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The following are two quotes from their tests:
“Based on the results we've got here, we'd recommend 8,000 miles between oil changes on an engine that uses no oil at all, perhaps 10,000 miles on an engine that uses some oil, and 15,000 miles or beyond with a filter change every 5,000 miles. This, of course, isn't any kind of guarantee, and you must evaluate for yourself what your engine requires. One thing we're pretty sure about though: 3,000-mile intervals is a huge waste of resources.”
“Notice how each time we change the oil, there is still an initial spike of wear metals, but the spike is smaller at each phase. We are working on a hypothesis: that the true break-in of an engine is at least 20,000 miles, and that, perhaps, during the first year of an engine's use it would be wise to change more frequently, and only start moving toward extended oil changes once the engine is older”
(In the first statement they are topping off whenever the oil level drops and
that introduces new oil which allows them to change less frequently in the
older engine.)
Here's some helpful info for anyone else who wants to change their own.
1. The oil filter housing is accessed from the top of the engine by removing the decorative cover which is held on by 6 bolts/nuts. Facing the engine, the filter housing cover is a domed round plastic cap about 4" in diameter slightly to the right of center.
2. Note carefully that there's a white painted "match" mark somewhere on the more exposed side of the filter housing. When you twist the cap back on, you'll want to make sure you turn it far enough to get those marks to line up again. If your car doesn't have such an alignment mark, make one yourself.
3. There is apparently a special tool for removing the filter cap sold by Hyundai, but I was able to easily twist mine off by hand. Before starting to remove the cap, wrap rags around the housing below the cap to catch any oil that might drip during cartridge lift-out. Also, have a container of some sort handy into which you can lift the cartridge without trailing it across the top of the engine. It is easy to avoid dripping any oil anywhere.
4. Change the filter BEFORE draining the oil out of the pan to enable the oil trapped in the housing to drain into the pan before the pan is emptied.
5. The cap takes several turns to get it off. When you lift it off, the filter will come with it since the filter is mounted on a hollow spindle that's attached to the cap and extends out of the bottom end of the filter a few inches. Once out of the housing, the old filter pulls straight off the spindle.
6. There are four o-rings to concern yourself with. They come with the replacement filter. Two are already installed inside the ends of the filter, there's one about 1/2" in diameter that can be found on the end of the spindle, and a large one the diameter of the cap seals the cap to the housing. The small one on the end of the spindle is sorta hard to get off and replace. Squeeze the o-ring, press it one direction, and get a nail under the loose part to help pry it off. Before putting on the new one, oil it to help it slip over the end of the spindle and back into its groove. The larger one is much easier to replace. Oil it too.
7. Before placing the new cartridge onto the spindle, oil the two o-rings inside the ends of the filter. This will help them slip into place. Push it on as far is it will go.
8. I've read how several people have had problems getting the cap cinched back down properly. That's because they fail to bathe the large o-ring with oil AND the inner surface of the housing where the o-ring will be required to twist/slide into place as the cap is screwed down. Trying to put the cap on with the o-ring and housing inner surface dry will be almost impossible, will probably damage the o-ring, and will most likely leak. Twist the cap/filter assembly down till it bottoms out on the housing, and the white marks are aligned.
8. Once that's done, drain your oil and refill as you would any other car. It holds 6 quarts. Don't forget to remove the rag from around the filter housing before replacing the decorative engine cover.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
Even though the manufacture specifies 5W-20, you go to 10W-30. Why? :confuse:
Are you sure that it takes six quarts? :confuse:
If I lived in Phoenix, I would run 10W-30 in the winter months when temperatures can dip down to around 32F at night. However, in the summer, when nighttime temperatures remain 70F+ and the daytime temperatures are routinely above 95F, I'd run conventional SAE-30 mono-grade oil. The superior protection it would provide between moving engine parts could only be surpassed by a mono-grade SAE-40.
For those of you who find this too horrifying, Phoenix summers would be well addressed by a synthetic 15W-40 or 15W-50. I say synthetic for a summer multi-grade because it supposedly has less VI improvers in it than conventional oil. Mono-grade oils have no VI improvers, and thus do not shear down in grade with use.
