Boost warranty --- just offering a Camry like 5 year powertrain warranty isn't enough IMO. Malibu doesn't have Camry's quality image (as per Edmunds and everyone I talked to).
I'm okay if you keep buying GM vehicles - you are free to choose your next vehicle. But don't try to sell GM to me. After all, I learned a lot about GM's quality first hand since I owned 2 GM vehicles - this warranty isn't reason enough for me to switch back to GM.
GM has made significant progress on all fronts: Warranty repairs at dealers have decreased 40 percent during the past five years. So says GM. That's the point to be highlighted. Warranty repairs have decreased 40 percent during the past five years because they are experts at dening claims. Just because you have a warranty, does not mean that you can get warranty work done.
I have a file of can not duplicate, no problem found, and environmental issues that constantly deny warranty claims and work from being done.
They can give 1 million mile warranties for 25 years, but the secret to warranty work is getting by the service writers who are paid to say no.
Great statistics. Some customers may benefit as you explained. I won't benefit. And, therefore, I won't be even test-driving Aura (before I buy a midsize car next year). I'll go with Accord/ Altima/ Mazda6. Yes, I do like Mazda's 4 year bumper-to-bumper coverage and I like the Protege that I am going to trade in. Again, this is my opinion and EVERYONE IS FREE TO DIFFER.
I never had a problem. My service representative would even let me know something was wrong with my car of which I wasn't even aware and the problem was fixed under warranty.
Of course we are all free to differ. That is why this is called a forum for discussion. I admit that I am biased to GM and american owned companies. That is just me. I also worked there and have many family and friends supported by GM and the domestics. Also have some friends supported by the transplants (but not many).
I am also very data driven as I hope is obvious by my posts. I too have had problems with GM cars. An 82 Z28 was my first new car out of college when I was 21. What a piece of crap but god did I love it. All the issues were minor and were basically quality build issues. My new '84 corvette also had a lot of problems with quality build (BUT these were both first year cars so some leeway can be given) and I loved it even more. However my new cars in the last 6 years have all been great. My minivan never went back to the dealer except when I turned it in. Had a recall because the sliding door handle was supposedly designed so that if a child held onto it it could break their arm. What a joke recall. The new part did not allow you to wrap your fingers around it. My new Envoy is wonderful and does what I need it to do. No problems.
All I am saying is that the data is now different than 20 years ago. Believe it or not GM is not going out of business. There are some here that said they would be gone this year. bankrupt. Not going to happen. GM has downsized to be competitive at 25% of the NA market. It will stay there and may even get more as time goes on. Of course that is my opinion but I do have a bit more data than anyone in this forum.
Do not leave!! We need opinions here!!! I do agree that the warranty would have been much better with 7 years and all divisions getting 4 year/50k bumper to bumper. GM just looked at the competition and upped the ante. They decided not to take on the extra costs of even longer warranties.
Wagoner is not getting a kick. In 2 years he will be in the business schools as a study in how a large corporation was brought back from the brink of bankruptcy.
Just about 1 year ago I think it was said that this whole episode would be a Harvard study on how GM went bankrupt?
When my van is cold the automatic transmission shifts perfect. When it warms up, the shifting is sudden. In other words, when shifting from 1st to 2nd it hits hards with a big thud. Going from 2nd to 3rd gear it hardly noticable. Any ideas. I was also wondering if it could be the transfer case (all wheel drive). Thanks, Chris
General Motors plans to increase production at its Lordstown, Ohio, plant, which builds the Chevrolet Cobalt, a flier sent by UAW Local 1112 shows.
The flier, sent to members of the Lordstown local, says management has indicated it may increase production of the 2007 Cobalt by 24,000 units. A GM insider confirms GM will add two Saturdays of overtime in September and three in October. GM also plans to add some daily overtime to the two-shift plant.
On straight time, the plant builds 63 cars an hour, the GM source says. It builds Cobalt sedans and the entry-level Pontiac G5 (sold in Canada as the Pursuit and in Mexico as the G4). GM started production of the G5 in early June. Pontiac has sold 191 G5s so far.
Cobalt sales through August were up 9.8 percent, to 163,343 vehicles, compared with the year-ago period.
