When I was going to school I worked in a gas station and I had to deal with some nasty cannister oil filters! Unless everything got lined up just right, they would leak and make a mess.
I remember on the V-8 Chevys, you could convert them to a spin on filter and we did this pretty often.
I have done a few of those canister to spin on conversions myself.
The only advantage I can see is that it is easy to see what kind of shape your oil is in. I would love for someone from BMW or Merc to come on and explain their reasons for using the canister filters.
On some of the ones I have seen, if you put the o-ring in the threads instead of where it's supposed to go, it will snap itself into the correct location when you tighten the canister. I'd say they're more leak-resistant now.
Also, I think some of the manufacturers have touted an environmental benefit to using the cartridge-style oil filter due to the fact that they don't hold oil and they don't use a casing, but that fails to account for the newspaper and few dozen paper towels you have to use to clean up the cartridge and work area (of course, that's also the case with some spin-on designs as well)...
The only advantage I can see is that it is easy to see what kind of shape your oil is in. I would love for someone from BMW or Merc to come on and explain their reasons for using the canister filters.
I think you and isell are confusing the old under-the-car canisters(which often leaked and WERE difficult to change) with the modern systems that are mounted on the topside of the engine. The current BMW filter system is quick and simple to change-and does not leak. I'll take Munich's solution over a conventional spin-on filter every time.
The one VW put on the VR6 engine was an under-the-car canister with a small drain plug in the middle. The Volvo S80 2.9 also uses an under-the-car canister with no drain plug and a cup at the bottom that will be full of hot oil when you lower the filter.
I still use Wal-mart, but I watch them like a hawk and make sure it's all done correctly. I don't like dealing with the waste once I am done.
bigal,
Since you ran a Wal-Mart shop in a previous life, you would know better than most what to watch. If they would let me in the shop area I think I could watch them pretty good myself but why torture yourself if you can DIY or take it to a place you can trust.
As far as the waste is concerned, several auto parts stores in my area will take used oil and tranny fluid but not anti-freeze.
I've found it is actually more convenient to do it myself when you consider the time spent taking it in (or worse yet dropping it off then going back to get it), waiting and then driving home, even though it's only a couple miles from the homestead. Being a DIYer I don't have to wonder if they used the right oil/filter and their workmanship in general plus I get a chance to neb around under there to see if I can detect any problems. So far I've been successful.
I know some day I won't be able to do this (hope it's not anytime soon) so then I'll be in the same boat as most car owners but until then I'm holding on for dear life to my independence. However, every time I go to do this, the wifee says, "haven't you grown up yet"? I don't even respond to this anymore.
Call me a hold-out,
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Our small, quality city has a tank in a small building at the city service garage for people to come up, pour in their waste oils, and toss the containers into trash cans.
I fish the trash cans for 4 and 5 quart containers with solid screw on lids and keep a couple at home to pour my waste oil into. I take mine to the disposal, pour it in, and bring home containers that I like. Handling the waste oil is not a problem to me. I've done it since I was 10 or so on the farm. I like doing the mechanical work. I understand that some people just don't like that, or don't want to do it themselves.
I use the cars' screw jack to slightly lift the right side to make a little more room underneath to get at the oil plug and then the filter by the front wheel. I used to do it without raising the car; not as agile as I used to be.
A relative with a diesel TDI VW purchased a pump that takes the oil out the top. His setup is a messy one to work on apparently.
I have 3-4 cases of the oil that I like purchased with rebates or on sales; same for filters. I have room in the 2.75 car garage to keep my "stock."
Ah yes the dreaded PZ-31 oil filter. Just so, so stupid of GM. Only some early 4-Tech motors used that design the rest used a traditional spin on mounted to the passenger side rear of the engine.
You are right that some of them had no drain plug at all just a 5 or so inch across revolving, threaded pie plate like thing that had a huge 15/16ths or so nut on it. Most of the 3.5-4 quarts of oil came out at once and then you had to pry the oil filter out of the oil pan with some pliers. Once you pulled it out another .25 of a quart or so came out.
