By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our
Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our
Visitor Agreement.
Comments
The gray cloth in most Toyota cars (Camry, Corolla, etc) is just horrible, looks so old even when the car is brand new, the worst of any cars. Many European and American car's cloth has very nice color, pattern and texture. Cloth is cheaper than leather but does not have to look that cheap as in the Toyotas.
Did you say European cars? It's great to be able to sit OTSOTR in nice seats when the HP fuel pump goes on your new 535i. Oops, I think they only come in leather, my bad.
Brand new hyundai and kia have more problems than my 10 year old toyota. Ford? Really? Another transmission job waiting to happen. GM...cough. Chrysler... junk.
Actually, after looking around for a few months for a replacement for my car in case I need one in a hurry, I've found NOTHING I'd buy in the midsize car segment. I think the falling value of the dollar has a lot to do with the poor quality of cars today as well as all the unnecessary bells and whistles they add that no one needs. A heated steering wheel? For a nation of women I guess...
I guess I need to sign up for a sex-change operation.
My 2010 BMW 328i has the option, and at first, I thought exactly like you. However, being in my mid-50's, and having poor hand circulation, I found that I really like it quite a bit.
My feeling is ...Don't knock it until you've tried it!
But, I do agree its not for everyone. If I was in my 30's, I wouldn't even consider it...
Any new Toyota's in the lot? How do I tell?
But I think the big factor is the oil price. If gas goes to 4 and above , then sales of all these SUV's and CUV's can tank and midsize,compact ,hybrid sedan may take off. :shades:
Pay close attention to those ads - Ford still uses Toyota as the benchmark.
I like Mike Rowe but those ads are annoying. Tout MyFord Touch without mentioning Camry 100 times.
The fact that you generalize the way you do goes to show just how deep your bias runs.
I like cloth because it breathes better. Perforated leather is OK, but it had better be heated.
del - they deserve a 2nd look. The new interiors are much improved, far fewer seams, softer materials, nicer designs. I agree some of the old designs were industry-worst, but look again.
They perhaps deserve the "Most Improved Player" award.
Toyota still has the most cash reserves of any automaker in the world. The total? Well over $48 billion
So how do they invest in R&D ? They can brush up a little bit - like Chrysler is doing with minivans / Durango/Jeep GC -- but they just will not have that cash to invest. Same with Ford. they have a debt of I think $30 billion and come 2012 they have to pay tax on that debt. So how do they spend on R&D?? :P
Toyota has cash reserves and they can spend a lot on R & D. Yes, they wanted to make even more profits by allowing quality to slip a little and cheapening the interiors. Honda too. Hyundai also has cash reserves as it is a very big player in Asia [except Japan of course]. So I think the major players in the future will be Toyo/Hon/Hyun. Ford will still be a big player as they have the F150 PU blockbuster. :shades:
They will need it to pay for all of the Tacoma and Tundra frame replacements due to bad design and inferior steel.
average replacement cost: $11,000 to $13,000 per vehicle.
Also the numerous SUA lawsuits in the pipeline; and complaints are still being made.
Oh, they'll get something...
Probably a coupon for a $250.00 discount on their next Toyota purchase...
And worse, the cover-ups. If this is not true, then why did toyota pay tens of millions of dollars to the federal government ? And did Nissan, Honda, Hyundai get fined like that ? Of course not ! Because they did nothing of the kind that toyota did !
Warren Buffett is not perfect either, I am sure he has his dark side, we all do. But look, Madoff got fined and went to prison. Buffett did NOT ! So comparing Nissan, Honda and Hyundai to toyota is like comparing Buffett to Madoff.
Its the DEGREE of shenanigan deeds that separate them.
This is a FACT. Its up to you to defend toyota if you want to.
But not surprisingly, due to their excellent quality today and more " refined " way of doing business, today, Nissan is BIGGER than toyota in China. And growing faster as well.