General Motors CEO Rick Wagoner today said the automaker had made "progress with all the constituents" in talks involving its bankrupt former subsidiary Delphi Corp. and unions representing its work force.
"We've made progress very quickly. I remain optimistic and hopeful to reach a deal as quickly as possible," Wagoner told reporters. "There are a million strings on this deal. ... It tends to make it a lot more complicated, but we're making a lot of progress with all the constituents."
GM, Delphi and its unions are trying to negotiate a new labor contract to avoid a court ruling that could lead to a union strike. Analysts have said a strike at Delphi could shut down GM's North American operations and force it to burn through billions of dollars a week.
The court in August granted Delphi's request to delay hearings until Sept. 18, giving the parties more time to negotiate.
"We continue to meet with all of the parties: the unions, the statutory committees and GM," Delphi spokesman Lindsey Williams said. "While we are making progress, we still have work to do. We are looking forward to making further progress."
GM has said it may have to spend $5.5 billion to $12 billion to help settle the Delphi labor issues. The automaker spun off Delphi in 1999, when it agreed to cover retiree and health-care costs for former GM workers if Delphi could not.
You're correct...thought I would have a little fun.
If people would actually take the trouble to read Consumer Reports, they would discover that the testers do say nice things about many Fords, and the Buick LaCrosse scores very well in the reliability surveys.
So the magazine must not hate ALL domestic vehicles.
This new warranty starts tomorrow morning. It has a zero deductible and is fully transferable to succeeding owners of the vehicle.
The 100,000 mile warranty covers 900 components including all powertrain parts. The 36,000 bumper to bumper warranty continues to be in place for everything else.
"We absolutely need the consumer to have as much confidence in us as we have in ourselves,'' Lutz wrote. GM warranty repairs have decreased 40 percent during the past five years....new warranty should help GM models retain more of their value when buyers resell them"
always look and act real for a while, only to be followed by another downfall. You are right that it looks like they are turning things around, certainly doing better than Ford in that regard.
But this warranty thing is a great idea and long overdue. Folks around here have been talking about that for a couple of years at least!
If they advertise this a lot, I bet it will lead to increased retail sales.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Don't care for Saturn SUV's, but I don't care for too many in general anyway. The Sky & Aura look fantastic to me. I haven't driven or looked at a Camcord in forever, and didn't drive the Aura, But I would definately check it out if in the market for that type of car. Seems like you can get a whole lot of car for the money. I did buy an 07 Ion3 Quad coupe. It looks fantastic, I think, with the body kit & perf package. The interior is very nice to me, it doesn't exactly scream "premium car", but it certainly isn't cheapo either. No complaints on fit & finish, and the parts that I actually touch on a regular basis feel good. Too bad GM crapped out on the original Saturn idea (out Japan the Japanese... we'll show them!). Now they are trying to turn Saturn into Olds by selling Opels. Wow. Also I bought the last "plastic" Saturn model to be made. Oh well. Also, forgot to mention that the dealer, who owns all 3 K.C. Saturn dealerships, includes a 10 year, 100,000 drivetrain warranty, free of charge, that is supposedly modeled after the Hyundai/Kia powertrain warranty.
Now they are trying to turn Saturn into Olds by selling Opels
Not sure I get this. Can you explain? Olds never sold Opels. I could never confuse an Olds 98 with any Opel. Even the last breath Intrique (which I loved) does not look like an Opel.
At one time Saturn looked at taking over some of the Olds products when Olds was killed. Saturn did not want them. I think a big mistake but then again I do not think Saturn knew at that time that they were on their own to make a profit and develop their cars with their own profits.
Do you think the Saturn dealer will give the same 10 years on the new Aura?
Now they are trying to turn Saturn into Olds by selling Opels
Sorry, what I meant was that it is my understanding that GM is trying to move Saturn into the Olds segment within the company. It seems that most of the new models coming to Saturn are Opel designs, like the Aura.
Do you think the Saturn dealer will give the same 10 years on the new Aura? As far as I know, for every model they sell.
And before someone says that this is from a Detroit paper and therefore biased, Anita and Paul, how do I say this, do not say many good things about GM cars.
