Stories from the Sales Frontlines

ilovetrailers

continued from above---
I finally got a price on the Camry but by that time it was getting late and the salesman probably figured we were tire kickers. In order to dispell that notion we gave him a credit application and told him we were interested in both cars. The credit report came back fine and we told him that we would call back the next day. The price on the Camry was out of line so I wanted to go home and see if my numbers were off. I also had to do some research on the Prius.

Monday morning I called the first dealership and told him that I was interested in two vehicles. The salesman acted like he had gone to heaven, and wanted to know the prices that I was quoted. I obviously gave him the price I was willing to pay less a small dickering charge. Next I asked about doc fees and he said that they would show them on the sale, but they would adjust the price. I told him that I was calling dealership # 2 and see what they would do. He was not excited about that, but he was civil.
Called dealership # 2 and spoke with the salesman about purchasing both cars as wife and I liked the colors. Asked him for price and he asked me what I had gotten from the other dealership so I told him. He still tried to push me into one or the other car. Not very interested in selling me the "HOT" Prius. He called me back in few minutes and matched price. We were ready to buy at that time because he had spent a couple of hours with us, whereas the other salesman had spent several minutes with me. This was wife's call. (See post above for "wise man" saying).
Asked about doc fee and he told me everybody paid them and they weren't negotiable. Asked if they would at least reduce the price on one of the cars because I wasn't happy having to pay on both. I really liked the colors. He said no way. As a note--their doc fees were almost 4 times higher than dealer #1.

I can't understand why a dealer would lose a sale(or 2) over a doc fee. I have never paid a doc fee and this is my 52nd and 53rd new vehicle. Figure i've lost half a million in depreciation less write offs

Needless to say we are picking up cars from dealership #1 next week. Prius must really be hot as we have to wait till her color comes in.

Dealership also set up financing so that I got 3.9 for 60 months on Camry and owed nothing on Prius. I owed nothing on trade and put cash down

driver100

Asked about doc fee and he told me everybody paid them and they weren't negotiable.

Everyone who buys a car from "him" might pay the doc fee....the other people, like you, walk. He wasn't working with you, so he lost the sale. He might have got the sale if he gave you a price, and just worked in the doc fee.

Great story (and actually on topic).

nortsr1

Bro-in-law wanted a new 2009 Honda CRV in Tango red (his wife's one and only one color).I went on the net and Emailed my local Honda dealer (after checking their inventory to make sure they had and EXL Tango red AWD) as to a price after giving him the Vin#. He came back with exact "invoice" price as listed at Edmunds.
I then went to the dealership and set up every thing for the bro-in-law.They had an ADM of $250.00 for mud flaps and locking lug nut. I did not say anything as bro-in-law was trading in a 1997 Volvo S70 with 170,000 miles.They had bought it used with 50,000 miles on it). I told him he probably would get anywhere from $500.00 to $1000.00 if "lucky" .
Set up an appointment for the next day. Bro-in-law and wife and I go to dealer and they offer $1000.00 for the Volvo. O.K., we agree.
Now I tell salesman we do not want the ADM and will not pay the 299.00 doc fee. or we walk. After a twenty minute wait they agree to "lower " the selling price to
$500.00 less than the invoice price. O.K. Deal closed and bro-in-law gets his new (or should I say his wife gets her new CRV.
Forgot to mention financing. Bro-in-law got a $20,000 credit union check and wrote a personal check for the balance with a 4.7% rate. The dealer rate was 5.9%
Bro-in-law was happy with the deal I got for him, as he would have been clubbed like a "baby seal", as he is not up on car purchasing. To show his appreciation,
he took us out to a great seafood dinner at "Capt. Cats" . Lobster tail, steamed shrimp with Old Bay" and steamed clams.
Also forgot to mention that I took a price printout from one of the internet dealer extended warranty sites. ( I believe it was $970.00 for the 8 yr. 100,000 mile warranty). F&I would not match it' so bro-in-law will purchase from Saccucci Honda, as they will keep the CRV for at least 8 years and they only drive about 11000miles/year.
That concludes my story from the sales front lines. I am sure the dealer probably had a "mfg. to dealer incentive" and we both felt satisfied with the deal (dealer and us).
NORTSR

traindriver

The dealers are not stupid. Try to pay with a check, and more often than not, they will wait for the check to clear before they let you drive off with the car.

