Luxury Lounge

bmlexus

Something wicked, and white, and silver, and grey, and covered in protective tape, this way comes. In fact, it is already here: a lot full of Nissan GT-Rs in Jacksonville, Florida. Amassed like the automatons in I, Robot, all of them await their chance to embarrass cars costing nearly twice as much on U.S. soil. And a few will probably end up in accidents, ditches and tire walls as well, sadly. Click the link to visit the forum and check out more photos of what's in store for U.S. roads and garage mahals. Thanks for the tip, Jeff!

Any 1 here planning to get 1?
link title

circlew

Hi TM, hope you're enjoying your vacation. Today I took the first test drive in a black 135i w/A/T and SP and M Pkg! I like the M touches!

Of course, it has power but my sales lady took me to a deserted corporate parking lot and before I could even react, she engaged the manumatic shift and told me to let-go while using the paddle shifters! She let me make quite a few power turns to get a good feeing of the control during power-on and braking into tight turns. I came away with a car I could take to the track if it finds it's way into my garage!

IMHO, it was a different car than the 128i I tested weeks before. The sport seats made all the difference to me also as the 128 had the standard seats. in regards to the fit for me behind the wheel. The ride is pliable enough given the set up for performance and compared to my current 330xi, cruising is not that much different regarding harshness over bumps.

This car is extrememly high on my list in December. Hopefully, the story she gave me regarding availability eases for the 2009's by then. There are folks who are on the list for '08's that probably will be delayed until NMY. No discounts as well as most of the posters have intimated regarding leases or purchase..

I will probably need to order it in September if I decide to pull the trigger.

TM, you have a great car to make you smile for a long, long time! I got a taste of it today. Way cool!

Regards,
OW

tagman

I'm a Porsche fan, but NOTHING except the M3 interested me enough from BMW until the 135i. There are no words to describe it. Not the very best, but way up the scale, and it has a unique seductive magical quality that is hard to describe, but you now understand... although I believe the manual tranny is even more engaging.

Thanks for taking the time to tell me about your test drive, and how much you like the 135i. Honestly, I absolutely love the 135i. I could have made most any other choice... so it says a lot for the car!!

TM.

lexusguy

Any 1 here planning to get 1?

It's been interesting watching the reviews come in. There isn't a clear consensus as to what its actually like to drive on regular streets, rather than a track. Everyone agrees that its a competition decimating track star, but some reviews have said its also great on the streets, while others have said its kind of lousy on regular roads. While I can appreciate that Nissan targeted the 911 Turbo and beat it, I don't think its a car I would ever buy. I'm more of an XKR/Gran Turismo guy.

tagman

I wouldn't own one either. And that is said in spite of my respect for the car. I was most impressed after seeing it up close at the car show. Much better-looking than in ANY pic.

For me, I don't want to be a "pilot" of my car. And the cockpit of the GT-R is just that... a serious cockpit surrounded by technical wizardry. There is just too much technology intermediating the driving experience. It's cool, but not for me. I'm more like the Lotus philosophy or sometimes more in the middle. Because of that, the GT-R isn't even on my wishlist.

TM

esf

Very interesting, thanks for posting.

'08 BMW X5 4.8i • '06 Audi A3 2.0T DSG • '05 Audi S4 Cabriolet

esf

I completely agree.

The GT-R is basically a robot. It knows how to do everything you want to do before you get in; it's just waiting for you to press the pedal. It's all pre-programmed. I don't think I would buy one either. It's a nice idea, but I am more drawn to luxurious sports cars like your Porsche. The Nissan is all business.

'08 BMW X5 4.8i • '06 Audi A3 2.0T DSG • '05 Audi S4 Cabriolet

esf

Dewey has been talking about it a lot, and now I'm thinking much more seriously about getting a winter car that combines fuel efficiency and fun. My wife is also nagging for it to be a "couples' car," to take people out to dinner with. This presents an extremely difficult process; there are really next to no cars that successfully combine all three of these traits while still boasting winter practicality. I am toying with the idea of simply getting a non-luxury hybrid and then indulging myself with a beautiful sports car later. It could be the best of both worlds. Not sure yet, though, as all of you can imagine. You've been there.

'08 BMW X5 4.8i • '06 Audi A3 2.0T DSG • '05 Audi S4 Cabriolet

2001gs430

Unlike others, I do plan to beg for one at a reasonable price. I believe the GT-R is a very practical vehicle to get a taste of extreme high performance driving (on a race track of course) while not taking too much risks. I believe you can totally disable the electronic nanies in this car if one wanted to try his/her own things. I will have to find out when I could ever take a test drive in one of them.
On a separate note, my neighbor from across the street just got an older Ferrari, a black Testerosa (sp) I believe (it looks like the car appeared in latter episodes of Miami Vices). I don't know the guy, so I am not sure if the car was modified. However, I have to say that it sounds terrible from a distance when he starts it up. It sounds like a tug boat if I had to compare it to something. The car does appear beautiful and timeless even today.
Then there is my brother in law, whom just picked up a 1991 NSX, auto with 60K miles on the clock. I wish he had gotten one with manual trans because I found it too civilized on the road. The car still drives beautifully. This is another car that has a timeless design. It looks good even when parked.

jlbl

Also, the Peugeot are in a blistering pace. It is 24 hours however and I think we'll see the Audi's where we usually find them. At the podium..