Geeze, I wouldn't even be looking at a Camry or a Malibu in the first place. Those aren't the type of cars anybody WANTS TO buy but HAS TO. I would look forward to driving a Malibu like I would look forward to eating a plate of cold brussels sprouts
And, he passed up truly nice cars like a RX-8, which is a kick in the pants. It's a great sports-sedan.(yes, it has four doors - just they hid them to make it look like a sportscar) $22-23K out the door and for four people(in a month when the new models come out), it's completely unlike a typical Camry or Malibu.
And that's only the beginning. Get into factory certified models, and you can get a used Volvo S80 or C-Class for about that a new Camry costs. Total no-brainer which is a better car.
Right -- I'm going to buy a sports car. My wife would really like that?
How do I carry my two adult sons (one of whom is married) in the back seat? How does my wife get in back when I visit my 77-year-old mother? Or do I make my mother sit in the back?
Volvo S80 or Mercedes C class -- how much are maintenance and repairs going to cost? My Camrys don't know what the inside of a repair shop looks like.
I had an old Volvo 240 - great car, but I wouldn't buy today's Volvos, sorry.
And please don't insult my intelligence: Total no-brainer which is a better car.
There is a good possibility in my mind that the lower gasoline prices could spell doom for GM and Ford. If you look at history, the "oil shocks" get GM and Ford to think more economical, then oil declines and they respond by building bigger gas hogs. Maybe happen this time too. So the 1979 oil shock didn't teach them, maybe the 2005-2006 oil shock won't either. Third time (and there will be a third time at some point) may kill GM and Ford once and for all. I don't think that they can help themselves, their core competance in North America is powerful and big vehicles.
Loren, does this help GM vehicles become more attractive ? I personally think this could push GM over the top for 2007'.
Hold on Rocky, here is the final sentence from your "link". It might work or is it desperation?
But beneath it all, GM must have supreme faith in its ability to reduce quality issues in the next few years in order to afford this program. It's either a sign that a solid turnaround is afoot... or a sign that GM has simply put its last stack of chips on the table.
And, what I would like to know is, how many buyers will that bring to GM. It is one issue, but is that the biggest issue? There's still styling, some people like GM styling and some don't, then there is handling which is very personal, and even with an extended warranty, there is time involved and attitude and your treatment when you try to get service. I am not convinced an extended warranty is enough!
If you look at history, the "oil shocks" get GM and Ford to think more economical, then oil declines and they respond by building bigger gas hogs. Maybe happen this time too.
the reason they go back to building "gas hogs" is because that is what the consumer wants. Yes it ("gas shortage") makes GM become more economical but that is because the consumer does whenever gas goes up.
General Motors Corp., the world's largest automaker, will extend warranties to 100,000 miles on 2007 cars and trucks as part of a plan to tout quality and win back buyers lost to Toyota Motor Corp. and other rivals.
The new warranty on engines and other powertrain parts is an increase from the current 36,000 miles,
I don't see this as a big deal. Engines and powertrains usually last 100,000 miles no problems...in fact I have never had a car that needed work done on them, some well past 100,000 miles. It is all the other stuff that cause the most problems; electrical, computers, etc., etc.
Now a bumper to bumper warranty for about 5 years, 75,000 miles and I would say, now your talking.
New Warranty! ... Not impressed. Same cars, different day. Half a change in warranty, different day.
Like the looks of the Solstice Coupe concept. Will consider one - test one out, if they build it. Most of the rest of their car line is " also rans." OK, the CTS is sort of special. The Corvettes a neat car, but out of my price range to buy new -- maybe used, but they can be costly to maintain. -Loren
citing claims by GM that they had reduced warranty expenses 40% over something like five years. Assuming none of that is due to denying more claims for coverage (!!), that's a heck of an improvement. The time is right for the expanded warranty. AND they one-upped Ford, which is going to a 60K powertain warranty for '07.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I saw that mentioned also - it was a quote from Wagoner.
'Wagoner said the number of warranty repairs at dealerships dropped 40 percent in the past five years.'
Another GM spokesman (it was Lutz) said GM had proven their quality was far better and it was time to demonstrate the confidence GM management has in the lineup.
``We absolutely need the consumer to have as much confidence in us as we have in ourselves,'', Lutz said.
