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2018 BMW 4 Series Lease Deals and Prices

24

Comments

  • untdrums98untdrums98 Member Posts: 18
    edited October 2017
    This is the latest deal I’m planning on signing on soon.  I’m not sure what numbers they are using because I can’t get the same monthly that they are giving me.  A lot seems to have to do with the sales tax amount.  I get about twice that amount.  I’m waiting to see actual MF, residual, etc.

    2018 440i GC
    Estoril Blue
    Essentials
    Premium
    M Sport
    Apple CarPlay 

  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    speedy54 said:


    speedy54 said:

    I would like to know if the following deal is a good one on a 2018 440xi gran coupe for 36 months and 18,000 miles a year in New Jersey:

    MSRP: $59,985
    $807/month including taxes and bank fee/acquisition

    $1740 due at lease inception which breaks down as follows:

    -$807 first month payment
    -$392 dealer doc fee
    -$221.30luxury tax
    -$319.70 dmv/tire fee

    This will be a made to order vehicle. The deposit on the build should be 100% refunded at lease inception, correct?

    Thanks for your input. 







    Forgot to mention sale price of $54595.50 + $2000 lease rebate incentive. 

    .00152 MF and 54% residual for 36/15.

    For 36/15, I get $717/mo.+tax. I don't know how much the extra 9000 miles reduces the residual. Assume it's $0.25/mile, then a $2250 reduction in residual puts us in the ballpark. I assumed the $925 acquisition fee was rolled into the CAP cost.

    I don't know how big of a deposit you made. Generally, they will just apply it towards your due at signing amount.

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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182

    This is the latest deal I’m planning on signing on soon.  I’m not sure what numbers they are using because I can’t get the same monthly that they are giving me.  A lot seems to have to do with the sales tax amount.  I get about twice that amount.  I’m waiting to see actual MF, residual, etc.

    2018 440i GC
    Estoril Blue
    Essentials
    Premium
    M Sport
    Apple CarPlay 

    .00152 MF and 54% residual for 36/15.
    Which state?

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  • slugger498slugger498 Member Posts: 2
    Can you please tell me the RV for a 430xi in NJ?  Dealer told me it was 54% this month. 
  • untdrums98untdrums98 Member Posts: 18
    kyfdx said:
    This is the latest deal I’m planning on signing on soon.  I’m not sure what numbers they are using because I can’t get the same monthly that they are giving me.  A lot seems to have to do with the sales tax amount.  I get about twice that amount.  I’m waiting to see actual MF, residual, etc.

    2018 440i GC
    Estoril Blue
    Essentials
    Premium
    M Sport
    Apple CarPlay 

    .00152 MF and 54% residual for 36/15. Which state?
    This is for TX.  $2000 for lease incentives and $500 for being a USAA member.  Is there a loyalty discount also this month?
  • speedy54speedy54 Member Posts: 24
    kyfdx said:
    speedy54 said:
    I would like to know if the following deal is a good one on a 2018 440xi gran coupe for 36 months and 18,000 miles a year in New Jersey:

    MSRP: $59,985
    $807/month including taxes and bank fee/acquisition

    $1740 due at lease inception which breaks down as follows:

    -$807 first month payment
    -$392 dealer doc fee
    -$221.30luxury tax
    -$319.70 dmv/tire fee

    This will be a made to order vehicle. The deposit on the build should be 100% refunded at lease inception, correct?

    Thanks for your input. 






    Forgot to mention sale price of $54595.50 + $2000 lease rebate incentive. 
    .00152 MF and 54% residual for 36/15. For 36/15, I get $717/mo.+tax. I don't know how much the extra 9000 miles reduces the residual. Assume it's $0.25/mile, then a $2250 reduction in residual puts us in the ballpark. I assumed the $925 acquisition fee was rolled into the CAP cost. I don't know how big of a deposit you made. Generally, they will just apply it towards your due at signing amount.
    $925 acquisition fee was rolled into the CAP cost. I have not made a deposit yet but I heard that dealers will often charge 10% of msrp as a refundable deposit for a car made to order. Does this sound like a good deal?
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,056

    Can you please tell me the RV for a 430xi in NJ?  Dealer told me it was 54% this month. 