Speaks volumes about their quality, and remember, in China, where some people still don't like the Japanese, it takes a lot of good quality for Nissan to achieve the no.1 Japanese car brand there.
toyota, the older player, is obviously less regarded than Nissan (not to mention Hyundai, VW, GM, brands that jd power often mocked) Small wonder, perhaps many Chinese have also read the shocking news about toyota's crazy behaviour, atrocious quality and decided not to waste their hard earned money on toyota....
Tell me, if you have say 11 million dollars and I have only 4, or even just 2 million dollars, and I say in public, " Look, I am almost as rich as Atei ! " Would you laugh at me in private ?
Not to mention the severity of the case. Don't forget qualitative comparison, not just quantitative. In the bank account comparison, a dollar belonging to you is worth just as much as my dollar. But EACH toyota recalled because it risk getting SUA cannot be regarded as equally serious as say a GM recalled due to more minor problems.
Unless you think that SUA is a small matter.
The other car maker's recalls are for more petty common problems, NOT for SUA !!!
Nissan's recall is for petty matters, NOT SUA !!! Even if you adjust for volume wise, its still telling, 2 million vs more than 10 million. AND toyota's much more serious cases !
Your way of comparing is like comparing say Boeing recalls for cabin vibration compared to another plane maker whose recalls are for inability to slow down the jet engine (thus unable to land), or for continued stalling.
For airplanes, its better, SUA in an airplane will not kill you, unless the speed reaches up to more than the plane frame can bear, but in a car, it won't take long before you crash and get killed !
As for the German car makers, I have never heard stories of them making weak cars and covering them up, German cars are well known around the world for strength and safety.
Even in third world countries where toyota sells several models whose crash test ratings are atrocious, the Germans did not do the same. That could be why VW is the king not just in Europe but in China as well but did poorly in poorer countries.
I have never heard people who laugh at German cars for their strength, on the other hand, if you go to third world countries, you will be amazed at some of the toyotas on sale there.
I can give some crash test data if anyone wants to. There are SOME toyotas on sale there whose crash test ratings are on PAR with some Chinese domestic brands !
toyota is even more ruthless in the third world countries where consumers know nothing and don't care abt safety, crash test matters. And there are no NHTSA like organizations there. But the Germans did not exploit this.
In a way its clear to me that the Germans care more for their customers' safety than toyota. By insisting on selling safe cars in third world countries with much more safety features, their prices are much higher, and thus VW, so big in the big markets, are very small in say South East Asia, where many weak, very cheap toyotas are bought in huge numbers.
And its no surprise, considering that toyota even dared to fool around with recalls here in the US and covering up, delaying recalls, risking their customer's lives !
Honda I must say have very decent quality like Nissan, but as for toyota, now that we know more about their multiple and numerous past covered up matters exposed, I for one am convinced that toyota NEVER did have a decent quality card in the first place.
Its all covered up for a long time by settlements, delaying of recalls, minimizing recalls, asking jd to give them high ratings etc...
In a nutshell, toyota have FOOLED many people for a LONG TIME....! They have created a virtuous circle for themselves for a long time like this :
Cover up problems - Work with JD for high ratings - People think toyota superb - BUY a lot of toyotas - MORE MONEY to " work " with JD and pay settlements to cover up issues - Volume increases - Squezze suppliers even more - MORE MONEY - More money to payout even more settlements to shut people's mouth and so on........
You see this virtuous circle for toyota but vicious circle for unsuspecting consumers ? But as they say, you can't fool EVERYBODY EVERYTIME !
Today that circle is starting to break, but still, some people still refuses to see the evidence, and instead continue to dream about the toyota paradise image that toyota has created !
Much more fun reading them than any soap opera ! Go ahead and keep posting like a SUA writer !! :shades:
Small wonder, I can imagine when Mulally, having built a superb engineering brain at Boeing, started at Ford. He must have felt car matters are so easy compared to a complex Boeing 747 !!!
