GM, Ford, Toyota, Honda...Who will sell you your next car?

mirth

By contrast, Toyota generally doesn't go back, then forward, then back like that, but just goes forward consistently. Isn't it even their slogan?!

Except, of course, for the previous generation Camry, which was a step backwards from the early 90's version.

nippononly

the '97 Camry and '98 Corolla were more spartan than their predecessors, certainly. That's right when Toyota took cost-cutting to heart, along with everyone else in the industry.

However, ABS was standard in the '97 Camry LE same as now. In fact, feature content did not diminish, just cushy places to put your hands and elbows, which is what everyone complained of.

lilengineerboy

The base Subaru Legacy, in addition to scoring very well in crash tests, comes with ABS standard and the 27 airbags that seem to proliferate cars today. It also has AWD, something that may help you avoid needing the aformentioned 27 airbags.
Fuel economy is comparable 4 cyl to 4 cyl, ~168 hp on the Subie and ULEV (at least in CA)., all for about $600 mre that the comparable Accord, or 1500 for a wagon, but wait, the Camry and Accord dont have wagons anymore. And its cheaper than a Mazda6 wagon.

nvbanker

Yes, but I'm pretty sure it was for lack of side curtain airbags. Glass cut the hell out of the crash dummies. Stupid of Ford not to include those right off the bat. Next year, they get them. But the rep damage is done to the "safety first" crowd, who should buy a Volvo anyway. Then, of course, there's Bill's new commercials about how much each life matters......

andre1969

I thought the '02 Camry was also a step down from the '97-01. Part of that perception though, is that the very first one I saw was a base model. I think it was called CE or something like that? I don't think they have a trim level that cheap anymore, or if they do it's called LE these days. I dunno; I always get these modern trim levels mixed up!

Anyway, the thing just reeked of cheap and just totally turned me off. I've looked at newer Camrys though, and don't get the same reaction. Heck, I could even deal with an SE V-6 model! Now the '07+ model with that swollen front-end will take me awhile to get used to.

I think one problem with the Japanese and domestic makers is that they've been influenced by the Europeans, specifically the Germans, which tend to go for spartan interiors. The difference though, is that while spartan, the Germans still tend to use high-quality interior parts. But somehow the domestics and Japanese started equating "spartan" with "slabs of hard plastic"

When the '92 Camry came out, it almost seemed too luxurious and upscale to be a Camry. I wonder if they did that partly because the Cressida was on its way out by that time, and they were going to try to make the Camry fill both roles? Then, once the Avalon was out, there really was no need for the Camrys to be so nice, so they started cheapening them for '97?

As for the '98-02 Corolla, I never could tell a difference between them and the '93-97. Personally, I always liked the style of the '88-92, because it looked a bit like a scaled-down Camry, and had a long, sleek look to it (well, as long and sleek as a car that small CAN look!), whereas the following generations have been more egg-shaped.

rockylee

I'm not really a buyer in the camcord segment, however the new 07' Camry is a nice looking vehicle with a good engine. Honda defintely needs a upgraded Accord.

The perfect Acura TL would be a SH-AWD model. They need to make the TL even more different than the Accord.

My honda fix to close the gap with Toyota and overtake Ford for #3

Acura RL-SH-AWD Luxury Sedan with a V-8 and gobs of technology and a 8-speed automatic.

Acura TL- Sports Sedan with a twin turbo package with SH-AWD, 6- speed manual option and gobs of technology

Acura TSX- keep it about the same but increase the power with a single Turbo.

Rocky

lilengineerboy

Honda sells more cars in the US than in their home market. Also, I can't think of a single factory turbo car (or supercharged) that Honda has sold here. I know they had a turbo bike in the 80s (maybe 70s).
Aftermarket turbo kits are prevalent though. I think the Prelude_SH came to be becuase Honda was hitting the limits of torque and horsepower in a front wheel drive platform (think Mazda MX6/Probe turbo, Dodge Spirit Shelby).

rockylee

The RDX is a turbo 2.3 VTEC 4-cylinder

Rocky

rockylee

http://www.detroitnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060309/AUTO01/603090352/- - 1148

Eifel Inc. in Fraser caters to Tier 1 suppliers, specializes in turning out quality industry parts.