Here in Sandy Eggo, near the coast, our temperatures remain fairly moderate, both night (seldom lower than 40F in the winter), and day (seldom above 85F in the summer). However, since I frequently drive further inland where the temperatures can frequently run 95F+, I'll switch from 10W-30 in the colder months to SAE-30 in the hotter months. In the 98 Grand Prix I just traded with 150K miles, it "used" 1 quart of conventional 10W-30 for the 7500 mile oil change in the winter, and about 1/4 quart of SAE-30 for the 7500 mile change in the summer.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
I respond: I assume you're responding to the message just prior to yours (which is mine).
Cars have not come from the factory with a special "break in" oil for at least 40 years. When they did come with a "break-in" oil, it was usually a SAE-20 oil that was to be replaced with SAE-30 after a prescribed number of miles (usually 500 - 1000 miles). The low viscosity oil was used to allow "high spots" between mating surfaces to be quickly worn down and smoothed. After that, the higher viscosity oil was needed to keep those now "mated" surfaces from touching each other thereafter. Since then, materials have improved, tolerances have become better, multi-grade oils were introduced, and oils have steadily improved.
Your car came from the factory with the multi-grade of oil that's written on the oil filler cap. Most of the time the factory fill is conventional, sometimes it's synthetic.
That being said, there's still a school of thought that has one changing out the factory oil within 500-1000 miles in order to get rid of all the dirt and manufacturing debris left in the engine when it was built. I won't criticize that position as doing an oil and filter change at 500-1000 miles can't hurt, but I will tell you than the appearance of oil sez a LOT about it's condition. If the oil is still fairly clear at 1000 miles, it's still pretty clean. Mine didn't start taking on color until about 3000 miles. At 4200 miles it was a medium amber. I wasn't so much worried about the condition of the oil as I wanted to get rid of that watery thin 5W-20 which is TOTALLY unnecessary in Sandy Eggo where my starting temperatures seldom go below 50F for the garaged car.
Finally, the old oil filter had taken on the amber color of the oil, but there was no obvious evidence of dirt or any other debris. They clean engine internals pretty well these days before closing them up at the factory.
----------------
Snaglepuss wrote: Even though the manufacture specifies 5W-20, you go to 10W-30. Why?
I respond: Several reasons.
1. 10W-30 will provide better metal-to-metal protection than will 5W-20 at operating temperatures.
2. The owner's manual sez it's OK to use 10W-30 down to 0F degrees. My starting temperatures are at least 45F-85F degrees higher than that.
3. Whereas the watery-thin oils being promoted by manufacturers these days provide a slight improvement in fuel economy by virtue of their lower viscosity, they do so at the risk of increased engine wear at operating temperatures.
-----------------------
Snaglepuss wrote: Are you sure that it takes six quarts?
I respond: That's what the owner's manual sez. After putting in 5 quarts it showed full on the dipstick. I then started the engine and ran it until the oil pressure light went off and rechecked the oil level. It had dropped from the full mark to the add mark (1 quart). I put in the final 6th quart, and it again registered full on the dipstick.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
You are right about one thing though, you really should oil the O-ring before replacing the canister cap, it does make it much, much easier to get the cap to seat properly and avoid leaks.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
>> corporate...they haven't passed that word down to their service departments.
>> Then again, if they did then there would be less oil changes and that means
>> less money being spent. So, service departments will still be telling customers
>> to change their oil at every 3000 miles as always.
Actually, the Azera owner's manual recommends 7500 mile oil and filter changes. Since it doesn't specify "synthetic" oil, this is for conventional oil. This is for ideal operating conditions (mostly highway driving, for example). Almost all auto manufacturers have been specifying 7500 mile oil changes for several decades.
There's a whole lot of confusion regarding the relative superiority of synthetic oil. Synthetic oil is superior to conventional oil in two ways that matter, and two ways only. First, most synthetics have less VI improving polymers in order to make the oil a multi-grade oil, and will thusly shear down out of grade slower than conventional oil. Second, most (not all) synthetics have a somewhat higher flash point than do the equivalent conventional oils. Of these two superior qualities, the higher flash point is irrelevant under most normal operating conditions.
The additive packages for corrosion control, anti-foaming, etc. are the same for conventional vs synthetic oil within any manufacturers production process. So, both will protect from this standpoint the same. So, other than Viscosity breakdown, the only thing the average motorist needs to concern himself with is particulate contaminants that the filter's there to remove. This is unrelated to synthetic vs conventional.
So the fact that synthetic multi-grade oil will stay in grade longer than conventional oil is the only benefit to using synthetic. If you're going to change your oil every 3000 miles anyway to insure "clean" oil, using synthetic oil vs conventional oil is a total waste of money. OTOH, if you want to go 10,000 miles between oil changes, the synthetic will remain usefull longer, just make sure you've got a good filter.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
Sorry to hear that something that's supposed to save you some time, actually makes the process a little slower. In reality, with a socket wrench, it may only take me 10-15 more seconds to get the oil draining. I guess I'm old school and that little bit of time isn't a big deal for me. By having a routine at this point...it doesn't even seem like it takes long at all.
The way I go about it...jack up the front passenger side of the car with a floor jack, remove the decorative engine cover, remove the oil filler cap, remove the oil filter cap and then get under the car and remove the oil pan plug and begin the drain. While that's happening, I get top-side and remove the old filter, get the "O" rings off and get the new filter and "O" rings in place. Since there's still residual oil in the cannister, I don't worry about oiling up the smaller "O" ring, but I do oil up the large "O" ring on the canister cap. I put the filter in place and screw the cap down till it seats properly. By this time, the oil should be finished draining and I get below and replace the drain plug (after putting the new crush ring in place), wipe up any dripping oil, remove the oil receptacle, lower the car and get top side to start pouring in the new oil...6 quarts of fresh, clean oil for my baby!!!
In most cases when I do it without fiddle fartin around, the process takes about 20-25 mins from jacking the car up to closing the hood. I have to say, the oil filter placement definitely aids in easier oil changes. :shades:
>> actually makes the process a little slower.
Some sorta misunderstanding. That Fumoto drain valve IS going to save me time AND effort.
I won't jack up the car.
I won't get under the car (except for my arm reaching over to the Fumoto drain valve).
I won't have to find a socket to fit the drain plug.
I won't have to unscrew the drain plug (just flip the lever 1/4-turn to open, then 1/4 turn to close).
I won't have to worry about hot oil splashing on my hand (the valve lever is oriented in such a way that I can flip it open and closed without my hand being in the way of the oil flow).
I won't have to carefully avoid dropping the drain plug into the oil drain pan.
I won't worry about replacing the crushable washer (find yourself a fiber washer or a teflon washer - they seal as good or better than a crushable washer anyway, cost a lot less, and are reusable).
I won't get dirty rolling around under the car.
The slightly slower drain time won't even be noticed because it'll be done long before I finish changing the filter while the oil is draining as you do.
If the filter was still located under the car, I wouldn't be all that excited about the flip-lever drain valve. BUT, with the filter now located on top of the engine, I only have to reach under the car with one arm to place the drain pan, flip the lever, then flip it back and slide the pan out.
5000 miles from now, we'll see if it's as simple as it should be.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
I do have to jack the car up as the drain pan I have is larger than most and I place it under before I start removing the drain plug.
Considering I have a drive way and garage (both are kept clean), I don't get dirty at all.
I guess, to each their own, whatever works and whatever you feel comfortable doing. In all the "time saving" you've installed with the drain plug...we probably take about the same amount of time to do an oil change from start to finish.
first thing in the morning before I go anywhere."
You are saying that you drain your dirty oil when the engine is cold?
Not only will the oil take longer to drain out, but some of the metallic particules may
remain in the bottom of the cold pan account of the oil being thicker when cold.
Draining the oil from a cold motor is a known no-no.
Always drain your dirty oil when your engine oil is warm, hot even, but not cold.
Maybe HOT is not the correct operative word.
Even in premium multi grade oils the warmer oil flows more easily and will carry out more contaminates which settle to the bottom of the oil pan.
Running the engine prior to changing the oil also stirs up the contaminants that may be in the bottom of the pan putting them into temporary suspension also allowing them to be removed by draining.
I'm sure that it is not a major issue in any case, but if you are the type that is very concerned about oil change intervals, you might as well maximize the results of your efforts.
What is your source of information for "HOT"?
I believe the fluid dynamics explanation that I presented requires warm only.
Mike
You are splitting hairs. If you feel that it's warm enough to flow properly and that the contaminants are in suspension, fine.
I would want to maximize the results of my efforts.
I have done it this way for every car I've owned with no problems at all with the engine. As a matter of fact, the '02 Sonata I traded in with 105K miles on it...the guy that did the appraisal for trade-in value came back in and shook his head, his exact words were, "I'm going to have a hard time convincing folks that this car has 105K miles on it...it runs as good as it did new!!!"