Around Memphis Wal-Mart does a full service oil and filter change with name brand oil for about $20. Jiffy Lube or Valvoline Instant Oil Change change runs a Monday-Friday 7am-9am $19.99 "Early Bird" special. I can leave home 20 minutes early, get my oil changed and still get to work on time. (5 qts max. dino bulk of course).
Around here oil changes usually run around $30.00. Every other monday we have a mobile oil change place come to our office parking lot. Just park next to it give them your keys make your payment and at the end of the day stop by building security to pick up your keys. Can't be any more convienent that that.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
...Just park next to it give them your keys make your payment and at the end of the day stop by building security to pick up your keys. Can't be any more convienent that that.
Now that's what I call CONVENIENT.
I never heard of this type of service. As long as you're satisfied with the product and the workmanship, this is a great way to have it done.
Maybe I'm the one that should move.
Please, no wisenheimer comments,
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Wal-Mart does a full service oil and filter change with name brand oil for about $20. Jiffy Lube or Valvoline Instant Oil Change change runs a Monday-Friday 7am-9am $19.99 "Early Bird" special.
We offer 10 oil/filter changes for $149 if you pre-pay. Its a loss leader for us but we do it to bring folks back to the dealerships serv. department on a regular basis. It's a great deal and even our employees buy it for their own cars. I'm surprised more dealers don't do something like this...
My old boss at my old shop used to do something like that years ago before he opened his shop. It can be a very profitable business in the right areas.
When I bought my Mazda 6 back in 2003, they gave me a nifty pewter keychain with the Mazda logo and the dealerships name and phone number on it. Also they gave me an acrylic coffee mug with a bag of Starbucks coffee.
Also, they did not put a dealer sticker on the car. Instead, they went with a nice license plate frame.
Also, they did not put a dealer sticker on the car. Instead, they went with a nice license plate frame.
Feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but I have never seen a dealership on the west coast put dealership stickers on their cars, but they always have a custom license plate frame. Personally I would be put off if a dealership put a sticker on my car, it is not like they give you a discount for advertising for them.
Those dealer stickers are so easy to get off. They peel right off with no affect on the paint I have ever seen - IF you take them off right away and don't leave them sit for YEARS.
I had heard that the 4 cylinder Mazda 6s had a canister style filter but I never worked on one. Back when I was in service only the 6 cylinder cars were out and about yet.
Hasn't anyone made an interesting sale lately? Here's something that happened in my household yesterday.
My wife has been bugging me about re-painting our house interior. For the most part, we don't agree on colors. Well yesterday, she said that she really liked the color on one area of our cat.
She was going to the paint store to get more color swatches. I told her to take the cat with her to see if they could match it. She didn't bite, but that could've be a good sales story for the paint guy?
> You wouldn't need that much cat to get a color sample from.
This is just a brilliant line regardless :-)
But if you did decide to do this, make sure the cat isn't one whose furs are individually striped (like a tabby cat), because you might end up with the underneath color instead of the top color, or with some mixed-up inbetween color.
I still use Wal-mart, but I watch them like a hawk and make sure it's all done correctly. I don't like dealing with the waste once I am done.
Have 3 different brands of vehicles and have oil changes at respective new car dealerships. One thing that I notice is that each of them always puts more oil in than is needed. When looking at dipstick next morning (car on level garage floor) oil is always beyond the "full" mark, sometimes more than just a smidge. I have spoken to a service writer at each dealership and they insist that their techs are properly using the bulk oil fill/meter system. They say that their meters are accurate. I wonder if the meters are calibrated by the same companies that sell the bulk oil to the dealers.
One thing about going to dealerships for oil changes is that one can then wander into the salesroom to check out current offerings and chat with salespersons if they are not busy.