FRASER -- Few people in the automotive mold-making business have the experience of Josef P. Hecker, a 73-year old retired industrial pattern and model maker who began his career in Michigan in 1956 and founded product design and manufacturing firm Eifel Inc. in Fraser.

"Back in the days before computers, a young apprentice would be hired to assist a more-experienced journeyman mold maker with gluing wooden models together and making templates from the master design drawings," said Hecker, who learned his craft in his native Germany. "After five to ten years on the shop floor, he would have acquired a comprehensive knowledge that encompassed tooling, machining, product design and manufacturing -- all of which are necessary to make a good part."

Most plastic parts on today's cars and trucks are made by an injection-molding process, where thermoplastic resin pellets are melted and forced into aluminum or steel molds. Afterward, they are cooled and resolidified to produce parts of the desired shape and dimension.

Eifel Inc., whose main clients are Tier 1 auto suppliers, specializes in the product development, from studio styling to prototyping and production tooling. Eifel produces such products as steering wheels, aftermarket parts, air bag housing units, car center consoles, headlamps and seat back panels.

With lessons learned from years of mold making, Eifel over the past 10 years has invested $3 million in computerized design software and CNC machining centers.

With the enormous pressure on suppliers to provide low-cost, top-quality parts in the shortest amount of time, young designers need to know the culture of the shop floor, and they must learn this quickly, Josef Hecker says.

"The man who designs an auto part needs to know how that part is going to be manufactured," he adds. "With this knowledge, he'll know what questions to ask and what mistakes to avoid."

The old-time mold maker was the vital link between the design studio and the tooling shop, Josef Hecker says.

Dave Behaylo, general manager of Seaways Mold & Engineering in Sterling Heights, echoes Hecker's thoughts on training.

"Our OE customers are demanding that our design-for-manufacturing processes and lead time be cut in half -- at half the cost," he said. "We don't consider that any of our product design or mold engineers can be proficient unless they have several years of shop floor experience."

What this means to you:

If your not happy with your plastic, perhaps these are the guys to have a beef with along with your automaker for demanding huge price cuts by suppliers.

Rocky

lilengineerboy

The RDX is a turbo 2.3 VTEC 4-cylinder

Rocky

Cool I didn't realize it was here yet, I heard not until summer and even then it was still a maybe. This means Honda will be in the turbo aftermarket wars. Since they haven't done this in a while here, I am curious to see how it goes. A RSX turbo would be a lot of fun, and make Mitsubishi feel stupid for dropping the turbo on the Eclipse.

rockylee

You are correct it's not coming until Summer time from what I've read. It is coming, and if you go on the Acura website you can sign up for a brochure which I've done already.

Rocky

rockylee

Report: Toyota Set to Launch Lexus $170,000 Supercar in 2008
Date posted: 03-06-2006

TOKYO — Toyota has secretly approved plans to put its sensational 200-mph Lexus LF-A supercar in the market, according to a report in Tokyo.

Japan's media are reporting that Toyota will launch a luxury sports car for the Lexus brand embracing F1 technology in fall 2008. The reports also say Toyota is pitching hard to bring the Japanese F1 Grand Prix to its newly refurbished Fuji Speedway track, which will help the company drive home the car's F1 connection.

The supersleek LF-A, as shown so far, has a 5.0-liter, front-mounted V10. However, with F1 engine regulations switching to V8, it raises the question whether Toyota will make that change on the LF-A as well. The fact that Honda is preparing a new V10 NSX for 2009 suggests Toyota will stick with the V10 so it won't lose out in the image war, and at the same time to hold firm to the LF-A's premium status.

The LF-A sticker is expected to be just under $170,000, a bargain by supercar standards.

Honda's contract to hold the F1 Japanese Grand Prix at Suzuka expires this year. This has not escaped the attention of Toyota, which will be lobbying hard to stage the race at its own Fuji Speedway, near Tokyo. Honda, however, seems determined to fight to keep its F1 date. That raises the possibility of two F1 races in Japan, which sounds exciting!

What this means to you: Toyota, with cash to burn, puts the pedal to the metal with F1, both on the circuit and the road.

What this means to me:b>

It will be fun watching ZO-6 Vette's, Vipers, Ford GT's, lap this over priced yuppie pile of dung.

