Stories from the Sales Frontlines

roadburner

...with this puppy:



It's an '86 with just 70k miles. Clean Carfax, for what little that's worth. Yes, I know it might be a time bomb, but heck, my father let me drive(and mod) his 1974 Monte Carlo when I was in high school. As fellow Kentuckian David E. Davis Jr. liked to say, "No boring cars!"

nyccarguy

Your son has excellent taste in cars (from his Dad no doubt). I was allowed to drive a family friend's '89 944 Turbo once when I was 18 & it was heavenly. So fast, so much grip. I think if you do some research, you'll find a properly maintained 944 will run as long as an E30. Checkbout rennlist.com & check out how many 200,000 to 250,000 mile 944s are out there. Just make sure you have a Porsche mechanic do a PPI.

roadburner

I think if you do some research, you'll find a properly maintained 944 will run as long as an E30. Check out rennlist.com & check out how many 200,000 to 250,000 mile 944s are out there. Just make sure you have a Porsche mechanic do a PPI.

Yes, a PPI is essential; although I think 944s are much like BMWs in that they don't tolerate abuse or neglect. Also, like most 10 to 20 year old Bimmers, 944 prices are so low that many have been bought by know-nothings who lack the funds to properly maintain the car. I don't get that vibe from this car.

sterlingdog

WHAT?! You haven't had that test yet? You promised me months ago that you would take care of it. I'm terrified of a simple flu shot but I took the test. Though the day before is a little unpleassant running back and forth to the toilet bowl, the test is nothing. You sleep right through it. I had a female doctor. We had some good laughs about the test.

You encouraged me when I went through the prostate experience. Now, I want to encourage YOU. Please make your appointment THIS week. Like jmonroe, I hate to preach; but this test is too important to avoid. Get with it. I've lost too many friends during the last year or two. Let us know when your appointment is scheduled---before I get home from this trip!

Richard

sterlingdog

"...drove to Palm Springs and made a boys' weekend out of it."

I hope that they each had their own room. This experience is definitely one in which you don't want to share one toilet bowl! :P

Richard

sterlingdog

Can you give me an idea of how much a big set of vintage wide white walls would cost---say for a '56 Cadillac or a '53 Buick Roadmaster? They must cost a small fortune.

Richard

sterlingdog

"...your asleep any way."

Come on now. What have I told you about "you are" (you're)? The word "your" shows ownership. No, it's not a Canadian thing.

Richard

driver100

I've test driven both a 128i (auto) and a 328i coupe (stick) in the past couple of years.

The 1s are nice...just not enough space especially in the back seat...who are they kidding...how could any one get back into those seats....and if they did....how would you ever get them out.

But, for 2 people who don't carry a lot of stuff, what a blast.

The 3 should have enough room for golf clubs. If not just play par 3s where you only need 3 or 4 clubs.

driver100

If you are considering a 550 over a 535 might wanna take resale into consideration...

My mistake, you are correct, I wouldn't take the V8 over a 6. Even the salesman said he'd only recommend that if you really needed a V8 for some reason.

The 6 with twin turbos is more than enough power, and I guess 8 speed transmission helps. I really wouldn't need more power.

My friend who bought the 7 Series got the V8 was in the back seat when we went on the test drive. He said, from the back seat, Hey Joe (salesman) you didn't tell me about the fancy gas gauge that comes with the car. Joe says what is that? My friend says the dial is always moving!

He says the people at the gas station always say hello Mr _______, they all know him by name.

driver100

I spent about 30 minutes in an F10 535i and all I kept thinking was, "Old man's car."

I agree, that's why I am going to wait awhile. But at what age do you become an old man? Some say 10 years older than what you are now.

I might be ready for it by next spring or summer. If we drive to Florida for the winters from now on it is nice to have a larger more comfortable car. And, it is probably much safer than many cars.

But, yes, I am hesitant to give up the 3 Cabriolet because i will age by about 10 years.

driver100

What have I told you about "you are" (you're)? The word "your" shows ownership.

