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Dubbed "le cost killer" and "the destroyer" by those on the receiving end of his streamlining
So his specialty was squeezing suppliers, and you're critical when Toyota does the same thing.
Why the double standard?
OK when Nissan does it, horrible when Toyota does it.
Again you apply double standards. OK when Nissan does it, Toyota is the devil when it does the same thing.
bribes to consumers, bribes to jd, bribes to NHTSA
Source? Proof? These are just wild conspiracies.
Toyota is growing at 8%, that's pretty strong given oil prices were low in 2010.
With oil prices up $20 a barrel, don't bet against Toyota this year.
How is an overall sales growth of 19% "failed miserably"? You're picking on one single model from a subsidiary.
Glass half empty much? Sheesh.
>Sales were flat in the US ...Camry is late in its life cycle, plus most of that reduction was from unprofitable fleet sales.
What! toyota is selling to fleets? I thought the foreign brands toyota and Honda never have to sell to fleets because their cars are so in demand by consumers? Oh, that's just Honda now that doesn't use fleet sales? :P
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
You're funny - you criticize Toyota for selling to fleets, and you also criticize Toyota for selling less to fleets.
I will go out on a limb here and guess that is fleet sales were flat, you would still criticize Toyota. LOL
"Within parameters?" Rats! I was going to design an updated 1958 Buick Limited for myself!
According to the Standard & Poor's Valuation and Risk Strategies group, Toyota still has the most cash reserves of any automaker in the world. The total? Well over $48 billion.
To Government Motors, Ford and Hyundai. Keep poking that bear...
Please list all 9 joint ventures and their 2010 sales volumes.
How about I just provide a source instead?
The China figures, however, carry a notable asterisk. They include sales arising from its nine China joint-ventures, including Shanghai General Motors Co., SAIC-GM-Wuling Automobile Co., and Shanghai GM Dong Yue Motors Co.
Read more: http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20110124/COPY01/301249945/148- - 9#ixzz1C4SOltkt
All my data was directly quoted from news sources, no spin.
Why do you always call other people "wrong", "spin"? Have you ever been trained to treat people with courtesy and respect? How did you survive the corporate world?
PS, why do you spend so much time here digging for every piece of good news still left for Toyota and defending it from so many other people? Are you paid by Toyota? If not, I don't see what benefits you get from defending a foreign company which takes away US jobs and caught cheating.
We need competition to keep the US companies competitive; we should never buy junks from the US companies just for the sake of patriotism; but we need to also reward the US companies when they improve. Look at Germany and Japan, no foreign automakers even come close to dominate their home market. They understand the importance of defending their home turf.
Well-said, xlu!
You can't just hand pick the news that paints a bad picture for Toyota - we should look at the whole picture.
Global sales up 8% is a good year, despite the recent problems.
Cash reserves simply dwarf whatever legal threat may exist. It's like writing Donald Trump a parking ticket.
And remember - it's wrong to assume they will lose in court - they creamed Dimitrios Biller and recovered millions off that case.
treat people with courtesy and respect?
Can you honestly say that's the way I've been treated in here? Accusations and insults have run rampant, in fact the hosts have had to intervene in the past because my opponents are uncivil.
Are you paid by Toyota?
Is that accusation what you would consider respectful and courteous?
treat people with courtesy and respect?
I dare you to take it back and apologize.
we need to also reward the US companies when they improve.
On that I agree. Read my posts - I commend Ford for MyFord Touch and EcoBoost. I mention Chrysler's recent interior improvements frequently, here and in other threads. The Pentastar engine, too. I have no problem at all when there is merit involved.
But there is no merit when you say Toyota has no momentum immediately after reading their global sales were up 8%. Sorry.
I agree with this, but I have read comments like this all too frequently lately and it would be fine by me, except that the perception of improvement is far too soon to be proven. It takes at least a couple or 3 to 5 years so that some of these vehicles can accumulate some miles, before we declare them officially improved.
I say the same darn thing about the likes of Hyundai and even Nissan too, so I don't mean to segregate GM and Ford here. Sure, they are enjoying some spotlight recognition right now, but they are having some pretty serious issues that are still surfacing, and aren't going away anytime soon by the looks of things.
So in all fairness, before we deem Detroit 3 cured, I think there has to be a bit more time invested.
Well-said, xlu!
And, if you have spent much time in either country (or studied their respective histories), you would also agree that a significant reason that is the case is due to cultural differences.
For instance, what happened to Wal-mart in Germany and Japan???
Isn't saving $$$ important to Germans and Japanese as well as Americans?
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/02/business/worldbusiness/02walmart.html
As an example, let's take Chrysler's Pentastar engine. It's a nicely modernized design that has competitive output, and it's being coupled to a modern transmission that make a good companion (as opposed to the 3 speed automatics from not too long ago).
So the powertrains have officially improved.
Now you may ask if it will prove to be reliable, or durable, and we need to wait-and-see on that.