I have always been able to write a check and drive away. It may depend though on your credit rating and a little "profiling" by the dealer, though.

I flew from South Carolina to South Florida and wrote a $5000 check for the down payment on the car we got last week. The check was drawn on an internet money market account from a Utah based bank. I don't think they even looked at the check and certainly didn't verify it.
I did take copies of my most recent statement as well as statements from other accounts just in case I needed them to help prove I was "good for it" but no one asked and I didn't volunteer.

This is common practice in my area but I wasn't expecting it to work on a long distance transaction -- certainly not in S. Florida, which isn't a small town, good ol' boy kind of place IMO.

Contrast that with the fact that a check from the same account was refused at Pep Boys in Atlanta a few months ago. I had about $250 worth of work done to the old jalopy that I keep down there when I am in town for work. The check processing company said that it was flagged as potentially fraudulent since I never had written a check that large to one of their clients before. True, since it was only about the 5th check I have written on the account ever. :sick: :mad:
If the work hadn't already been done, I'd have told them to stick it _______ . They accepted my credit card without even looking at the name on it. :confuse: :mad:

lrguy44

We used to accept checks from customers and never had a problem - until a few years ago. A women who said she was a real estate agent came in with her 11 year old daughter several times and finally picked out a $75k vehicle and wrote a check. To make a long story short, she stopped payment the next day. By the time the car was found over 2000 miles away, we had discovered she had done the same thing to several other dealers. We were left with a "miled up" vehicle while she gets 3 squares a day compliments of the state. We will still take checks from repeat customers, but for new customers we can do one of 3 things. Wire transfers, go to the bank with them to get the counter check or do a back up finance contract (with credit check).
Problem solved..

mikefm58

Wow, I am surprised at the number of dealers that accept personal checks. I thought the only dealers that would do this, had the ability to clear the check immediately. The last time I wrote a check for a vehicle, which was about $14K, they said they had to verify the check while we signed all the paperwork, then handed the check back to me after it cleared.

jipster

I took my MPV (ZOOM ZOOM) in for a trans. fluid flush the other day. I told my service advisor that my coolant level was a tad low and if they could add a bit during the full circle inspection. No problem he says. Well, I get home and the guy had filled it all the way up to just under the cap in the coolant resevior.... probably a half gallon too much. I'm thinking isell put the word out on the street about a guy from Louisville with a MPV calling service technicians "grease monkeys"... and this guy is wanting some pay back. Does isell have this kind of power, or am I being paranoid again?

Also, the brake dust fairies must have paid a visit to my MPV and crazy glued some dust back onto my pads. As you recall, this same dealership said I needed new brakes about 6 months ago.... which I declined. On their their full circle inspection report the bakes were rated as "good". I just love when my vehicles fix themselves, saves me a lot of money. :P

Kirstie_H

http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/WebX/.ef465cf/640

New member who emailed hosts looking for advice... truly overwhelmed. If some of you could pop in and help, that'd be great - I'm sure follow-up questions are needed!

lrguy44

can't understand why a dealer would lose a sale(or 2) over a doc fee. I have never paid a doc fee and this is my 52nd and 53rd new vehicle

He may have been at the bottom on profit and could not absorb the doc fee into the deal. One charged - all charged.

roadburner

I wrote a personal check for my MS3, but I had also given the salesman my Visa card info for a deposit since they had to have the car with the color I wanted trucked from Cleveland to Cincinnati.

lrguy44

We will take a Visa for a deposit but it is no good for purchase. Even if the credit limit is OK it can easily have the charge cancelled by the consumer. Not to mention the fees attached.

mikefm58

He may have been at the bottom on profit and could not absorb the doc fee into the deal. One charged - all charged.