Geez, just enjoy your trip and forget about the grammar lessons.

I played tennis for 2 hours in 80 degree weather and worked 3 hours after that, so I was not functioning properly when I wrote that.

Enjoy the rest of the journey, and just give us road reports, don't worry about our grammar while you are on the road.

tjc78

I spent about 30 minutes in an F10 535i and all I kept thinking was, "Old man's car."

Wow!! Maybe there is hope for me to like BMW!! :P

graphicguy

burner...my likey that 944. I don't know how fragile those are. Seems to me, they were pretty robust, from what I remember of them.

My lawyer drives a 968 (don't know the year). He's had it for a good long while and says it's cheaper to maintain than a Ford.

Pick up the latest AUTOMOBILE MAG. There's an article in there outlining what it's like to live with a 911 as a daily driver. Their conclusion is it's fine as a grocery getter.

I have to wonder, however, if it's just coincidence they wrote that article and the current advertisement pieces Porsche is running stating their cars are very useful daily drivers,. Or, was it a paid "puff piece"?

graphicguy

I had mentioned previously how a dealer 50 miles away from me had found the car I wanted (and ended up purchasing from a local dealer) at the port. This dealer's name is Evans Motorworks in Dayton, OH. We had agreed to a deal via email and phone calls. They asked me for a $500 deposit to secure the deal, which I provided.

to back up even further, I was working with 3 dealers, which were provided to me by Trucar.com. These dealers subscribe to Trucar.

As a refresher, two of the dealers found the same car for me. One was further away (Evans). One was closer (Sweeney).

Since Evans found the car first, I told them we had a deal.

For reasons unknown, Evans could not secure the car at the port. However, Sweeney could and did secure it. At no time did I tell one dealer what the other dealer was doing. Matter of fact, I didn't even have a deposit at Sweeney. They knew I wanted the car and got it, without any deposit/deal pending.

Now, for two weeks I've been trying to get my $500 deposit back from Evans. I've called them. I've emailed them. I've contacted the sales person, as well as her manager. When I was shopping, I got a phone call every day, sometimes multiple phone calls. Now, no phone calls, no notes, nothing.

w, I must call my credit card company and protest the charges. Plus, I need to contact BBB, just so they have a record of this.

This is an example of how NOT to treat people, whether they're a customer, or not. I hate this kind of dealership. They failed to secure the car, when it was clear they had a customer for it (with a deposit, no less). Fair enough....Sweeney knew how to do it, Evans clearly did not.

But don't exacerbate the issue by antagonizing the potential customer over your own failings.

driver100

Now, for two weeks I've been trying to get my $500 deposit back from Evans.

GG, that is disgraceful on their part. You might just ask to talk to the owner and hit that keeping your money at this point is theft and you will be persuing it with the proper authorities. Also, throw in the name of a consumer columnist or TV show. I have found those things to actually work. Always be calm and don't raise your voice, that just gets them to do the same. If yousound like a logical person chances are they will answer in a logical way.

I can't believe they wouldn't send back the deposit.
Good luck, a hassle you don't need and certainly don't deserve.

qbrozen

Agree with the others, isell. I'm only 37, but I had to get it done for health reasons. It really is nothing. You only THINK it will be unpleasant, but when its over, you don't even know anything happened.

Oh, by the way, a little tip: use LESS liquid rather than more when mixing your cocktail the night before. otherwise you'll have a hard time getting it all down. I threw the whole container of laxative into one 64-oz bottle of ocean spray cranberry juice (the strong flavor of cranberry masks the laxative better) and was able to down it pretty quickly. And, yes, cranberry is OK because it isn't a dye, it is natural. Doc's comment afterwards was that it was it was an easy exam cause it was so.... ummm... clean.

oldfarmer50

"...Seems the salesman goes with you on all test drives these days. I think it's an insurance thing..."

How were you dressed? Maybe you didn't look like you could afford a new BMW. Remember the long ago discussion from our sales pals about how they size up a customer by his watch and shoes?

