BMW 3-Series Lease Questions

ursamajor

Took delivery today of a 335xi sedan. But I had Rusnak competing against Pacific in Glendale down to the wire for LESS THAN $ 500 over invoice. I had ordered at the very end of December to lock a .002 MF, so my deal was really done, and Pacific got what I wanted--Conti Contact SSR RFTs, added a spare, which is in storage for long trips only. The frustrating part of this is the "break-in" period. Man, this car is not intended for LA traffic. I want to be aggressive, but must bide my time. If you hadn't priced with the internet dept. of these two dealers, I believe you should have, and I would encourage all readers in this area to consider them, as once you make them aware of what we share here, that you're an informed buyer/lessee, and know what the "spread" should be, they'll give you as good a deal as you can get without any nonesense.

stevek4

Thanks....
I found the MF and RV through your resources, and found the equations; the deal they are offering me is really a pretty good deal!
But now knowing how they get there, I will TRY to neg a little better deal....why not, right?
They are quoting me a little off the MSRP (around $1k), so can't complain either way.
Thanks for the guidance.

stevek4

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=260678

It is under bimmerfest forums....I was just directed to this the other day, and it helped a lot!
Good luck.

cdnpinhead

Glad you were able to find what you needed. Unless you're looking at a coupe or convertible (and it sounds like you're not), you should be able to do better than $1K off list -- reports are that some people are getting $500 - $1000 over invoice. You may want to broaden your scope & add a couple more dealers to the mix.

Thanks for the update.

kyfdx

Speaking of coupes and convertibles...

$1500 customer down payment assistance on in-stock 3-series coupes and convertibles (as of 2/14), through the end of the month.. It's good for leases or financing through BMWFS..

scottyt24

How does IL figure tax on leases? Do they charge the tax based on payment, MSRP, sales price or residual??

Thanks in advance.

kyfdx

Full selling price..

amy9

What exactly are these incentives? Thanks.

ilovedogs

$1,500

kkindor

You may have good credit and had credit cards before, but unless you have had a comparable credit debt such as another automobile, BMWFS will not touch the deal. It is not that you have bad credit, you simply may not have enough credit for them to consider the risk. Suggestion: consider a much less expensive BMW and perhaps they will reconsider. 3 years goes by pretty quickly

kkindor

with all due respect, you mean to tell us that for $580.00 you love the car and for $600.00 you hate it? lol...

you probably down more than $20.00 at Starbucks per week! make your own coffee and start driving the car you want

kkindor

PEOPLE!!!! Please get away from this buy-rate money factor thing. "BUY RATE" is what the dealership pays for the money and they DO NOT SELL THE MONEY FOR THE COST OF THE MONEY! Dealers are entitled to earn a profit, just like your business does! If you take out a loan on a home, the bank will NOT sell you the money at their cost they are in business to make money too... IT IS NO DIFFERENT. Most lenders do limit how much a dealer can mark-up the cost of the money. Tthat is a good thing!

When it comes to BMW's, reality is that there is only an approximate 7.5% GROSS profit margin in any of their cars. That means on a $40,000.00 car, the dealers GROSS, not net, profit is right around $3,000.00 That is all there is, no rebate $, no "Trunk money" no incentive $ ( most of the time).....So when you ask for a large discount on their product, particularly on one that is hard to come by, just exactly where is it supposed to come from?

There are only 3 things that matter when one acquires an automobile, THREE:

Do you love the car? ( you had better say "oh, cool" not "oh,crap" everyday)
How much $ will I spend up-front and is that figure comfortable?
Is the monthly expense comfortable? ( not affordable, there is a differece)

If all 3 peices fit, you have found the perfect car! The price of the car DOES NOT MATTER. You give me a $250,000 Ferrari for $600 per month and WE HAVE A DEAL! :):) Give me a $4.5 mil home for a $1,200 mortgage payment and you can bring me the paper work, right now!

