@ray80 said:
Interesting numbers when one looks looks at them from that standpoint. Guess my GM vehicles aren't all that bad from a recall standpoint (current daily driver the exception of course
Remember, recalls in the past 4 months are no listed on that report. GM did a recent recall of millions of vehicles for ignition problems, remember?
I know CHRYSLER has a bad track record ...What kills me about my friends Chrysler van is at the time this van with 46k needed total front end repair work. A leaking trans. probably bad. Pw seats not working properly and had alot of interior squeeks.. He told me his last van had a trany problem at 60k and a electrical problem that cost him $$$$$ .
I would assume in the past 8 years chrysler is doing much better in the realibility dept... Look at the grand jeep and 300 very nice write ups..
This is a major part of Honda's reputation.......I know they failed to beef up transmissions enough for a while, but I think their reputation for holding together for a long time still has some basis in fact.
11.Chrysler Group: 63.2 million recalled/63.2 million sold; 1.00 recall rate
Is this a misprint????? or a joke?
That list shows the total number of cars sold since 1980 and recalled since 1985. A certain car may be recalled more than once and others may never be recalled.
I read the article - so GM produced 20 million cars a year from 1980-1985? That's amazing. In such a short time to produce that many cars. 5 years, 99 million cars, according to your interpretation.
I read it as 1985 and forward. 29 years, 3.5 million cars a year produced - that makes more sense, I think?
@abacomike said:
I read the article - so GM produced 20 million cars a year from 1980-1985? That's amazing. In
such a short time to produce that many cars. 5 years, 99 million cars, according to your
interpretation.
>
I read it as 1985 and forward. 29 years, 3.5 million cars a year produced - that makes more sense, I
think?
@forbes siad:
Here’s iSeeCars.com’s full list of least and most recalled car lines since 1985, with the given recall
rate being relative to sales registered in the U.S. from 1980 forward:
Bolded by me for emphasis.
I read it as cars recalled since 1985 based on sales since 1980. They gave manufacturing 5 years to get cars in the system. So GM produced 153 million cars since 1980 and recalled 99 million since 1985.
@ray80 said:
Interesting numbers when one looks looks at them from that standpoint. Guess my GM vehicles aren't all that bad from a recall standpoint
The catch is that by listing in broad groupings, the values are distorted up or down. Let's posit that GM has a certain group of pick up trucks that had more troubles than average and a few really well built autos, like my leSabres. There is no generalization that all GM vehicles are good or bad because of the statistics.
Also some of the premium brand are very good at taking care of the little things while the car is in the shop. I know my shade tree neighbor does lots of work on MB, BMW, Jag, and Subaru. Lots of problems. Don't know that they are more troublesome than on say your previous generation Impala (I'll stick with GM examples so I don't gore someone else's ox (is that the right saying?)). Am I allow to use parentheses within parentheses?
In other words, statistics can be made to say almost anything one wants by properly massaging the numbers and by careful wording of the statements using those statistics.
@imidazol97 said:In other words, statistics can be made to say almost anything
What does it all mean anyway. Some car companies may be more fastidious about recalls. Some may do minor recalls while some let them go. Some companies try to get out of doing a recall, others, such as Toyota the 2nd time around are being more careful. Maybe doing more recalls is a good thing, at least they found out there was a mistake. And, as Imid suggested, some car lines may have more than average recalls, some lines not so many.
Might get some facts from it, like the extremes are probably pretty accurate.
"Might get some facts from it, like the extremes are probably pretty accurate."
I was thinking...I wonder if "campaigns" are considered? What I mean is this:
Let's say Mercedes puts out a bulletin to all service managers that a wire can become disconnected from a fuse box in E Class vehicles and should be checked. In the case where the wiring disconnects, the cigarette lighter will not operate. I receive a letter to make an appointment to bring my car in to my dealership for an inspection, and if necessary, a repair of the wiring to the fusebbox. Is that considered a recall or not?
It is obviously not a safety recall, but does it count as a recall? I wonder!
