Stories from the Sales Frontlines

jmonroe

@abacomike said:
I only have 1200 miles on the car - it still smells new. By the end of this week is a bit too soon, jmonroe. But after that, I have no comment.

There is nothing "too soon" for you. I guess I have more faith in you than you do.

jmonroe

driver100

@abacomike said:

I only have 1200 miles on the car - it still smells new. By the end of this week is a bit too soon, jmonroe. But after that, I have no comment.

Yeh JMonroe........there's been a bit of rain around here lately so the 550 probably got a Florida wash (the rainwater seems pretty clean down here and people leave there cars out to get them washed) so it should be good for another few weeks any way. Either that or this dealer will make Mike another offer he won't be able to refuse.

robr2

@driver100 said:
I have heard of used, sorry, pre-owned Rolex watches but that's a little different. You are really >
paying for the outer shell of a watch and that won't deteriorate much. The inards of watches aren't
that different, so that can all be replaced if needed

Don't ever say that to a watch aficionado. To you, they are just innards. To them, the movements can be differentiated in so many ways. It would be like saying - it's just a motor, they are all the same.

driver100

@robr2 said:
Don't ever say that to a watch aficionado. To you, they are just innards. To them, the movements can be differentiated in so many ways. It would be like saying - it's just a motor, they are all the same.

I was told a long time ago - and i actually sold watches at one time in my illustrious career - and I was rather good at it...that basically the inside of most watches are all the same. If the insides need to be fixed they will drop the same insides into a $40 watch as a $2000 watch.

Check out this letter I found right away...could be true, sounds possible to me.

"All quartz movements are essentially the same, whether the watch is a $15 Fossil or something 100 times that price. So when you buy a nice quartz watch, you're buying an expensive bracelet with a movement worth a couple dollars. That said, the quartz is accurate, no question."

Found at Badger and Blade : badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/164381-Automatic-vs-Quartz-Watch-Movements

Now, I will agree some watches are probably much different...but, many people will be surprised to learn many watches aren't that different, no matter the price.

bwia

@graphicguy said:
Driver....that reminds me of a childhood friend I had growing up.... For reasons I can't quite remember, he decided to bury a couple of dollars in an old coffee can in his back yard.

A couple of months later, we dug it up. Well, the money didn't fare too well. It was wet, and falling apart. Lesson learned.

When I was a boy I remember my grandmother drying money in the sun. Being a victim of the great depression she would literally hide her money under her mattress and periodically put it out to dry. Come to think of it, I can't remember what became of that money.

abacomike

@driver...that basically the inside of most watches are all the same. If the insides need to be fixed they will drop the same insides into a $40 watch as a $2000 watch.

So, according to your take on watch movements, when my Rolex "Rolesor" 2-tone Date-Just stops working properly, I can go to an Omega or Baume Mercier watch specialist and their balance wheels, mainsprings, levers, gears are all interchangeable with my Rolex!

You've got to be joking, driver! All watches (mechanical) are similar, but not the same. They all have mainsprings, gears, levers, etc., but their inner workings are specific to that make. Rolex parts are stringently inspected for the type of alloys used in the mainspring, gears and gear teeth, lever shape and size, number and type of jewels used. (As well as quality and size), to name a few.

Of course you are paying for the gold in the band and case, but the working and moving parts are quite different than an Omega - so not just the balance wheels are different.

Quartz watches, on the other hand, are much more alike - but even those are different. A Rolex Quartz is very different than a Seiko Quartz - the calibrations - quality, etc.

On this one, driver , I have to disagree with your take - sorry.

laurasdada

@abacomike said:
On this one, driver , I have to disagree with your take - sorry.

And, as someone who appreciates wristwatches, I'm with you Mike! Also, I'm not sure that Rolex makes a quartz? Unless you get it from a street vendor in Chinatown for $15... which I did once. Kept fine time, battery died and I was too embarassed to have a new battery put in my "Fauxlex!"