For crying our loud, quit debating over $30.00 per month, start driving and enjoying the car you want. If you are all that concerned over $30.00........drive something CHEEPER, I do not mean less expensive, I mean CHEEP

Oh, waiter...I'd like to talk to you about this bill......IS THIS THE BEST YOU CAN DO? I can't believe this place charges so much, we should have eaten at McDonalds....oh, yeah, I wanted real food.

kyfdx

Hey, kkindor..

Welcome to CarSpace.com forums!!

You might have missed the memo, but we are a consumer oriented website, and the whole purpose of the Prices Paid forums is to compare deals and dealers, so we can get the best deal possible. And... I don't think I'm alone in this... By "best deal", we mean "lowest price".. And.. by "we", we mean "buyers"...

So... unless you are willing to send each and every one of us $30/mo. out of your own pocket... we'll keep worrying about the price...

Have a great day!
kyfdx
Host-Prices Paid Forums

cdnpinhead

Thanks for that response.

I was tempted, but trying hard to be kinder & gentler, I refrained.

Let's see, $30/mo X 3 years is only $1080. Let's round that off (who cares?--it's only money) to $1100.

I'm sure kkindor's cheques will be in the mail shortly to everyone who has posted here for the past year or so. Let's see. . .$1100 times a pretty large number (carry the . . .) is probably only pocket change to those who don't care about stuff like this.

Or not.

elizariev

Car_Man, here's what I got today thanks to you. I did save a lot on my lease three years ago too. How did I do? How much better could I have done? Is there some dealer incentive I didn't know about, because the deal seems too good to be true?

2008 BMW 328i, 36 months, 12,000 miles, RV 63%, MF .00175, $136 over the invoice (MSRP $38675 -- Premium, Heated seats, matallic paint). Drive off: $625 acq fee, $150 doc fee and 1st month mayment.

Dealer in St. Louis metropolitan area in O'Fallon, IL.

Thanks!

jezmia

Hi,

I know this question has been asked many times over, but each case is different. I am looking to get a 328i automatic with power front seats and metallic paint. The dealer is quoting $35,920, MF .00175 residual factor 63% 36months 12k miles, inceptions $1215, I have asked a detailed inceptions, but still have not got it, he just said that he was not charging any Bank acquisition fees or Dealer Fees (which he said a lot of dealer add at the last minute to increase inceptions). monthly payments $460+taxes. This seems very high to me???

I also got this other offer $475 included taxes $0 out of pocket, $0 down payment, something they call sign and drive, but this one was for a 328i sedan automatic, basic paint, no extras. Now the salesperson was not that nice, so not sure if he was just bluffing and he game me a figure and can't really do it.

any suggestions on how I can bring the price of the vehicle down or the mf down or plainly get a good deal. Ideally I would like to get my payments $400 including taxes or maybe $400 plus taxes, $0 down, but want the automatic, metallic paint and power seats which are more money. is this realistic???

Normally, would you suggest doing $0 down inceptions only or sign and drive $0 out of pocket, $0 down ???

thanks for replying....

stef3

Got it today for my daughter from CA dealer.
328i automatic, premium package, Ipod/USB adapter, metalik paint, leather seats.
Sticker price $38575.
Lease terms 36 months, 15000 miles.
Deal: $1501.19 drive off, (477.96 payment and 37.04 tax ) = $515 per month including tax.
Is it a good deal or not? ... I do not know but we are happy with it.

cdnpinhead

My lease calculation spreadsheet is on my other computer, so I can't do that part for you. However, I think your dealer is being straight with you for your inception total. It normally consists of 1st payment (460) plus inception fee (625) plus security deposit (500), which is way more than the $1215 you've been quoted. If you take the first payment out, or consider it separately, you're at $1125, so maybe your dealer has a $90 documentation fee. It's a BS fee, but some are $200-400, so it could be worse.