But...I still think we can call the Pentastar V6 much improved.
Same with Chrysler's recent interiors. Material quality has improved. We may have to wait and see on things like NVH over time, but there are fewer seams so even that seems promising. I'm comfortable giving those an "improved" label already.
It is a refreshing change. Before we'd get Dodge vans with hard plastic interiors and pushrod engines and excuses like "but we have to pay UAW pensions".
Now they are aiming high, for class-leading, and hoping people will be willing to pay more for a potentially better product.
I respect the latter much more, so I wish them luck. The 4 door Wrangler gets an interior upgrade for MY2011 and the engine in MY2012. I may even have to short list one of those...
Thanks for explaining it, though. LOL
What I agree with you on tho at this point, is that the design is improved and has potential.
AAMOF when I posted that, that new Pentastar V6 was in the back of my mind.
I hear you, though. By the time the Wrangler comes out, the Pentastar V6 would have been on the roads for a couple of years, so I would have access to at least a couple years' worth of feedback.
They have an 8 (!) speed automatic coming soon, rumored to go in the Grand Caravan, but it might take a bit of a leap of faith to buy a relatively new engine and brand new transmission when it does.
Also, when I see terms like improved, there is so much more to a car that give you a lot of grief, than just engine and trans. Having premature A/C or HVAC or assorted electrical glitches, or seats that start jabbing you with support rods underneath, and in these days, software incompatibilities ranging from everything from tran programming to iPod use, all can make a new design literally improved...or...a wannabee improved but isn't.
As for the 8 speeds, the more speeds they add, the busier the tran becomes so you might as well get a CVT (gee i just brought up a little in my mouth there) with paddle shifters. Then you can at least more easily choose how busy you want it to be. Having to use your right arm on a shifter if you go out of full auto mode, is not that comfy. So you might say, well with a std your right arm is always busy and while that is true enough, having to move the stick into a specific H type pattern seems to keep your mind more easily in tune without having to think about which gear you are in. Hope that makes sense. What I mean is, you can tell what gear you are in with the position of your hand rather than having to use your eyes also.
I think 8 speeds could be better justified in other markets with Autobahn type limitless speeds. Then they could gear the car appropriately and reap good urge but not with as much FE expense. But here, in the land of 50 to 70 mph limits, the 8 sp seems to make less sense considering how busy it will be. But on that, I'm going to have an open mind with a wait-and-see. With the invention of electronic FI and then later being able to electronically alter valve timing and intake lengths, it has allowed them to make pretty big hp and torque almost anywhere in the rev range, even in fairly small engines, so in doing that, it does tend to make excessive gear ratios more of a moot point with an everyday speed range of only 5 to 75 mph.
Is that accusation what you would consider respectful and courteous?
Why do you consider "paid by Toyota" an "accusation"? Does it imply Toyota is evil? Toyota employees are probably proud to be paid by Toyota.
It's not an accusation. I was just trying to figure out why you work so hard here for Toyota.
But there is no merit when you say Toyota has no momentum immediately after reading their global sales were up 8%. Sorry
Of course they are lagging more and more behind when they have 8% increase while most other automakers and the industry average have double digits increase. The 8% increase does not mean they are doing well; the fact that they cannot even ride the industry average says they are doing poorly.
By chance do you have a source? I would be curious to see who had double digit increases globally... :surprise:
Still far away from claims of "most other automakers and the industry average have double digits increase."
That's called "spin" my friend.
Hyundai is doing better even than Ford in all major market. Again, we are waiting for the official numbers.
Nissan is another one.
Honda-2%
Toyota-8%
Nissan -15%
Hyundai-17%
Ford-32%
GM-35%
Chrysler-close to 40% +
And this year fewer toyotas were sold to fleets b'cos of the SUA recall and those fleet companies avoided buying Camrys or Corollas. Yes, I know a lot of folks here hate Toyota ,but the truth has to be given weightage. And all these in one of the worst years for toyota. I can bet that 2011 will be back to scheduled programming !:shades:
Because it implies a bias. Also, I've been here on Edmunds for more than a decade, met several members as well as some hosts.
Thanks for the T-shirt, hosts!
most other automakers and the industry average have double digits increase
Globally? Most? Double-digits? I doubt that. Can you name a source for that? Competitors (read: GM) are expanding via joint-ventures (source already provided). That's not the same - retailers usually compare same-store sales. GM is adding its acquisitions and JVs.
the fact that they cannot even ride the industry average
You have not even stated what the industry average is! Do you know?
I think you're just making this stuff up.
Please list all 9 joint ventures and their 2010 sales volumes
Now I ask - who is the one making assumptions about all volume makes making double digits gains without listing a source?
And GM doesn't count when they include the sales volume of all 9 joint ventures, sorry.
So let me turn this around on you - please list GM's growth excluding new Joint Ventures. I doubt it's 12%, in fact I doubt it's even double digits.
