Stories from the Sales Frontlines

snakeweasel

Well I will say this, I was born with a speech impediment and I tend to be sensitive when it comes to jokes about peoples speech.

cotmc

isell:

Sorry, it's all my fault. Your buyer must have read "COTMC's '5 Points' to a Lower Sales Price"! The 'huge circle of friends' point was always my favorite ace in the hole.

I guess I better publish "Version 2.0" soon, with some new ideas...

steine13

Y'all can use my method free of charge.

Which is, I don't discuss how I got the price. I say please and thank you, and I even apologize for being too low as I'm broomed out. But I don't ever talk about invoice and holdback and profit and all that good stuff, because it doesn't matter. Take my offer, or counter, or reject outright; it's just about the price at that point, it's not a debate match.

Not quite the bobst method, but it's close, and it works well for me. At least it's quick.

-Mathias

dino001

Sorry then. Same joke heard twenty times is not funny anymore, even if it is to others. First ten time one attempts to lough with them, as they laugh at him or her, but twenthieth it may not be so funny, even if no real harm is intended, as we all do not know each other's hot buttons, until we're told. I understand.

british_rover

Dude where have you been?

How have Lambo sales been?

mackabee

I can totally emphatize with you. I'm married to a foreign born wife and she also has an accent when speaking. I remember back around 1991 or so; she called the ship I was on at the time to speak with me. (USN) I was summoned to the quarterdeck and when I got on the phone she was very upset. It seems the seaman that answered the phone mocked the way she talked and she heard him as back then the phones onboard did not have a "hold" function. I was also upset and when I hanged the phone up I dressed him down appropriately. So again my apologies. My joke was in very bad taste.

Mackabee

jipster

Sounds like a similar problem that plagued the earlier model Mazda MPV's transmission(2002 & 2003). Last time I checked on the Camry board the reflash hadn't been developed yet. Glad to hear they came up with a solution.

moparbad

What is the meaning of "broomed out"? No money?

british_rover

Shown the door.

jipster

Testament to a good site that those that leave usually come back. You, macabee, britishrover, I believe isell several times... welcome back. :shades:

mac24

I don't discuss how I got the price.

Exactly! It's the number that's important, not where it came from.

snakeweasel

Hey its cool.

snakeweasel

As I said its cool, now that everything is out in the open. No harm no foul.

epiney

At our dealership we have a three day/500 mile exchange priviledge. No questions asked. Must be on a new vehicle. Once in a while we'll do it on a pre-owned to keep the customer satisfied.

How many times has a customer of yours exchanged? What did they buy and what did they trade for?

greanpea68

On Saturday morning at 10:00am I greet a couple on the lot, " Goodmorning and welcome to Nissan Country I'm Greanpea, have you been to the Dealershipbefore and are you here to see anyone in paticular?" With a heavy Bosnian accent they say no we are just looking today please give us some time to look around and if we have any questions we'll come find you. So I give them my card and let them be. Fifteen minutes later they come inside and find me and say " We want your best price" I say no problem What kind of car are you looking for. He replies he wants a Altima with convienance pkg and ABS. He aslo wants price on base Altima with ABS I Say OK. I bring up a conv. pkg with ABS. He says he doesn't need to drive it but I talk him into driving around the dealership. He drives around the dealership building about 10 times and comes in. I ask him is this the right car and he says yes. I ask if figures are agreeable and affordable today is ready for his business. He says yes. It is the last day of the month and Fourth of July. He states he wants a good deal. Now he is driving a 2000 Altima with 110k on it with a dent on every corner. I ask him if he is trading and he says that doesn't make a differance he just wants price. Now in my head I say OK this guy read the book I know this trade is coming into play somewhere. So I say your right it doesn't make a differance but if you were we can give you figures to think about he says no he is going to give the car to his sister. No problem. Now we work numbers on the conv. pkg and he says ok to high. I'm taking $1000 off. He then says he wants numbers on a base altima with ABS. I say no problem I show that car and then he says he is not buying unless we discount the car to $1900 Now the whole time we are negotiating he is on the phone talking to his brother in Bosnian. The brother keeps telling him we should take more off. Finnally show that we are at Net, Net all of the hold back is taken out. Finally I say ok if we do this are you ready to do business today? He says yes. Then I remeber the trade and I ask how about now are you still going to give the trade to your sister? He asks " What will give me for it?"