Especially here in Florida - home of the $899 doc. fee :sick:. And if they don't at least write it up on the invoice as being charged then they may open themself up to being sued because certain ethnic groups may have had a higher percentage of being charged the fee :sick:.

speterson1

Get this one - back in 2001 when we were buying our Subaru Forester we worked out a cash deal with our salesman. However, since we were taking delivery about a week later (they had to install a CD player and a couple other options) I was going to put down $500 to hold the car, so I whipped out my Mastercard. Dealership said no dice - they don't take credit cards. They would take a personal check. I couldn't believe it and since we didn't have the checkbook with us I had to stop by a day later to give them their check.

Why wouldn't they take the card? Isn't that infinitely more guaranteed (from their end) than a personal check? Always thought that was weird...

lrguy44

A check is more viable because they can verify funds, hammer it (go to your bank and cash it immediately) and cannot be cancelled as easy as a credit card - but it does surprise me they would not take a card for the deposit.

Kirstie_H

No kidding. Seems simple - if the transaction is cancelled, hold goes away. No one really loses much, except time, which can be lost by anyone at just about any point in the deal. At least a deposit indicates that the buyer is most likely serious.

joel0622

Will u as a dealer trust me if I say,I will take delivery today ,,take home the car and then give u a check tomorrow ?I don`t think so and any GM who does this is setting himself for trouble and potential financial disaster.

Do it all day every day. We take a personal check attatched to a prommissory note, and let you take the car with you. Standard business in our store. Those who don't do it are setting themselves up for potential financial disaster. In missed sales.

deltheking

I am not saying if the dealer accepts the check or not.The dealer can accept it with a promissory note as u said.
My query was--The customer takes delivery today,Drives the car to his house today--and says -he will come back tomorrow and then give u the check.No payment on the delivery day..He offers payment only on the next day.
So would u agree to that?

Kirstie_H

Again... no kidding! If a customer takes a vehicle home overnight, they're more likely to get accustomed to the idea that the car is "theirs," particularly if they left their old trade at the dealership. It's a lot harder to take that shiny, new-smelling car back to the dealership the next day and face the idea of taking home your old vehicle. That one has worked twice on me.

lrguy44

Of course not - would you let a 5 figure asset go down the road that way? Wired funds in hand, Let's go to your bank and cash the check or a promissory note with credit check are the only ways. So what's the point?

joel0622

If you sign the prommissory note and let us pull a 5 liner on you we will. But no we will not just pitch the keys to someone and say "hey see ya in the morning"

If you are out of state we get a full app and get the deal approved at the bank. The have you sign a contract. When you bring the check back we give you the contract

fezo

I had that - "see ya tomorrow" but it was a used car and indeed the trick was expecting me to get attached to it overnight. It worked! I loved the thing. I still think back kindly on that car. Was an 87 Maxima wagon bought in early 93. Other than the fact that it talked ("lights off," "Seat belt on," "your fly is open") it was just about perfect.

joel0622

"your fly is open"

I could have used that option on a couple of my cars in my younger days LOL

lrguy44

I remember the talking GM cars well. I had a business partner who was a computer geek. We seriously thought about reprogramming my ex-wife's car to have a very pointed greetng every time she started it.

fezo

I wonder if the voice on my car could have been changed. As it was it was a nice, pleasant, almost seductive sounding slightly Asian female voice. good thing I'm a married man....

boomchek

let you take the car with you. Standard business in our store. Those who don't do it are setting themselves up for potential financial disaster. In missed sales

My old Honda store was totally against spot deliveries. Even if a person brought in a certifed cashier's check backed up with a credit card deposit and perfect credit.

Their line was: "minimum of 24 hour turnaround time" which totally didn't make sense as customers who were excited to take their new car had to wait in line for it to get detailed at least a day.

The dealerships thinking was that this way the car would be perfect every time resulting in high ssi scores. Instead the scores were poor due to the long wait times and the cars were not perfect as expected because the detailers (minimum wage lot boys) were always behind that one day and didn't detail cars until last minute. :sick:

driver100

Why wouldn't they take the card? Isn't that infinitely more guaranteed (from their end) than a personal check?