"Every Sales Manager loves to tell a story about how some customer nobody wanted to wait on ended up buying a fleet of cars. "
I think I shared this story before, but it's worth repeating:
At the Lexus dealer I worked, the IS 300 had just been released in an assortment of "very unique colors." One of those colors was a mustard yellow-green color.
We had an inventory of 10 of those cars and had not sold one in that color in 45 days. I know they tried to dealer trade them, but no other dealership would take them.
At a Thursday morning sales meeting, the GSM said he wants them "gone" over the weekend and put out a $500 spiff for everyone sold Thursday through closing on Sunday.
Not one was sold through Saturday - they were all out on the front lot conspicuously displayed.
I was working Sunday so I arrived at 9:00 AM, an hour before we opened. I was trying to make calls and get a few customers who had shown interest in the IS300, but no luck.
At 10:00 AM, the manager opened the front showroom doors, but the greeter had not yet arrived. The manager said if customers come in, it's an open floor until she arrived.
I spotted an African American gentleman looking at cars out on the front lot and seemed interested in the IS300's. So I walked out to greet the gentleman since none of the other salesmen moved a muscle. They said to me as I walked out the door, "...don't waste your time - he's a looker, not a buyer.
I introduced myself and he mentioned that he didn't think we were open yet. I asked the customary questions regarding needs, type of driving, size, economy, etc. he shared with me that he had twin girls whose birthday was tomorrow, Monday, and since they will just turn18, he thought it was time for them to have cars of their own. I asked him if any one of the cars he had looked at would be right for his daughters. He replied that he liked those IS300's we had lined up in the lot. He walked over to the yellow/green cars and said I like these.
Without dragging this out, needless to say he called his daughters who were with their mom at Denny's having breakfast to come over to the dealership. They arrived, fell in love with the cars, and he paid cash for both cars.
Then, his wife liked the car so much that they bought a third one in the same color and traded in their 4 year old Pontiac Bonneville.
True story! They were so very nice and extremely refined an poised - very loving family. I sold them more cars a couple of years later and I had many referrals from them through their church.
At Monday's sales meeting, special mention was made of my 3-car mustard deal and they handed me 3-$500 checks right then and there. Of course on Friday's check, they took out all the taxes and Social Security, but the manager said I had found a "Diamond in the Rough !"
That makes me think it was a recall as it came from the manufacturer. TSB's typically aren't sent out to owners. The service department gets them and the techs reference them for any issues. I know my VW dealer runs my car through their TSB database to see if there are any misc items to take of.
@sterlingdog said:
Goodness. The choice between Fezo and Bradd is a difficult one. Now if one of them could care for me in my old age, I might be able to make a final decision.
Forget them, I'll make sure you get taken care of in your old age (he says in his best mobster impression).
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
@brian125 said:
I would assume in the past 8 years chrysler is doing much better in the realibility dept... Look at the grand jeep and 300 very nice write ups..
My Sebring is 6 years old with around 85K miles on it. So far no issues with it.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
"I would also like to see those rates for the last 5 years and the last 10 years so we could see trends.
Also it would be interested to see across models, see how the Mustang fared in comparison with the Fiesta."
I just happened across that Forbes article - have no other data or stats on recalls. I would think you could extract the stats you are looking for from the ".gov) site for NTSB or one of those other bureaus.
I am still awed over the fact that Mercedes had the least recalls - I would never have guessed that if it was an answer to a Jeopardy topic:
"...the automotive manufacturing company had the least number of recalls over the past 30 years"
@driver100 said:
Oh no, I pressed quote then changed my mind. I think once you do that yo can't just delete it any more, so I sent this "nothing" message.
If you just delete whats in the box it should go away. If it saves as a draft you will have an option to the right (the same box where you click to see your bookmarks) to see what is saved as a draft and to delete that draft.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
@abacomike said:"Oh no, I pressed quote then changed my mind. I think once you do that yo can't just delete it any more, so I sent this "nothing" message."