Come on, someone out there has to have a story about a recent deal or customer. No one has run across a customer trading a big SUV who demanded over KBB? Nobody has started screaming when you told them they were $15,000 upside down in their car? No kooky customers demanding a huge discount off a hot selling car? No trades that smelled like rotting fish? No customers test driving cars like they stole them, telling you they're not going back to prison?
Customer comes in and drives and 06 Honda Odyssey. Customer leaves and then comes back with the spouse. Drive odyssey two more times.Spouse says "before you buy are you sure you like the color,features etc...(answer yes).Customer signs on dotted line and spends 45min with sales rep on the delivery.customer is 100% happy from hello to goodbye.
Three days later customer calls manufacturer and tells them they were lied to and pressured into buying a car they didn't want nor could afford.Then customer came to dealer and had a major blow out on showroom floor.Customer wanted money back and to return the odyssey. Dealer said no but would trade out for the pilot customer claims they ask for.
Note. Dealer did not ask customer to buy the Odyssey. Customer came to the dealer and asked dealer to sell one of their Odysseys to them (the customer)
Customers even when in the wrong still think the dealer owes them something.
Customer has obviously learned that blustering, bullying, belligerence, and even outright lying will enable him to get his own way.
As I don't behave like that I'm ill equipped to deal with people that do, which is why I don't have a job in sales. I take my hat off to any of you that can deal with that, and still go home in a relaxed frame of mind.
No customers test driving cars like they stole them
Well, I wasn't driving it like I *stole* it, but apparently 85-90 is faster than most people test drive their cars. This was in an xA.
This was, at least, on the freeway, and I wasn't too far off the norm of traffic for that time of day.
I didn't see the salesman actually clutching at anything or turning pale, but he did say that I was driving at about the max he's ever taken a test drive with. (I say I was just doing the next buyer a favor, by helping with the break-in. You're supposed to vary speeds for the first 1k miles anyway... )
Here you have to go up to 80-85 to run with traffic on the interstate. How am I going to know if I still have passing power at those speeds without taking it up to 90-95? With something like an xA that doesn't have a ton of surplus hp, this is something a buyer might legitimately need to know.
Good grief, it ain't like we're talking about piloting a '60s Buick down a curvy two lane road at those speeds.
If someone wants to drive 90-95 they can do it AFTER they buy the car. I'm not about to let some reckless driver get me killed doing something stupid and driving that fast IS stupid. I don't care where you live!
And I will say this....we have people do some dumb thngs test driving cars and these people rarely buy!
I have never had a salesman even seem to slightly care about going 90mph. That speed is safe in modern cars on modern interstates - likely far safer than going around the speed limit on a two-lane undivided highway.
Try arguing "speed does not equal recklessness" when you get the ticket for going 25 mph above the speed limit. Where I live (in Northern Virginia), that's an automatic "reckless driving" ticket with big fine attached.
Yeah VA is the Speeding [non-permissible content removed] state. I guess we can think The unesteemed Former Gov. Gilmore for that.
The modern highway system was originaly designed with speeds of around 80 mph in mind but that was with much lighter traffic loads then they see today.
Yeah VA is the Speeding [non-permissible content removed] state.
I used to commute monthly between Petersburg, VA and Nashville, TN on a monthly basis. I have to admit that I did not care if VA enforced the speed laws as it was not uncommon to see vehicles on I-85/95 at 100 mph ... when the limit was 55 MPH.
Comments
When I was going to school I worked in a gas station and I had to deal with some nasty cannister oil filters! Unless everything got lined up just right, they would leak and make a mess.
I remember on the V-8 Chevys, you could convert them to a spin on filter and we did this pretty often.
The only advantage I can see is that it is easy to see what kind of shape your oil is in. I would love for someone from BMW or Merc to come on and explain their reasons for using the canister filters.
Also, I think some of the manufacturers have touted an environmental benefit to using the cartridge-style oil filter due to the fact that they don't hold oil and they don't use a casing, but that fails to account for the newspaper and few dozen paper towels you have to use to clean up the cartridge and work area (of course, that's also the case with some spin-on designs as well)...