    54% for 36/15

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  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,056


    kyfdx said:

    This is the latest deal I’m planning on signing on soon.  I’m not sure what numbers they are using because I can’t get the same monthly that they are giving me.  A lot seems to have to do with the sales tax amount.  I get about twice that amount.  I’m waiting to see actual MF, residual, etc.

    2018 440i GC
    Estoril Blue
    Essentials
    Premium
    M Sport
    Apple CarPlay 

    .00152 MF and 54% residual for 36/15.
    Which state?

    This is for TX.  $2000 for lease incentives and $500 for being a USAA member.  Is there a loyalty discount also this month?

    We do not have any loyalty information.

    Texas assesses sales tax against the entire selling price.

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  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,056
    speedy54 said:


    kyfdx said:

    speedy54 said:


    speedy54 said:

    I would like to know if the following deal is a good one on a 2018 440xi gran coupe for 36 months and 18,000 miles a year in New Jersey:

    MSRP: $59,985
    $807/month including taxes and bank fee/acquisition

    $1740 due at lease inception which breaks down as follows:

    -$807 first month payment
    -$392 dealer doc fee
    -$221.30luxury tax
    -$319.70 dmv/tire fee

    This will be a made to order vehicle. The deposit on the build should be 100% refunded at lease inception, correct?

    Thanks for your input. 







    Forgot to mention sale price of $54595.50 + $2000 lease rebate incentive. 
    .00152 MF and 54% residual for 36/15.

    For 36/15, I get $717/mo.+tax. I don't know how much the extra 9000 miles reduces the residual. Assume it's $0.25/mile, then a $2250 reduction in residual puts us in the ballpark. I assumed the $925 acquisition fee was rolled into the CAP cost.

    I don't know how big of a deposit you made. Generally, they will just apply it towards your due at signing amount.

    $925 acquisition fee was rolled into the CAP cost. I have not made a deposit yet but I heard that dealers will often charge 10% of msrp as a refundable deposit for a car made to order. Does this sound like a good deal?

    I've never heard of the 10% of MSRP required as a down payment on a custom order.

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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    speedy54 said:


    kyfdx said:

    speedy54 said:


    speedy54 said:

    I would like to know if the following deal is a good one on a 2018 440xi gran coupe for 36 months and 18,000 miles a year in New Jersey:

    MSRP: $59,985
    $807/month including taxes and bank fee/acquisition

    $1740 due at lease inception which breaks down as follows:

    -$807 first month payment
    -$392 dealer doc fee
    -$221.30luxury tax
    -$319.70 dmv/tire fee

    This will be a made to order vehicle. The deposit on the build should be 100% refunded at lease inception, correct?

    Thanks for your input. 







    Forgot to mention sale price of $54595.50 + $2000 lease rebate incentive. 
    .00152 MF and 54% residual for 36/15.

    For 36/15, I get $717/mo.+tax. I don't know how much the extra 9000 miles reduces the residual. Assume it's $0.25/mile, then a $2250 reduction in residual puts us in the ballpark. I assumed the $925 acquisition fee was rolled into the CAP cost.

    I don't know how big of a deposit you made. Generally, they will just apply it towards your due at signing amount.

    $925 acquisition fee was rolled into the CAP cost. I have not made a deposit yet but I heard that dealers will often charge 10% of msrp as a refundable deposit for a car made to order. Does this sound like a good deal?

    I would never make that sort of deposit. $1000 should be plenty, unless you are asking for them to paint it pink, or ordering a zero-option vehicle.

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  • speedy54speedy54 Member Posts: 24
    Am I to assume that this is not a good deal since neither one of you is directly answering that question? Or are you not allowed to comment on whether a deal is good or not?
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    speedy54 said:

    Am I to assume that this is not a good deal since neither one of you is directly answering that question? Or are you not allowed to comment on whether a deal is good or not?