The only ways to get the payment down is to do multiple security deposits (which you get back at the end of the lease), each of which drops the money factor a little bit, or to get the dealer to reduce the cap cost (you shouldn't be paying too much above invoice for a sedan). The money you have tied up in the multiple security deposits reduces each monthly payment enough to equate to ~8% (more or less, can't remember exactly) interest on the money.

The screamer ads in the paper ($370/mo, or whatever) usually involve a hefty down payment applied toward the cap cost reduction, which is NEVER a good idea. It's money down a rathole if the car is totalled or stolen -- the gap insurance just takes care of the lease payoff, NOT the down payment. Put that money toward multiple security deposits and you'll get it back.

Good luck.

jezmia

Thank you very much for your suggestions. do you think the other sign and drive offer I got for a basic bmw, no metallic pain, no automatic front seats is realistic $475 a month including taxes.

jezmia

In my opinion I think you got a good deal, but I am not doing the math, you will need to know the MF for that. But from just what you said the price tag for your car is much higher than the one I want, plus you are getting a 15k miles. Do you mind me asking was was the MSRP. thanks!

stef3

The MSRP is $38575. Negotiated price $ 36883. The orther things I got are 4 floor mats, and tinted windows. Includin these, base on KBB , I am about $1200 over invoice.

gtli

I've been approved to assume a lease on a 2007 335i. Alpine white, premium and sports packages.
24 months and 24k miles left on lease.
$535/month.

Is that a good deal?
Thanks

stef3

This is just a sugestion...

On the first deal you pay $0 down, so your first month and other fees are more or less rolled in to the lease.
Lets say only $475 divided by 36 = about $13.
Basically your monthly payment is around $460 including tax with a drive off of around $475 (this is just a very gross estimate) One more time, ... this is just a basic estimate.

In this case the second offer will cost you about $1000 more than the first.
To make the 2 deals even and considering the extras, you should get the second offer down to about $450+tax

Maybe I am wrong ... just trying to help.

jezmia

Normally would you suggest leasing a car $0 deposit, with inceptions only, deposit, registration and first month? or a sign and drive $0 down $0 out of pocket?

Does anyone have idea how a lease and sing is calculated? I thought this was the most expensive way to lease a car, but so far this is the best quote I have. But still not sure if there is a catch. $475, 6% tax included on a 328i sedan, automatic, no extras, 36/12miles. I've also gotten a 328i sedan, automatic, metallic, power front seat 36/12m for $460 + taxes with first payment plus tags/registration fees and the State leasing fee $713.

if you go with a 10,000 miles how much more is for a $12k.

On a BMW should you go with the exact miles that you think you need or with extra, I've been told that 6 months before your lease ends you can buy miles at $.16 cents, but not sure if this is a good idea.

can a dealer go below the invoice price, or this is something never happens... thanks!!!!

jezmia

Stef3,

thanks for your suggestions, they are helpful, as I don't have the slightest idea. :-)

troyss

forgot to add in my last post how low a payment could I get with the drive off down payment can I roll the tax part into the payment so it not monthly plus tax plus whatever.

troyss

looking to pick up a 328i sedan with automatic transmission and maybe an ipod adapter thats it need to keep it simple for the payments. reading these posts I see some are getting invoice and near invoice prices. since its the end of the month im hoping to get a super deal. any advice on a good dealership in los angeles. i also have a trade in im thinking about . the money factor i have no clue what i should expect to get on a 2 or 3yr 12k lease. advise thanks

jjlawyer

yes. I have a 335 with those options plus nav, sat radio, paint and fold down seats and I am at $590. that was when mf was .00150. i think mf is higher now than that so you cant touch your deal on a new car.

qbrozen

I think that is nuts as a brand new 08 328xi is about that for 3 years.