How is the above message any different than your usual nothing messages?
@snakeweasel said:
If you just delete whats in the box it should go away. If it saves as a draft you will have an option to the right (the same box where you click to see your bookmarks) to see what is saved as a draft
Thanks for the info...I'll try it next time. On the other hand, I was going to change my deleted message into a reply to:
@snakeweasel said My Sebring is 6 years old with around 85K miles on it. So far no issues with it.
Hope those aren't famous last words!
btw...nothing to do with this, but Ford had the largest recall, 14.1 million cars, for a faulty cruise control. . Automotive analyst says it happens when a car company is trying to build more cars than they had planned..
Defect: Engine-mount failure.. Units affected 6.7 million. Back then this was a big recall
Models affected: 1965-'70 Chevrolet Bel Air, Brookwood, Camaro, Caprice, Chevy II, G Series, Impala, Kingswood, Nova, P Series, C Series and Townsman; GMC C Series, G Series and P Series
What happened: Motor mounts failed. They have to be tough enough to keep a weighty engine in place, yet soft and pliable enough to allow for flex and to prevent the transfer of vibration to the vehicle's occupants. But when more than just a random amount of GM mounts started crumbling in the early 1970s, both GM and NHSTA knew something was up. GM issued the recall before NHSTA made it official. Curiously, the official GM fix didn't include replacing the mounts, but simply anchored the engine to the firewall with a cable to prevent the engine from moving under mount failure, a situation that often resulted in unintended and uncontrollable acceleration.
A guy we knew from the neighborhood had a 69 camaro . His car went thru a store front in Brooklyn he claimed his car just Accelerated . Of coarse we all didn't believe him .. He was not lying sued GM and won his case.
Speaking of assembly screw-ups, I hung out on one of the Fiesta ST forums when I was thinking of buying one. One owner noticed that his car was lacking the stability control defeat switch, while another car was missing the driver/passenger footwell lights. And a few others were delivered without turn signal or tail lamp bulbs. I suspect that the Mexican auto workers were simply trying to show that they were the equal of their UAW brethren when it comes to attention to detail...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
@oldfarmer50 said:
Hey, I'm the one who offered to let him park it in my driveway. I even agreed to drive it around every day so the tires didn't get flat spots.
This whole thing may have to develop into a lottery.
Nice triple deal story. Especially on an oddball car. Speaking of the 1st gen IS series, those mini wagons never did sell in huge numbers did they? I rarely see any around these days.
"Speaking of the 1st gen IS series, those mini wagons never did sell in huge numbers did they? I rarely see any around these days."
No, they never did. Lexus made a mistake building a wagon for that model. It was a personal performance sedan and those who were attracted to that car had no interest or need for a mini wagon. The coupe should have been introduced sooner than putting out that wagon.
I never sold one and they sat on the lots collecting dust.
Lexus made a mistake building a wagon for that model. It was a personal performance sedan and those who were attracted to that car had no interest or need for a mini wagon. The coupe should have been introduced sooner than putting out that wagon.
I never sold one and they sat on the lots collecting dust.
That first generation Lexus IS wagon looked pretty nice...similar to the now extinct Camry wagon I think. Could the problem just be that Americans don't buy wagons....they prefer SUVs.
Europeans like wagons, they use less gas, but there just aren't enough people buying them worldwide to make them worth making.
"Europeans like wagons, they use less gas, but there just aren't enough people buying them worldwide to make them worth making."
Your comment about "they use less gas" seemed puzzling to me. How or why do wagons use less gas?
I agree that North Americans prefer minivans and small SUV's to wagons. I am still surprised Mercedes continues to produce their E Class wagon. My dealer tells me he sells 8-10 a year - so why continue exporting wagons to North America?
I owned one wagon ('71 Chevy Caprice) which came in handy when we moved to our first home - but it handled so poorly. I always had problems tracking after a turn - it seemed rear-heavy. I can tell you that we didn't keep it very long.