A check, there won't be any additional fees for them to pay. But, on a credit card they are paying an additional 1.5 or 2% on a few $1000 - that could add up. Could be the difference between profit and loss on the sale.

fezo

You almost described my last purchase (well, last from a dealer anyway). They dragged things out saying they were detailing it and then the F&I lady kept us waiting - it was three hours between when we said we'd buy until we got through. I absolutely understand the " deal if I'm out of hear in an hour" theory.

snakeweasel

My last purchased we put down about 40% of the total cost by personal check. Since the funds for the car were in a different account I asked if they could hold it a day to give me time to transfer funds from one account to the other. The dealership had no problem with this,

jwilliams2

I think each dealer (or group) has their own policy on checks, based on their past experience. Once burned, twice shy....

lrguy44

Holding for a day or 2 is not a problem as long as the check is protected.

lrguy44

Amen. Too bad we have to learn the hard way

joel0622

I always say if you want to get out of the place quick either be there when the doors open so your the first one or 45 minutes before close cause were ready to go home. If you show up in the middle of the business day there are usually 5 or 6 people here all wanting to get out in an hour.

exb0

A month ago we purchased a CR-V, about three weeks after we turned a lemon Odyssey in. The CR-V had 7 miles on it, but according to the safety inspection sticker, it was received by the dealer in November. Needless to say the battery was a little weak and while we were in the F$I office, the salesman kept it running to recharge the battery.

My wife was approved by the Pentagon CU at 4%, so the dealer did a spot delivery with no deposit, just a promissory note to pay for the car in seven days. That was on Wednesday. The following Monday she was going out of town for a week, so Sunday was the only day she could pick up the check and take it to the dealer (CU is open 2-5 on Sundays). Around 2 on Sunday, she clicks the remote to open the door and it doesn’t open. The car battery is completely dead.

She calls the store and asks to speak to someone in charge. They put a SM on the phone, who after listening to what happened tells her: “Well ma'am, you were offered to purchase extended service plan, which you declined. That service plan comes with road side assistance…” After hearing that, my wife lit him up. Most of what she said is against forum rules to repeat here, but the conversation ended by her saying to come and pick this POS up because she is not paying for it. The SM called her back trying to convince her to call the tow truck and bring the CR-V in for service. She just tore him a new one again.

Five minutes later the GM calls and tells her: “Ma’am, whatever you do, you need to find alternative means of transportation and get that check to us because you are going out of town.” Her reply was: “I don’t have a vehicle because of your POS CR-V, and if it’s not fixed in time for me in time to get the check, you are not getting paid for it.” Twenty minutes later a tech (aka a Grease Monkey) pulls into our driveway in a fresh CR-V. He pulled the battery out of that one and put it into ours. The dealer got their check that day.

jipster

Twenty minutes later a tech (aka a Grease Monkey)

LOL. :P

roadburner

One of my fellow track geeks has a 330xi that his wife drives(he also has a 1998 M3 and a Triumph Bonneville). I asked him about it and his response was, "I refer to it as 'the truck'".

venture

I didn't think you would be happy with the xi. Glad you followed up.

jmonroe

He pulled the battery out of that one and put it into ours.

Did you leave out a step here? With no battery or a bad battery from your car now installed in the car he drove to your place; how did he get back to the dealership? :confuse: Only a good Grease Monkey would know how to do something like that.

jmonroe

mako1a

Jumper cables off the new batt and off he goes to deliver the Stanley Cup to the burg.

driver100

Jumper cables off the new batt and off he goes to deliver the Stanley Cup to the burg.

Hopefully the "grease monkey" gets the cables right and doesn't blow up both cars :sick:

driver100

deliver the Stanley Cup to the burg.

That was a really good game and you deserved to win......congratulations!

exb0

He brought a portable charger with him. Put the bad battery into his CR-V and charged it. Now some poor smock will end up buying a CR-V with a bad battery in it.

Come on, do I really need to spoon feed you every single detail?

jmonroe

...Stanley Cup to the burg

City of Champions...AGAIN. It's almost getting kinda old.

jmonroe

jmonroe

Come on, do I really need to spoon feed you every single detail?

Just wanted to know if you were payin attention. :P

jmonroe

greanpea68

Sometimes if someone has excellent credit over a 750 we will take a personal check at time of signing the contracts. This will ussualy save everyone one some time and keeps all people happy.