I think you and isell are confusing the old under-the-car canisters(which often leaked and WERE difficult to change) with the modern systems that are mounted on the topside of the engine. The current BMW filter system is quick and simple to change-and does not leak. I'll take Munich's solution over a conventional spin-on filter every time.
I also prefer the top-side systems.
bigal,
Since you ran a Wal-Mart shop in a previous life, you would know better than most what to watch. If they would let me in the shop area I think I could watch them pretty good myself but why torture yourself if you can DIY or take it to a place you can trust.
As far as the waste is concerned, several auto parts stores in my area will take used oil and tranny fluid but not anti-freeze.
I've found it is actually more convenient to do it myself when you consider the time spent taking it in (or worse yet dropping it off then going back to get it), waiting and then driving home, even though it's only a couple miles from the homestead. Being a DIYer I don't have to wonder if they used the right oil/filter and their workmanship in general plus I get a chance to neb around under there to see if I can detect any problems. So far I've been successful.
I know some day I won't be able to do this (hope it's not anytime soon) so then I'll be in the same boat as most car owners but until then I'm holding on for dear life to my independence. However, every time I go to do this, the wifee says, "haven't you grown up yet"? I don't even respond to this anymore.
Call me a hold-out,
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Give me one of each.
Now, go peddle your wares elsewhere.
What a nut,
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Our small, quality city has a tank in a small building at the city service garage for people to come up, pour in their waste oils, and toss the containers into trash cans.
I fish the trash cans for 4 and 5 quart containers with solid screw on lids and keep a couple at home to pour my waste oil into. I take mine to the disposal, pour it in, and bring home containers that I like. Handling the waste oil is not a problem to me. I've done it since I was 10 or so on the farm. I like doing the mechanical work. I understand that some people just don't like that, or don't want to do it themselves.
I use the cars' screw jack to slightly lift the right side to make a little more room underneath to get at the oil plug and then the filter by the front wheel. I used to do it without raising the car; not as agile as I used to be.
A relative with a diesel TDI VW purchased a pump that takes the oil out the top. His setup is a messy one to work on apparently.
I have 3-4 cases of the oil that I like purchased with rebates or on sales; same for filters. I have room in the 2.75 car garage to keep my "stock."
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
You are right that some of them had no drain plug at all just a 5 or so inch across revolving, threaded pie plate like thing that had a huge 15/16ths or so nut on it. Most of the 3.5-4 quarts of oil came out at once and then you had to pry the oil filter out of the oil pan with some pliers. Once you pulled it out another .25 of a quart or so came out.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Now that's what I call CONVENIENT.
I never heard of this type of service. As long as you're satisfied with the product and the workmanship, this is a great way to have it done.
Maybe I'm the one that should move.
Please, no wisenheimer comments,
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Are they there when workers arrive? How do they get the keys and payment?
Do they use a van, trailer, ????
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
We offer 10 oil/filter changes for $149 if you pre-pay. Its a loss leader for us but we do it to bring folks back to the dealerships serv. department on a regular basis. It's a great deal and even our employees buy it for their own cars. I'm surprised more dealers don't do something like this...
They are usually there between 6:30 and 7:00 so they are there when most people arrive.
How do they get the keys and payment?
Drop the keys off with them and make payment right there and then.
Do they use a van, trailer, ????
Its a very large trailer that is open on one side and cars can be driven onto it for service.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Also, they did not put a dealer sticker on the car. Instead, they went with a nice license plate frame.
Feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but I have never seen a dealership on the west coast put dealership stickers on their cars, but they always have a custom license plate frame. Personally I would be put off if a dealership put a sticker on my car, it is not like they give you a discount for advertising for them.
-brian
My wife has been bugging me about re-painting our house interior. For the most part, we don't agree on colors. Well yesterday, she said that she really liked the color on one area of our cat.
She was going to the paint store to get more color swatches. I told her to take the cat with her to see if they could match it.
2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Limited Velvet Red over Wicker Beige
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
Probably just cut out a quarter to half inch patch of fur should do it.