I know some time back, in one of the discusssions, we took a detour into the appreciation of fine time pieces. Next on my list, maybe a Tudor or an IWC Ingenieur. Or I could pay the rent...

abacomike

@ laurasdada...Also, I'm not sure that Rolex makes a quartz?

I am not sure either - however several years ago I thought I saw one on their site that they did. I'll have to check one of these days with my jeweler.

Let's face it, mechanical self-wind Rolex watches do not keep as accurate a time as a quartz movement because mechanical watches are affected by heat, winding of the mainspring and how taut that spring is kept, and the amount and quality of the special oils in the movement which lubricate the movement.

My watch gains about a minute every 3-4 weeks, which is normal, even for a chronometer as carefully regulated as their is. I've sent it to Rolex twice and the best they could do was this adjustment, which is just fine. I only wear the watch 8 hours a day which also affects it's movement.

A Rolex should have a full service once every 3-5 years for oiling, time calibration, replacement of worn parts, etcetera. My jeweler told me that when the Rolex service is done, the internal movement is totally disassembled, inspected, lubricated, reassembled and calibrated. The cost for one of those services is about. $500.00

driver100

@abacomike said:So, according to your take on watch movements, when my Rolex "Rolesor" 2-tone Date-Just stops working properly, I can go to an Omega or Baume Mercier watch specialist and their balance wheels, mainsprings, levers, gears are all interchangeable with my Rolex!

It was explained like this to me....a long time ago. First, no, I don't mean if your Rolex is broken they can fix it with parts froman Omega or a Bulova Cardinal. What I was told, a long time ago, was if your watch is really old and they have to do a complete refurbishing, they use the same mechanism in all watches...they replace everything.

Maybe things have changed, but that is what I was told. I did add a letter that explained that quartz watches are basically the same. I did use hyberbole a bit to make a point, but, lets face it, watch movements have been around for a long time, they don't vary the same way cars do. You can only make hands that go around vary a little bit.....parts may not be interchangeable but the mechanisms all do about the same thing.

Personally, if I was to buy a Rolex, I would really have to fall in love with a pre-owned one before I would choose it over a new design. But, I would be more inclined to buy a used Rolex (if it comes with a warranty) than a used Mercedes - because less could go wrong.

driver100

@laurasdada said:as someone who appreciates wristwatches, I'm with you Mike! Also, I'm not sure that Rolex makes a quartz?

I am not an expert on watches and I am not sure how we got onto comparing used watches with used cars....especially since there are no threads these days, but my guess is, if you had a Rolex, that completely stopped working. A good watch guy could drop a no name mechanism in the watch, and no one would be the wiser....in fact it might work better. Rolex may add special parts, but the watch won't corner better, go faster, be more comfortable, etc., so I don't think buying a used watch is the same as buying a new car.

Last September we went to Prague and saw the Astronomical Clock. It was made in 1410 and it keeps track of the moons phases and where the planets are, has a calendar, and has moving figures. It keeps perfect time....and it was built in 1410. Making a watch that keeps time isn't rocket science.

laurasdada

All mechanical ("automatic" "self-winding" I have three of them....so far...) should have periodic maintenance. But, an automatic Swiss watch, to me, is truly a watch and more of an emotional purchase. Quartz, while more accurate, is more machine. I guess, to keep it in the car idiom, it would be like comparing a BMW 2002tii to a Toyota Corolla. The BMW, to some, would be more emotionally satisfying, worth the extra upkeep. The Toyota, set it and forget it. Nothing wrong with either in the eye of the beholder.

This is why I bought a Jag over a Lexus and own a few Swiss automatic watches. However, I have also owned Acuras, Mitsubishis and Lexus. As well as a couple of Seikos and Invictas (one with a Japanese automatic movement). Different wants, needs and times fulfilled.

oldfarmer50

"Watches aren't that different"

As a Timex owner I'm glad to hear that.

oldfarmer50

"my watch gains a minute every 3-4 weeks"

The last two Timex watches I've owned kept perfect time for years if the battery was good. Hated to get rid of the last one but it had been put through so much hell that the mounting points for the band rotted away. Still have it in a drawer somewhere keeping accurate time.