Rocky

rockylee

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FirstDrives/articleId=109579

It's a nice SUV, but is it better than the Navigator or Escalade @ $90K+ :surprise:

-Didn't think so.

Rocky

mayberryguy

It's a nice SUV, but is it better than the Navigator or Escalade $90K+

Uh Rocky, it's an AWD S-Class Sedan, not an SUV.

anythngbutgm

Whoa, that thing is sick! :surprise: Awesome!

black_tulip

Uh Rocky, it's an AWD S-Class Sedan, not an SUV.

Then why is the review(in rocky's link) titled "The S class SUV"?

gagrice

Check it out.

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FullTests/articleId=108988

fintail

Probably because it is a 4matic - somehow AWD = SUV

And I would easily take one over *any* Navi or Escalade.

mayberryguy

And I would easily take one over *any* Navi or Escalade.

Amen, fintail.

gagrice

An elegant ride without the bling bling. Nice car. I believe I would want the diesel version...

fintail

It'll be cool when/if we FINALLY get one

snakeweasel

I would easily take something like a Subaru and save $75K, I can do a lot with $75K.

fintail

I figure, if I am going to drop 100K on a car, I have so much money that it doesn't matter. But logically with a normal income, you're right.

snakeweasel

Even if I had 100K to drop on a car I wouldn't. Even if I won one of those mega million dollar lotteries i seriously doubt I would spend more than 50K on a car.

fintail

If I won a mere couple mil, I wouldn't buy something so outrageous. But if I won a couple hundred mil...new S55/S65 AMG, here I come...

And when I see this thread topic....GM, Ford, Toyota, Honda...Who will sell you your next car?

Probably none of the above.

ivan_99

Yeah...and I'd continue to go to work everyday

anythngbutgm

Subaru is functional, the Benz is all about class and luxury with all the functionality to boot. I'd buy one in a heartbeat even if I wasn't loaded (which I'm not ) over a comparable ML or comparable SUV.

BTW, I am shopping Legacy's at the moment, this Benz woouldn't make it to my driveway so it's all a pipe dream...

iluvmysephia1

Kia with their 2006 Rio5 and Rio LX sedan and Scion with their 2006 xA. I test drove a Polar White 2006 xA yesterday and I'm impressed. The only thing I want is a nice set of rims and the dealer, get this, didn't try to sell me their expensive EP-10 rims for $800(I don't know what they cost but I do know that they're the rims that Scion puts on the Relase Series xA's and they're not cheap)but, instead, offered to fix me up with the tire and wheel shop they do business with down the street! That's not a negative!

That way I can pick out the rims I want and include it in the deal for the car and go pick it up the same day I sign the papers. Viola! That is all the Scion "customization" that I need. The car is i-Pod ready, Sirius radio ready, the radio seems great, the radio changes colors(12 different plaettes), on and on.

Another nice feature Scion added with the 2006's is the tuner controls on the steering wheel. You can change radio stations at the steering wheel and adjust the volume.

Some people don't like the center-mounted dash instrumentation but it doesn't bother me. Can't say I like it but I could get used to it. This xA has fog lights as well.

OTOH-my favorite Kia is offering the Rio LX sedan for only $13,055 and the Rio5 for $14,110.

I could always just sit tight and wait, too.

b3nut

I really liked the feel and layout of the car. It was very easy for me to dial things in and feel "at home" in its cockpit. I love the xA too, I'd love to have one in my driveway but my wife made faces and noises when I showed her the brochure. She thought the Rio looked decent, so that'll work. Both are nice high-mpg hatches, for sure.

andre1969

Even if I had 100K to drop on a car I wouldn't. Even if I won one of those mega million dollar lotteries i seriously doubt I would spend more than 50K on a car.

They say that having money changes people. But I've always theorized that it merely exaggerates the traits, wants, and desires that were already there. For instance, if I had always aspired to owning expensive new cars, and then won the lottery, then I'd go out and buy one, or possibly more. And then probably trade them as they go out of style or something else new and prosperous-looking comes along.

But I've never really aspired to owning expensive cars. If I really wanted to, I could probably swing most cars built today, or at least qualify for the credit to buy/lease one. But I just have no desire, no dream to do so.