The way I dress they would probably not only send the salesman along but also a cop and the dealer's mother to keep an eye on me.

qbrozen

Just call the CC company. I would have done that in a matter of a few days, personally. I had the same thing happen. Tried for 3 days via phone, then went back to the dealership. They gave me some runaround that only 1 person could do it and that person wasn't there. I was quite calm and said, "Oh, that's ok. I was just driving by at this time. I'll call the credit card company and cancel it through them."

Wouldn't you know it? Someone else could do it after all and they did it right then and there. Not sure why my "threat" got results. Maybe its a big hassle for them to deal with the CC company with a dispute??

imidazol97

That store has been pumping BMWs into the local area at a fast clip for a couple of years. The predecessor owners (Evans or Village) didn't get nearly as many cars purchased and on the streets. I don't know if they are leases or ownership, but the customers are getting cars. Surely the BMW of Dayton store can afford to refund the $500. Was there any stipulation that it was not refundable within a certain period or something?

You might call Turn to 2 at wdtn.com, Channel 2 in Dayton. I don't know if Channel 7 has a similar guy that does business followups about things like this?

oldfarmer50

"...some Hollywood people have Colonoscopy parties..."

Ewwwwwwwwwwww! :sick:

imidazol97

>"Oh, that's ok. I was just driving by at this time. I'll call the credit card company and cancel it through them."

I rejected a credit card billing by a Hampton motel in Michigan. I happened to look at my CC online after we returned from Tennessee and saw the billing for a date we were south instead of north. I assumed someone had gotten the CC number and was billing people thinking they wouldn't notice the extra charge since they had stayed at that location before.

Later I called the Hampton and the manager said that she knew about it and the company that does their billing had a mistake and billings didn't go through earlier--months earlier. So they just rebilled it. We were part of their Honors frequent sleeper group and they had all our info, email, phone, and could have done calls to let people know there would be a rebilling. There couldn't have been more that 20 or 30 people at the motel that night.

She couldn't understand why I had a problem. Maybe it was a language or cultural barrier. But the back charging costs the merchant a fee if what I remember is right.

Eventually the parent company Honors group sent a free night coupon--took months for that. They have a perfect satisfaction guarantee and I invoked it.

nyccarguy

Roadburner - you are right. Definitely have to watch out for those who bought cheap & then said "These Porsche mechanics are a complete rip off, I can get that fuel pump from Pep Boys way cheaper."

Driver - if you think the 5 is too soft (I agree) & the 3 Cabrio is too small, check out a Porsche Cayenne. My parents had an E60 530i & an E90 328xi. They LOVE the way the Cayenne drives!

oldfarmer50

"...this puppy..."

That's a beautiful car and my kind of bargain. Old, in good shape (so it seems) and low miles. What's not to love?

I've always liked that style Porsche. I see them every once a a while around town, usually red like that one.

graphicguy

imid....no stipulations. My sales lady told me that in order for them to divert the car to their store, they'd need a $500 deposit. Since we already agreed to the numbers, and they were going to put a unit in inventory for me (I thought that was a good thing), I thought that was fair. That was the beginning and end to the conversation.

No talk about "non-refundable" deposit ever entered into the conversations/emails.

They did stall me on getting the car to their dealership.....stating "they were working on it". I didn't know they couldn't get the car until the local dealer (Sweeney) contacted me and said they already had the vin# (something Evans couldn't/wouldn't get), and was on the carrier headed to their store.

Finally, Evans did indeed contact me (after several attempts on my part to find the status of the car) and told me they couldn't get it. And, they asked what other car I might want. I told them to just refund my deposit....not only once, but twice, three times, four times....with the sales person, and then the sales manager. I also wanted proof of the credit/refund.

They've been silent throughout all of this, not acknowledging me, or my requests.