    We don't follow sales prices, as those change frequently, and we don't have access to all of the incentives. Your price seems good to me, but the lease program on this model is not that great, so it's a pretty expensive payment relative to MSRP. You can't fix the program, of course.

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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    Also.. I do whatever I want.. ;)

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  • speedy54speedy54 Member Posts: 24
    Thank you
  • carz4funcarz4fun Member Posts: 2
    I would like to lease a 2018 BMW 430 x convertible for 36 mos./ 10K miles; typical inceptions are fine. What kind of deals are people getting? I live in NJ.
  • speedy54speedy54 Member Posts: 24
    What is the MF and RV on a 36 month, 15k/yr lease on a 440xi gran coupe for November?Thanks. 
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    carz4fun said:

    I would like to lease a 2018 BMW 430 x convertible for 36 mos./ 10K miles; typical inceptions are fine. What kind of deals are people getting? I live in NJ.

    .00152 MF and 57% residual
    $2000 lease credit

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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    speedy54 said:

    What is the MF and RV on a 36 month, 15k/yr lease on a 440xi gran coupe for November?Thanks. 

    .00152 MF and 54% residual
    $2000 lease credit

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  • carz4funcarz4fun Member Posts: 2
    So I guess it all depends upon the sale price of the car. Can you approximate the sale price or can you tell me where I should be on the monthly payment?
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    carz4fun said:

    So I guess it all depends upon the sale price of the car. Can you approximate the sale price or can you tell me where I should be on the monthly payment?

    93% of MSRP minus the $2000 rebate. (ideally)

    What is the MSRP?

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  • manisharmamanisharma Member Posts: 2
    Hello - Please advice what would be the lease payment on a loaner 2018 BMW 430i xDrive Gran Coupe.
    I have following info. from dealer

    MSRP - $50,645.00
    Asking - $43,495.00
    Miles - 4725
    Residual - $27811.40
    Down Payment - $1000.00
    36 months
    15000 miles per year
    NH
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,056

    Hello - Please advice what would be the lease payment on a loaner 2018 BMW 430i xDrive Gran Coupe.
    I have following info. from dealer

    MSRP - $50,645.00
    Asking - $43,495.00
    Miles - 4725
    Residual - $27811.40
    Down Payment - $1000.00
    36 months
    15000 miles per year
    NH

    I get roughly $544/mo before tax with those numbers.

    But, the $1000 up front won't be enough to cover all your up front costs ... ask the dealer for the adjusted cap cost, and how they got there from the asking price.

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  • manisharmamanisharma Member Posts: 2
    Michaell said:

    Hello - Please advice what would be the lease payment on a loaner 2018 BMW 430i xDrive Gran Coupe.
    I have following info. from dealer

    MSRP - $50,645.00
    Asking - $43,495.00
    Miles - 4725
    Residual - $27811.40
    Down Payment - $1000.00
    36 months
    15000 miles per year
    NH

    I get roughly $544/mo before tax with those numbers.

    But, the $1000 up front won't be enough to cover all your up front costs ... ask the dealer for the adjusted cap cost, and how they got there from the asking price.
    Thanks. Forgot to add Rebate of $2000.00
  • pcyxwcpcyxwc Member Posts: 17
    edited November 2017
    Hey, I would like to ask what is the MF and RV in Nov for 1) 2018 430i gran coupe 36mo 10K/year; or 2) 2018 430i convertible 36mo 10K/year? in CA, haven't decided which one to get lol
    btw, how about 12K/year? Does 39mo lease have better MF and RV?
    Thanks a lot
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,056
    pcyxwc said:

    Hey, I would like to ask what is the MF and RV in Nov for 1) 2018 430i gran coupe 36mo 10K/year; or 2) 2018 430i convertible 36mo 10K/year? in CA, haven't decided which one to get lol
    btw, how about 12K/year? Does 39mo lease have better MF and RV?
    Thanks a lot