To each his own but expensive watches and personal jewelry never seemed to be a good use of my limited funds.

robr2

@laurasdada said:

Rolex made quartz watches between 1970 and 2000. The OysterQuartz is one of the rarest Rolexes ever made - about 20,000 over the 30 year production.

driver100

It seems we can agree quartz watches run on the same principle. Now this quote from wikipedia about mechanical watches;
How it works

The mechanical watch is a mature technology, and most ordinary watch movements have the same parts and work the same way.[4]

I think this statement tells us something too:
Currently there is only one manufacturer producing watch movements in the United States. RGM Watch Company in Mount Joy, PA currently produces three in house movements,

I am not saying a $50 watch is exactly the same as a $10K Rolex, but, they all basically work on the same principle in their category, mechanical-self-winding-quartz. You can check it out at:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanical_watch

btw....I always wonder at Christmas time they always advertise all these very expensive watches in newspapers and magazines. I have no idea how they can justify those ads, expensive watches don't seem to sell in huge numbers. My guess is the profit on each watch is probably enormous.

robr2

@driver100 said:
It seems we can agree quartz watches run on the same principle. Now this quote from wikipedia about mechanical watches;
How it works

The mechanical watch is a mature technology, and most ordinary watch movements have the same parts and work the same way.[4]

I think this statement tells us something too:
Currently there is only one manufacturer producing watch movements in the United States. RGM Watch Company in Mount Joy, PA currently produces three in house movements,

I am not saying a $50 watch is exactly the same as a $10K Rolex, but, they all basically work on the same principle in their category, mechanical-self-winding-quartz. You can check it out at:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanical_watch

So the engine in a Corolla is the same as the engine in Mike's CL550 because they work on the same principle?

Yes all watch movements work the same way but high end watch makers make their own movements or modify movements made by others. High end watches often use extra, high cost components to improve the accuracy of time keeping.

Some of it is marketing but that's no different than Mont Blan pens, Audis or Coach bags.

driver100

@robr2 said:High end watches often use extra, high cost components to improve the accuracy of time keeping.

Old Farmers Times kept better time than Mikes Rolex. Of course the Rolex will be superior, it will be made from better more costly parts, it will feel better on your wrist, it will probably be thinner etc, you should get something for your 1000X extra you pay. But is you put that Toyota motor and riding gear into Mikes 550, you will notice a big difference in how the car drives.....if you put a no name watch movement in a Rolex, you probably will never know the difference.

This started now I recall with Mike saying I probably wouldn't be interested in a used Rolex because i wouldn't be interested in a used expensive Mercedes. I would be an idiot to say there isn't a difference in a Rolex compared to a regular watch......all I am saying is, a used Rolex is not a problem if I wanted to buy a Rolex (if it comes with a warranty), but, a used Luxury Mercedes is much more complex, and for the small difference - especially if I can afford a $70 or $80K car in the first place.....I would just buy new. As I pointed out, some people prefer to buy used because they get a thrill out of saving a few $s...I get a thrill out of having a brand new car no one has owned before me, and I would pay the difference to have that.

If I wanted a Rolex and could get it for half price, then I would consider that. We got a Dyson Animal Stick vacuum, regular $400 - cordless. They are incredible...bought a rebuilt one on Amazon for $240. No problem for me...I wouldn't know there's a difference (esp since I don't use it, ha).

Mr_Shiftright

"So the engine in a Corolla is the same as the engine in Mike's CL550 because they work on the same principle?"

You really learn the difference when you have both rebuilt and compare the bill! The MB invoice will look like the sales invoice for your Corolla when you bought it.