And that is pretty typical. New cars have the benefit of manufacturer subsidizing. Used usually don't.

nygxdriver

I am interested in leasing a CPO 07 328xi 12k miles (Heated seats and power front seats are the onlt options) listed at $31,995. I wanted to lease it for 3 years 10k/yr. what would be a fair lease? On the phone the dealer quoted me $478/month with taxes and fees paid up front. I think that is nuts as a brand new 08 328xi is about that for 3 years. Please help as I dont really know how they figure a used car lease (how do you figure a residual value or the MSRP?)

scottyt24

Hi-

Looking for some advice from those folks in snowy climates. Interested in a 328, but debating whether the AWD is necessary. I am in Chicago area and we have definitely had a snowy winter. I keep wondering what my driving experience would be like if I only had RWD. Just looking for winter experieinces in the i models and how the cars handle. Are they all over the road or do they drive pretty well in bad weather?
Thanks in advance.

kyfdx

With a good set of winter tires, you'll be fine with RWD...

A Chicago winter with the stock all-seasons? You could do it, but it might not be pretty...

scottyt24

I just realized that I probably put this post in the wrong forum so I apologize, but just one more question.

Any idea on winter tire prices??

kyfdx

Prices are fairly similar to all-season tires of the same quality and size..

My last set were Dunlop M3, in 205/50-17.. I don't remember exactly, but I think they were around $650-$750, which was the total bill, on the car.. including tax..

Not cheap, but every mile you put on the winter tires, is not being put on the stock set.... So, even though it might not be a wash, the actual expense is less than the initial cash outlay...

coby03

Just thought I'd let you know that I pulled the trigger on a 2008 335i sedan, to replace my 2005 330Ci that comes off lease in a month. I had to order it so I may have to have BMWFS extend the lease one month. But that's OK because I'm way under on miles (30K on a 36K miles lease). Here's the deal on the 335i sedan;

Jet Black
Black Dakota leather
Dark Burl Trim
Premium Pkg
Sport Pkg
Heated front seats
Steptronic automatic
Paddle shifters

MSRP = $45,800 incl dest
Selling price = $42,885 ($700 over invoice, no MACO or training)
3 year/10k miles per year lease
MF=0.0021 (same as it was last month)
RV=64%
Payment = $528/mo (not incl taxes)

Dealer placed order and with their allocation the vehicle is already scheduled for production on 3/11/08. Hopefully will arrive in approx. 6 weeks or so. Oh, one other thing. I told the GM that I wasn't happy at all with the tires on my current 330Ci (Bridgestone RE040s, which wore out in about 10,000 miles and are horrible in the rain). He put in writing that if it doesn't come in with Michelin Pilot Sports, he will put them on. That was pretty nice. Overall, I think a good deal. Now for the wait!

hopefall

Has anyone seen the March MF/Residual numbers for the 328i/15k Lease?

Much Thanks

stvroy

I'm currently looking at a 328i Convertible. Here are the specs....

Alipine White Convertible
Cream Beige Dakota Leather
Premium Package
Cold Weather Package
Automatic Transmission
Comfort Acces

MSRP - $49,050.00
Dealer Add-ons (Mats-$199 & Wheel locks-$199)

Total- $49,448.00

Money Factor Quoted- .003 (Which is high based on what I read here)
Bank Acquistion Fee - $825 (Seems high)

Upfronts - @ $1,320
Total Cash - $2,500
36 Month Lease at 12k miles/year

Payment- $787

This seems insane to me. First, the price is sticker. Plus the other fees that seem extreme.

Any thoughts on what is fair for this car? I want to pay multiple security deposits as I've seen on this board. Here's what I need...

1) Fair Negotiated Price
2) Money Factor
3) Residual
4) Payment?

Thanks in advance!

jezmia

Hi, I have a question, how much money did you have to pay for the inceptions, dealer fees, tags, tax, deposit, and first month. I think you are getting a great price. congratulations

cdnpinhead

If you review the posts from the past several weeks on this board, you'll find links and/or sources for the answers to all your questions. If you can't be troubled, then neither can we.

The regulars here are willing to answer specific questions, but it's important to show that you've made a reasonable effort to help yourself.