You guys all read the Member Agreement when you joined, right?
The marketing team for the Prius V must be salivating.
No doubt those making hi-efficiency/electric vehicles are prone to like the trend you posted...
Actually, some of toyota's top brass should have gone to prison for playing with those recalls that result in American lives lost. But I wonder why none go to prison for this travesty as of today ?
Anyone wants to answer this ? Mind you, its one thing to make a mistake and do a recall, its ANOTHER THING to know you screwed up and yet REFUSED and DELAYED the recall for YEARS ! Risking lives !
Hidden recalls, well, at least its DONE ! But this ? Worse than hidden recalls !
Remember the case where they did the recall in Japan and yet not in the US ? Like what I said, toyota is the traditional Japanese chauvinistic corporation, and not surprisingly they put Japanese lives ahead of American lives !
Otherwise, how to explain the discrepancy of the recalls in Japan and America ? Even then they got rebuked by the Japanese government ! It takes a lot for the Japanese to criticize toyota you know ?
Real bad man.
But too bad Madoff did not have toyota's luck. He cheated money and was given long sentences. toyota's shenanigans (playing with recalls as opposed to making mistakes) KILLED PEOPLE ! Yet no toyota boy went to prison.
This is one incident where stealing money was punished much more severely than MURDERERs who got away with small fines. I guess the US justice system isn't that good after all !
Talk about comparing a liar and a murderer ! And it happens that toyota is ALSO a LIAR, MURDERER put together as a COMBO !
I say it again, Madoff just stole big money and he got life sentence. Madoff DID NOT KILL ANYONE ! toyota KILLED many people by playing with recalls and they just got fined tens of millions, thats small change compared to their billion dollar cash hoard as atei likes to brag about.
And no toyota boy goes to prison for even ONE DAY.
WHERE IS JUSTICE ? How will the families of the victims feel right now ?
They insist on being fanatically loyal to a foreign company that have MURDERED Americans by being sneaky and breaking American laws !
I mean its FINE to buy from foreign companies that did business in a PROPER way and OBEY US laws. But this toyota ? I am tired of repeating their misdeeds again and again. People just won't listen, or they won't even read the news.
They prefer to " see no evil, hear no evil ". And kiss their toyotas everyday.
Japanese buys predominantly toyota, Honda and Nissan. The Koreans buy predominantly Hyundai and Kia. Now, even the Chinese are buying lots of BYDs. The French buys predominantly Peugeots, Citroens and Renaults. The Germans buy predominantly VW.
Why do you think all of them did that ? Other than the fact that these other car makers are not as lousy as jd power made them out to be, they also understand that if the country loses badly in the global economy, they know that other countries will NOT come with big handouts ! They got to support their own backyard.
Americans should do the same, especially now that you got companies like Ford under new able, talented management offering good products. Unless you want the US to become the China 40 years ago !
yet we know you will soldier on..
I am NOT proud of a crook getting RICHER and RICHER, but you are ! I can't understand people who still supports such murderers even though the evidence is overwhelming, open for all of us to see !
Even some Japanese already know how nasty toyota is. Just that they are so Nationalistic that they will rather still buy toyota than to buy foreign.
But you are NOT a Japanese ! You have the choice to support either another honourable Japanese carmaker or come back to support come back domestic kids like Ford !
All I ask of you is for you to STOP supporting murderers ! Is that too much to ask ?
Americans SOLDIER ON ! For JUSTICE ! I am doing the same thing. To keep on raising awareness of the " toyota you don't know ", even though I know some people will refuse to read, or just turn a blind eye because their love for toyota has become unconditional.
I have absolutely no interest in defending Toyota, which doesn't make anything that I particularly want to own. I'm only pointing out the obvious: this thread has devolved into a boring personality clash.
In two other filings on Wednesday, Toyota said it would recall about 75,000 Crown models and about 6,200 Townace vans in Japan.
The latest recalls bring the total number of Toyota-made vehicles recalled worldwide since late 2009 to more than 15 million, dealing a blow to the automaker's efforts to restore its reputation for quality.
Toyota was the only major automaker to see its sales fall in the United States, its biggest market, last year.
Yet more Toyota recalls
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110126/ap_on_bi_ge/as_japan_toyota_recall_4
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110126/ts_afp/japanautocompanytoyotarecall_2011012- 6053545
This time many in Japan and some in Europe also got hit. Of course the US ones always have its share.
atei, hows that for toyota QUALITY ? Never ending stream of recalls, and not for squeks and rattles mind you, but for FUEL LEAKS !!!
And the affected units started from the year 2000, so you see, toyota's quality has never been good, many problems go way back long time ago to 2000. It amazes me why it takes so long to recall this ?
Remember Koua Fong Lee's camry ? Its a 1990s model.
Another delayed recall perhaps ?
Yeah, they killed JFK. LOL
Wonder if they use the same supplier as BMW?
That's a serious question, FWIW.