This is really shady. Do you know how they came about this dealership? Is it part of a dealer group? Who owns it? This is the first (and last) time I'll ever deal with them.

graphicguy

q...the sales lady (the last time she returned a phone call or email was about 2 weeks ago) told me they were slow in issuing refunds. I told them I can take a $4K TV back to Best Buy and get a full refund within minutes. They can't issue a $500 refund on a deposit for something they couldn't deliver?

im_brentwood

They aren't that horrible actually. Those should use an 820-15 which is the size I'm probably going to put on the Lincoln.

I'm debating... The Generals are about $193 each and Coker has your choice of US Royal, BFGoodrich or Firestones for $231 each.

For what they are it's not outrageous IMO.

oldfarmer50

"...I must call my credit card company and protest the charges..."

That should be all you have to do. Don't let the "sour grapes" dealer upset you now that you have that fine new ride.

I'd say tell 20 friends about your experience to get even but by posting here you've told thousands.

Some day I'll tell you how I drove K-Mart into bankruptcy over a bad deal on kitchen cabinets.

jayrider

Contact the BBB. You could spend Saturday parked outside the dealer greeting customers with the issue. Any deposit I ever left was always returned if things didn't work out. Very strange for a dealer to act this way. Makes no sense.

sterlingdog

Thanks. I agree. The prices aren't bad. I would have thought about $500 per tire. I've paid $150 or more for regular tires for our SUV's. Those wide, white walls were so beautiful on the old cars. The bad part was keeping them white. I used to scrub and scrub with a big brush to get the black marks removed. My mother was forever parking too close to the curb. I paid the price each Saturday morning.

Richard

im_brentwood

I know that dealer... When I lived in Louisville I used to drive to Cincy for my BMW needs.

That being said, it looks like a nice car from the pics, worry about the timing belt and the clutch. Also, 64k in 02 and 70k today? Hmmm...... These are prone to odometer gears going bad ya know.

isellhondas

Yeah, I know. I'm a wimp.

It'll be soon. That I promise. Thanks for caring.

sterlingdog

"...don't worry about our grammar while you are on the road."

You know that I have to keep a check on you ALL of the time. "You're" prone to get in trouble. :P

We're taking a day of rest today. My legs have taken a beating with all of the walking---even the cane quit helping. My wife is also exhausted. Still, it has been the most wonderful of trips. We'll use cabs in Memphis to get to Graceland, the Mississippi River cruise, and Beale Street music events.

Your comments of perhaps purchasing a larger more comfortable car brought a smile to my face. Who knows? I may get you in a Cadillac or Lincoln before all is said and done.

Watch that heat on the tennis courts. Drink plenty of fluids. At your age, I admire you for playing tennis. It requires lots of energy and stamina.

Richard

roadburner

I know that dealer... When I lived in Louisville I used to drive to Cincy for my BMW needs.

I never had a problem with their sales but I was less than impressed with their service and parts department. However, about 10 years ago things improved 100%. Parts and service are now top-notch.

fezo

I'm thinking too much like you... those don't sound like outrageous prices to me either. It's not like they produce them on the huge scale of a modern tire - and they have a pretty captive audience.

Other birthday shares.... Pat Benatar, the late, great Jim Croce, Ray Bolger......

sterlingdog

Good deal. I'm counting on you.

Richard

fezo

Richard - there are some very nice Cadillacs you can get at Graceland.

Maybe this is you and the Mrs. - "Tennessee Plates.

sterlingdog

"Just call the CC company."

I totally agree. I've had to do that once or twice myself. GG is a professional dealing with an unprofessional dealer. He doesn't need the stress. He has made an honest effort to have the deposit returned. He no longer should deal with these people.

Richard

Kirstie_H

If you haven't already, make sure to review both dealerships:
http://www.edmunds.com/dealerreviews

When you do a Google search for a business now, Google adds in amalgamated ratings from various sources, including Edmunds.

sterlingdog

Can't wait to see his car collection. He had two Stuz Blackhawks and three Rolls Royces in addition to the Cadillacs. The collection also includes two MB's and a Lincoln, plus a Harley. Should be exciting.

Richard

driver100

How were you dressed? Maybe you didn't look like you could afford a new BMW.