At this time it is 12:00pm Been with this customer for two hours we landed him on a car and have sale price for my car we just need to appraise his trade. 2000 Altima with 110k miles and more dents then a golf ball. So we offer $500 and settle on $2000 and now is the time I think I have a deal.

He says OK now that we worked out price I am not ready to buy a car yet. I am baffled and ask why? If we do this deal I want it on this stock number. (reminder he looked around the lot for 15 minutes before coming in) He says it is a base car with ABS but different color I say as long as it is the same MSRP I will do the deal. ( If your still reading this is where things get interesting.) I take the stock number and get the keys and go out to the car. It has the right MSRP but when I go to get in the car it has a stering wheel for a conv. pkg. ( stering wheels for conv. pkgs have stereo controls on them which the car we agreed to figures with shouldn't have them... Moo have you ever seen a base Altima with stero controls on the stering wheel?) So I drive the car up and the controls don't work which they shouldn't but this is the wrong stering wheel. As I'm driving up I know this is the only reason he picked out this car.
The cust sits in the car and tries to play with the controls right away he says the controls don't work. (now at this point I can't believe this car has these controls and all I can think is it must have been built on a friday afternoon or the new kid started that day at the building plant) Now right away when he starts complaing about the controls I tell him I already showed you another car with same equipment and you know that this equipment level does not come with stero controls on the stering wheel. Is this the only reason you picked this car out?.................

He finaly says yes and agrees he thought he was getting something for nothing. Now if they did work fine but they don't. So now he says the whole deal is off he is sorry he wasted my time. I just spent almost three hours with this guy on a busy Saturday I'm not letting him go. Finaly his wife gets mad at him and tells him to stop being foolish at least thats what she said to me. She yalled at him in Bosnian... And says he will buy the equipment level but different car. I show him three other cars because he wants to sit in each of them all of the same equipment, two of the same interior just different exterior. We finaly find a car and he says ok this one will work. Now 10 minutes later I'm getting paper work and he says no deal... Continue soon

greanpea68

I like what do you mean no deal. He says there is a scratch on the car there are way too many problems buying this car I'm not going to buy today. I ask him to show me the scratch be cause I have a idea of what the scratch is and I say if I can magically fix the scratch right before your eyes with out a bodyshop or a machine buff will you buy and he says yes. I go out to the car see the scratch rub it pretty good with my finger and take the glue mark off. then I simply ask how are you going to take care of that deposit. His wife hands me the credit card by the time they leave it is 4:30pm Only 6 and a half hours. Which put me for 12.5 units for the month. It was a tough month for June. It's July now and I have one deal done and one in the bucket. July is looking to be better than June so far. I hope every sales guy here finished good for the month :shades:

geffen

Great Story thats quite a long deal, do you have many customers that sometimes take that long? I don't have any dealerships open in my area on sundays you guys must all be in large cities?

greanpea68

I wanted to comment on buying from the manufacturer. You would end up paying more. Think about it... there would be no competition... If you look at the adds that nissan has nationaly compared to the adds you see in the papers which price would you rather pay? Ya know whats funny? The Altima add on TV is like $3000 down+t,t,l at 249/mo... I could be off. The funny part is no one comes into the dealership looking for that national add they all want the one they saw in the paper 3000 down 169/mo. So the funny thing is the nanufacturer prices are already there. Oh it's also on the cars too it's called Manufacturers Suggested Retail Price. :shades:

Now that being said the consumers of the world get a better price today because dealerships compete with each other as most of you guys seem to know. If there was no competition you would have to pay a better price. Plus think about it the more dealerships, let's say Nissan there are in one area the better it is for the manufacturer because more dealerships, more competition= better prices for consumers ...

Now here is the thing most of you consumers here on this site know invoice, know what a good deal is to you. You go into a dealership you make a if it is accepted you deal if it's not you don't. YOU KNOW YOU GUYS REALLY AREN"T THAT BAD. I need to sell cars every month you guys are ussually quick and give all exellents on surveys. So I may make a mini on you but I'm getting another exellent survey and that will help me make bonus. How can I complain?

greanpea68

This is a two part quetion #1. I was just curious if any consumers had any idea what dealerships can spend a month on advertising? Do you think it is $10,000... $50,000... $100,000...?