I have owned GM product in the past. A GM or any other car, for that matter, is most likely to other issues than the drivetrain. Now in the case of one of my GM cars, it was equally bad. Since it is GM bringing this to light, as in it being so great, why then not compare it to the rest. Does it best Hyundai? It is like the HEAD2HEAD ads. Compare GM to other cars, and if you like the car, the style, AND it beats the others in HEAD2HEAD, why not consider it? Don't forget to compare warranties and resale. Hyundai and GM need to work on resale values, as ya know. -Loren
I had an old Volvo 240 - great car, but I wouldn't buy today's Volvos, sorry.
And please don't insult my intelligence: Total no-brainer which is a better car.
Did you run the numbers on which car would cost you more to drive?
I bet a three-year old certified Volvo will cost you less over 10 years than the brand new Camry, and there is NO question which car is better to drive, though that is subjective. I bet the Volvo is better over any time period.
Not sure what you have against Volvos. I own one and it is a great vehicle. Best vehicle I've ever owned, that's for sure. Way better than my Acura Legend.
If the reason you are buying a new Japanese car is to avoid the cost of repairs, then how can you argue with buying a car for far less money? Even if it has more repairs, you will have kept all that extra money in YOUR bank, rather than in Toyota's.
But you guys have heard my diatribe re buying good used cars versus buying new cars. Buying new because it will be cheaper is not the most logical argument, obviously. New starts out as far more expensive than used. No used car that I've ever bought has come close to being stupider than buying a similar car new. Hell, I bought my used Legend and it has tranny work and it was STILL cheaper than if I had bought a brand new Camry and had NO repairs. AND I was driving a MUCH nicer car than the Camry. There simply is no pure economic case for buying new.
Doesn't mean buying new is bad. There are all sorts of valid reasons to buy new. Wanting the latest and greatest is not immoral or fattening.
Wanting the latest and greatest but telling us (and yourself) that it's really cheaper. Well, that's just intellectually dishonest.
I bet a three-year old certified Volvo will cost you less over 10 years than the brand new Camry, and there is NO question which car is better to drive, though that is subjective. I bet the Volvo is better over any time period.
Well, to get a Volvo equivalent to a Camry, you'd have to get an S80, and even there the Camry is still a bit bigger inside. And an S80, even a 3-year old one, isn't going to come cheap.
Sure, something like an S40 or S60 might be a nice car, but if you need room, they're not going to cut it. An S40 is like a very nice Ford Focus. Nice car, but if you need a lot of room, it ain't gonna cut it. And the S60 isn't that much bigger.
I think I'd also be a bit afraid of a 13 year old Volvo, repair bill-wise, whereas a 10 year old Camry might not scare me as much.
We will be in the market for a Suburban/Yukon XL (larger SUV than our Pilot) later this fall or early winter. We have mostly driven Honda/Toyota and were a bit gun shy with the domestics... with the warranty extended to 100K/5 years, it looks pretty certain that our next car will be made by GM. So yeah, I think it will help as well.
thinking again about the whole Nissan/Renault/GM merger idea. It is as dead as a dodo now.
GM stock is up 61% in 2006 and GM just had a great August for sales. The new 100,000 mile warranty is the icing on the cake. I read that a suggestion from Ghosn during merger negotiations was partly responsible for this new warranty.
I look back and realize how wrong I was to favor this merger two months ago. I am now glad the deal didn't happen. Nissan and Renault have lots of challenges that GM doesn't need to be part of. It looks like GM will do better on their own.
Thanks Andre, you're a great guy for helping me out of a tight spot! I don't want to get into a squabble with alp8 on this new vs. used thing, plus pulling quotes out of context: total no-brainer which is a better car were plekto's words, not mine. And alp, please read my profile; I have bought both new and used.
For the record, I did seriously consider a well-maintained but rather high-mileage 1999 Volvo S70 for my son before he moved to L.A. But I read up about them, including on Edmunds, and there seemed to be *ahem* issues with them.
The clincher though was a candid assessment from a corporate rep at Volvo when I asked how the car would do in the IIHS side impact test. I'm sworn to secrecy, so I'll leave this to your imaginations!
Again, here's how the Camry performed, and note that the side results apply only to 2004 and later models, so in 2004 I had to buy new!