Why don't you tell us what you think is reasonable, based on what you've read here and researched elsewhere? For starters, the $825 bank fee is as high as BMW allows -- 625 is the actual amount, and some dealers don't mark it up.

Good luck.

coby03

I just put down a $500 deposit to place the order. When it arrives, I'll pay 1st, $725 acq fee, $200 for doc fee/registration, and taxes of $1,188 (6.25% where I live in Ohio) for a total of $2,641 less the $500 deposit. Hope this helps.

stvroy

I have read through some of the posts, yes. I was mainly asking if someone had purchased/leased a similar vehicle and what kind of a deal they got. I'm not asking anyone to do research for me, just want to know what people know. I know it's my first post, but I came here hoping to learn more about the BMW process. I've owned Lexus, Porsche, Toyota and Hummer, but not BMW (yet).

Here's what I've researched so far and some specific questions....

1) I do know the $825 is marked up and maybe they won't mark it down, but I did read about the $625. How negotiable is this or does it vary based on the dealer?

2) I'm unsure about the lease rates for March as they just came out (I'm guessing). I was quoted .003, but I noticed this was higher than last month.

3) I did see a post where someone said they picked up a 335 convertible for $800 over, but I haven't seen anyone else say this is realistic. I did research on Edmunds and the FMV price was about $600 off sticker. I was hoping to get in for about $1,000 over invoice, but didn't know if anyone has had success with that.

4) I saw multiple people say not to put cash down, but instead focus on MSD. I asked them about that and the salesman said you couldn't do it. I pushed on this and they said that I could do 8 at $800 each (on the BMW site the security deposit was $600) and other posts have said 7 is the max. I personally don't mind putting cash down as I would rather have a lower payment because I have a few rental properties and like to keep my debt/income as low as possible. Is putting cash down that bad?

5) I was told the $1,500 incentive from FED didn't carry over to March (so I may wait or use this as leverage with the dealer to come off MSRP).

6) Will I get a better deal if I order one? It's a third vehicle, so no hurry.

Sorry if I didn't ask the specifics in the first post, I'm new to this. I appreciate anyone's input or suggestions.

cdnpinhead

Okay, now there's something to work with.

The way I look at the acquisition fee markup is the same as I do the "documentation" fee. It's all added dealer markup and just as bogus as an ADM sticker that adds $1000 to the list price of the car. That said, many (if not most) mark up the acquisition fee, have hundreds of dollars in doc fees (or both).

Normally the security deposit is the monthly payment rounded up to the next $50. The dealer you're working with seems to have worked out a payment between $750 & $800. Either that, or he's got a different approach to things.

The money factor for either convertible (328 or 335) is 0.00275. Marking this up is another way to get more profit out of a deal, but going all the way up to 0.003 would certainly have me looking for a different store, especially combined with that $825 thing. You may already know your residuals, but for 36 months it's 59% for 15K a year, 61% for 12K and 62% for 10K. Also, the last I heard that $1500 thing was for the month of Feb only.

There could be a little legitimate confusion over the MSD thing. I believe the rule is 7 additional deposits (plus the one you're required to pay unless you're turning in a BMW off-lease), for a total of 8. As you may already know, each additional security deposit lowers the MF by 0.00007.

Some dealers are very happy to do an order & will give you a better deal on it. Others won't & it wouldn't surprise me if this dealer wasn't one of them. If you're willing to take a three-day weekend & fly to Germany, you can do European Delivery and save another 7%. If you have any kind of a European vacation planned, then you save the cost of a rental car as well.

Lots of choices, but it's certainly nice to be in a position to make them. Enjoy.

Sorry I came off as harsh as I did yesterday, but I'd much rather help someone who's already done a chunk of the work and/or has specific questions.

Go to post #2137 for a few other odds & ends.

stvroy

^

Great information! No worries on coming across harsh. It was my first post and in your eyes I was just fishing without doing work myself. I've been looking a while and there were availability issues, so more recently I've been looking more seriously. The dealership did p&ss me off a bit the way they handled things acting like it was my first buying experience and I didn't research. I guess for those that don't research before hand, things seem fine.