With that car, I used the Syntec Blend and I would use the Berryman's Chem-Tool in the gas with every oil change. With my Azera...I do the same thing, but...I now use Castrol's full synthetic (Syntec), still use the Chem-Tool and now I go longer between oil changes. I've had my car now for 2 years and I have just over 43K miles on it...and it is purring like a kitten!!!
>> when that left-handed monkey flips the pin 1/4 turn while you are motoring
>> down the highway, say fifty miles from Laredo, Texas?
I don't know if anyone else posting to this thread has installed the Fumoto valve, so I'll respond since I have.
The 1/2-turn lever is held in a recess by spring pressure. It cannot be turned without lifting it out of its recess first. Once lifted out of the recess, it takes a few pounds of force to rotate it 1/4 turn in order to open it. And, Fumoto also offers a small springwire hose clamp that can be installed into the lever's groove that positively keeps the lever from being lifted out of it's detent notch (for those who are nervous that a left-handed monkey will get under the car and turn the lever to the open position while fifty miles away from Laredo, TX).
I ordered the safety clip ($1.00) at the same time I ordered the valve. After playing with the valve a little before installing it, I decided that:
a. The chances of the internal spring breaking sufficiently to allow the lever to flop loose out of it's safety notch is close to zero.
b. Even if the spring did break sufficiently to allow the lever to flop loose, the chances of the lever then turning itself open is close to zero.
c. Installing the safety clip would probably require my presence under the car to remove it before flipping the lever, thus negating the whole reason for installing the valve in the first place.
So, zero times zero is a BIG ZERO, and I opted not to install it.
P.S. - Draining the oil hot allows it to drain faster and a little more completely. It used to be very important before the advent of detergent oils (half a century ago) in order to stir up contaminents that dropped out of suspension. Aside from cold detergent oil leaving a little more of the old oil undrained due to the thicker amount sticking to the pan, it's really not all that important anymore. I still always drain my oil when it quite warm anyway.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
I have to say that with the Fumoto drain valve installed and the easy access to the Azera's oil filter, this is the easiest car to do an oil change that I've ever owned.
I also use Mobil 1 oil but still change it every 3,000 miles. Overkill? Sure. But I've torn down enough engines that were full of sludge to know that clean oil will never let the sludge build up in an engine. It's best practice to change the oil after the engine has been running and up to normal operating temperature to make sure any contaminates are held in suspension and drained with the oil.
Where do you buy a Fumoto?
>> I am concerned about the possibility of a road hazard knocking off
>> the valve and losing all the oil. Where do you buy a Fumoto?
You didn't direct your question to me, but I'll take a shot anyway.
There's a slight dip in the oil pan where the drain plug is located. The flat on the back of that dip is where the drain plug goes in. That flat is fairly near perpendicular, so when you screw in the valve, it doesn't extend below the bottom of the pan. The thing I wanted to do when installing it was to make sure the lever mechanism which is attached to the side of the valve and at 90 degrees to the flow through would be oriented in such a way that as I reached under the car from behind the right wheel, I could flip the lever without my fingers being in the way of the oil flow. Turned out that with a very tight installation, the lever mechanism points to the right side of the car and is up out of harms way also (if the lever mechanism had been oriented down, it would extend slightly into harms way). The valve itself is machined out of brass and is very stout. I also contemplated sawing a few slots into the threaded portion in case it extended into the pan, but I didn't and I'm glad I didn't because the drainage will not be affected by the grip length of the threads after all.
Several internet sites sell the valve. You can see a picture of it here, and buy it from them. All Hyundai's use the F-106. The picture can be enlarged by clicking on it. The lever is shown in the open position. When closed, the lever is 90 degrees away and no longer extends beyond the extended length of the valve.
http://www.lubricationspecialist.com/front/shop.aspx?catid=3&parentid=0&curr_pag- - e=2
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
Grayfox
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
> the way are identical except for the price. The Purolator is almost twice as
> expensive, and it is exactly the same filter. Compare them side by side and
> you'll see what I mean!
I bought a STP brand filter for my first oil change. I didn't think there were many companies making the cartridge filter. Seems there are. I took your advice and looked at Pep Boys. You're absolutely right. Those are one and the same filter. They didn't even make any effort to disguise that fact. Same markings, same little red ring on the filter element on the inside, etc. The Proline is $5.99 and the Purolator is $9.99. Both are boxed with the same part number. I went ahead and bought a few even though my 5000-mile change interval will probably span six months.