    .00152 and 57% for both models; 56% for 12K
    $2000 lease credit

    36 months is the sweet spot for BMW

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  • pcyxwcpcyxwc Member Posts: 17
    Michaell said:

    pcyxwc said:

    Hey, I would like to ask what is the MF and RV in Nov for 1) 2018 430i gran coupe 36mo 10K/year; or 2) 2018 430i convertible 36mo 10K/year? in CA, haven't decided which one to get lol
    btw, how about 12K/year? Does 39mo lease have better MF and RV?
    Thanks a lot

    .00152 and 57% for both models; 56% for 12K
    $2000 lease credit

    36 months is the sweet spot for BMW
    thanks a lot
  • m0neyfact0rm0neyfact0r Member Posts: 19
    Can you tell me what the MF and Residual is for a 440i and 440x in Northern California for 36@12k? And are there special deals for black friday / cyber monday?
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182

    Can you tell me what the MF and Residual is for a 440i and 440x in Northern California for 36@12k? And are there special deals for black friday / cyber monday?

    .00152 MF and 56% residual
    $2000 lease credit.

    No special deals

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  • pcyxwcpcyxwc Member Posts: 17
    Hey, wanna ask a question here
    went to the dealer today and I was given the following numbers on a 2018 430i gran coupe, 36 mo/12K per year:
    MSRP $51850
    Dealer discount $4570
    incentive $2750 ($2000 + $750 loyalty discount)
    this means the selling price is $44530
    dealer used 0.00152 MF and 56% RV (I don't think there is mark up here)
    Acquisition fee is $925
    and dealer gave me a monthly payment fee of $569.31 before tax ($619.12 after tax), does this sounds right? I am in CA
    There is also $1410.75 due at signing (dealer says this include first month payment, registration and licence fee). But I thought there must be something else cos the licence fee shouldn't be more than $400, isn't it?

    Thanks for your help
  • pcyxwcpcyxwc Member Posts: 17
    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.

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  • pcyxwcpcyxwc Member Posts: 17
    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.
    I see, that makes sense

    So the more important question is: Is this a good deal? Or I might be able to push for more discount?
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.
    I see, that makes sense

    So the more important question is: Is this a good deal? Or I might be able to push for more discount?
    Given the lease program on this vehicle, the dealer is being more than fair.

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  • pcyxwcpcyxwc Member Posts: 17
    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.
    I see, that makes sense

    So the more important question is: Is this a good deal? Or I might be able to push for more discount?
    Given the lease program on this vehicle, the dealer is being more than fair.
    great. Thanks for your reply
    now the only problem is that I am not a fan of the coral red interior of this car. Hopefully dealer can find or order me another one with the same price.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.
    I see, that makes sense

    So the more important question is: Is this a good deal? Or I might be able to push for more discount?
    Given the lease program on this vehicle, the dealer is being more than fair.
    great. Thanks for your reply
    now the only problem is that I am not a fan of the coral red interior of this car. Hopefully dealer can find or order me another one with the same price.
    Coral red is pretty popular. What color is the car?

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  • pcyxwcpcyxwc Member Posts: 17
    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.
    I see, that makes sense

    So the more important question is: Is this a good deal? Or I might be able to push for more discount?
    Given the lease program on this vehicle, the dealer is being more than fair.
    great. Thanks for your reply
    now the only problem is that I am not a fan of the coral red interior of this car. Hopefully dealer can find or order me another one with the same price.
    Coral red is pretty popular. What color is the car?
    white
    I am thinking estoril blue with simple black interior.
    How long do we typically have to wait if we custom order a car?
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.
    I see, that makes sense

    So the more important question is: Is this a good deal? Or I might be able to push for more discount?
    Given the lease program on this vehicle, the dealer is being more than fair.
    great. Thanks for your reply
    now the only problem is that I am not a fan of the coral red interior of this car. Hopefully dealer can find or order me another one with the same price.
    Coral red is pretty popular. What color is the car?
    white
    I am thinking estoril blue with simple black interior.
    How long do we typically have to wait if we custom order a car?
    That sounds great... but, probably 8-10 weeks, at best.
    What color is the car that has the coral red interior?