Compare to toyota ! Now that no ones have given an answer, I'll tell you guys, many of toyota's top brass is a bean counter !
katsuaki watanabe is a very notorious bean counter who even tried to save money by changing things in the toilet ! akio toyoda, the boss today, does he have Alan Mulally's kind of brain power ? Even hiroshi okuda, another top toyota brass and former chairman of the board, said akio toyoda is just a spoiled rich crown prince of the toyoda family !
I have the full story if anyone wants to read it. Its amusing really looking at the way the toyota brass shoots among themselves in private !
Now that strong statement does not come from Ford or Nissan mind you, it comes from deep inside toyota's inner top circle !
Another superbly wired brain is Carlos Ghosn at Nissan. He is also a longtime combat veteran engineer since the very old days when he worked for Michelin. He graduated from one of France's famous engineering schools.
You just can't expect quality from BEAN COUNTERs ! But I must admit bean counters are very good at wringing water from a dry towel. And very good at deciding how much to pay off settlements to cover up defects !
Deming will turn in his grave if he sees what toyota have done ! But luckily, the other students like Honda and Nissan did not. Small wonder Honda and Nissan is poorer than toyota. Because they did not try to wring their towels THAT HARD. And they did not do shenanigans like toyota to fool people into thinking they are the best.
Its common for a student to one day become proud and throw all their teacher's teachings away !
And as for their WRING WATER from a DRY TOWEL philosophy, I must admit toyota have wringed it so hard that not only does NO water come out, but the towel is beginning to TEAR !!!
Forget about your old toyota ! The newer ones are junk ! And hey, some of the old ones turn out to be junk too ! Just that its been covered up so well by settlements that few people know.
Koua Fong Lee's camry is an old 1990s model...
And give me evidence that toyota is still the best. What evidence do you have ? Just saying that have no meaning at all !
Madoff also have BIG bank balances before he got exposed. The drug lords probably also have a lot in the bank !
Hey, don't judge quality by how much money they have in the bank ! Many smart intelligent people are rich, but so DO MANY CROOKS !!!
And the VW, Nissan-Renault group achieved these big sales in spite of them often given low ranks by jd power. Without doing frequent settlements like toyota to cover-up defects.
Now atei, if you have say 8-9 million dollars and I have about 7 million plus, will you dare to laugh if I say I am almost as rich as you and I am growing faster than you in China and Europe ?
You cannot judge the future of any automaker without seering how well they do in other big important markets like Europe and China. Now I tell you, in China and Europe, the big ones and fast growing ones are VW and Nissan ! NOT toyota or honda !
And the US and Japan car markets, toyota's stronghold, are STAGNANT and hardly grow compared to China !
Its just maths. 2 people almost equally rich, whoever grows his sales and profits faster will emerge the winner.
I will put my bet in VW and the Nissan-Renault Group. Oh yes, of course the Hyundai-Kia group are also very strong today.
No they don't - Dana is paying since they supplied those.
If you're going to follow this thread, try to keep up.
I've been saying that for a long, long time. Right here in this thread, actually.
toyota's shenanigans are thousands of miles ahead of Nissan
I disagree. Their shenanigans are pretty much industry standard. Nissan had about the same number of recalls per vehicle on the road last year, too.
You compared GM's 2010 only recalls to Toyota's 2009 and 2010 recalls combined. And you're not even looking at GM's worst year, for that matter.
Funny how you guys always have to "cheat" to make Toyota look bad. Just like the 600 lbs overweight Scion xB.
That's your source? Seriously?
The same guy who paid punitive damages to Toyota?
Your star witness is a crook.
Another superbly wired brain is Carlos Ghosn at Nissan
You got it backwards, Ghosn is the bean counter. His nickname?
Carlos "le cost cutter" Ghosn.
You're all wrong about him.
Source please?
It's nice to keep making stuff up! How convenient.
Did you learn that from Nissan's Carlos "le cost cutter" Ghosn?
But they are in front.
First truth you've acknowledged in a while.
Toyota sold 7.528 million units under its own nameplate, up 8 percent
So looks like 2010 was a good year for Toyota globally.
LOL