Part two: What do the other sales guys stores average per month...

dino001

Be patient. There will be a deal. In some parts of the world it's a common negotiating technique to threaten walkout on every small issue and pulling surprising extra demands the minute you think you have a deal. Be prepared for demands on extra oil changes, mats, etc. AFTER you think agreed on the price with threats of walkout. They often simply test the opponent's real bottom line that way.

greanpea68

geffen................. No I my deals ussually take 2-3 hours evrything papered and out the door. Since you don't have to work sundays does that mean you get two days off a week?

greanpea68

Dino... Thanks for the support. I just thought of something. Even though they signed up it really isn't a deal till they drive off. I'm sure there will probrably be something else before I deliver :sick:

jipster

That's the second time I've read the "there will be no competition" phrase. Explain please. Manufacturers won't be competing against other manufacturers for sales? Sounds crazy to me.

The ads that Nissan runs, or any manufacturer, are usually quoted at MSRP. Nationally/regionally run ads quoting a specific price would not work due to the large number of dealerships and the long list of variables each dealership face in setting their price. So of course dealership advertised prices would be lower.

You must be on your way to a hot date. That last paragraph makes no sense at all.

mackabee

As Mrs. Johnson sits in the middle row captain's chair admiring the DVD screen she says to no one in particular: "I really like the leather."
"Do you have leather in your current vehicle?" I ask. "Yes, but it's old. My daughters have been telling me to buy a new car now for a while." she replies. "What do you drive?" I ask. "It's an old Ford Explorer. What will you give me for it?" she asks. Mr. Johnson chimes in, "You'll be lucky to get $500.00 for it. The condition it's in they'll have to wholesale it." I can tell he's been around the block more than a couple of times and they been married a long time. There's an LE with cloth right next to the one I'm showing them and she wants to look at that one too. I open it up and she sees it's cloth and it doesn't have all the bells and whistles the other has. "I like the other one better, but I wished it had a middle bench." she says. Mr. Johnson chimes in again and says. "Now why in the world do you need a bench? You are the only one in the car most of the time." not really wanting to hear the answer. "Well, you never know when the kids will visit and we need the extra seat." she replies.
I then tell her that the XLE is not available with the middle third seat only the CE and LE. She's visibly disappointed and shakes her head, "Now why would they do that?" she asks. "I have no idea." I reply. "Do you have anymore or are these two the only ones?" she asks. "These are the only ones, but I do have quite a few new ones if you want to look at those." I respond. "Do you mind?" she asks. "Not at all." I say. "You know what? Let's get in this van and drive around to the back where the new ones are. That way we can have the a/c on and keep cool. It's very hot out." It's around 3pm by now and the strongest heat of the day can be felt. We drive around back and I stop the van for a few minutes. "Stay here, I'll be right back." I leave the van running with the a/c on and run into the building to get a few bottles of water. I come back and give them a bottle to cool off and drink one myself. I then drive to where all the new vans are parked and we get out of the vehicle and begin our search for the right one.
To be continued.....
:shades:
Mackabee

british_rover

Oh I know there will.

Do you guys have Nissan hats and t-shirts around like in a display case? Any kind of display with accessories for sale at the dealership?

He will ask for free stuff at delivery and threaten to walk out if he doesn't get it.

mackabee

I'll reply to this one in detail after I finish the ongoing saga "Treat them like they are your folks". It's also a story worth telling here as it was one of my previous customers that somehow got shuffled and I got screwed out of not one but two sales. Stay tuned.
:sick:
Mackabee