@abacomike said:Your comment about "they use less gas" seemed puzzling to me. How or why do wagons use less gas?
>
Since gas is more than double the price in Europe, Europeans prefer the economy they get from buying a wagon vs. an SUV....guess it would be better to say, wagonsget better gas mileage than SUVs..
MB, Audi, BMW even Jaguar wagons are very popular in Europe, Just to give you an idea;
Station wagons ranked No. 2 with men last year as 11 percent of the survey respondents said that was the type of vehicle they intended to buy. Minivans finished third with men at 8 percent with SUVs ranking No. 4 at 6 percent and coupes in last place out of the five car types at 3 percent.
For women, station wagons and minivans tied for second at 8 percent last year while SUVs were No. 4 at 4 percent and coupes finished at the bottom with 2 percent. SUVs not Hot in Europe
There aren't too many wagons offered in the US, but I was surprised Cadillac is probably the only American manufacturer offering a wagon....I wonder how many of those theyactually sell.......and surprisingly, you could get it with manual transmission, bet they don't sell many of those.
I love wagons! They exhibit inherently better handling capabilities and superior fuel economy than the SUV crowd due to the lower ride heights and less weight, but provide similar day-to-day utility. Wagons just make sense unless you absolutely need ground clearance, but even in that category, most of the new crossovers offer very little ground clearance and off-road capability.
Maybe I'm just missing something. What makes crossovers so great that they've become the hottest and fastest growing segment?
@tyguy said: What makes crossovers so great that they've become the hottest and fastest growing segment?
>
I like wagons too! Usually the actual carrying capacity is greater than an SUV. I prefer the lower centre of gravity and car like qualities, as opposed to truck like qualities too.
Just an opinion, but I think North Americans like sitting higher, they like the extra room the front seat area has in an SUV or van, they like the feeling they will be safer with a larger car. Why get the smaller wagon when for the same price you can get a larger car?
I just wonder if the wagon isn't actually safer in some respects, lower centre of gravity, better handling, less roll, etc.
@tyguy said:
Maybe I'm just missing something. What makes crossovers so great that they've become the hottest and fastest growing segment?
The utility of a wagon without the stigma of a wagon.
That being said, I own a Passat wagon, an Odyssey minivan and an Explorer CUV. I'm not anti wagon.
CUV's are also great for our aging baby boom population. The hip point is higher in CUV's when compared to traditional sedans and wagon making it easier for folks to enter and exit as they age.
Posted this in the CCBA thread, but thought it would have relevance here, too....
Cadillac is trying hard to get people into their showrooms. Hot on the heels of sending me a $50 Visa gift card from the autoshow this past winter, I just received an invitation to take another look, offering $1,500 Conquest allowance on a purchase/lease of any Cadillac, and $100 Visa gift card for another test drive.
I might start signing up for every manufacturer's "incentives". Could be a nice supplement to my income.
@driver100 said:
Since gas is more than double the price in Europe, Europeans prefer the economy they get from buying a wagon vs. an SUV....guess it would be better to say, wagonsget better gas mileage than SUVs..
OK, now I understand - wagons compared to SUV - that makes much better sense to me.
@tyguy said:
I love wagons! They exhibit inherently better handling capabilities and superior fuel economy than the SUV crowd due to the lower ride heights and less weight, but provide similar day-to-day utility. Wagons just make sense unless you absolutely need ground clearance, but even in that category, most of the new crossovers offer very little ground clearance and off-road capability.
When I posted that I had owned just one wagon because of poor handling, you have to understand where I as coming from - 1971 GM wagons were notorious for being overly heavy and clumsy. The newer generation of wagons are as good as a sedan, to be sure.
LOL Give me a straight line and I'll take advantage of it - I just love pulling your leg and anything else I can grab!
Gee, I hope, after grabbing "anything else" you at least buy the guy dinner...
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
@laurasdada said:
Gee, I hope, after grabbing "anything else" you at least buy the guy dinner...