I think it works like this---to go from 0% to 90% of something costs X dollars. But if you want that other 10%, that "special" bit of extra......WHATEVER...that costs a disproportionate amount. And to go from 98% to 99% gets REALLY expensive.

There's no 100%, because there is no perfect car or watch.

mako1a

With all this talk of watches having the same guts, why is it that the Rolex sweep second hand versus the tick tick second hand on a regular watch was not mentioned? That alone tells me Rolex is a different type of timepiece.

stickguy

Do you rich folk with expensive watches just keep them in a box? I coiled never wear something that expensive on my wrist to get beat up! Then again it seems like a huge waste of money to me but as always YMMV.

jayrider

My $7 Casio keeps perfect time -- looks great and has enough radium on the dial to read in the dark.

driver100

@mako1a said:why is it that the Rolex sweep second hand versus the tick tick second hand on a regular watch was not mentioned?

Thats what you are paying the extra $4950 for!

graphicguy

@mako1a said:
With all this talk of watches having the same guts, why is it that the Rolex sweep second hand versus the tick tick second hand on a regular watch was not mentioned? That alone tells me Rolex is a different type of timepiece.

Actually, there's a reason for that. a quartz movement will have distinct sweep hand "start-stop" as it ticks off seconds. An automatic or manual movement will have the smooth sweep of the secnods hand.

Movements really only come in 3 distinct categories.

1. The afore mentioned Quartz movements, powered by battery or light
2. Automatic movements powered by a fly wheel that winds your watch "automatcally" based on your wrist movement
3. Manual movements powered by the wearer winding it

There are some derevatives from the above, but that about covers it.

Generally speaking, Swiss movements are considered the best in the world by some. Personally, I think Japanese movements have met, and in some cases, exceeded the Swiss.

A swiss made watch will state on it's face or rear case "Swiss Made". That means it was totally made and assembled in Switzerland.

Some watches have swiss movements, but are made in Japan, Korea, or China. Those are the watches that are maked with "Swiss Movement".

Swatch Group makes 99 percent of the Swiss movements. Some of those movements are then modified by the watch manufacturers. Rolex makes their own movements, but are one of the (very) few that do.

Most of the cost is in the materials used in making the band, the watch case, the face, etc.

I love watches. I could go on and on (almost as much as dishwashers). I have some really expensive watches, and I have some really cheap watches. All of them keep good time. Don't buy a watch beause of its accuracy. Buy it because you like the looks, regardless of manufacturer.

I don't like quartz watches, even though, generally speaking, they keep better time than manual wind or automatic watches. They have more heft, and are generally better made. Exceptions always apply.

My daily worn watches come from these people...high quality, good price, made in Japan.

http://orientwatchusa.com

My "dress" watches are all swiss made, though.

abacomike

@driver100 said:
I have no idea how they can justify those ads, expensive watches don't seem to sell in huge numbers. My guess is the profit on each watch is probably enormous.

No, I would imagine they don't sell in huge numbers, but they do sell. If they didn't, Omega, Ulysses Nardin and other manufacturers wouldn't have stores in the major malls. Mont Blanc also makes an excellent, expensive watch. Here in Florida, Mayors Jewelers is one of the few Licensed Rolex Dealers. I bought mine from an upscale Rolex Dealer in Lighthouse Point - near Pompano Beach.

As for profits, the average Rolex watch has a mark-up of about 50%. Otherwise, I couldn't have bought mine for 40% off list.

abacomike

@mako1a said:
With all this talk of watches having the same guts, why is it that the Rolex sweep second hand versus the tick tick second hand on a regular watch was not mentioned? That alone tells me Rolex is a different type of timepiece.

Yes, I agree mako. My watch's second hand seems to move "graciously" like an electric sweep second hand with no hesitations, etc. On the other hand (no pun intended), I have a mechanical Omega and the sweep second hand "ticks" it's way around the dial. Also remember that Rolex has a certified swiss chronometer in each of its watches.

abacomike

@driver100 said:
.....if you put a no name watch movement in a Rolex, you probably will never know the difference.