mackabee

I think what he's trying to say and correct me if I'm wrong greenpea, is that there will be no competition amongst the same brand dealers only against competing brands. The way the system works today Toyota or Nissan dealerships compete against each other therefore the smart shopper is able to pit one dealer against another when all that matters to them is who can give them the lowest price. Your scenario assumes that all factory controlled dealers will set their own prices. I doubt it very much that would happen and if it did or does than you would be back to where we are today. The only solution that I see is what Saturn and now Scion do. No haggle/hassle pricing everybody pays the same. The only difference is where you buy the car. Maybe you like the salesperson better or the store itself. The way Scion's covenant to do business is set up is that there are no negotiations on price or trade. We can discount the vehicle but that same discount must be advertised on the same vehicle to others for a certain period of time. It also has to be advertised on the dealers Scion website and it must match what is shown in the showroom. Toyota hopes that eventually we will sell Toyotas the same way. Scion customers love it, we love it, and everybody's happy. The only drawback and it's really not a drawback is that we get paid a flat commission and that varies by dealership but the time it takes is usually half of what it takes to do a "traditional" back and forth deal. Heck, I rather spend time with three Scion customers in one day than all day with a stubborn, recalcitrant, "give me your best deal" customer any day.
:shades:
Mackabee

cdnpinhead

Yessir, yessir, three bags full.

Bobst, you & others describe what has worked for me for years.

I got so hosed when I was younger.

I do better now.

cdnpinhead

There would still be competition between OEM's (manufacturers). Of course, for specialty vehicles, not so much.

Let's all wait and see how it turns out.

mackabee

Grab some Snickers, it's going to be a while.

Mackabee

mac24

The way Scion's covenant to do business is set up is that there are no negotiations on price or trade.

So how do trades get priced? Do you just use a reverse bobst method, quote a price and either the customer takes it or walks?

madmanmoo

Damn Greenpea. Sounds like we had similar Saturdays.

I have never seen that with the steering wheel. That's crazy. I've seen the wrong lettering on the backs of vehicles before. An S model Altima with SL badging, but that's nothing too crazy.

My only sale Saturday was a couple of folks who said they would be there at 11:00. Showed at 12:30. I had the vehicle they had picked out already detailed and ready with a full tank of gas. The numbers were already agreed upon, so all was good.

When they get to the dealership, they throw in a trade and want $2,500 more for it than it is worth. AND they keep negotiating on the price of the vehicle even after we had already agreed upon it.

That was a long time I spent with them and they pretty much blew my Saturday. I sold them, but I probably ended up getting paid minimum wage for it. Ugly.

-Moo

dino001

Yes, they will, but the competition will be only on "National" level. It's already here, yet you still have Almost all of them setting prices at unrealistic levels, which later they have to modify with incentives.

As much as I used to think factory direct was the way to go, I don't think that anymore. They are good in building things, but it takes completely different set of skills to sell them and provide post-sale service.

With current system you have competition between retailers of the same brand for the same customer. Can be pain in the neck for them, but it does have advantages for us, consumers. With factory direct sales there is no guarantee that the "fat" (if any - remeber large organizations have amazing ability to squander any amount of money and justify any expense) trimmed from middle man would be passed on the consumer. As I mentioned to to HP's website and compare their prices with your local Best Buy, CompUSA or Office Depot prices. I even had some special extra discount from my employer - still CompUSA came way cheaper.

im_brentwood

Why in god's name if any business controlled the retail sales channels of their products would they dicker over pricing?

Here's an example! I opened up a BMW repair shop in NJ and am opening another one, same name, in NY City.

An Inspection 2 for, say, a 1995 325i is going to be $399 plus tax at either location. A Synthetic oil change is going to be $69, at either location.

I can see it now, you walk into Downtown Chevrolet and ask how much a new, I dunno, Malibu LS is. "$23,250, right there on the window" says the salesperson. "But I want a better price, I'll check with Northern Chevrolet" you say...

"Knock yourself out" says the salesperson, "All Chevrolet stores are corporate owned now and pricing is fixed".

I would bet my life on it... like I said elsewhere, The value of every GM dealer in this country, including used car inventory, parts inventory, fixed assets, REAL ESTATE, etc.. is quite likely a larger number than GM itself.

That alone makes it unrealistic to ever see happening... to say nothing of the value of, say, Lexus, Toyota, Mercedes, etc dealerships... SEVEN years ago I know of a large Honda and a large Toyota store selling, lock stock and two smoking barrels, in Orlando (Jimmy Bryan) for close to ONE HUNDRED MILLION!