On my first change, I went from the factory fill 5W-20 to Syntec 10W-30 synthetic (mainly because I got a 6-pack for less than conventional oil would cost). In the future I'll be using conventional 10W-30 Pennzoil in the winter and will probably go to Pennzoil SAE-30 mono-grade in the summer.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
Also, the filter change required no special tool, as I was able to turn the cap off the filter by hand. We have 6k miles in 18 mos, and this (third oil change) gave me the opportunity to change to fully synthetic. I reasoned this might be helpful for an engine that seldom reaches temperature.
Very easy to do.
Yes, you must remove that cover which is easily done.
Takes a 10 mm socket for the six points where it is fastened.
Then you'll see the oil filter.
Don't sweat the oil rings as there are two new rings provided with each new oil filter cartridge.
Very easy to change each time also.
I use 6 quarts of Mobil 1 5W-20 so I don't have to change mine as often.
Also, note the white paint mark between the cap and the housing that is done at the factory, to see if you have secured it right.
It's actually easy to do, once you've done it the first time. Now I have a Santa Fe that uses the exact same setup.
Last, always replace the crush washer on the oil drain plug when you change oil. Some people are not aware that it should be changed each time.
BTW, I use Hyundai factory filters which I can buy on Ebay in bulk. I also use Mobil-1 Synthetic 5W-20 oil.
Good luck
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
Regards,
LPT
I love these forums. It's great to get all sorts of help and tips before attempting something.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
A big mistake for sure.
No one can tell the actual conditions of the oil by "the appearance" of the oil.
I found out the hard way when I mistakenly waited until mine had 3750 miles and then changed it and sent a sample in for analysis. I got the results back and discovered that I should have changed mine much sooner
to get rid of all kinds of contaminants, many of which may have been there since the motor was installed.
Hopefully some of those high levels of undesireable contaminants were from the new motor breaking in.
I trust that with the next analysis, many of those high levels will no longer be present.
Took the Azera to my dealer and found out that batteries have two years of warranty coverage, I'm a month short of 2 years since purchase, so they replaced it for me No charge.
I know Hyundai service takes a lot of hits on this forum, but my experiences have been very good. We now have the Azera, a Santa Fe and just added an Elantra to the family...and all have been very impressive.
What is required to maintain the warranty, if an owner wants to do his own maintenance?
Thanks, Jerry
As far as DIY, keep your receipts and keep a log of when you do your oil changes. That's what I did on my previous '02 Sonata and my current '06 Azera.
I just bought the Azera and have not used that type of oil filter before. Could you tell me what is inside the oil filter container besides the oil filter and the "O" rings? Is there some springs or other stuff that can fall out?
Do you need a special tool to remove the oil filter contained? Does it have a nut type fitting on the top?
I have done my own maintenance on my other cars, but they all had the old stile oil filter.
Thanks, Jerry
>> Could you tell me what is inside the oil filter container besides the oil
>> filter and the "O" rings? Is there some springs or other stuff that can
>> fall out?
Go back and read message 205. It will answer all your questions, including some you wouldn't think to ask.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
Thanks, Jerry
>> 5000 miles from now, we'll see if it's as simple as it should be.
I recently did my 10K-mile oil change. It was as simple as I hoped it would be. I did experience one unexpected problem. I'd bought a Pure One filter from Pep Boys earlier. When I went to replace the small o-ring on the end of the cartridge spindle, I noted that the new o-ring didn't have quite the same cross-section (thickness) as the old o-ring (from the STP filter kit that I used for my 1st oil change). In fact, the edge of the Pure One o-ring did not extend beyond the edge of the recess it was contained in which meant it would not seal. So, I levered the old o-ring back on and reused it. I'd bought three Pure One filters, so I traded the two remaining ones for Fram CH9999 filters at Pep Boys. Some may not be able to see the difference in the cross-section of the o-rings, but I could see that the Fram o-ring was slightly thicker.
It was weird when I did the exchange. I expected to pay a $2 difference for each Fram filter. Instead, the clerk said I owed $10 more because the Fram filters were $10.99. I told her "no, they're $7.99. So, she phoned back to the parts area, had a short discussion, hung up and told me the Frams are really on sale - two for $5.00 and gave me back $5 plus the Fram filters instead of charging me anything.
Go figger.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
Go back and read message 205. It will answer all your questions, including some you wouldn't think to ask.
Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo
Thanks, Jerry
Go here and register: http://www.hyundaitechinfo.com/
HTHs