Plus, when I was looking for used cars for my son in early 2005, it was virtually impossible to find any decently priced midsize cars with SIDE CURTAIN AIRBAGS. They don't exist when the airbags are optional.
Oh, there was one loaded 2002 Camry XLE that was going for close to the cost of a new LE. There was also a rather tired-looking 2000 Taurus (which had head/torso side airbags, not curtains) at the "everybody rides!" (their slogan) mouse-house used car dealer. It had enough miles that it was approaching the tranny-dropping point! (Now of course, you can buy any 2005 Accord and get curtains and thorax bags standard.)
And for Ye Who Think I Hate All Things GM, I (gasp!) looked at Malibus and Impalas too! Please keep in mind I grew up on GM iron and was never burned personally by a GM product.
BTW, I loved my '80 Volvo 240, which I bought USED in 1982 and kept till 2003 and an estimated 245K miles! Top that one in terms of cost to own!
210: I didn't mean to take the quote out of context. I just cut and pasted and didn't look up at it to notice that it made it look like you were stating something that you had quoted. Sorry bout that.
It sounds like you did a decent inquiry. Hard to beleive there is nothing used that beats a new Camry. You've really burst my bubble. (not kidding)
It's likely that existing 36,000 mile warranty GM vehicles will drop in value right away. My guess is $1500 or so; about the cost to extend the warranty.
Is a Camry really bigger inside than an S80? Is it enough to add an extra person, or is it just space you don't need? Hard to imagine that 4 adults wouldn't be comfy on a long drive in the S80. Maybe it matters if you plan to jam 15 tiny immigrants into your car and try to cross the border, but for most of us I have to think the size difference is inconsequential.
My experience with repairing Japanese cars is that stuff is not as cheap as we think it is gonna be. And it's not like Volvo parts cost what Mercedes or Porsche parts do. At least this is something there is REAL data on. What's the cost of an S80 brake pad versus a Camry brake pad? How about a tranny?
Heck, people should just buy what they like and screw trying to justify it based on any objective criteria. Those are all lies we tell ourselves, anyway.
Sometimes there are things more important than money, like your children's safety. Especially when they are 3000 miles away, and dad can't be around to check on the car.
Actually, as I said, you can now find used 2005-06 Accords, which have standard side airbags and did well in the crash tests.
Comments
I'm okay if you keep buying GM vehicles - you are free to choose your next vehicle. But don't try to sell GM to me. After all, I learned a lot about GM's quality first hand since I owned 2 GM vehicles - this warranty isn't reason enough for me to switch back to GM.
Warranty repairs at dealers have decreased 40 percent during the past five years.
So says GM. That's the point to be highlighted. Warranty repairs have decreased 40 percent during the past five years because they are experts at dening claims.
Just because you have a warranty, does not mean that you can get warranty work done.
I have a file of can not duplicate, no problem found, and environmental issues that constantly deny warranty claims and work from being done.
They can give 1 million mile warranties for 25 years, but the secret to warranty work is getting by the service writers who are paid to say no.
Bye the way, this is my last post. I'm done with GM and GM related discussion (at least until Wagoner gets a big kick on his rear end).
I am also very data driven as I hope is obvious by my posts. I too have had problems with GM cars. An 82 Z28 was my first new car out of college when I was 21. What a piece of crap but god did I love it. All the issues were minor and were basically quality build issues. My new '84 corvette also had a lot of problems with quality build (BUT these were both first year cars so some leeway can be given) and I loved it even more. However my new cars in the last 6 years have all been great. My minivan never went back to the dealer except when I turned it in. Had a recall because the sliding door handle was supposedly designed so that if a child held onto it it could break their arm. What a joke recall. The new part did not allow you to wrap your fingers around it. My new Envoy is wonderful and does what I need it to do. No problems.
All I am saying is that the data is now different than 20 years ago. Believe it or not GM is not going out of business. There are some here that said they would be gone this year. bankrupt. Not going to happen. GM has downsized to be competitive at 25% of the NA market. It will stay there and may even get more as time goes on. Of course that is my opinion but I do have a bit more data than anyone in this forum.
Wagoner is not getting a kick. In 2 years he will be in the business schools as a study in how a large corporation was brought back from the brink of bankruptcy.
Just about 1 year ago I think it was said that this whole episode would be a Harvard study on how GM went bankrupt?