You got it!

General and LMP1 class
1. Audi Sport North America (R. Capello*, A.McNish, T. Kristensen)
2. Team Peugeot Total (Marc Gené*, N.Minassian, J. Villeneuve)
3. Peugeot Sport Total (F.Montagny*, R. Zonta, C. Klien)

LMP2 class
1. Porsche
2. Porsche

LM GT1
1. Aston Martin (D. Brabham*, A. García, D. Turner)
2. Corvette Racing (J. O'CConnell*, J. Magnussen, R. Fellows)
3. Corvette Racing (O. Beretta*, O. Gavin, M.Papis)

LM GT2
1. Ferrari
2. Ferrari
3. Ferrari

Regards,
Jose

jlbl

I will be registering my daughter for Jim Russell's driving classes in the near future

It will be a valuable present. Once upon a while I thought my daughter (now 29 year-old) would become a passionate driver since she showed very good driving manners and high interest. Now she drives beautifully her car but she belongs to the 'I am not in the mood of driving' feminine mob when we cruise together in my car to some destination and I get tired of driving. :mad:

Regards,
Jose

reality2

I just want to congratulate Tom Kristensen on his win at Le Mans who deserves to mentioned in same breath as other legendary motor sport drivers. His truimphs at Le Mans (all under Audi) make him a sure legend. Unfortunately, most Americans are not aware of him, but his accomplished at Le Mans couple with those at ALMS and DTM place him at the top. His relentless attack against the leading Peugeot was brilliant and a pleasure to watch his race technique and strategy.

And of course, congrats to Audi for yet another Le Mans truimph It will interesting what the next R10s will be like as closed tops. I am sure they will be made faster to catch those slippery Peugeots.

jlbl

Tom Kristensen has won eight times the 24 Hours of Le Mans. Whether few drivers finish the race and among them only a handful wins it once in life, to win eight times is just a real achievement. Congrats to him.

Regards,
Jose

anthonyp

Greetings esf

I to am thinking of a hybred, either the Prius, or if Lexus comes out with a nicer one....I`l wait a couple of years for myself, but may get something for one in the family...before then....The Prius looks pretty roomy, and with the driving conditions today, I think it might be a fun car, and a challenge to get good fuel economy....Today... driving a few hundred miles I saw two of them and they were going in the high seventies....Also saw many Hondas....Don`t drive on a Sunday --in the summer-- as there are many families on the road...Tony

lexusguy

I believe you can totally disable the electronic nanies in this car if one wanted to try his/her own things.

The three switches on the dash allow you to adjust the transmission, suspension, and stability control. Stability nannying isn't the problem here, though. This car isn't like a C63 AMG, a wild animal with an electronic leash around its neck, which you can remove.

It's the AWD system that makes this car do what it does, and you can't turn that off. You point, it goes. The AWD system finds the fastest way around the corner, and the car follows that line. It's faster than a 911, but it will never drive like one.

Too bad about the autobox, it really ruined the NSX. They had to detune the engine and lower the redline for it, and with just 4-speeds it was far slower than the stick. The NSX was impressive in its day, but there are better choices now, especially if you need an automatic.

esf

Interesting input. I would also go for the Lexus hybrid if it were available, but the GS450h just doesn't really fit the bill. I don't think a Prius could ever be considered fun (to drive), but yes it definitely could be a fun challenge to get the best MPG. I just have a problem with the Prius. I've been making fun of them for too long (LOL), and if I got one it would go against everything I stand for. IMO a Camry hybrid would be a better choice; I travel incognito.

'08 BMW X5 4.8i • '06 Audi A3 2.0T DSG • '05 Audi S4 Cabriolet

2001gs430

The AWD system finds the fastest way around the corner, and the car follows that line. It's faster than a 911, but it will never drive like one.


That can't be. You need to at least have to line up the corners correctly for the trick AWD to do its work. I believe the GT-R will simply enhance the driving experience for drivers with at all driving skill levels that he/she could never obtain from the other super cars.

I think he bought the NSX just to reminiscent the early 90's. It'd be way more fun with a stick in it.