And Jimmy Bryan Toyota wasn't the biggest Toyota store in Orlando... still isn't.

These days a million bucks buys ya a small domestic store in a tiny market without the dirt.

im_brentwood

Ahh.. I been busy. Took some time away from the car biz.. also got REAL sick, beat Stage 3 cancer!

Heck, if I could deal with Snurple I can beat anything!

bolivar

50 something messages and we have several 'frontline' stories. Even one from isell.

You guys just needed to be whipped up, just like your sales managers do.

And, I can't provide a story, because I'm a buyer. And the last buyer story I contributed included some questionable salesman processes, and wasn't accepted well in here.

imidazol97

>REAL sick, beat Stage 3

Congratulations. That's great.

british_rover

Oh man glad you are doing ok. I almost lost my mom to cancer about 15 years ago and then she had a flare up again 5 or 6 years ago. It is just so rough on everyone really wears you down.

mackabee

I been there done the chemo (twice). Glad to see you back. What kind of cancer? Mackabee

isellhondas

Hey, it really IS you!

Welcome back! Snurple has been gone for years and his "replacements" are nothing!

Really glad to hear you are doing better health wise. Sounds like a whole bunch of no fun. I hope you stick around!

thenebean

brentwood,

i don't think we ever posted at the same time (though I've read many of your posts as i would read through archives and the like). I am glad to hear you are doing well, and that you beat cancer. welcome back!!

-thene

lilengineerboy

This particular forum is like the internet version of the neighborhood bar. Its mostly a bunch of regulars and storytellers with the occasionally newbie thrown in. Pretty neat.

madmanmoo

Who's the regular drunk?

-Moo

lrguy44

Careful Moo, there just might be a mirror in the showrrom - Join us in a beer?

greanpea68

I'll take a Grey Goose dirty Martini with Bue chese olives when you get a chance :P

greanpea68

Do you guys have Nissan hats and t-shirts around like in a display case? Any kind of display with accessories for sale at the dealership?

Of course we do. The only word I'll have for him is NO!

lrguy44

Sorry, I only do pop tops

british_rover

Man you are are particular aren't you. :P

I prefer a HOT and dirty martini with pepper vodka and a pickled jalapeño pepper.

But my favorite drink is a Margarita on the rocks with a little salt on the class. You have to use añejo tequila, a splash of Grand Mariner, an ounce or two of fresh lime juice and a splash of fresh orange juice. Put a wedge of lime on the glass and you are done.

Kirstie_H

Bombay Sapphire G&T w/a lime wedge, or a spicy Bloody Mary, celery stick mandatory.

However, if you're buying, I'll be less picky So where's the official "sales stories" happy hour, again?

greanpea68

Mack you were right in what I was trying to say...

Jip... What I am trying to say is that there will be no competition with each manufacturer itself... They will have there MSRP and that will be the price. There will also be no deals below invoice. They might have rebates or special APR's. But I don't think they would discount anything untill the new product came out.

What I mean by competition is that lets say in Boston there are 15 dealers. Each dealer is in competition. You wouldn't be able to go to three dealers to see who is giving the best price. There would be one Nissan outlet and that would be the price. You get a better deal now because when you say I'm going to shop your price I might give you a deal now that would save you thousands instead of buying direct. Reasons for that are many. One reason is say when a dealer has a car that has been on their lot for say 6 months and they are paying a reserve on that car at say 2% every month they might advetise that car at $300 below hold back or maybe even more to move the car.

If a manufacturer already owns the car they are not paying a bank to have it sit on there lot. So that is one reason why if you can understand that.

You ask about competition between manufacturers. There is always competition, the way they are built, waranties, rebates etc.. so that I would say already exists.

You also say that when manufacturers do national add campains on leases that they do them at sticker. I'm not sure about other manifacturers but I believe they all follow the same suit. I know that when Nissan does it they give lease numbers at a discounted price ussualy a couple hundred above invoice. I'm sure Moo can back me on that. So like I said before if you look at the national add for Altima $2999 down+t,t,l your at $229/mo. My store advertising the same car is at $199/mo with same money down.

I hope this helps you understand what I'm trying to say.