Of course you'd notice the difference, driver. A Rolex is manufactured and assembled by expert time-piece journeymen who do nothing else but build Rolex Watches. The "no-name" manufacturer of time-pieces does most of the production using computers and "stamping out" gears, levers, etc. The parts will wear out much faster than those found in a Rolex.

Finally, a Rolex is manufactured to last "a lifetime" and with age, they continue to function as well as when they were brand new - assuming the watch is cleaned and re-oiled as recommended.

As for your comment about "...I'd buy a Rolex if it had a warranty...", but buying a used car is different. You forgot to mention that pre-owned later model Mercedes, BMW's, Audi's, etc., come with a 6 year, 100,000 mile warranty if certified. Isn't that the same as someone buying a certified pre-owned Rolex (which they happen to have)?

I'm not saying that more expensive is better, however when a manufacturer develops a name for itself by producing great products (Amana, GE, Rolex, Omega, Mercedes, BMW, KitchenAid), people usually do not hesitate buying those same product pre-owned because of the quality built into their products.

abacomike

@robr2 said:
Rolex made quartz watches between 1970 and 2000. The OysterQuartz is one of the rarest Rolexes ever made - about 20,000 over the 30 year production.

Thanks for doing the research on that, robr, I knew I had seen them a while back - but have not seen them recently. You've now answered laurasdada and my dilemma.

abacomike

@stickguy said:
Do you rich folk with expensive watches just keep them in a box? I coiled never wear something that expensive on my wrist to get beat up! Then again it seems like a huge waste of money to me but as always YMMV.

You are correct, stickguy. I would not wear my Rolex everywhere - I just use it daily (if possible) so it can be wound automatically. If I don't wear it, I usually have to rotate the watch in circles in my hand for about 3-4 minutes every day to make sure it does not stop.

Rolex (and some other manufacturers) produce an automatic electric "watch rotator" that you put your Rolex in and it has an electric motor which rotates the watch when turned on. It is supposed to be the best way to keep an expensive time-piece working properly and keeping excellent time. They cost about $150-$200 - but because I am retired and do not abuse watches, I don't bother getting one.

I also own a Rado quartz Jubilee with small diamonds at 12, 3, 6, and 9 o'clock. It's 20 years old but keeps perfect time. It has a sapphire crystal just like Rolex to prevent scratching, but also the 18k gold and ceramic band is scratch proof as well - but I don't wear it much because it "smudges" all the time (the ceramic band).

My favorite watch is a Seiko quartz watch in stainless steel that I bought in California about 20 years ago - I use it every night because its dial "glows" to show the time. All I do is change the battery every year or so. I even had the band fixed twice because it is so worn. But I love my Seiko even more than I love my Rolex or my Rado.

murphydog

@graphicguy said:
Mike....this is mainly for you, but thought the others might want to see this. Benz is back in the game in a large way with some of their new cars.
http://www.caranddriver.com/news/2015-mercedes-benz-c-class-photos-and-info-news

Very excited to this in real life, I have an 08 C350 and this looks good enough that I may need to make the trade - I mean my 08 now has 35,000 miles on it, almost used up!

ray80

@graphiguy

I love watches. I could go on and on (almost as much as dishwashers).

Watchs are good but my interests are in 100 + year old clocks that I collect and keep running (If I ever get through reading the books I have I'll be able to maintain them better). Most of what I have are clocks made for the general population (not high end) but even with their age they still run and keep reasonble time and could for many more years with proper care.

robr2

@graphicguy said:
My "dress" watches are all swiss made, though.

Do you consider the chunky chronometers to be "dress" watches? I go by the rule that the slimmer the watch, the dressier it is.

And don't get me started on these modern oversize faces.

laurasdada

@stickguy said:
Do you rich folk with expensive watches just keep them in a box? I coiled never wear something that expensive on my wrist to get beat up! Then again it seems like a huge waste of money to me but as always YMMV.

Which begs the question, do you rich folks with expensive cars just keep them in a garage? I couldn't drive a BMW as they are so expensive I fear it might get beat up on the mean streets of Boston! My wife, kids and several non car-guy friends who could certainly afford rich folks cars think anything more expensive than an Accord is a huge waste of money! ; - )

YMMV, too. But, I gotsa waste my money on something! And, if I didn't waste it on cars and watches, maybe I'd ge a rich folk... : - (

laurasdada

@robr2 said:

I'm with you, anything larger than, say, 42mm is a bit much... Unless you have the wrist of Vince Wilfork!!!

houdini1

@jayrider said:
My $7 Casio keeps perfect time -- looks great and has enough radium on the dial to read in the dark.

Cheapskate ! I got a higher line Casio for $14.00. Very classy. I wear it every day while my Rolex, which I have had for 23 years, is resting in a wooden box on my desk most of the time. I still treasure it because it was a gift from my wife.

robr2

@laurasdada said:

Biggest I have is 44 mm with the crown and that's about the max I would go. My son received a 46 mm from his aunt and it's looks HUGE.

laurasdada

@robr2 said:

My Omega Seamaster Pro is 42mm, that's as big as I'd go. Others are in the 37-40mm range, better size for my wrist. Although, as my eyes seem to be getting older than the rest of my body, 37mm is seeming a bit on the small size...

abacomike

@laurasdada...Others are in the 37-40mm range, better size for my wrist. Although, as my eyes seem to be getting older than the rest of my body, 37mm is seeming a bit on the small size...

After reading all these posts about 37mm and 42mm, etc., it would appear that size really does matter after all!!!!!

explorerx4

@driver100 said: about 1410 clock keeping perfect time

There's a guy behind the curtain with a quartz watch who keeps it adjusted.

driver100

@abacomike said:As for your comment about "...I'd buy a Rolex if it had a warranty...", but buying a used car is different. You forgot to mention that pre-owned later model Mercedes, BMW's, Audi's, etc., come with a 6 year, 100,000 mile warranty if certified. Isn't that the same as someone buying a certified pre-owned Rolex (which they happen to have)?

I have seen ads in the newspaper where some outfit is selling pre-owned Rolex watch along with other stuff-usually from estate sales. What I meant was I would only buy a pre-owned Rolex from a dealer who will honor a warranty with the watch....I wouldn't buy from some temporary outfit that comes to town.

Yes, I would certainly consider a used MB or BMW with a 100K - 6 year warranty, no problem. I just think, if I am going to spend $60 or $70K for a car....I would spring for the extra few bucks and pay a bit more to get a new one. It may fetch more money at trade-in time because it will truly be, a one owner car. Also, I will get it exactly how I want it. I suppose on a used one you also save transportation cost and dealer prep. But, why quibble if spending that kind of money in the first place....I can honestly tell my friends I bought a brand new MB....not a slightly used one.

sterlingdog

@graphicguy said:
My "dress" watches are all swiss made, though.

There is much discussion today regarding watches and pre-owned automobiles. First, I'll give my view on watches---which I know nothing about except whether or not I like the design. Like you, I have enjoyed my Orient watch which I purchased a few years ago because it was square, had a navy blue background, silver numbers, and a navy blue band. When I wear blue, I wear that watch. I have a silver Seiko watch that was purchased in Japan in 1966. After 47 years, it runs great and looks beautiful. I now wear it on special occasions. I have a classy looking Fossil watch that is silver and gold with pearl numbers and hands and is a square design. I wear it on Sunday, usually. I have a Mickey Mouse watch given to me by my parents on Mickey's 50th Anniversary. It works beautifully and I wear it when we go to parties. I own a Citizen watch with an alligator band that is my daily time piece. It keeps very good time. I also have a Timex watch that I don't wear very often.

Now for my recent purchase: While on our cruise at Christmas, the ship's jewelry store announced that on Christmas Eve afternoon, we could buy an Invicta watch at 80% off. The sale was to last only one hour. I went down to see what they were like. They were priced from $500 to $10,000 before the discount. I didn't see anything that turned me on until I was walking out of the shop. In a window display at the shop's entrance, I spotted a huge black and gold watch with gold numerals and hands. It had a nice wide black band. The sales rep removed it from the display case and I tried it on for fit. It covers the entire top of my wrist and then some. It had all of these "bells and whistles" which I know nothing about but find interesting. It was the beautiful design and gold finish that really attracted me. I gave myself a Christmas gift. It was tagged at $2,000 and I paid $400. It came with a good warranty from the company and another warranty from the ship line, along with an instruction booklet and a nice watch case. I'm enjoying it very much and it does make a statement, as nearly everyone notices it. It's not a Rolex, but it gives you a good feeling to wear it.

I'll post about owning a "used" car later.

Richard

snakeweasel

@robr2 said:
Don't ever say that to a watch aficionado. To you, they are just innards. To them, the movements can be differentiated in so many ways. It would be like saying - it's just a motor, they are all the same.

Bad analogy, a motor that makes the car go faster is good, innards that make the watch go faster is bad.

If you want all cars to be the same (weight, style and such) and accelerate the same then every motor would be the same. Watches are pretty much move tiny arms around at the same rate.

snakeweasel

@abacomike said:
So, according to your take on watch movements, when my Rolex "Rolesor" 2-tone Date-Just stops working properly, I can go to an Omega or Baume Mercier watch specialist and their balance wheels, mainsprings, levers, gears are all interchangeable with my Rolex!

If they are the same size then yes you could. My watch guy told me that if a gear is the same size with the same number of teeth you can use any manufacturers gears, same thing with balance wheels and levels. Plus he used to say a mainspring is a mainspring is a mainspring.

Now many manufacturers do have some parts that are propitiatory to them but they can be worked around or:

You can even take out the entire mechanism and put in someone elses (if there is enough room).

abacomike

@snakeweasel...Bad analogy, a motor that makes the car go faster is good, innards that make the watch go faster is bad.

Snake, you forgot to add, "chuckle, chuckle, chuckle!"

abacomike

@snakeweasel...Now many manufacturers do have some parts that are propitiatory to them but they can be worked around or:

Snake, there are major differences in the alloys that are used in watches. Alloys that are more susceptible to expand and contract with temperature changes in the 35 degrees to 100 degrees F range are not used in a Rolex, according to what my jeweler just told me. The alloys used are "proprietary" as you mentioned.

Of course you can replace the internal parts of a Rolex with any parts that are the same size, but then it wouldn't be a Rolex, would it?

laurasdada

@sterlingdog said:

I have purchased a couple of Invicta watches from ShopNBC, I get addicted to their Watch Hour shows. It's funny, my father said he does, also. A nice 40mm diver's watch with an automatic Japanese movement and a quarz chronograph on a black leather strap. I bought the black chrono to replace the Swiss Army watch that turned out to be a little less water resistant than I had hoped...!

Richard, if you like your Invicta, check out ShopNBC.com. All kinds of watches there and you can spread out payments, same as cash. Cars and watches, I could read, watch and talk about 'em for long stretches of time.

snakeweasel

@abacomike said:
Let's face it, mechanical self-wind Rolex watches do not keep as accurate a time as a quartz movement because mechanical watches are affected by heat, winding of the mainspring and how taut that spring is kept, and the amount and quality of the special oils in the movement which lubricate the movement.

Most watches especially the more expensive ones have a temperature compensated balance. This is made of two different metals forming two rim segments which expand and contract with temperature changes that counteract the effects of temperature on the mainspring. This can be adjusted to different ranges of temperatures.

the big thing that affects the accuracy of a watch is it's position. The balance wheel sits on top of a jewel that reduces friction to next to nothing. Once you tip the watch it disrupts how the balance wheel sits on that jewel and accuracy suffers. While I am not sure how it works with wrist watches I know that pocket watches are either 3, 5 or 8 position watches. That means that the watch is adjusted to run accurately in those positions outside those positions the watch would run either fast or slow.

FWIW a 3 position watch is a less expensive watch that is adjusted to run accurately with the face vertical with the stem at 1.) the 12 o'clock position 2.) the 3 o'clock position and 3.) the 9 o'clock position. more expensive watches have 2 additional positions 4.) laying face up and 5.) laying face down. the high end watches (and few were) had the additional 3 positions of 6.) stem at the 6 o'clock position 7.) stem at the 12 o'clock position tilted 30 degrees forward and 8.) stem at the 12 o'clock position tilted 30 degrees back.

Railroad time keeping required their watches to be 8 position watches which is one of the reasons they are so sought after today.

Wrist watches work pretty much the same way (IIRC most are 5 position)

My watch gains about a minute every 3-4 weeks, which is normal, even for a chronometer as carefully regulated as their is. I've sent it to Rolex twice and the best they could do was this adjustment, which is just fine. I only wear the watch 8 hours a day which also affects it's movement.

My Missouri Pacific railroad watch (1880's) loses 5 seconds a month. Since accuracy of watches are dependent on position you could try setting at different positions when you are not wearing it and checking its accuracy there. If you find a position that slows it down enough you could place it in that position when not wearing it and that would improve accuracy.

A Rolex should have a full service once every 3-5 years for oiling, time calibration, replacement of worn parts, etcetera.

Any mechanical watch should be serviced every 3 to 5 years, at the very least cleaned and oiled.

snakeweasel

@mako1a said:
With all this talk of watches having the same guts, why is it that the Rolex sweep second hand versus the tick tick second hand on a regular watch was not mentioned? That alone tells me Rolex is a different type of timepiece.

Hate to tell you this but all watches have that "tick tick" second hand. Quartz watches tick by the second and mechanical watches do it by between 1/8th and 1/5th of a second. That Rolex really isn't a true sweep second hand it just ticks so fast and over a much shorter range that it can appear to be a sweep second hand. Just look closely and you will see it.

abacomike

SPEAKING/TALKING ABOUT CARS

I usually take my car in for a wash once a week up in Delray Beach. I usually go after we take our walk in Boca Raton, which is about 6 miles south of Delray.

I took my car in for a wash at the Mercedes dealer right here in the town I live in since it is owned by the same conglamorate that owns my dealership. When I pulled in I was told that they would not wash my car and that I should take it to my own dealership.

When I told the GM of my dealership, he said that was wrong - corporate policy is to wash any cars purchased at any of the 6 Mercedes dealerships they own down here. So I called their corporate offices to find out why they would not wash my car.

I received a call from the GM of my local Mercedes dealership (2 miles away) who assured me that my car could be washed at his dealership and that the next time I was looking for a new car that I should see him personally. He said he knows what a good customer I am from his corporate data and wanted to earn my business.

So, I can assume corporate got in touch with him. But I will take advantage of his car wash offer when I just need a quick wash without going all the way up to Delray Beach. I wonder if they serve bagels and other munchies like my dealer - if not, Dad won't go - he so looks forward to the "free" munchies.

ab348

@abacomike said: SPEAKING/TALKING ABOUT CARS

.

What?!?

How dare you! What will all the watch people say?

Thanks for the on-topic post.

abacomike

@ab348...@abacomike said: SPEAKING/TALKING ABOUT CARS .

What?!? How dare you! What will all the watch people say? Thanks for the on-topic post.

LOL, I thought it was "time" (pun intented) to get off watches and back to ANYTHING to do with cars!