My friend and I were in jeans. That shouldn't affect sale people these days. Wearing jeans is actually a sign that you could have money...you don't have to dress up in a suit to sell insurance or mutual funds.

It is a status symbol not to have to wear a watch...it means you don't care about the time....you don't have to be somewhere.

cdnpinhead

It is a status symbol not to have to wear a watch...it means you don't care about the time....you don't have to be somewhere.

What it really means is that you carry a cell phone.

robr2

It is a status symbol not to have to wear a watch...it means you don't care about the time....you don't have to be somewhere.

Actually not having a cell phone is a sighn of status - it means your personal assistant carries one.

graphicguy

Kirstie...thanks for the reminder. I sent 3 reviews...one for my Acura dealer, one for my BMW dealer and one for the n'er do well BMW dealer.

driver100

. At your age, I admire you for playing tennis. It requires lots of energy and stamina.

How old do you think I am? I know you saw that picture and you keep talking as if I am in my 90s.

By the way, 64. There are players who are better than me and they are in their 70s and a few in their 80s. We have one fellow who was playing up until February this year when he got shingles, and he is 94, and plays an excellent game. He is the only one that only wears tennis "whites" and doesn't believe in first one in...once you start you start playing.

There is a similarity between the Lincoln MKZ (?) I sat in in the showroom when I went to test a GM (the salesman never called me back if one came in, he said he would) and the 5 Series. Both have lots of room and comfort. I have a feeling, driving them will be very different though. I do have to say though, fun and handling are priorities for now, but I can see where priorities could change one day.

You are right about drinking water while in the heat. I was reading that if you go past the point of no return......... the point of being hydrated enough, it is very hard to get you back. It is better not to reach that point in the first place.

Your trip sounds fantastic...you are seeing all these places we hear about and see in movies and that, but you are actually seeing it in person.

driver100

"...some Hollywood people have Colonoscopy parties..."
Ewwwwwwwwwwww!

Hey, it's the new rage.

Here are a few celebrity colonoscopies including Homer Simpson;
Celebrity Colonoscopies

kyfdx

Evans still owns that.... when I got my car there, last year, he personally introduced himself.....

Just call up... and, ask for the general manager.... tell him you are getting ready to trash his dealership on-line if he doesn't credit your card immediately...

jmonroe

The 1s are nice...just not enough space especially in the back seat...who are they kidding...how could any one get back into those seats....and if they did....how would you ever get them out.

You don't get them out. The back seats are for true BMW enthusiasts. They will have a permanent "feel of the road" experience. :sick:

jmonroe

explorerx4

Fezo, I didn't realize you posted that link until I was done watching it, but I thought would be a great one for you to play.

imidazol97

I happened onto a book author interview on Detroit radio on our last trip to Michigan. He has a book about the history of the interstate highway system. I am reading it now after getting it from my local library. It's by Early Swift--pub 2011. It's a thorough history from the 1880s of the car and the effect it had on the US in terms of the need for roads.

I find it very thorough and well developed. The only flaw is the author has an almost political hate for Eisenhower who is given credit for starting the interstate system. Author points out every detail where Eisenhower shouldn't get credit; but misses that Eisenhower actually pushed for it in person in a budget bill. When you'll read the book, you'll see why I point out that one fault. Otherwise the book is as good as a David Baldacci book for me.

The Big Roads, the Untold Story of the Engineers, visionaries, and Trailblazers who created the American Superhighways.

http://www.infrastructurist.com/2011/06/09/the-secret-history-of-americas-inters- - tate-highway-system/

http://www.aaroads.com/blog/2011/06/30/a-road-geeks-treasure-the-big-roads-by-ea- - rl-swift/

driver100

You don't get them out. The back seats are for true BMW enthusiasts.

The best way to get in and out of the back seat of a 1 or 3 Series BMW is to put the top down, and you can stand up to get in and out.

Not great in the winter time.

But, otherwise you are right, it could be "the feel of the road", for life.