The flier, sent to members of the Lordstown local, says management has indicated it may increase production of the 2007 Cobalt by 24,000 units. A GM insider confirms GM will add two Saturdays of overtime in September and three in October. GM also plans to add some daily overtime to the two-shift plant.
On straight time, the plant builds 63 cars an hour, the GM source says. It builds Cobalt sedans and the entry-level Pontiac G5 (sold in Canada as the Pursuit and in Mexico as the G4). GM started production of the G5 in early June. Pontiac has sold 191 G5s so far.
Cobalt sales through August were up 9.8 percent, to 163,343 vehicles, compared with the year-ago period.
"We've made progress very quickly. I remain optimistic and hopeful to reach a deal as quickly as possible," Wagoner told reporters. "There are a million strings on this deal. ... It tends to make it a lot more complicated, but we're making a lot of progress with all the constituents."
GM, Delphi and its unions are trying to negotiate a new labor contract to avoid a court ruling that could lead to a union strike. Analysts have said a strike at Delphi could shut down GM's North American operations and force it to burn through billions of dollars a week.
The court in August granted Delphi's request to delay hearings until Sept. 18, giving the parties more time to negotiate.
"We continue to meet with all of the parties: the unions, the statutory committees and GM," Delphi spokesman Lindsey Williams said. "While we are making progress, we still have work to do. We are looking forward to making further progress."
GM has said it may have to spend $5.5 billion to $12 billion to help settle the Delphi labor issues. The automaker spun off Delphi in 1999, when it agreed to cover retiree and health-care costs for former GM workers if Delphi could not.
ram02, "Got a Quick, Technical Question?" #2840, 6 Sep 2006 1:40 pm
and someone or alcan who's a mechanic may answer with help. I'll look for the Transmission Discussion
or here
dsingle, "Transmission Traumas?" #2085, 5 Sep 2006 9:33 am
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
If people would actually take the trouble to read Consumer Reports, they would discover that the testers do say nice things about many Fords, and the Buick LaCrosse scores very well in the reliability surveys.
So the magazine must not hate ALL domestic vehicles.
The 100,000 mile warranty covers 900 components including all powertrain parts. The 36,000 bumper to bumper warranty continues to be in place for everything else.
"We absolutely need the consumer to have as much confidence in us as we have in ourselves,'' Lutz wrote. GM warranty repairs have decreased 40 percent during the past five years....new warranty should help GM models retain more of their value when buyers resell them"
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=amecW6rnhgxc&refer=worldwide- - - _news
GM stock is up over 60% so far this year. Their comeback is starting to look real.
But this warranty thing is a great idea and long overdue. Folks around here have been talking about that for a couple of years at least!
If they advertise this a lot, I bet it will lead to increased retail sales.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I did buy an 07 Ion3 Quad coupe. It looks fantastic, I think, with the body kit & perf package. The interior is very nice to me, it doesn't exactly scream "premium car", but it certainly isn't cheapo either. No complaints on fit & finish, and the parts that I actually touch on a regular basis feel good.
Too bad GM crapped out on the original Saturn idea (out Japan the Japanese... we'll show them!). Now they are trying to turn Saturn into Olds by selling Opels. Wow. Also I bought the last "plastic" Saturn model to be made. Oh well.
Also, forgot to mention that the dealer, who owns all 3 K.C. Saturn dealerships, includes a 10 year, 100,000 drivetrain warranty, free of charge, that is supposedly modeled after the Hyundai/Kia powertrain warranty.
Not sure I get this. Can you explain? Olds never sold Opels. I could never confuse an Olds 98 with any Opel. Even the last breath Intrique (which I loved) does not look like an Opel.
At one time Saturn looked at taking over some of the Olds products when Olds was killed. Saturn did not want them. I think a big mistake but then again I do not think Saturn knew at that time that they were on their own to make a profit and develop their cars with their own profits.
Do you think the Saturn dealer will give the same 10 years on the new Aura?
Sorry, what I meant was that it is my understanding that GM is trying to move Saturn into the Olds segment within the company. It seems that most of the new models coming to Saturn are Opel designs, like the Aura.
Do you think the Saturn dealer will give the same 10 years on the new Aura?