GP

greanpea68

This story really bothered me because it is incompetenance of the business manager to do something like that. Ussualy it is because the dealer is afraid of losing a deal that he tells the customer everything will be fine because the Finance manager thinks he has a great relationship with the bank and the bank will do him a favor....... Very bad practice of a dealer who is doing that!!!! If that happens to someone the dealer has to either take the vehicle back or eat the difference on the loan. As a customer your original contract was false. It is not final until the deal is approved by the bank. I can see a dealer trying to use some scare tactics but it is just BS.... The dealer is not trying to make extra money but said dealer has no respect to them selves or the customers if they are just hoping certain deals would get certain teir levels. A good business manager will know when they have something and when they are hoping. Any Finance manager or any sales person that is hoping something great will happen to keep the customer happy is plain old weak. I can only speak from dealerships practice. We don't deliver a car until the loan is approved and we have a insurance binder in house. That way there are no questions after you take delivery. It is funny to me these days..... Every wants the turn around time for delivery to be with in one hour. There is so much behind the scenes stuff that happens after you buy the vehicle that no one unless you are in the business understands.... I know we have talked about it in the past but it is what it is.

joel0622

payoffs

Here is a good link with a ton of payoff numbers. I use the heck out of it daily.

nick1958

Beware! If you visit the www.edmunds.com site, your contact information is being collected and sold to others! I have long been an enthusiastic fan of the Edmunds.com website. You cannot imagine my shock, anger, and outrage at what I learned about the website today.

We are starting the process of buying a new car. My first stop, as usual, was to the Edmunds website, during which I read various reviews of the models we are considering. I then went to the “pricing” sections to see what these different models cost.

Today we visited several dealers in our area (Honda and Toyota) to look at the cars. Upon giving my name to the “greeters” at these dealerships, I was shocked to learn that they already knew all about me! Apparently, Conicelli Toyota and Conicelli Honda (both of Conshohocken, Pennsylvania) had my name and e-mail address, and knew that I had visited the edmunds website looking into the Honda Civic, Accord, and Toyota Matrix. They had this information less than 24 hours after I visited the Edmunds.com site, and had even “pre-assigned” sales people to me!

I am absolutely outraged at this blatant violation of privacy. While it is common knowledge that web providers use a variety of spyware to surreptitiously and unethically gather information on visitors to their sites and then sell these data to others, this level of intrusion is disgraceful and offensive beyond belief. I could understand if I had specifically requested quotes from dealers that they would have my contact information. However, simply viewing information on the Edmunds site does not give permission for my name and contact information to be sold.

Beware! If you visit this site, your contact information is being collected and sold to others! This violation of privacy should be widely publicized and made known to all those who innocently use the site. Edmunds should be ashamed of themselves.

boomchek

Edmunds has millions of visitors every month. Maybe a few hundred thousand of those are registered Edmunds users that log in every time they use the site.

I personally find it hard to believe that every day, Edmunds would forward a list of thousands of names to every dealership in the country, hoping that one of those names will match up with someone walking into the showroom. That is unless you specifically checked off some sort of a box that says it's ok for a dealership to have your name on file because you will be visiting them soon.

I get a ton of email based requests for info on vehicles from consumers who email every dealership in the city, and when I call to follow up with them they claim no knowledge that they filled out contact forms, or forgot what they emailed about. Same goes with some people filling out credit applications who later deny they did so, and are not concerned that I have their personal info :confuse:

Even the logistics of managing such lists are difficult to comprehend. It's hard enough for dealerships to manage their own customer base in their computers, let alone databses and lists of some strangers who are out in cyberspace browsing around.

tidester

The Edmunds Automotive Network never provides information to third parties without your permission (see the Edmunds Privacy Statement).

Please note that you have, in fact, given permission for personal information to be shared under specific conditions in order that we may provide you with some of our services including the use of our dealer locator service. This should not come as a shock to you since you did agree to the Terms of Use when you signed on as we all do.

If you wish to discuss the matter further, please contact one of the hosts or use the "Contact Us" link at the bottom of this page as it is not particularly germane to this topic.

tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper

jb_turner

Nick1958,

For those dealers to know that much information about you someone who has access to your PC, login/password or even you would have had to agreed to something or gave this information up.