In my case, my downfall would probably be buying up every old/antique car that happened to catch my eye. But on the plus side, I doubt if there would be any car in the fleet that would break the $50K barrier! Unless an old DeSoto Adventurer or 300-Letter Series convertible is up in that territory these days. But even then, my hand would probably be shaking as I wrote out the check!

imidazol97

>But I've always theorized that it merely exaggerates the traits, wants, and desires that were already there.

I won a contest which included a car (Pacecar turbo Mustang) and cash and services and products. I had just bought a new Cutlass with cash. The sales person called me and tried to tell me I should trade fror a Corvette. Instead I went into defensive mode economically.

It hurt me somewhat because I was afraid to buy a stock I would have bought because it was unreasonably down. Other moves I normally would have made, I didn't make. My landlord tried to raise my rent during the time all costs were supposed to be frozen. He later called me back to say "changed my mind." I think he figured out I was smart enough to know I probably had recourse since he thought he would collect some of my gains during a time it would be illegal. I bought a condo which I could have done w/o the prizes. Just to get out of the rental.

A lot of lottery winners do the massive spending first thing however based on some articles in our part of the country. I recall one who had several runins with police in his Corvette such as driving on the sidewalk.

However media doesn't cover very many people out of all those who win substantial amounts of money.

snakeweasel

In my case, my downfall would probably be buying up every old/antique car that happened to catch my eye.

Yeah that would happen to me, the Zephyr would have plenty of company (and I would keep it to boot).

snakeweasel

A lot of lottery winners do the massive spending first thing however based on some articles in our part of the country.

Many lottery winners (a majority of them IIRC) are broke after the payouts stop. I recall reading of one couple that won a pot that paid $300K/year after taxes, after 10 years they were over $300k in debt.

andre1969

being referred to as "the poor man's investing". I think the main reason you hear all these dream-come-true stories about lottery winners who were $20K in debt and lived in a cardboard box suddenly hitting it rich is because, by and large, it's the lower-income people who usually spend the most money on lottery tickets.

And because, more often than not, it's usually someone with poor money management skills who wins the lottery, it's only natural that the dream come true will end in a nightmare. Personally, I couldn't fathom blowing through more than several million $ in my lifetime. Although with the way housing prices have shot up, not to mention healthcare, it's probably more possible than I think. But then I hear of these people who win millions upon millions, and are broke in no time.

Now this isn't to say that people in higher income brackets don't buy lottery tickets, because they do. But they usually only set aside a regular, small amount per week, and keep it all in perspective. Or they buy tickets when the jackpot goes real high. Still, they don't blow the vast wads of money that lower income brackets tend to on lottery tickets.

lemko

In my case, my downfall would probably be buying up every old/antique car that happened to catch my eye. But on the plus side, I doubt if there would be any car in the fleet that would break the $50K barrier! Unless an old DeSoto Adventurer or 300-Letter Series convertible is up in that territory these days. But even then, my hand would probably be shaking as I wrote out the check!

Me too! I could see both of us buying up just about half the field at Macungie between us! I can think of one that would at least break the $50K barrier - a 1957 or 1958 Cadillac Eldorado Brougham.

andre1969

yeah, I could see that one, and probably some other mid-late 50's convertibles that I'd like, that would toy with the 50K barrier. And while plenty of musclecars from the late 60's could easily topple the $50K barrier, I'd be just as happy with some Satellite, Coronet, Malibu, or Cutlass convertible with a decent-sized engine for a fraction of the price, rather than some over-the-top 426 Hemi powered musclecar, or Chevelle SS396, or whatever.

I mean, don't get me wrong...those over-the-top musclecars were cool, but I'm just not willing to spend the kind of money they seem to be commanding!

lemko

...if I won only a million, you would see no outward changes as I would just bank it all or put it in safe investments. I wouldn't quit working and I certainly wouldn't go out and buy fancy cars, boats, or a big house.

If I won ten million, I could quit work, live very well off the interest and not even touch the big money. A new Cadillac or Buick every couple years would be no problem as my house would be already paid for.