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  • pcyxwcpcyxwc Member Posts: 17
    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.
    I see, that makes sense

    So the more important question is: Is this a good deal? Or I might be able to push for more discount?
    Given the lease program on this vehicle, the dealer is being more than fair.
    great. Thanks for your reply
    now the only problem is that I am not a fan of the coral red interior of this car. Hopefully dealer can find or order me another one with the same price.
    Coral red is pretty popular. What color is the car?
    white
    I am thinking estoril blue with simple black interior.
    How long do we typically have to wait if we custom order a car?
    That sounds great... but, probably 8-10 weeks, at best.
    What color is the car that has the coral red interior?
    It was White exterior with red interior
    BUT
    I got lucky today and dealer found me an estoril blue + black 430i gran coupe
    $52135 MSRP
    selling price $44090 + acq fee $925
    36mo/12K
    due at signing $1423
    monthly payment $604 (incl tax CA)
    What do you think? I think I am going to take it...........
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.
    I see, that makes sense

    So the more important question is: Is this a good deal? Or I might be able to push for more discount?
    Given the lease program on this vehicle, the dealer is being more than fair.
    great. Thanks for your reply
    now the only problem is that I am not a fan of the coral red interior of this car. Hopefully dealer can find or order me another one with the same price.
    Coral red is pretty popular. What color is the car?
    white
    I am thinking estoril blue with simple black interior.
    How long do we typically have to wait if we custom order a car?
    That sounds great... but, probably 8-10 weeks, at best.
    What color is the car that has the coral red interior?
    It was White exterior with red interior
    BUT
    I got lucky today and dealer found me an estoril blue + black 430i gran coupe
    $52135 MSRP
    selling price $44090 + acq fee $925
    36mo/12K
    due at signing $1423
    monthly payment $604 (incl tax CA)
    What do you think? I think I am going to take it...........
    Looks good. Beats ordering and waiting

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  • pcyxwcpcyxwc Member Posts: 17
    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    kyfdx said:

    pcyxwc said:

    My calculation gives me $542.2 pre tax, which is $27 less than the dealer number. Not sure where is the difference

    DMV/doc fees are probably closer to $550-$600.
    Rebates are also taxable, and that could easily make up the difference in the amount due at signing.

    If you add the $925 onto the selling price, the dealer's price quote is exactly correct. I'll guess you left that out.
    I see, that makes sense

    So the more important question is: Is this a good deal? Or I might be able to push for more discount?
    Given the lease program on this vehicle, the dealer is being more than fair.
    great. Thanks for your reply
    now the only problem is that I am not a fan of the coral red interior of this car. Hopefully dealer can find or order me another one with the same price.
    Coral red is pretty popular. What color is the car?
    white
    I am thinking estoril blue with simple black interior.
    How long do we typically have to wait if we custom order a car?
    That sounds great... but, probably 8-10 weeks, at best.
    What color is the car that has the coral red interior?
    It was White exterior with red interior
    BUT
    I got lucky today and dealer found me an estoril blue + black 430i gran coupe
    $52135 MSRP
    selling price $44090 + acq fee $925
    36mo/12K
    due at signing $1423
    monthly payment $604 (incl tax CA)
    What do you think? I think I am going to take it...........
    Looks good. Beats ordering and waiting
    yeah, I think the price is reasonable. So I just called and will pick up the car today
    Thanks for your help and feedback
  • needatlsneedatls Member Posts: 22
    Hello! Hope this thread is still alive and well.

    I'm looking for MF and residual on a 2018 440i GC with 12K miles/ month. They still doing 39 month deals? Still doing multiple security deposits?

