Odometer stopped a month ago"

    https://longisland.craigslist.org/cto/d/police-cruiser/6700067412.html Old police cruiser for a grand
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 33,737
    i'd actually like to see more pics of the Diplomat

    '11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S

  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 20,723
    Forget that Diplomat, how about this? WHAT?
    https://westernmass.craigslist.org/cto/d/1968-plymouth-sport-fury-hemi/6700302278.html
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
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