Now, if I won 100 million, I guess I could go hog wild as long as I set aside a certain amount I couldn't touch. Still, even if I wanted to go nuts there isn't much I want or need outside of a few nice 1950s and 1960s cars and a place to keep them. I don't really want to travel anywhere and I sure don't want a boat or plane. I could build a really nice place for myself, but I'd build it in a region where real estate was cheap and property taxed low. Northeast Pennsylvania would be my choice - perhaps Schuylkill or lower Luzerne County,

imidazol97

I would look for a car that's clean and uncomplicated to repair myself. But I'd seek advice from someone who knows the potential market-such as andre or lemko. I'd want something I could work on myself for the mechanical parts. My first thought would be something memorable to me like a 56 Ford or Chevrolet.

One problem with winning and going public is that every tom, dick and harriet that sells investments is trying to contact you. I was unlisted and rented. Couldn't find me. I got notes at work from people wanting to "help" me invest. Yeah, and Merril Lynch had my best interests in mind too, :laugh: roll eyes upward. They tried to call at work for the few who caught the one time it was mentioned on the radio.

I was given a recommendation to my dentist's CPA. He only made one mistake for $11 on state tax form. Everything else he was perfect for me and my needs at the time.

Want to buy property? Buy close to an old, long-established nursery area for investment. Buy farther out for living.

gagrice

If you both were to win the lottery. I hope you get together and decide on who bids on what. I would hate to see you run each other up at the auctions.

gagrice

I'd build it in a region where real estate was cheap and property taxed low. Northeast Pennsylvania would be my choice - perhaps Schuylkill or lower Luzerne County,

While looking for places to retire. I thought I read that PA real estate taxes were some of the highest in the nation. I was born in Erie.....

lemko

...I think I'd stay the heck away from Barrett-Jackson. There are probably guys in attendance willing to sell their souls to the devil for a certain car...

"Next up is Satan's mint Hemi 'Cuda convertible with only 666 miles on it..."

snakeweasel

You guys know nothing about classy cars. lets talk about pre-war, Like the Lincoln KBB or Zephyr, the Caddy, Duesie, Cord, American-laFrance, and the like. Cars that were the essence of driving. Yeah I know a lot of them break that $50K limit, but you can't beat them for style.

andre1969

I like a lot of those classic pre-war cars, but to me they're more akin to museum pieces. Something that I love to see at a car show, museum, etc, but nothing I'd really want to own.

I tend to like big 50's, 60's, 70's, and even 80's cars, and very few of the cars that I really like would be anywhere near the $50K mark, let alone above it!

snakeweasel

One problem with winning and going public is that every tom, dick and harriet that sells investments is trying to contact you.

One of the conditions is that you go public. Look on the back of your ticket, it clearly states that you agree to participate in lottery sponsored interviews with the media and that your name and likeness can be used in public relations. You can't collect unless you do that.

They say that the best thing to do is say as little as possible during those interviews to make you less interesting. Not sure if that works.

To those that win big my advice would be to invest 45% in long term but safe investments (low yield but low risk) and go hog wild with the rest. The 45% getting 3% interest after taxes and you will be set for life.

lemko

I wouldn't mind having something like a 1933 Cadillac V-16 Phaeton, but I would never drive it for fear of some chump in a $25 Nova running into it. I guess it takes somebody like Jay Leno to have the guts to actually drive his Duesenberg J on a daily basis.

I'd also stay the heck away from exotics. Sure, they may be sexy and the driving experience second to none, but I'd also have to bring Mario and Luigi over from Europe to take care of it. The insurance premium alone could probably buy an ordinary sedan.

nwng

just saw a nsx with pop-up lights yesterday. That might be something I want if I hit a $3m jackpot.

Anything less than that is not gonna change my life much, especially what I get after taxes. Well, I'll get my wife a mb C class cause that's what she likes. I'll still be piloting the HMS ody with screaming kids aboard, but probably won't have to look at the fuel gauge that often.

snakeweasel

Me and a friend of mine bought a Zephyr a while back. Not in the best condition but the price was good and it came with tons of spare parts. We are restoring it with the intention of selling it later this year.

This friend of mine actually collects antique fire trucks. he has 8 or 10 that go back to the 30's. We drive several of the for the towns founders day parade.

I have to admit we are pretty much children when it comes to playing with those fire trucks :P

andre1969

What is it about boys and their toy trucks? I think it would be way cool to own this beast.

lemko

I'll go for it provided they toss in an orange-red 1970 Valiant for free! I remember seeing "Duel" when it debuted on TV.

snakeweasel

But it doesn't have any mars lights or sirens or water cannons. :P