I offered to buy driver and his wife dinner if they were in the Ft. Lauderdale/Boca Raton area, but he never took me up on it. But as far as grabbing "anything else," as we age, our skin begins to sag, so I though I would grab one of his spare tires.
Comments
"11.Chrysler Group: 63.2 million recalled/63.2 million sold; 1.00 recall rate
Is this a misprint????? or a joke?"
Must be - I copied it righ out of Forbes!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Remember, recalls in the past 4 months are no listed on that report. GM did a recent recall of millions of vehicles for ignition problems, remember?
Toyota just recalled a ton of cars yesterday.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
I know CHRYSLER has a bad track record ...What kills me about my friends Chrysler van is at the time this van with 46k needed total front end repair work. A leaking trans. probably bad. Pw seats not working properly and had alot of interior squeeks.. He told me his last van had a trany problem at 60k and a electrical problem that cost him $$$$$ .
I would assume in the past 8 years chrysler is doing much better in the realibility dept... Look at the grand jeep and 300 very nice write ups..
23 Telluride SX-P X-Line, 23 Camry XSE
If you should hear some strange noises in your garage one night, don't worry, it's nothing!!!!!!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/news/9815860/German-cars-lose-out-in-reliability-survey.html
This is a major part of Honda's reputation.......I know they failed to beef up transmissions enough for a while, but I think their reputation for holding together for a long time still has some basis in fact.
That list shows the total number of cars sold since 1980 and recalled since 1985. A certain car may be recalled more than once and others may never be recalled.
Here is a link to the article: http://www.forbes.com/sites/jimgorzelany/2014/03/26/automakers-with-the-lowest-and-highest-recall-rates/
I read the article - so GM produced 20 million cars a year from 1980-1985? That's amazing. In such a short time to produce that many cars. 5 years, 99 million cars, according to your interpretation.
I read it as 1985 and forward. 29 years, 3.5 million cars a year produced - that makes more sense, I think?
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Richard - you need help in your old age? I'm not doing anything now. Of course I probably won't be doing anything then, either...
>
Bolded by me for emphasis.
I read it as cars recalled since 1985 based on sales since 1980. They gave manufacturing 5 years to get cars in the system. So GM produced 153 million cars since 1980 and recalled 99 million since 1985.
The catch is that by listing in broad groupings, the values are distorted up or down. Let's posit that GM has a certain group of pick up trucks that had more troubles than average and a few really well built autos, like my leSabres. There is no generalization that all GM vehicles are good or bad because of the statistics.
Also some of the premium brand are very good at taking care of the little things while the car is in the shop. I know my shade tree neighbor does lots of work on MB, BMW, Jag, and Subaru. Lots of problems. Don't know that they are more troublesome than on say your previous generation Impala (I'll stick with GM examples so I don't gore someone else's ox (is that the right saying?)). Am I allow to use parentheses within parentheses?
In other words, statistics can be made to say almost anything one wants by properly massaging the numbers and by careful wording of the statements using those statistics.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
What does it all mean anyway. Some car companies may be more fastidious about recalls. Some may do minor recalls while some let them go. Some companies try to get out of doing a recall, others, such as Toyota the 2nd time around are being more careful. Maybe doing more recalls is a good thing, at least they found out there was a mistake. And, as Imid suggested, some car lines may have more than average recalls, some lines not so many.
Might get some facts from it, like the extremes are probably pretty accurate.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
"Might get some facts from it, like the extremes are probably pretty accurate."
I was thinking...I wonder if "campaigns" are considered? What I mean is this:
Let's say Mercedes puts out a bulletin to all service managers that a wire can become disconnected from a fuse box in E Class vehicles and should be checked. In the case where the wiring disconnects, the cigarette lighter will not operate. I receive a letter to make an appointment to bring my car in to my dealership for an inspection, and if necessary, a repair of the wiring to the fusebbox. Is that considered a recall or not?
It is obviously not a safety recall, but does it count as a recall? I wonder!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Probably not. That sound like a TSB. Was the letter from the dealer or MB?