As far as I know, for every model they sell.
ok, I think I can see that as long as we are talking about the "new" Olds that did not make it. Not the "old" Olds which stepped on Buick too closely.
And before someone says that this is from a Detroit paper and therefore biased, Anita and Paul, how do I say this, do not say many good things about GM cars.
If the confidence GM shows offering this warranty is justified it should mean a good boost in market share.
I expect it will mean good things for GM resale value as well since the warranty is fully transferrable.
http://www.gm.com/
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=116728
Loren, does this help GM vehicles become more attractive ? I personally think this could push GM over the top for 2007'.
Rocky
GM shares are now up 61% for the year to date so there is some confidence building out there.
Warranty costs in the second quarter of 2006 were $300 million below projections - see link, end of article.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aoIsN2RBfmqs
And, he passed up truly nice cars like a RX-8, which is a kick in the pants. It's a great sports-sedan.(yes, it has four doors - just they hid them to make it look like a sportscar) $22-23K out the door and for four people(in a month when the new models come out), it's completely unlike a typical Camry or Malibu.
And that's only the beginning. Get into factory certified models, and you can get a used Volvo S80 or C-Class for about that a new Camry costs. Total no-brainer which is a better car.
How do I carry my two adult sons (one of whom is married) in the back seat? How does my wife get in back when I visit my 77-year-old mother? Or do I make my mother sit in the back?
Volvo S80 or Mercedes C class -- how much are maintenance and repairs going to cost? My Camrys don't know what the inside of a repair shop looks like.
I had an old Volvo 240 - great car, but I wouldn't buy today's Volvos, sorry.
And please don't insult my intelligence: Total no-brainer which is a better car.
Hold on Rocky, here is the final sentence from your "link". It might work or is it desperation?
But beneath it all, GM must have supreme faith in its ability to reduce quality issues in the next few years in order to afford this program. It's either a sign that a solid turnaround is afoot... or a sign that GM has simply put its last stack of chips on the table.
And, what I would like to know is, how many buyers will that bring to GM. It is one issue, but is that the biggest issue? There's still styling, some people like GM styling and some don't, then there is handling which is very personal, and even with an extended warranty, there is time involved and attitude and your treatment when you try to get service. I am not convinced an extended warranty is enough!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
the reason they go back to building "gas hogs" is because that is what the consumer wants. Yes it ("gas shortage") makes GM become more economical but that is because the consumer does whenever gas goes up.
The new warranty on engines and other powertrain parts is an increase from the current 36,000 miles,
I don't see this as a big deal. Engines and powertrains usually last 100,000 miles no problems...in fact I have never had a car that needed work done on them, some well past 100,000 miles. It is all the other stuff that cause the most problems; electrical, computers, etc., etc.
Now a bumper to bumper warranty for about 5 years, 75,000 miles and I would say, now your talking.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Not impressed. Same cars, different day. Half a change in warranty, different day.
Like the looks of the Solstice Coupe concept. Will consider one - test one out, if they build it. Most of the rest of their car line is " also rans." OK, the CTS is sort of special. The Corvettes a neat car, but out of my price range to buy new -- maybe used, but they can be costly to maintain.
-Loren
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
You are awfully hard to impress. :P
Rocky
'Wagoner said the number of warranty repairs at dealerships dropped 40 percent in the past five years.'
Another GM spokesman (it was Lutz) said GM had proven their quality was far better and it was time to demonstrate the confidence GM management has in the lineup.
``We absolutely need the consumer to have as much confidence in us as we have in ourselves,'', Lutz said.
-Loren
And please don't insult my intelligence: Total no-brainer which is a better car.
Did you run the numbers on which car would cost you more to drive?
I bet a three-year old certified Volvo will cost you less over 10 years than the brand new Camry, and there is NO question which car is better to drive, though that is subjective. I bet the Volvo is better over any time period.
Not sure what you have against Volvos. I own one and it is a great vehicle. Best vehicle I've ever owned, that's for sure. Way better than my Acura Legend.
If the reason you are buying a new Japanese car is to avoid the cost of repairs, then how can you argue with buying a car for far less money? Even if it has more repairs, you will have kept all that extra money in YOUR bank, rather than in Toyota's.