2001gs430

The next gen LI batteries will make Lexus hybrids more interesting, I hope.

louiswei

What! There are auto NSXs out there? :surprise:

louiswei

That can't be. You need to at least have to line up the corners correctly for the trick AWD to do its work.

Thank you 2001gs430. The AWD can only help you to be faster around the corners if you are on the correct line, it is not intelligent enough to find the fastest way around the corner. If the later is the case then it'll truly be a robot with AI...

tagman

GT-R enhance driving skills? NO.

Sorry, but the easier it is to drive a performance car, the LESS it does to enhance driving skills.

Here's the reality...

The GT-R brings a profound level of supreme stability and capability to driving at the limits. THAT is the credit the GT-R has earned. It has taken the physics of driving, and masterfully utilized those concepts. The GT-R's use of sophisticated technology combined with enhanced hardware makes it a potential benchmark.

There is nothing wrong at all with the idea of engineering a car that can excel to new levels. The GT-R is the embodiment and realization of that idea. It's an incredible achievement.

That said, I would LOVE to drive one. But own one? I'll pass. I don't want to own a car like the GT-R. As incredible as it is, it's just too much like a mad scientist's car than an enthusiast's car. For the sake of purity, I'd buy an Exige or Elise SC before a GT-R.

TM

dhamilton

Congrats to Audi, Tom Kristensen, Ronaldo [Dindo] Capello, and the very like able Alan McNish.

The Speed guys said it best, The Tortoise vs the Hare

jlbl

The Tortoise vs the Hare

2008 24 Hours du Mans has been one of the life best examples of that fable!!! Strategy (and excellent driving under the rain) did the deed.

Regards,
Jose

2001gs430

GT-R enhance driving skills? NO.

I did not say this.
I wrote "enhance driving experience" meaning any driver can simply goes around the track faster/quicker than he ever could. Don't you agree fast = fun, especially with the twisty stuff thrown in?
Being in the computer business, I love technologies, so the GT-R's cockpit is just perfect.

2001gs430

Yep, and I got to drive one of them

jlbl

Enough hydrogen stations as announced in the media to fuel Honda FCX Clarity to do practical ridings? How many? Evenly distributed?

Regards,
Jose

tagman

Thanks for the clarification. But, with so much technology intermediating the drivng "experience", I think it sounds more like a simulator, interacting with the computers than the "car meets road". Regardless, going to the next level of performance is always cool.

In any event, it's a car I respect and want to drive for myself.

I also love it's high-tech cockpit, but I would not want to own it.

TM

2001gs430

But, with so much technology intermediating the driving "experience", I think it sounds more like a simulator, interacting with the computers than the "car meets road".
That's understandable. Changes are not always for the better, but in this case, I think the technologies in the GT-R are for the better. Sort of like the inventions of power assisted brakes/steering. I am sure in the beginning a lot of people were saying who needs them
I am pretty sure when the GT-R is more readily available, we will learn more about how to extract the most FUN driving them.

tagman

We'll read more hands-on feedback, and we'll drive it. Then, we will know if it's an isolated and disconnected "experience", like driving a simulator... or if it's got a great feel of the road.

Regarding your comparison to power steering, there are different levels and feel of various power steering applications. Some lose the road.

If the GT-R can retain the feel and connection to the road, and not drive with an artificial and disconnected dynamic, then I'll be quite impressed and satisfied with all the mitigating technology.

In the end, though, the Lotus Exige still fairly represents my idea of a fun and rewarding performance experience. And the 911 represents a car I'm good with spending the bucks on.

TM

esf

Go Audi!

'08 BMW X5 4.8i • '06 Audi A3 2.0T DSG • '05 Audi S4 Cabriolet

esf

We'll read more hands-on feedback, and we'll drive it. Then, we will know if it's an isolated and disconnected "experience", like driving a simulator... or if it's got a great feel of the road.

Judging from all of its glowing write-ups, the car has nice steering feel and nice road feel. I don't think it would've won all of those comparison tests if it hadn't.

However, IMO, the R8 and 911 are still the best combos of purity and technology in the sports car world. The '09 911, with its fantastic new engines and transmission, is a great step forward without losing any of its Porsche-ness. The R8 is pretty much perfection; it's soft and nice in town but like a scalpel at the track. I would rather own either than the GT-R. But that's just you and me. A good amount of people are drawn to the Japanese philosophy of super tech.

'08 BMW X5 4.8i • '06 Audi A3 2.0T DSG • '05 Audi S4 Cabriolet

louiswei

Let's see, between the GT-R, 911 Turbo and R8, which one would I go for...

The Corvette ZR1!!

or either the Corvette Z06 or Cayman S and save the extra $30k+ for speeding tickets... :shades:

circlew

I'm with you for the Z-06!

Regards,
OW

lexusguy

Let's see, between the GT-R, 911 Turbo and R8, which one would I go for...