    Thanks!
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,056
    needatls said:

    Hello! Hope this thread is still alive and well.

    I'm looking for MF and residual on a 2018 440i GC with 12K miles/ month. They still doing 39 month deals? Still doing multiple security deposits?

    Thanks!

    .00152 and 56% for 36/12.

    No 39 month residuals.

    MSD program was suspended this past spring.

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  • needatlsneedatls Member Posts: 22
    Thanks... unfortunately the dealership I'm dealing with doesn't see it that way. He said .00152 is the retention rate and he has to use .00192. Any idea what he means by retention rate?
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    needatls said:

    Thanks... unfortunately the dealership I'm dealing with doesn't see it that way. He said .00152 is the retention rate and he has to use .00192. Any idea what he means by retention rate?

    .00152 is the base rate. BMWFS allows them to mark it up to .00192 for extra profit.

    Any other terms they use are just to confuse you (buy rate, sell rate, retention rate, yada, yada, yada)

    It's very simple... they are marking up the rate to add to their profit.

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  • needatlsneedatls Member Posts: 22
    Thanks for the reply... confirms my suspicions.
  • needatlsneedatls Member Posts: 22
    Here is where things currently stand... I'd love your opinion. Sorry in advance for the length of the post.

    Some background... I'm currently driving a 2015 435i GC (Purchased in November 2014). I'm currently paying $626.34/ month. This was a 39 month lease. I put down 7 refundable MSD's at the time to the tune of $4900 and first month payment, nothing more. Negotiated price of the car was $53,500 on a sticker price of $59,525.

    Lease will be up in February, so I'm negotiating now because I need to secure a build slot so the new car will be ready around when the current lease is up. My goal is to get roughly the same deal as last time. Ideally, payment stays the same, I move over the MSD's, and I drive off with the new car after leaving the old.

    Things started off very well! Sticker on the new 440i GC (comparably equipped to the old) is $61,035. Negotiated price is $52,785. They come back with a monthly price of $808. They explained that the 39 month lease isn't available and only a 36 month is presently available. Based on how things worked last time, you sign the deal when the car arrives, so a 39 month term COULD be available again, but we won't know. The MF was .00192 with 56% residual. I live in VA, so the tax is 4.15% I think. Almost $200 difference for the same car? Outrageous. I pushed back on the MF, and he said it's only used for retention.

    After you responded to my question about MF, I explained to the guy that the monthly pricing wasn't acceptable. I told him I'm happy with the negotiated price. Told him that financing usually is what it is... BMWFS sets the goalposts and if you know where to look, the information is widely available. As long as there are no hidden or unnecessary costs added by the dealership, should be a pretty straightforward part of the negotiation. Also mentioned he never answered my question about the availability of the MSD's.

    He responded that as of right now, BMW FS has multiple security deposits in place. If he agrees to bring the rate down to .00152 and then lower it accordingly using MSDs, your payment will be at $731/mo. He said, "I understand that you'd like to keep your payments the same or close to what you have. However, the residual was higher at the time you got your current vehicle. And 39 month lease offer made it even higher, that's how you got to the payment you have. At this time there is no 39 month lease offered, unfortunately."

    I realize he's using a 36 month product (vs. the 39 I'm currently using), but what else could account for the extra $105/ month? That's ~$3600 extra over the life of the deal!

    How would you approach? Any idea how he's coming up with these numbers? If I have the Negotiated price, the MF, and the residual, and the tax, I should be golden. What Am I missing? The math doesn't seem to add up...

    Thanks!
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,056
    edited December 2017
    needatls said:

    Here is where things currently stand... I'd love your opinion. Sorry in advance for the length of the post.

    Some background... I'm currently driving a 2015 435i GC (Purchased in November 2014). I'm currently paying $626.34/ month. This was a 39 month lease. I put down 7 refundable MSD's at the time to the tune of $4900 and first month payment, nothing more. Negotiated price of the car was $53,500 on a sticker price of $59,525.

    Lease will be up in February, so I'm negotiating now because I need to secure a build slot so the new car will be ready around when the current lease is up. My goal is to get roughly the same deal as last time. Ideally, payment stays the same, I move over the MSD's, and I drive off with the new car after leaving the old.

    Things started off very well! Sticker on the new 440i GC (comparably equipped to the old) is $61,035. Negotiated price is $52,785. They come back with a monthly price of $808. They explained that the 39 month lease isn't available and only a 36 month is presently available. Based on how things worked last time, you sign the deal when the car arrives, so a 39 month term COULD be available again, but we won't know. The MF was .00192 with 56% residual. I live in VA, so the tax is 4.15% I think. Almost $200 difference for the same car? Outrageous. I pushed back on the MF, and he said it's only used for retention.

    After you responded to my question about MF, I explained to the guy that the monthly pricing wasn't acceptable. I told him I'm happy with the negotiated price. Told him that financing usually is what it is... BMWFS sets the goalposts and if you know where to look, the information is widely available. As long as there are no hidden or unnecessary costs added by the dealership, should be a pretty straightforward part of the negotiation. Also mentioned he never answered my question about the availability of the MSD's.

    He responded that as of right now, BMW FS has multiple security deposits in place. If he agrees to bring the rate down to .00152 and then lower it accordingly using MSDs, your payment will be at $731/mo. He said, "I understand that you'd like to keep your payments the same or close to what you have. However, the residual was higher at the time you got your current vehicle. And 39 month lease offer made it even higher, that's how you got to the payment you have. At this time there is no 39 month lease offered, unfortunately."

    I realize he's using a 36 month product (vs. the 39 I'm currently using), but what else could account for the extra $105/ month? That's ~$3600 extra over the life of the deal!

    How would you approach? Any idea how he's coming up with these numbers? If I have the Negotiated price, the MF, and the residual, and the tax, I should be golden. What Am I missing? The math doesn't seem to add up...

    Thanks!

    You need the adjusted cap cost in addition to the negotiated price, and an explanation of the delta between the two.

    One thing to note - the per MSD reduction is now .00005 instead of .00007, so the net MF will be .00117. That may also account for some of the payment difference.

    The dealer is right about the residual. You may have timed the market right on your last lease, and got an above market residual for your deal.

    EDIT - one more thing to consider. The base MF 3 years ago could have been much lower than it is today - IIRC, at this time last year, the MF was around .00132 (don't quote me on that).

    What we're saying is, that BMW has made leasing more expensive this year. All these little changes (MF bump, residual reduction, price increase, change in MSD policy) could account for the $100 delta.

    You shouldn't ever expect to get the same lease deal; the market has changed in the last 3 years.

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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,182
    needatls said:

    Here is where things currently stand... I'd love your opinion. Sorry in advance for the length of the post.

    Some background... I'm currently driving a 2015 435i GC (Purchased in November 2014). I'm currently paying $626.34/ month. This was a 39 month lease. I put down 7 refundable MSD's at the time to the tune of $4900 and first month payment, nothing more. Negotiated price of the car was $53,500 on a sticker price of $59,525.

    Lease will be up in February, so I'm negotiating now because I need to secure a build slot so the new car will be ready around when the current lease is up. My goal is to get roughly the same deal as last time. Ideally, payment stays the same, I move over the MSD's, and I drive off with the new car after leaving the old.

    Things started off very well! Sticker on the new 440i GC (comparably equipped to the old) is $61,035. Negotiated price is $52,785. They come back with a monthly price of $808. They explained that the 39 month lease isn't available and only a 36 month is presently available. Based on how things worked last time, you sign the deal when the car arrives, so a 39 month term COULD be available again, but we won't know. The MF was .00192 with 56% residual. I live in VA, so the tax is 4.15% I think. Almost $200 difference for the same car? Outrageous. I pushed back on the MF, and he said it's only used for retention.

    After you responded to my question about MF, I explained to the guy that the monthly pricing wasn't acceptable. I told him I'm happy with the negotiated price. Told him that financing usually is what it is... BMWFS sets the goalposts and if you know where to look, the information is widely available. As long as there are no hidden or unnecessary costs added by the dealership, should be a pretty straightforward part of the negotiation. Also mentioned he never answered my question about the availability of the MSD's.

    He responded that as of right now, BMW FS has multiple security deposits in place. If he agrees to bring the rate down to .00152 and then lower it accordingly using MSDs, your payment will be at $731/mo. He said, "I understand that you'd like to keep your payments the same or close to what you have. However, the residual was higher at the time you got your current vehicle. And 39 month lease offer made it even higher, that's how you got to the payment you have. At this time there is no 39 month lease offered, unfortunately."

    I realize he's using a 36 month product (vs. the 39 I'm currently using), but what else could account for the extra $105/ month? That's ~$3600 extra over the life of the deal!

    How would you approach? Any idea how he's coming up with these numbers? If I have the Negotiated price, the MF, and the residual, and the tax, I should be golden. What Am I missing? The math doesn't seem to add up...

    Thanks!

    1) It's very, very rare for BMW to offer 39 month leases. The chances of that happening by February are 5%, at best.
    2) MSD program has been discontinued for all except those that currently have a lease with MSDs. But, the discount has changed from .00049 to only .00035 on the money factor.
    3) Residuals aren't that great for the 2018 4-series. They were better on the 2017, and guessing that they were even better on your model.
    4) Base MF is now .00152, when it was probably around .00130 when you leased. Couple that with the smaller discount for MSDs, and you are looking at a .00035 spread.
    5) BMWFS has always allowed dealers to mark up the rate by .00040 (always, meaning at least the last dozen years).
    6) Add all that up, and $100/mo. is not hard to imagine.

    Running into a great lease program before, doesn't mean it will happen the next time. The best you can do is not pay more than you have to, or pick a vehicle with a better lease program. (probably not a 2018 BMW, though)

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  • needatlsneedatls Member Posts: 22
    Thanks for the thoughtful and detailed responses guys. I didn't realize I was capturing lightening in a bottle when I did the last deal. Unfortunately I don't have the MF from the current lease... for some reason it's not on the lease paperwork and I don't have a screen shot of their worksheet. Would be great to see for sure.

    Funny thing though... when I run the deal through a lease calculator http://lease.guide/advanced_calc/ , I'm getting $633.37 including tax. The slight increase I've attributed to 36 months. (vs. the 39 months I got before). The MF I used in the calculator was .00117. (Base MF of .00152 - Dealer told me that each security deposit lowers it by .00005. ... .00005 x 7 MSD's is .00035... .00152- .00035 is .00117.

    Is this a reasonable number or do you think the model isn't representative of reality? If I can get it at $633.37, it would be a done deal!

    Thanks again... you guys always provide awesome advice and expertise!
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,056
    needatls said:

    Thanks for the thoughtful and detailed responses guys. I didn't realize I was capturing lightening in a bottle when I did the last deal. Unfortunately I don't have the MF from the current lease... for some reason it's not on the lease paperwork and I don't have a screen shot of their worksheet. Would be great to see for sure.

    Funny thing though... when I run the deal through a lease calculator http://lease.guide/advanced_calc/ , I'm getting $633.37 including tax. The slight increase I've attributed to 36 months. (vs. the 39 months I got before). The MF I used in the calculator was .00117. (Base MF of .00152 - Dealer told me that each security deposit lowers it by .00005. ... .00005 x 7 MSD's is .00035... .00152- .00035 is .00117.

    Is this a reasonable number or do you think the model isn't representative of reality? If I can get it at $633.37, it would be a done deal!

    Thanks again... you guys always provide awesome advice and expertise!

    But, you need to account for any costs over and above the selling price that you aren't paying up front.

    Ask the dealer for the adjusted cap cost they are using for their payment quote. That should identify the differences.

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