The ED is interesting to me, and definitely to save another 7%. Thanks for your help.

cdnpinhead

I'm not sure what part of the country you're in, but shopping among 5-10 (or more) stores is a very good thing. Some are very competitive. Many aren't.

Good luck, and enjoy.

ellechero

it seems kind of high i just got a 535i and they told me the money factor went down on the first the money factor i got was .0019 and i think last month money factor was .0025 im not sure if the money factor is different on the 3 and the 5.

boe747lcf

Hi coby03,

That looks like a pretty good deal. Can I ask how you got the MF and residual? I'd like to do the exact same lease term, just a slightly different optioned car. Did you put anything down (like an acquisition fee, security deposit)?

I thought I read somewhere that at the end of a BMW lease you have to pay a disposition fee (basically paying BMW to take your car back)? Any truth to that?

Thanks!

ursamajor

335xi sedan w/ $ 600 deposit lowering MF to .002, same mileage (10k/yr for 3yrs), therefore same residual, your equipment, plus Arctic metallic paint, plus cold weather, no sport, no paddle shifters, add park distance control, add remote entry device. I didn't put up a deposit when ordering. I ordered 12/28, took delivery 2/18 in Burbank, CA. Based upon info provided by several posters here (like Woody1241, #1736), I insisted upon Continental Conti Contact SSR RFTs as a condition of taking delivery. Guess what? The vehicle arrived with the tires I wanted. We actually had some rain in L.A. right after I took delivery and the traction and feel on wet surfaces is peerless with the AWD. I bought a fifth identical wheel and tire and keep it in the garage until and unless I drive over 300 miles, when I'll place it in the cargo area (rear seats fold forward). The spare is little expense, about $ 550, considering the peace of mind. My lease is $ 552/mo. prior to sales tax, based upon a cap cost $ 500 over invoice.

FWIW, not one person has failed to remark favorably about Arctic metallic. In bright sun, the grey exhibits subtle hues of green and light blue, and it's not a "dark" color, which reduces the heat buildup factor.

stvroy

I know it's speculation, but what do you all think rates will do over the next couple of months? The base rate dropped from .00275 in February to .00245, but they are still much higher than the coupe and sedan. Do you think they will continue to drop?

Also, if I order one now, do I get the rate now or do I contract and lock in at delivery? Thanks in advance.

coby03

The MF and RV are the base rates from BMWFS for a 335i sedan, 3 year, 30K mile lease as of beginning of March 2008. They were MF 0.0021 and RV of 64%. Since I ordered the vehicle, the rates are locked in for 60 days. If they go up, I'm covered. If it goes down, I'll get the better rate. Watch to make sure the dealer doesn't try to mark up the MF which they are prone to do to bake a little more profit into the deal.

As far as anything down, I paid a $500 deposit so far. When the vehicle comes in I'll pay the 1st payment, BMWFS acquisition fee, plate/regist fee, and taxes (less the $500 deposit). There is no security deposit since I'm a returning BMWFS customer. And when I turn in my 2005 330Ci, they will waive the $350 disposition fee. If I didn't re-up with BMW I'd have to pay that fee.

I saw that my 335i is scheduled for production on BMW Owner's Circle. Hopefully will have it here in less than 6 weeks from now. Waiting....ugh.

shipo

I just configured up three different 3-Series cars, a Sedan, a Coupe, and a Sport Wagon, all at exactly $44,000, and all with exactly $4,000 "down" (kind of simulating ED savings). What I found disheartening was the huge disperity between the various monthly lease costs given three "identically" financed cars (3-Year/36,000 mile leases). Consider the following:

2008 328i Sedan -- $507
2008 328i Coupe -- $531
2008 328i Wagon -- $572

Ouch, that means that over the term of the lease, the Sport Wagon will cost $2,340 more (or nearly 13% more). Ouch, what's up with that?

Best Regards,
Shipo