For me it has to be the R8. The General's effort with the ZR1 is very impressive, but there's a bit of cheesiness to it with its flash wheels and stupid clear engine cover. Note to GM, if your engine doesn't look like anything, don't show it off. There's a reason why Ferraris and Lambos have clear engine covers, and Porsches don't.

oac

IMO a Camry hybrid would be a better choice; I travel incognito.

Have you seen my TCH? Here is a pic



Think you can be incognito in that ride? :shades:

Seriously, TCH is a nice and comfy ride... shodded with 18" and the right tire combo (235/40/18) and lowered with Eibach/TRD (mine isn't lowered yet but I have the springs), you won't believe how nice and firm the ride can become... Go ahead, and give it a try. Its only like $30K loaded with everything you can ever want on it...

oac

Looking to take the plunge and buy a Bimmer, preferably a 3. But want something that's a beater that I can drive around for nothing. High mileage is OK, but how high should it be b4 I get worried about fixing cost? Just want something like a '00 to '02 323i or 328i. I don't want to break no bank on it, like I said a beater. If my experience is positive, I'll then take the deep plunge later... So what'll you guys suggest? and what should I be concerned with in a 6-7yo Bimmer with 100K tall ones on the odo???

I know I've been derelict not being around here for months... Its work... work... work... So friggin busy these days. I keep trying to visit here but cannot find the time. Oh well...

tagman

TCH? Timely car.

Yes, you have been delinquent... And marked absent too many times!!

Good to see you posting! Good luck with the car search.

TM

2001gs430

That's a good looking TCH. If I had to buy a hybrid tomorrow, this would be it.

2001gs430

Yes, you will be the 1/4 mile king on the drag strips among the super cars. Nothing wrong with having a Z06, but the GT-R or the R8 might work better in all weather conditions.

tayl0rd

...what should I be concerned with in a 6-7yo Bimmer with 100K tall ones on the odo???

Exactly that.

No warranty, no deal. Consider yourself warned. Then again, if you're only looking at a 325i (The last 328i prior to the current one was in the '90s, I think.), then you might be okay. Those cars are so slow that I can't imagine anybody bought it for "performance." But maintenance/repair is still going to be high dollar.

tayl0rd

...the GT-R or the R8 might work better in all weather conditions...

...if you're a big enough idiot to drive like an a-hole on adverse road/weather conditions.

There, I completed that statement for you. Now if you intend to use your brain just a little bit and only test the limits on "ideal" road/weather conditions, a Z06 will be superb.

2001gs430

I have seen three different R8's within the past month on the roads in my area. I think being close to an Audi dealership I will see a number of them. This car most intimidating view is in the rearview mirror, those LED head lights looks very menacing when racing up to the rear of my RX350.

Which car do you think will hold up better, say after 15 years, the current GT-R, R8, or 911 AWD.

2001gs430

Not sure where you live, but let say you take your fun car out on a cool fall day in Toronto, and then all the sudden there's is an inch of snow on road, which car do you think would actually look good driving home (hint: not the Z06)?
Either way, all tests of limits of cars with over 400hp should be done on a track, IMHO.

tayl0rd

Wouldn't that be considered adverse road conditions? :confuse:

circlew

Some interesting changes due at M-B. Let's get ready to rumble!

link title

Regards,
OW

lexusguy

then all the sudden there's is an inch of snow on road, which car do you think would actually look good driving home (hint: not the Z06)?

It doesn't take an inch of snow. All it takes is a freak rain storm, which can happen anywhere, and AWD starts to feel very comforting, while mega-power and RWD only makes you feel nervous.

2001gs430

Wouldn't that be considered adverse road conditions?


Yes, only for Z06 in this case.

tayl0rd

High HP, RWD, and wet/icy roads has never made me feel nervous. I just drive more sensibly and pay attention to the car's feedback. It's not rocket science, people. :sick: I swear, everybody's always looking for a crutch.

jimbres

Dunno about the mega power part of the equation, but my experience with my BMW 330i, equipped with the sports package, has convinced me that traction on wet roads is entirely a function of tire quality when temps are above freezing. Drive train layout matters little, if at all. Because sudden thunderstorms are common during the hot months where I live, I look closely at wet pavement behavior when I choose replacement tires.

Sure, hard rain makes me nervous, but that's because (1) visibility is way down & (2) I'm sharing the road with some idiots. AWD won't fix either of those problems.

louiswei

Nothing wrong with having a Z06, but the GT-R or the R8 might work better in all weather conditions.

Unless you forgot, I live in LA, there no "all weather" here in Southern California... But I am with you, for you guys live up there in the snow belts, the GT-R and R8 are better suitable choices.

The Z06 won't only be the 1/4-mile king, it'll tear it up on road courses like SOW and Buttonwillow as well.