"Probably not. That sound like a TSB. Was the letter from the dealer or MB?"
It was from Mercedes Benz - USA.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
"Every Sales Manager loves to tell a story about how some customer nobody wanted to wait on ended up buying a fleet of cars. "
I think I shared this story before, but it's worth repeating:
At the Lexus dealer I worked, the IS 300 had just been released in an assortment of "very unique colors." One of those colors was a mustard yellow-green color.
We had an inventory of 10 of those cars and had not sold one in that color in 45 days. I know they tried to dealer trade them, but no other dealership would take them.
At a Thursday morning sales meeting, the GSM said he wants them "gone" over the weekend and put out a $500 spiff for everyone sold Thursday through closing on Sunday.
Not one was sold through Saturday - they were all out on the front lot conspicuously displayed.
I was working Sunday so I arrived at 9:00 AM, an hour before we opened. I was trying to make calls and get a few customers who had shown interest in the IS300, but no luck.
At 10:00 AM, the manager opened the front showroom doors, but the greeter had not yet arrived. The manager said if customers come in, it's an open floor until she arrived.
I spotted an African American gentleman looking at cars out on the front lot and seemed interested in the IS300's. So I walked out to greet the gentleman since none of the other salesmen moved a muscle. They said to me as I walked out the door, "...don't waste your time - he's a looker, not a buyer.
I introduced myself and he mentioned that he didn't think we were open yet. I asked the customary questions regarding needs, type of driving, size, economy, etc. he shared with me that he had twin girls whose birthday was tomorrow, Monday, and since they will just turn18, he thought it was time for them to have cars of their own. I asked him if any one of the cars he had looked at would be right for his daughters. He replied that he liked those IS300's we had lined up in the lot. He walked over to the yellow/green cars and said I like these.
Without dragging this out, needless to say he called his daughters who were with their mom at Denny's having breakfast to come over to the dealership. They arrived, fell in love with the cars, and he paid cash for both cars.
Then, his wife liked the car so much that they bought a third one in the same color and traded in their 4 year old Pontiac Bonneville.
True story! They were so very nice and extremely refined an poised - very loving family. I sold them more cars a couple of years later and I had many referrals from them through their church.
At Monday's sales meeting, special mention was made of my 3-car mustard deal and they handed me 3-$500 checks right then and there. Of course on Friday's check, they took out all the taxes and Social Security, but the manager said I had found a "Diamond in the Rough !"
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
That makes me think it was a recall as it came from the manufacturer. TSB's typically aren't sent out to owners. The service department gets them and the techs reference them for any issues. I know my VW dealer runs my car through their TSB database to see if there are any misc items to take of.
Are we sure it wasn't a strong gust of wind?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Forget them, I'll make sure you get taken care of in your old age (he says in his best mobster impression).
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I would also like to see those rates for the last 5 years and the last 10 years so we could see trends.
Also it would be interested to see across models, see how the Mustang fared in comparison with the Fiesta.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
My Sebring is 6 years old with around 85K miles on it. So far no issues with it.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
"I would also like to see those rates for the last 5 years and the last 10 years so we could see trends.
Also it would be interested to see across models, see how the Mustang fared in comparison with the Fiesta."
I just happened across that Forbes article - have no other data or stats on recalls. I would think you could extract the stats you are looking for from the ".gov) site for NTSB or one of those other bureaus.
I am still awed over the fact that Mercedes had the least recalls - I would never have guessed that if it was an answer to a Jeopardy topic:
"...the automotive manufacturing company had the least number of recalls over the past 30 years"
Answer "Who is Mercedes Benz?"
No way I would have gotten that one!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Recalls are like saying I'm sick. They are considered to be safety related, but sometimes it's adding a sticker.
Oh no, I pressed quote then changed my mind. I think once you do that yo can't just delete it any more, so I sent this "nothing" message.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
"Oh no, I pressed quote then changed my mind. I think once you do that yo can't just delete it any more, so I sent this "nothing" message."
