Saturn Outlook, GMC Acadia and Buick Enclave

nxs138

I've been trying to figure out prices too, and have concluded that none of these vehicles will be in the low 20's. If you look at current GM offerings, the closest in size is the Trailblazer EXT, and that starts near $25k.

If you want low 20's, you'll have to step one size down, i.e. Equinox or "regular" Trailblazer size.

Don't forget that these new CUVs are the size of a Tahoe! So they will be priced in the range of large SUVs. I'm also interested in the Enclave, but have prepared myself for prices starting in the high 20's/low 30's, based on current Buick Rainier prices (the Rainier is larger than the Rendez-vous).

murfdog

That is too bad. I was hoping these cards would be replacements for the Rendez-vous in the Rendv price range. I can not see myself paying high 20s/30s for a car. If the prices are really that high, then I need to look for a different crossover.

I was spoiled by the Rendv and because of that the Equinox did not appeal to me. When we bought the Rendv, we also tried the trailblazer and boy those cars were night and day. The Rendv drove smooth like a car with a ton of room where as the trailblazer drove stiff like a truck lacking the headroom and other spacing of the Rendv.

We want something like the Rendv in its price range. From the outside it may not look that great, but its shaped that way for a reason when you see the space inside especially without the third row of seats. It also is great for people like my mom to get into because its low to the ground.

I will wait and see how this plays out and will still keep this family of cars on my radar list.

nxs138

I wouldn't give up on the Outlook or Acadia quite yet, even though the Enclave might be out of reach, price-wise. One of those two will likely start near the $25k range in its base form, and you would expect them to have somewhat similar handling/comfort characteristics that will be more car-like and less trucky.

62vetteefp

They drive like sedans. Everyone is going to be very surprized. I hope they can get the base MSRP under $25k but I doubt it. Of course you can always dicker with the GMC dealer.

pig

Why not reconsider another Rendezvous if youre that pleased
with it...if you can't get your price on a Lambda or find another CUV that meets your needs(eventhough it might look a little hoakie to have 2 of them). The price should be right for one of those these days.

I personally have/had it(rendez)as a contengency, if the Mid-$20k for a base Lambda was a 'come on' earlier in this forum; and now appears to realistically be the high-20s at best.?.Though I'm still holding out for now.

I do not really have a problem with the appearance of the rendezvous except for the over exposure of the undercarrage from the rear view(can definatly do without that), but the cargo, my 1st priority, is quite good. Also mpg is very acceptable. However, the Consumer guide does not treat it
very kindly on their rating format.

I believe the Hyundai Veracruz is most likely the primary contengency for now, with it's phenominal warranty/safety rating/and it's overall performance acceptance...but at present,not much data on it.

jd14

If he wants to get another Rendezvous he better act quickly because both the Rendezvous and the Rainier are being axed shortly after the introduction of the Enclave. For all those on this forum that are hoping for a low 20k price tag, all I have to say is it ain't gonna happen. However, you could always wait for someone else to take the initial depreciation hit and end up scoring a Lambda with a few thousand miles on it for thousands and thousands under MSRP.

pig

I have to agree...GMC is probably the best bet. However, if GMC gets a good head start(opening arrival date) on Saturn and the 1st month or so the Outlook doesn't really get going because everyone is running over to GMC because that is what they are seeing on the street... then there could be another possibly for another scenario that hopefully plays out. This is obviously more wishful thinking on my part again. I want to support GM. But they have to met many of us half way though.

I really think there is no way that the Enclace is in this
conversation for these price ranges...30k and above for sure...and believe the GMC base MRSP will be higher than Saturn, but there is that room for negotiation, especially if the first months are not brisk.

62vetteefp

http://media.gm.com/servlet/GatewayServlet?target=http://image.emerald.gm.com/gm- news/viewpressreldetail.do?domain=2&docid=28661

nxs138

Wow, they already have the publicity photos all made up! I assume that this is the production model that we see in that (small) picture? Rims look to be the same as the concept.

62vetteefp

Not sure what you mean my publicity photos but the pic shown is a stock photo from awhile ago.

nxs138

Well I guess I meant the one photo shown on the site: looks like Tiger standing next to the Enclave. Haven't yet seen other upcoming CUVs with spokesperson already advertising the model, so I thought they were getting ready to lauch some ads, which might have meant that the Enclave would be coming out sooner than "sometime" next year. Guess not...

Really wish more info would come out on all these CUVs, not only the GM products--Mazda CX-9, Hyundai Veracruz, etc. Right now it looks like all these CUVs will come out around the same time, and its going to hurt my head trying to decide.

62vetteefp

Tiger is not advertising the Enclave. He was photographed with the concept car.

All the data on the Outlook and the GMC is out except price!

jd14

After reading the article I got the impression that the Enclave production model will be shown to the public on November 28, which is one month and ten days from now. Is this true? :confuse:

62vetteefp

yes. It should have already been shown too the long lead press (magazines) by now.

jd14

considering that the production models of both the Outlook and Acadia have been shown already. I wonder why it's taking them so long to show the production Enclave. Oh well, we'll find out soon enough.

jd14

if GM keeps the interior with all the real wood and brushed aluminum accents, stiched leather seating (don't care too much about the leather dash), tasteful chrome exterior accents and of course the highlight of the car, the monstrous 21 inch chrome wheels. I know that some people don't care very much about the wheels, but for those of us who do( ) they should at least offer it as an option.

62vetteefp

The Enclave is not being shipped to dealers until next year. Normal procedure for all OEM's is to not show the vehicle until introduction. Introduction in usually a few months before the ship date but depends on the available venues for introducing (auto show, etc.)

mayher

Do you have any idea as to when pricing will be released for the Outlook and the Acadia?

Thanks

albook

Believe the GMC base MRSP will be higher than Saturn
-I haven't heard that one. We'll see!

albook

How's november a month and 10 days from now?

jd14

Because...well...um... I made a mistake. TWO months and ten days until November 28. Thank you for catching that.

62vetteefp

Most likely Nov 28th at introduction like most every other vehicle. That is what introduction is about!!

Heck many manufaturers do not even let you know anything abut the vehicle untill introduction.

nxs138

A Mazda CX-9 "First Drive" impression was posted on the Mazda CX-9 forum, which lists pricing structure for that SUV: starts near $29k, with the top of the line starting at $32.6k.

I would expect similar pricing for the GM products, since they will be a few inches bigger (i.e. the new GM CUVs will be slightly larger and longer, and have more cargo room, i.e. 116 cu ft vs. 100 cu ft in the Mazda).

pig

Just a gut feelin'....actually I hope I'm wrong, as Edmonds
has Outlook in the mid $20k but the consensus on the forum is high 20s. So if you think otherwise, on the GM, and are right... I'll be a very happy camper!!... as if the base for CX9 is 29K...CX9 just fell off my consideration list as it was only a contingency in the 1st place, just behind the Veracruz, which is behind the Saturn and 'GMC'.

arumage

I think most of the room is due to the shorter wheelbase (113 vs 118) and slanted rear glass. I actually expect that the Outlook will be cheaper, and the Acadia will be similar in price. It's a tough call for me. Is the extra 16 cu. ft. of cargo space worth all that extra weight and lower performance numbers? The Hyundai could be the performer of all them though with between 270-290hp, but it will be the smallest too.

62vetteefp

300 hp in a people hauler? Why? Seems like overkill.

arumage

Maybe... but overkill is also the probable 400-500lb weight difference between the CX-9 and Acadia given that their similar size. There will always be that group that looks for performance. That's why Chevy made the Trailblazer SS. I'd like to have good performance, good size, good price, good looks, and a good warranty. When I get closer to buying a vehicle, I suppose I'll have to order those.

jd14

It may be overkill, but we live in America...lots of things are over the top. Last time I checked the Escalade had 403hp and 417 torque, the R63 has over 500hp(talk about overkill...geez), and Audi is developing a Q7 with a V12 diesel pumping out 500hp and 738( :surprise: ) torque. 300 suddenly seems so small...yet in reality, that's all you need.

jd14

A neighbor starts trying to brag about how his car does 0-60 in under 5 seconds and then you stump him. "So...when's the last time you shot off from a stop to sixty in 4.9 seconds?" He remains quiet for an akwardly long period of time and says "I might have to reconsider this purchase."

For me, the Enclave/Acadia/Outlook have sufficient power to get me through my daily routine and the occasional roadtrip. The V6s are supposed to get 0-60 in under 7 (maybe it was 8) seconds, which seems pretty peppy for an engine that gets 24/25 mpg highway in a vehicle of this size.

jd14

Pics and info on the all new CX-9 now available here at edmunds.

arumage

The Enclave/Acadia/Outlook will probably be 0-60 in the high 7's or low 8's, which is respectable. I'm guessing the CX-9 will be in the mid 7's because the Edge is supposed to be in the low 7's. I'm not really worried about it other the having to make a quick pass on the highway or something to that nature.

My wife really likes the lines on the CX-9 but thinks the Outlook and Acadia are a bit too "traditional SUV" for her. We both do like the Enclave, but it is most like out of our price range. The Hyundai is a possibility, but I'm worried that it may fall to far behind in space. All of them are going to be very similar as far as gas mileage goes. I suppose I'll just have to test drive them all. Darn!

62vetteefp

If someone knows more about this can you tell us how the Ford Edge compares to the triplets and CX-9? Announced their base price as $26,000.

blstanle

The Edge has only two rows of seating (targeting 5 passengers), so no it is not in the same category.

62vetteefp

So id the edge is a smaller vehicle we can look for the GM CUV's to be over $27k?

The articles say the Edge is undercutting the prices of others and coming in low.

nxs138

Well the Mazda CX-7 starts at $24k, and also has 5 seats. Both the CX-7 and the Edge have about the same length and width, and have similar cargo volume (the Edge has a bit more), so I don't see much undercutting there ;-)

chrisl0

The GMC Acadia/Saturn Outlook are better vehicles than the Ford Edge I feel. They hold 8 people comfortably and have plenty of room. A fully loaded Edge probably will cost as much as the Acadia/Outlook. Not to mention the Edge won't offer 8 passenger seats, HUD, power liftgate, and has smaller standard rims. Same goes for the MKZ the Enclave will probably be cheaper and offers just as much.

I am not saying the Edge/MKZ are bad vehicles but I feel the Acadia/Outlook/Enclave offer more for either the same price or less.

jd14

The Ford Edge/MKX isn't in the same category as the CX-9 or triplets at all. They are 186.5 inches in length compared to 202.3, and they have no third row. I customized an edge and it came in at about $37,000 fully loaded. The Outlook/Acadia will come in at about the same price, but will have a bigger engine, more features, and MUCH MORE ROOM. Same goes for the Enclave vs. the MKX, more features, MUCH MORE ROOM, and less $$$. So basically, you get a better car in the next class up for less money. Well...I guess that about sums up my opinion on the Edge/MKX. Back to you...

jd14

I just priced an MKX to see how if it would support my Enclave vs. MKX assumption, and sure enough, it came in at $46,000 loaded. It did have some nice features though, such as heated and cooled front seats with memmory and rear heated seats, but the Enclave will most likely have that as well considering that it will be a higher model than the Lucerne, which already has those features.

nxs138

$46k...that's heading into the new Acura MDX territory, which is almost fully loaded at that price. Don't think I'd pay that much for a MKX, but that's just me (i.e. the MDX is already a proven brand name).

I even wonder if a fully loaded Enclave would reach $46k...I think the Outlook/Acadia will likely start near the 28k range, and the Enclave in the low 30's. It'd take a boatload of options to get it up to $46k.

jd14

What I was saying is that a fully loaded Enclave won't hit that price point, making it more for less.

deerlake7

The CX-9 is around 200" long and has a usable third row seat. With it's lighter weight and same horsepower it's likely to be quicker and more nimble than the GM triplets. The FWD MSRP is $29630 which, my guess, will be close to the Acadia. It will be great to have so many choices.

jd14

Yes, you are right about the CX-9 being 200(199.6) inches long. I was referring to the triplets as being 202.3, and they also have a 5.8 inch longer wheelbase than the CX-9(119 compared to 113.2) which should allow for more slighly more legroom between the rows. I agree that the CX-9 will most likely be the quicker than the GM triplets, but the difference will be pretty slim considering that the triplets have slightly more hp but a little more weight. However, if you are looking for quickness, you'd have to wait for the V8 engine likely to be put in the MY09 Enclave, but of course that would be priced MUCH higher. I guess you'll have to choose...performance or cost?

nxs138

This is a blown up version of a picture that was posted a few days ago.

This is still the Enclave concept, but gives you a hint of the size when someone (i.e. Tiger, who is over 6 ft tall) stands next to it.

kjnorman

I got a Saturn brochure in the main today that high lighted the Outlook and also the Aura. The photos of the Outlook, in full high resolution detail (unlike those on the web) do make it look nice.

The interior really looks okay: The photo of the XR with grey interior would be my cup of tea. There is also a photo with four children and four adults standing around the car (presumably to show that it can seat 8) and that really gives you a sense of how large the car is. I showed the photo to my wife (who currently drives a Freestyle) and she said "I'm not driving that its huge!".

Anyway if you have requested a brochure and do not have it yet, look out in the mail as Saturn marketing have started to send them out.

kjnorman

FYI.

Watch Autoline Detroit on Speed this week. They have video of the Arcadia, Outlook and Enclave.

arumage

Actually, only the Enclave is 202.3. The Acadia is just over 201, and the Outlook is just under 201. The wheelbase is also 118. 500lbs is not just "a little" more weight. That's more than 10% more weight for less than 2% more horsepower. Also, I saw someone say "comfortable" seating for 8. As the back seat is narrower than the middle, I only see "comfortable" seating for 7 with an extra seatbelt for someone you don't like as well as the others. It seems like they used some of that "leg room" space behind the 3rd row, gaining 2 cu. ft. on the CX-9 in the back (which is a plus for someone hauling their kids sports equipment, etc.). Seating positions are probably going to be very similar. I'll bet that the difference in room between the two will be in the front. GM is generally pretty generous with front leg room so it should be great for tall drivers.

62vetteefp

Perhaps there is a bench seat in the front? kidding.

3rd row is tight for adults and only really good for 3 if they are kids. 48" hip room vs. 54" in back of LaCrosse and Camry which I would not call spacious.

wlbrown9

Second and 3rd row seating is adjustable...to quote "GM's exclusive Smart Slide feature is standard on all second-row configurations, allowing quick and easy access to the third-row seating area. The second-row seat cushion flips up while the seatback slides forward, effectively compressing the space occupied by the seat. It operates with one hand and enables adjustable fore/aft positioning of the second-row seat. When adjusted rearward, the second-row seat provides more legroom for taller passengers; when adjusted forward, it provides more storage space or additional legroom for third-row passengers. Seating space is sufficient for adults in all positions."

I'm still not really sure what these will be like in person. Looks good on paper so far. I would think 7 full size adults is about the max comfortable in anything short of an Excursion, and maybe really 6. We have an Envoy XL and the 3rd row is okay for 2 adults. Second row is okay for 3 adults, but I don't know anyone that wants the middle seat for any extended trips. I compared some of the specs on room for the Enclave/Acadia with the Envoy and an surprised to find the Envoy is 6.5" longer with wheelbase of 129 inches or 11 more than the Envlave. The Enclave is 4" wider than the Envoy.

I also got the impression that the Enclave might only have second row buckets, so that would in effect make it 6 passenger....Acadia and Outlook if they offer choice of second row configs would then be 6 or 7 passenger (adult size anyway.)

arumage

Most of the new crossovers have an adjustable second row. It was a feature originated in the Pacifica (as far as crossovers go). The same one touch feature is available in the CX-9 but not in the 06 Pacifica (you have to slide the seat forward, then flip it up). The second row should be a bit more comfortable, as far as hip room, in the Lambda's because the vehicle is about 2 inches wider.

albook

That Enclave is starting to scare me! No offense to anyboby- especially GM, but I think I'd rather have an MDX. Still waiting on that Pilot. Still liking that Acadia. I was just looking on Chevy lot and had serious urge for a Tohoe. It may lack some third row space, but not too bad. I also really like Aspen- What a good mix of 300C and durango-which doesn't look so great.