But you guys have heard my diatribe re buying good used cars versus buying new cars. Buying new because it will be cheaper is not the most logical argument, obviously. New starts out as far more expensive than used. No used car that I've ever bought has come close to being stupider than buying a similar car new. Hell, I bought my used Legend and it has tranny work and it was STILL cheaper than if I had bought a brand new Camry and had NO repairs. AND I was driving a MUCH nicer car than the Camry. There simply is no pure economic case for buying new.
Doesn't mean buying new is bad. There are all sorts of valid reasons to buy new. Wanting the latest and greatest is not immoral or fattening.
Wanting the latest and greatest but telling us (and yourself) that it's really cheaper. Well, that's just intellectually dishonest.
Well, to get a Volvo equivalent to a Camry, you'd have to get an S80, and even there the Camry is still a bit bigger inside. And an S80, even a 3-year old one, isn't going to come cheap.
Sure, something like an S40 or S60 might be a nice car, but if you need room, they're not going to cut it. An S40 is like a very nice Ford Focus. Nice car, but if you need a lot of room, it ain't gonna cut it. And the S60 isn't that much bigger.
I think I'd also be a bit afraid of a 13 year old Volvo, repair bill-wise, whereas a 10 year old Camry might not scare me as much.
Smart move at the right time by Wagoner.
GM stock is up 61% in 2006 and GM just had a great August for sales. The new 100,000 mile warranty is the icing on the cake. I read that a suggestion from Ghosn during merger negotiations was partly responsible for this new warranty.
I look back and realize how wrong I was to favor this merger two months ago. I am now glad the deal didn't happen. Nissan and Renault have lots of challenges that GM doesn't need to be part of. It looks like GM will do better on their own.
Tough luck kid, better luck next time?
For the record, I did seriously consider a well-maintained but rather high-mileage 1999 Volvo S70 for my son before he moved to L.A. But I read up about them, including on Edmunds, and there seemed to be *ahem* issues with them.
The clincher though was a candid assessment from a corporate rep at Volvo when I asked how the car would do in the IIHS side impact test. I'm sworn to secrecy, so I'll leave this to your imaginations!
Again, here's how the Camry performed, and note that the side results apply only to 2004 and later models, so in 2004 I had to buy new!
Plus, when I was looking for used cars for my son in early 2005, it was virtually impossible to find any decently priced midsize cars with SIDE CURTAIN AIRBAGS. They don't exist when the airbags are optional.
Oh, there was one loaded 2002 Camry XLE that was going for close to the cost of a new LE. There was also a rather tired-looking 2000 Taurus (which had head/torso side airbags, not curtains) at the "everybody rides!" (their slogan) mouse-house used car dealer. It had enough miles that it was approaching the tranny-dropping point! (Now of course, you can buy any 2005 Accord and get curtains and thorax bags standard.)
And for Ye Who Think I Hate All Things GM, I (gasp!) looked at Malibus and Impalas too! Please keep in mind I grew up on GM iron and was never burned personally by a GM product.
BTW, I loved my '80 Volvo 240, which I bought USED in 1982 and kept till 2003 and an estimated 245K miles! Top that one in terms of cost to own!
It sounds like you did a decent inquiry. Hard to beleive there is nothing used that beats a new Camry. You've really burst my bubble. (not kidding)
Is a Camry really bigger inside than an S80? Is it enough to add an extra person, or is it just space you don't need? Hard to imagine that 4 adults wouldn't be comfy on a long drive in the S80. Maybe it matters if you plan to jam 15 tiny immigrants into your car and try to cross the border, but for most of us I have to think the size difference is inconsequential.
My experience with repairing Japanese cars is that stuff is not as cheap as we think it is gonna be. And it's not like Volvo parts cost what Mercedes or Porsche parts do. At least this is something there is REAL data on. What's the cost of an S80 brake pad versus a Camry brake pad? How about a tranny?
Heck, people should just buy what they like and screw trying to justify it based on any objective criteria. Those are all lies we tell ourselves, anyway.
:-)
Sometimes there are things more important than money, like your children's safety. Especially when they are 3000 miles away, and dad can't be around to check on the car.
Actually, as I said, you can now find used 2005-06 Accords, which have standard side airbags and did well in the crash tests.