How is the above message any different than your usual nothing messages?
LOL Give me a straight line and I'll take advantage of it - I just love pulling your leg and anything else I can grab!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
If you just delete whats in the box it should go away. If it saves as a draft you will have an option to the right (the same box where you click to see your bookmarks) to see what is saved as a draft and to delete that draft.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Hey, I'm the one who offered to let him park it in my driveway. I even agreed to drive it around every day so the tires didn't get flat spots.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
How is the above message any different than your usual nothing messages?
lol...I guess I asked for that one.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
"lol...I guess I asked for that one."
Nah - you're too nice a guy. I just took advantage of a one-liner ! LOL
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Thanks for the info...I'll try it next time. On the other hand, I was going to change my deleted message into a reply to:
Hope those aren't famous last words!
btw...nothing to do with this, but Ford had the largest recall, 14.1 million cars, for a faulty cruise control. . Automotive analyst says it happens when a car company is trying to build more cars than they had planned..
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
GM, had a very big recall back in 1971
Defect: Engine-mount failure.. Units affected 6.7 million. Back then this was a big recall
Models affected: 1965-'70 Chevrolet Bel Air, Brookwood, Camaro, Caprice, Chevy II, G Series, Impala, Kingswood, Nova, P Series, C Series and Townsman; GMC C Series, G Series and P Series
What happened: Motor mounts failed. They have to be tough enough to keep a weighty engine in place, yet soft and pliable enough to allow for flex and to prevent the transfer of vibration to the vehicle's occupants. But when more than just a random amount of GM mounts started crumbling in the early 1970s, both GM and NHSTA knew something was up. GM issued the recall before NHSTA made it official. Curiously, the official GM fix didn't include replacing the mounts, but simply anchored the engine to the firewall with a cable to prevent the engine from moving under mount failure, a situation that often resulted in unintended and uncontrollable acceleration.
A guy we knew from the neighborhood had a 69 camaro . His car went thru a store front in Brooklyn he claimed his car just Accelerated . Of coarse we all didn't believe him .. He was not lying sued GM and won his case.
23 Telluride SX-P X-Line, 23 Camry XSE
Speaking of assembly screw-ups, I hung out on one of the Fiesta ST forums when I was thinking of buying one. One owner noticed that his car was lacking the stability control defeat switch, while another car was missing the driver/passenger footwell lights. And a few others were delivered without turn signal or tail lamp bulbs. I suspect that the Mexican auto workers were simply trying to show that they were the equal of their UAW brethren when it comes to attention to detail...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Not only that, I could be driven around in a nice MB. You're edging your way to the top of the list.
Driver, that's a good idea. Now just where was that fountain of youth?
Richard
I did promise you first dibs, didn't I?
Richard
You wouldn't be a bad choice; you could do my taxes. So many good choices here.
Richard
Same with my convertible, plus look at all the abuse that my wife gave it. It still looks and drives like new.
Richard
This whole thing may have to develop into a lottery.
Richard
@abacomike
Nice triple deal story. Especially on an oddball car. Speaking of the 1st gen IS series, those mini wagons never did sell in huge numbers did they? I rarely see any around these days.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
"Speaking of the 1st gen IS series, those mini wagons never did sell in huge numbers did they? I rarely see any around these days."
No, they never did. Lexus made a mistake building a wagon for that model. It was a personal performance sedan and those who were attracted to that car had no interest or need for a mini wagon. The coupe should have been introduced sooner than putting out that wagon.
I never sold one and they sat on the lots collecting dust.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Lexus made a mistake building a wagon for that model. It was a personal performance sedan and those who were attracted to that car had no interest or need for a mini wagon. The coupe should have been introduced sooner than putting out that wagon.
That first generation Lexus IS wagon looked pretty nice...similar to the now extinct Camry wagon I think. Could the problem just be that Americans don't buy wagons....they prefer SUVs.