This is just a brilliant line regardless :-)
But if you did decide to do this, make sure the cat isn't one whose furs are individually striped (like a tabby cat), because you might end up with the underneath color instead of the top color, or with some mixed-up inbetween color.
ahhh shucks....
Have 3 different brands of vehicles and have oil changes at respective new car dealerships. One thing that I notice is that each of them always puts more oil in than is needed. When looking at dipstick next morning (car on level garage floor) oil is always beyond the "full" mark, sometimes more than just a smidge. I have spoken to a service writer at each dealership and they insist that their techs are properly using the bulk oil fill/meter system. They say that their meters are accurate. I wonder if the meters are calibrated by the same companies that sell the bulk oil to the dealers.
One thing about going to dealerships for oil changes is that one can then wander into the salesroom to check out current offerings and chat with salespersons if they are not busy.
Come on, someone out there has to have a story about a recent deal or customer. No one has run across a customer trading a big SUV who demanded over KBB?
Nobody has started screaming when you told them they were $15,000 upside down in their car?
No kooky customers demanding a huge discount off a hot selling car?
No trades that smelled like rotting fish?
No customers test driving cars like they stole them, telling you they're not going back to prison?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Cats don't mind having their fur trimmed. Try giving one a bath, on the other hand...
Three days later customer calls manufacturer and tells them they were lied to and pressured into buying a car they didn't want nor could afford.Then customer came to dealer and had a major blow out on showroom floor.Customer wanted money back and to return the odyssey. Dealer said no but would trade out for the pilot customer claims they ask for.
Note. Dealer did not ask customer to buy the Odyssey. Customer came to the dealer and asked dealer to sell one of their Odysseys to them (the customer)
Customers even when in the wrong still think the dealer owes them something.
2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Limited Velvet Red over Wicker Beige
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
Be careful...keep that story quiet....or the neighbors might begin thinking you're starting a "cat house".
As I don't behave like that I'm ill equipped to deal with people that do, which is why I don't have a job in sales. I take my hat off to any of you that can deal with that, and still go home in a relaxed frame of mind.
Well, I wasn't driving it like I *stole* it, but apparently 85-90 is faster than most people test drive their cars. This was in an xA.
This was, at least, on the freeway, and I wasn't too far off the norm of traffic for that time of day.
I didn't see the salesman actually clutching at anything or turning pale, but he did say that I was driving at about the max he's ever taken a test drive with. (I say I was just doing the next buyer a favor, by helping with the break-in. You're supposed to vary speeds for the first 1k miles anyway...
If you didn't, I would have asked you to pull over and trade places with me.
Does that work both ways, for when you're the next buyer? :confuse:
Good grief, it ain't like we're talking about piloting a '60s Buick down a curvy two lane road at those speeds.
Anyway, did you buy the car?
If someone wants to drive 90-95 they can do it AFTER they buy the car. I'm not about to let some reckless driver get me killed doing something stupid and driving that fast IS stupid. I don't care where you live!
And I will say this....we have people do some dumb thngs test driving cars and these people rarely buy!
Around here they are much less linent. If I was with someone driving like that it would be my job.
I have never had a salesman even seem to slightly care about going 90mph. That speed is safe in modern cars on modern interstates - likely far safer than going around the speed limit on a two-lane undivided highway.
Try arguing "speed does not equal recklessness" when you get the ticket for going 25 mph above the speed limit. Where I live (in Northern Virginia), that's an automatic "reckless driving" ticket with big fine attached.
Perhaps. Perhaps not. But it is illegal. End of story.
Time to get back on topic.
tidester, host
The modern highway system was originaly designed with speeds of around 80 mph in mind but that was with much lighter traffic loads then they see today.
I used to commute monthly between Petersburg, VA and Nashville, TN on a monthly basis. I have to admit that I did not care if VA enforced the speed laws as it was not uncommon to see vehicles on I-85/95 at 100 mph ... when the limit was 55 MPH.