Europeans like wagons, they use less gas, but there just aren't enough people buying them worldwide to make them worth making.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
"Europeans like wagons, they use less gas, but there just aren't enough people buying them worldwide to make them worth making."
Your comment about "they use less gas" seemed puzzling to me. How or why do wagons use less gas?
I agree that North Americans prefer minivans and small SUV's to wagons. I am still surprised Mercedes continues to produce their E Class wagon. My dealer tells me he sells 8-10 a year - so why continue exporting wagons to North America?
I owned one wagon ('71 Chevy Caprice) which came in handy when we moved to our first home - but it handled so poorly. I always had problems tracking after a turn - it seemed rear-heavy. I can tell you that we didn't keep it very long.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
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Since gas is more than double the price in Europe, Europeans prefer the economy they get from buying a wagon vs. an SUV....guess it would be better to say, wagonsget better gas mileage than SUVs..
MB, Audi, BMW even Jaguar wagons are very popular in Europe, Just to give you an idea;
Station wagons ranked No. 2 with men last year as 11 percent of the survey respondents said that was the type of vehicle they intended to buy. Minivans finished third with men at 8 percent with SUVs ranking No. 4 at 6 percent and coupes in last place out of the five car types at 3 percent.
For women, station wagons and minivans tied for second at 8 percent last year while SUVs were No. 4 at 4 percent and coupes finished at the bottom with 2 percent.
SUVs not Hot in Europe
There aren't too many wagons offered in the US, but I was surprised Cadillac is probably the only American manufacturer offering a wagon....I wonder how many of those theyactually sell.......and surprisingly, you could get it with manual transmission, bet they don't sell many of those.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I love wagons! They exhibit inherently better handling capabilities and superior fuel economy than the SUV crowd due to the lower ride heights and less weight, but provide similar day-to-day utility. Wagons just make sense unless you absolutely need ground clearance, but even in that category, most of the new crossovers offer very little ground clearance and off-road capability.
Maybe I'm just missing something. What makes crossovers so great that they've become the hottest and fastest growing segment?
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I like wagons too! Usually the actual carrying capacity is greater than an SUV. I prefer the lower centre of gravity and car like qualities, as opposed to truck like qualities too.
Just an opinion, but I think North Americans like sitting higher, they like the extra room the front seat area has in an SUV or van, they like the feeling they will be safer with a larger car. Why get the smaller wagon when for the same price you can get a larger car?
I just wonder if the wagon isn't actually safer in some respects, lower centre of gravity, better handling, less roll, etc.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
The utility of a wagon without the stigma of a wagon.
That being said, I own a Passat wagon, an Odyssey minivan and an Explorer CUV. I'm not anti wagon.
CUV's are also great for our aging baby boom population. The hip point is higher in CUV's when compared to traditional sedans and wagon making it easier for folks to enter and exit as they age.
Posted this in the CCBA thread, but thought it would have relevance here, too....
Cadillac is trying hard to get people into their showrooms. Hot on the heels of sending me a $50 Visa gift card from the autoshow this past winter, I just received an invitation to take another look, offering $1,500 Conquest allowance on a purchase/lease of any Cadillac, and $100 Visa gift card for another test drive.
I might start signing up for every manufacturer's "incentives". Could be a nice supplement to my income.
OK, now I understand - wagons compared to SUV - that makes much better sense to me.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
When I posted that I had owned just one wagon because of poor handling, you have to understand where I as coming from - 1971 GM wagons were notorious for being overly heavy and clumsy. The newer generation of wagons are as good as a sedan, to be sure.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Gee, I hope, after grabbing "anything else" you at least buy the guy dinner...
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
That's funny, now that I read that comment over again. And, he hasn't even met me in person either!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I offered to buy driver and his wife dinner if they were in the Ft. Lauderdale/Boca Raton area, but he never took me up on it. But as far as grabbing "anything else," as we age, our skin begins to sag, so I though I would grab one of his spare tires.
How's that for getting out of a syntactic jam?
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger